iPhone 15 Models Have 'Completely Standard' USB-C Port Without Restrictions on Accessories

[bgillander]

Ha ha! Never thought I'd see TPOH quoted in MacRumors - love it! (or is it MacRumours...)?

I debated posting a link to the original 1986 video since it is so good, but thought I should just leave it as a deep cut for the fans! I figured it would likely be Canadians that would get the reference, though that tune did make some international charts.

I had simply copied the lyrics from Google, and just noticed they used “your” for “you’re”. Never trust the internet!

I assume the person downvoting you didn’t get the joke, so I guess I will add the video link, after all:

 

[bgillander]

The rollout of third-party cables was my biggest gripe about Lightning.

If I remember correctly — for both USB-A to Lightning and USB-C to Lightning — Apple was the ONLY company making “official” cables for at least a year. So if you wanted to pay less than $19 for a cable, then you’re buying something cheap and uncertified.

The fact that Apple was the only manufacturer of MFi cables essentially created a parallel market for fake cables which had massive demand, because people didn’t want to buy several $19 cables. Apple should have partnered with Anker and other manufacturers to sell cheaper cables simultaneously.

Now, you can get bundles of name-brand, MFi third-party Lightning cables for as low as $1 each. Is there a technical reason this couldn’t have happened 10 years ago? Or was it just because Apple needed their cut?

I just bought 4 braided Anker C-to-C cables (2x 3”, 2x 6”) for $16 total — less than the cost of one of Apple’s less-durable $19 cables. The same cables from Apple would be $95.

This could have been the reality five years ago, and then we’d have five less years of Lightning waste — AND customers would have saved billions of dollars, cumulatively.

Wait, name brand MFi cables are as cheap as $1 and you are still complaining about Apple needing their cut? That technical reason you ask about is capitalism, as those manufacturers are charging what people will pay, the same as 10 years ago.

If you look back at posts, people complained about Apple switching from the Dock connector. People complained about switching the Mac from MagSafe to USB-C so much that Apple added it back. And people are complaining in this thread that Apple switched from Lightning.

There is hardly pleasing anyone, let alone pleasing everyone. Lightning has some advantages, USB-C has some advantages. Apple gets criticism for changing too little, and Apple gets criticism for changing too much. There are few other vendors that get as much criticism, yet people that love to criticize them apparently love to buy from them. Maybe that is the real issue.

 

[mrat93]

Wait, name brand MFi cables are as cheap as $1 and you are still complaining about Apple needing their cut?

….. No. I’m complaining because there’s no reason that Lightning cables needed to be $19 minimum for such a long time, and that it took years for the cables to be remotely reasonably priced.

 

[bgillander]

Which was basically my point when I pointed out that an important part of the EU directive was that it also mandates a particular minimum USB PD standard.

Apple are actually ahead of the game in that they're been using USB PD standards at the charger end for a while. where selling and licensing proprietary cables and adapters has been a cash cow for them since the 30 pin iPod days - and whether Apple were going to give that up without a fight (and probably the only reason that they didn't switch to USB-C for phones when they rolled it out to Macs).

The issue is the connector at the other end - and there, the iPhone is a bit of a special case: selling and licensing proprietary cables and adapters has been a cash cow for Apple since the 30 pin iPod days. Its good that they appear to have let go of that, but I don't think it was a foregone conclusion until it happened.

Considering my linked post was someone complaining about Apple already using the newest PD spec 3 years ago, that mandate didn’t really affect Apple in the least. Again, it was a dumb rumour that was basically a Rorschach test about one’s opinion of Apple.

As for the reason they didn’t switch in 2015 when they added it to the Mac, they had just switched to Lightning in 2012 and got many complaints at that time. Switching again 3 years later would have seen far more complaints than now, just for the multiple changes in 3 years factor. Beyond that, USB-C was still rather new in 2015 and it wasn’t simple to find cheap cables like now, so just as many people would have whined that Apple was gouging them then as they do now. It seems like some people just like to complain.

 

[bgillander]

….. No. I’m complaining because there’s no reason that Lightning cables needed to be $19 minimum for such a long time, and that it took years for the cables to be remotely reasonably priced.

I found mine for less than that, years ago. Again, companies charge what the market will bear, because that’s capitalism. There is also competition, so you need to buy when you see a sale (which I will admit, is not always when you suddenly need a cable.) Good USB-C cables are not that cheap at full price, either.

I’m just saying that if companies can sell MFi cables for $1, it isn’t the MFi certification that was causing them to be $19!

 

[mrat93]

I found mine for less than that, years ago.

Likely at least a year after the cables were launched. It took several years to reach this price point. It happened twice — once when Lightning was originally announced, and once when Apple switched to USB-C for chargers.

I’m just saying that if companies can sell MFi cables for $1, it isn’t the MFi certification that was causing them to be $19!

