iPhone 15 Pro Predicted to See First Price Increase Since iPhone X

[ric22]

In the US the phones haven’t increased (or maybe the top end a little) since the iPhone X. I doubt over the world in general the price since the iPhone X has increased 3x.

Eh? Where did the 3x since the X argument come from? Prices are up three fold since the iPhone 6/Max, 8 years back. And no, I don't follow US pricing because it's meaningless to me. I've lived in China, Thailand and the UK in the last 8 years, for reference, and travelled widely in Asia.

 

[ric22]

Not "Apple's marketing," simple reality. E.g. simply picking just one of the many upgraded features, the camera, we see that one would pay more than the cost of an iPhone Pro just for a standalone 45 MP sensor camera.

What? Wouldn't the same argument exist when comparing the iPhone 6 camera to the cameras of the earliest smart phones? The difference is incredible, simply incredible, but the phone price was consistent. I literally stopped carrying a $600 point and shoot camera when holidaying at that point in time, because the iPhone 6 performed well enough to make the difference (excluding zooming) negligible.

 

[ric22]

Prices have come down. Apple's first iPhone launched in 2007 with a starting price of $499 (4GB) and that required a 2 year AT&T contract. Without the contract requirement, it likely would've been $649. Adjusting for inflation, $649 would be around $940 today. You can get a new larger, more capable 64GB iPhone SE starting at $429 or 54% less. The 128GB iPhone 14 and 14 Plus also have lower starting prices than $940.

Looking at the even higher level Pro models, the first iPhone 11 Pro launched in 2019 for $999 (64GB). Adjusting for inflation, $999 would be around $1,172 today. The 128GB iPhone 14 Pro is priced at $999 so, again, prices have cone down.

Sounds like Americans get an OK deal then... the rest of the world (outside HK)... not so much

 

[zombierunner]

cries in £

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

I think your statement is conflating cause with effect. It's not that people are upgrading less often because iPhones cost more (the implication is that even if iPhones cost less, people would still not upgrade as often). Instead, because people are upgrading less often (in part due to slowing innovation across the board), Apple is comfortable charging more for them. It's also a better deal when you hold on to your phone for a longer period of time, especially when coupled with carrier deals, instalment plans and trade-in offers.

Meanwhile, Apple is still able to continue earning from their users by way of accessories, services and app revenue. So Apple doesn't need you to keep buying iPhones, it just needs you to keep using one.

It's actually a pretty good business move when you think about it.

I know quite a few people who use phones for many years until they break but now as prices have soared, there is still that initial cost to overcome. You don’t pay the phone off over 5 or so years as the expectation is to do so over 2 years. I’m encountering more and more people looking for cheaper options as smartphones have reached a point where they all essentially do the same thing. The hard sell going forward is maintaining the attraction of a £1100+ phone when cheaper phones are coming with the same features.

 

[1291030]

Who is going to realign Tim Cook’s expectations? Following the earnings calls people are buying products and services. Prior iPhones work just fine. It’s an individual choice as to whether a new iPhone is needed. At least in the US one can even fine $0 android devices if one is tired of the apple “tax”. As far as software quality: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...14-launch-the-worst-ever-not-so-fast.2361027/

Indeed. People just need to vote with their wallets. You can do this without leaving the ecosystem just fine. Some options are

• Keep a hold of your current phone for a bit longer. iPhones age pretty well. I can barely tell a difference from my old 11 to my new 14
• Apple sells older-gen phones, if you need an upgrade, get one of those and send a signal that way
• Buy second hand. There are lots of great second hand iPhones available on eBay.

In short, if enough people does this and the new, more expensive 15 ends up making less profit than the 14, then somebody might take notice.

Otherwise, they won't.

 

[I7guy]

Eh? Where did the 3x since the X argument come from? Prices are up three fold since the iPhone 6/Max, 8 years back. And no, I don't follow US pricing because it's meaningless to me. I've lived in China, Thailand and the UK in the last 8 years, for reference, and travelled widely in Asia.

Comparing this to 2014 is not relevant. Almost 10 years ago the world was a different place, so it’s a red herring, your argument. might as well compare today to 2007.