That’s because Apple has lowered the cost for manufacturers over the years. Apple used to make at least a few dollars per MFi cable. In addition to that, third parties needed to invest in R&D to build and market these new cables.

Good USB-C cables are not that cheap at full price, either.

Again, I just bought four name-brand USB-C cables which are more durable than Apple’s, and for less than the price of one of their cables.

If you wanted to buy the same length, low-durability Lightning cables 1-2 years after launch, your only option was to pay Apple $95, or buy crappy knockoffs. It took Anker over a year to release USB-C to Lightning cables.

 

[bgillander]

Likely at least a year after the cables were launched. It took several years to reach this price point. It happened twice — once when Lightning was originally announced, and once when Apple switched to USB-C for chargers.


That’s because Apple has lowered the cost for manufacturers over the years. Apple used to make at least a few dollars per MFi cable. In addition to that, third parties needed to invest in R&D to build and market these new cables.


Again, I just bought four name-brand USB-C cables which are more durable than Apple’s, and for less than the price of one of their cables.

If you wanted to buy the same length, low-durability Lightning cables 1-2 years after launch, your only option was to pay Apple $95, or buy crappy knockoffs. It took Anker over a year to release USB-C to Lightning cables.

Yes, R&D affects prices. I paid too much for USB-C cables in 2016. It happens. Prices change, and not just Apple’s.

Can you provide that Apple MFi pricing to the licensees? Was it per unit or percentage?

If their certification pricing has dropped that much, though, then the original rumour makes even less sense, because Apple would have that much less incentive to bother worrying about losing MFi.

 

[bgillander]

You've conveniently dropped the "...if they stole stuff" qualification, which puts a rather different spin on things. As long as that is clear and they don't actually prosecute (or may be throw the customer out) its still not "pre crime" as claimed - and could be somewhat justified if they had reason to suspect.

OK, there are all sorts of lines that they could cross that could make it (subject to jurisdiction) defamation, harassment, misuse of data or discrimination - but that's really extending the analogy beyond reason when we were originally talking about a government official reminding a publicly traded company about the consequences of breaking the rules. Nobody here really knows if whatever information triggered the EU was credible. Its not that Apple aren't being investigated for various anti-competetive practices or that the MFI scheme isn't a real thing.

“could be somewhat justified if they had reason to suspect”

Wow, that is just a depressing statement. I assume you haven’t actually seen Minority Report?

And that “scheme” called MFi is a certification program. It isn’t an unusual practice, and I have non-MFi Lightning cables, so your choice of words seems a bit biased.

 

[theluggage]

Wow, that is just a depressing statement. I assume you haven’t actually seen Minority Report?

Why, yes, I've seem Minority Report. The version I saw involved "suspects" being grabbed of the street, forcibly fitted with brain-numbing headsets (if they do a remake its' a great product placement opportunity for Vision Pro) and incarcerated permanently without trial purely on the strength of a dodgy vision of the future. Was there maybe an edited-for-airlines-and-prisons version where Tom Cruise just went around reminding suspects that murder was illegal?

If the EU had pre-emptively banned the iPhone 15 on the basis of rumours, if the "accusation" had been of something morally heinous that would damage Apple's reputation rather than a technical violation of trading rules or if Apple were a private individual with expectations of privacy rather than a giant company - then you might have a point. Otherwise, its a completely over-the-top false equivalence.

 

[OneBar]

Speculation: The entry level Vision Pro might just be a screen that you tether to an iPhone 15 Pro that has extensive USB-C features and high performance.

Apple are known to bread crumb as few features as are strictly necessary. I think there’s a strong financial motive behind USB-C port on the 15 Pro. 🤠🤑

Sure and I assume that USB2 board controllers are starting to get long in the tooth, so switching to USB3 controllers next year would seem logical.

 

[Macalicious2011]

Sure and I assume that USB2 board controllers are starting to get long in the tooth, so switching to USB3 controllers next year would seem logical.

Exactly.

Future of spatial computing:
-iPhone with USB3
-Magsafe battery
-Vision Light with 2k instead of 4k displays but without an M2

Sometimes, when Apple want you to upgrade or spend more, they do so by making an accessory exclusive to newer models.

Think smart connector or magic keyboard and Apple Pencil.

 

[bgillander]

Why, yes, I've seem Minority Report. The version I saw involved "suspects" being grabbed of the street, forcibly fitted with brain-numbing headsets (if they do a remake its' a great product placement opportunity for Vision Pro) and incarcerated permanently without trial purely on the strength of a dodgy vision of the future. Was there maybe an edited-for-airlines-and-prisons version where Tom Cruise just went around reminding suspects that murder was illegal?

If the EU had pre-emptively banned the iPhone 15 on the basis of rumours, if the "accusation" had been of something morally heinous that would damage Apple's reputation rather than a technical violation of trading rules or if Apple were a private individual with expectations of privacy rather than a giant company - then you might have a point. Otherwise, its a completely over-the-top false equivalence.

Good lord, man, it just wasn’t enough of a false accusation?! You are full on doubling down that it is okay to have a board of authority not really have to follow the rules while reminding the other side how important it is to follow their rules. The hypocrisy is amazing, but I guess it isn’t that far a trip from “could be somewhat justified if they had reason to suspect”. I’ve always thought the “rights and freedoms” absolutists were way over the top, but I am starting to see why they worry.

 

[OneBar]

Exactly.

Future of spatial computing:
-iPhone with USB3
-Magsafe battery
-Vision Light with 2k instead of 4k displays but without an M2

Sometimes, when Apple want you to upgrade or spend more, they do so by making an accessory exclusive to newer models.

Think smart connector or magic keyboard and Apple Pencil.

Or next cycle all iPhones will be able to utilize the Vision Pro, regardless. Maybe a frame rate drop for the regular 16/Plus. Dunno, I'm less interested in the Vision and its compatibilities.

 

[Macalicious2011]

Or next cycle all iPhones will be able to utilize the Vision Pro, regardless. Maybe a frame rate drop for the regular 16/Plus. Dunno, I'm less interested in the Vision and its compatibilities.

VR won't be for everyone and Apple has a mountainous task in building use cases. Although I won't be first to buy one, they have done a phenomenal job convincing people to spend £200-500 on wireless earbuds and smart watches better than anyone else.

I can imagine apple stores offering people to hook up their USB3 iPhones to a headset to "re-experience" moments you have already recorded in Spatial video and audio.

Can't wait until it's year 26-27 and half of us are on 5-10Terabyte iCloud plans to storage heavy shoot spatial video 😂

 

[Unregistered 4U]

VR won't be for everyone and Apple has a mountainous task in building use cases. Although I won't be first to buy one, they have done a phenomenal job convincing people to spend £200-500 on wireless earbuds and smart watches better than anyone else.

I can imagine apple stores offering people to hook up their USB3 iPhones to a headset to "re-experience" moments you have already recorded in Spatial video and audio.

macOS people looking at Vision Pro: That won’t be for everyone!
The rest of the computing industry looking at macOS: Same.

As you say, Apple’s been very good at finding folks that 1) Have money and 2) Finds value for the price that Apple offers for goods/services. Even if everyone that owns an Apple product currently vowed to NOT buy Vision Pro, there’s still a large number of people in that potential market.

And, they wouldn’t have to hookup their phones to a headset. Vision Pro will have the same deep access to iCloud as the iPhone/iPad. Authenticate to the device and have access to their library.

 

[Macalicious2011]

And, they wouldn’t have to hookup their phones to a headset. Vision Pro will have the same deep access to iCloud as the iPhone/iPad. Authenticate to the device and have access to their library.

This is true about the Vision Pro. However as the name suggests, there will likely be a non-pro version. It will undoubtedly have to be closer to the price of a Studio Display or iMac in order to drive adoption and economies of scale.

Remove the M2 chip, half the screen resolution, and tether to USB3 iPhone with MagSafe battery and even I might be interested in buying one to share with my partner. With man maths, it would way easier to justify spending $1500 versus $3500. At least with a dumb/brain-less Vision I am not forever stuck with a non upgradable computer but can upgrade iPhone every two years.

That would be an eco-system tie up that would make it even harder for iPhone users to consider switching to android.

Sony is supplying the 4k displays for the Vision Pro and have also developed the 2k display in the PSVR2 which is tethered to the PS5 using a single USBC cable for both dsts and power.

I stubbornly resisted the Apple Watch for years until I was itching for new tech and couldn’t think of something else to buy.

Either way I am super excited about USBC and USB3 speeds for many use cases.

 

[theluggage]

Good lord, man, it just wasn’t enough of a false accusation?! You are full on doubling down that it is okay to have a board of authority not really have to follow the rules while reminding the other side how important it is to follow their rules.

Hang on, are we still talking about how the EU commission sent a letter reminding Apple that “Devices that do not meet the uniform charger requirements will not be allowed on the EU market" - or did I miss the bit where the EU pre-emptively banned the iPhone and sent a pre-crime squad to "disappear" Tim Cook?

Your reaction is ridiculously disproportionate to what actually happened.

 

[bgillander]

Hang on, are we still talking about how the EU commission sent a letter reminding Apple that “Devices that do not meet the uniform charger requirements will not be allowed on the EU market" - or did I miss the bit where the EU pre-emptively banned the iPhone and sent a pre-crime squad to "disappear" Tim Cook?

Your reaction is ridiculously disproportionate to what actually happened.

No commission should take any action based on just a rumour. Support for that behaviour at any level is ridiculous and creates a dangerous precedent. History is filled with baby steps of overreach that should have been called out before they became giant leaps.

So, yeah, I didn’t really care about that letter, until I discovered someone actually thought those actions were defensible.