 

[dumastudetto]

The thing is that most people outside of macrumours don’t really have a beef with Apple. That’s why Apple does what it does (and seemingly gets away with it). The consensus here is not representative of general consumer sentiment.

Yes you always have to be careful relying on popular opinions forming on internet forums. It is rarely representative. Apple has largely tried to shut this kind of noise out... especially in the final Steve Jobs era.

 

[ric22]

Comparing this to 2014 is not relevant. Almost 10 years ago the world was a different place, so it’s a red herring, your argument. might as well compare today to 2007.

Right. Let's ignore all of history. Everything that occurred before, what, this week? Sensible argument.

Business economics remain the same= make the margin between production costs and sale price as wide as possible. I strongly suspect the margin between those two on a top of the range iPhone is higher than ever right now.

As we all like historical comparisons so much... if the widely touted numbers are correct for production costs, Apple now makes over treble the margin between production costs and sale price in the US market per device, between 2007 and today. However, since 2014, the margin has only sneaked up by another $100 or so up to today. Meanwhile, the sale prices in foreign markets have wildly climbed in the last 8 years, producing a wider margin.

 

[FlyingTexan]

So much for passing cost savings to the customers.

 

[FlyingTexan]

I will say that the price tag is what it is and the “people can barely eat” argument doesn’t really hold water here. I’m still using my iPhone 13 mini and loving it. People ARE NOT REQUIRED TO BUY ANYTHING. You can hop on apple.com right now and buy a cheaper phone. They’re to charge whatever they want for their tech.

 

[I7guy]

Right. Let's ignore all of history. Everything that occurred before, what, this week? Sensible argument.

Business economics remain the same= make the margin between production costs and sale price as wide as possible. I strongly suspect the margin between those two on a top of the range iPhone is higher than ever right now.

As we all like historical comparisons so much... if the widely touted numbers are correct for production costs, Apple now makes over treble the margin between production costs and sale price in the US market per device, between 2007 and today. However, since 2014, the margin has only sneaked up by another $100 or so up to today. Meanwhile, the sale prices in foreign markets have wildly climbed in the last 8 years, producing a wider margin.

The margin on iPhones as I understand has been going down ever so slightly. I think 2018 with the iPhone x is a reasonable benchmark to gauge price updates for the iPhone world wide. If you are going back 10 years might as well go back 20 years.

 

[PauloSera]

Americans would just have to suck it up. In the UK a standard iPhone 14 is £849 ($1022) so $800 for a standard 15 might well be fantasy this year. I’m certainly going to enjoy the outcry if US prices increase this year considering how smug some have been about us getting gouged in Europe.

We really don't care about you being gouged in Europe. At least not from an Apple-related perspective. It is a currency problem.

 

[webkit]

So much for passing cost savings to the customers.

Apple has been, to a degree. When the iPhone X launched in 2017, the starting price with 64GB was $999 or about $1,219 in today's dollars. When the original iPhone Pro launched in 2019, the starting price with 64GB was $999 or about $1,172 in today's dollars.

The improved iPhone 14 Pro with twice the storage, more features, etc. is still only $999 or $173 to $220 less (inflation adjusted). Even if Apple raises the iPhone 15 Pro price $100 over the 14 Pro, it would still be less than the X or original Pro (again, inflation adjusted).

 

[PauloSera]

Stating that tech companies are firing workers despite of record profits, and apple holding back bonuses are no more anecdotal than you saying apple bases its pricing decision on previous sales, if anything, its less anecdotal as its well documented in the press via. press statements and such from said companies regarding redundancies.

The only slightly anecdotal about the comment you replied to, was the aspect about the cost of living crisis. With that said though, to an impartial reader, it feels a fair amount of evidence exists in the public space to support the hypothesis that many countries face a cost of living crisis, and some might even argue this is more factual than just assuming the main factor apple considerings in its pricing strategy is volume sold of the past generation. I seen less evidence to suppose that statement in the public space, than any of the stuff you wrote off as anecdotal.

No idea what you're even trying to say. The cost of living crisis amongst some demographics has no relation whatsoever to the highest end version of a premium smartphone.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

We really don't care about you being gouged in Europe. At least not from an Apple-related perspective. It is a currency problem.

That’s great to know, hopefully we buy less Apple stuff this year here and money goes to more deserving parts of the economy. I wish higher prices on Americans too, they’ve earned it .

 

[PauloSera]

That’s great to know, hopefully we buy less Apple stuff this year here and money goes to more deserving parts of the economy. I wish higher prices on Americans too, they’ve earned it .

Yes, while we create the things you want to buy in the first place. Keep up that EU delusion though.

 

[Allen_Wentz]

I will only upgrade that I see fits. No point in upgrading if it doesn't serve or fit the needs, when it still does the same thing as the previous models. The only thing 14 Pro lineup have is four things: Camera upgrade, Dynamic Island, Satellite Connection and Crash Detection. That's it. I went to the Apple Store and play around with it. I didn't see the need to upgrade. Not only that, but I have a 13 Pro. It does everything the 14 Pro does except the things mentioned. Otherwise, I'm keeping my 13 Pro, which is the best iPhone I've owned since the 5S.

Each year the new iPhone Pro has tens of thousands of Apple engineering hours spent improving it from the previous year. You of course may choose to trivialize the changes to four simplistic things for your own decision process, but you are wrong. Each new iPhone Pro is improved in scores of ways, probably hundreds.

Many of those myriad improvements may be subtle when viewed non-critically, especially in the context of comparison to the immediate past model. But the improvements are real and they do present in overall operation.

Note that I do not say everyone should buy each new phone, but I do say that the reason not to upgrade is not simplistically because it still does the same thing as the previous models. That same thing has actually changed in subtle (and sometimes unsubtle) ways. Most years since the v1 iPhone I have aggressively A-B compared old versus new in the field with friends' phones, and the newer phones always have presented noticeable performance improvements of one kind or another (speaker sound quality, mic competence, reception in strong locations, reception in weak locations, camera, durability, etc.).

All that said, personally I pretty much upgraded about every other year until the recent camera improvements have made each new model way cost effective for my business.

 

[I7guy]

That’s great to know, hopefully we buy less Apple stuff this year here and money goes to more deserving parts of the economy. I wish higher prices on Americans too, they’ve earned it .

Sure, the people will decide what their budgets will be for the next few months.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Yes, while we create the things you want to buy in the first place. Keep up that EU delusion though.

Well some things of course and vice versa as America has European products too. Smartphones come from all over the world though and iPhones are a smaller segment in Europe.

I don’t live in the EU so that rather juvenile insult doesn’t apply in this instance.

 

[ric22]

The margin on iPhones as I understand has been going down ever so slightly. I think 2018 with the iPhone x is a reasonable benchmark to gauge price updates for the iPhone world wide. If you are going back 10 years might as well go back 20 years.

$13 USD increase manufacturing costs in that time, as far as I can see from the estimates. 30-40% increase in price in many places. Why are we allowed to go back 4 years, but 8 years isn't ok? Anyway...

 

[I7guy]

$13 USD increase manufacturing costs in that time, as far as I can see from the estimates. 30-40% increase in price in many places. Why are we allowed to go back 4 years, but 8 years isn't ok? Anyway...

You can go back as far as you want but at least to me it doesn’t prove anything. But yeah, margins have been going down over time. Even if only slightly.

 

[ric22]

You can go back as far as you want but at least to me it doesn’t prove anything. But yeah, margins have been going down over time. Even if only slightly.

Say it with me: "I think the margin between production costs and sale price may have gone down ~2% in one country alone, but not in the other couple of hundred, and not overall". That we can agree on.

 

[I7guy]

Say it with me: "I think the margin between production costs and sale price may have gone down ~2% in one country alone, but not in the other couple of hundred, and not overall". That we can agree on.

Let’s repeat - all together - there is only one margin, and that margin is the gross margin reported on the financial statements. The net revenue is the one of interest.

 

[ric22]

Let’s repeat - all together - there is only one margin, and that margin is the gross margin reported on the financial statements. The net revenue is the one of interest.

Oh gosh. Nice deflection when you're made to look silly! 😂 There's only one margin in existence, huh? Use Google to check. Or a dictionary.