I'm going to upgrade my phone this year no matter what, however, if the iPhone7 isn't crazy great then I'm just going to get a 6s since the price will drop in Sept. Removing the headphone jack will not make it crazy great; I'm very skeptical of the upcoming iPhone.
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iPhone 7 and the Audiophile Case For Lightning Headphones
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Kiwikat88
macrumors 6502
Audio, for better or worse, is very much going the opposite direction though. Streaming, the "cloud", and absurdly priced data plans have necessitated smaller files. People used to listen to lossless CDs and analog vinyl. Now most people listen to crappy 128k or less streams. I listened to satellite radio in my Dad's car a while back and then put in a CD and the difference was absolutely astounding, and that's with a cheap stock audio system.
Some of the statements made in the Verge article are really lame. There is NO MORE "digital potential" with lightning headphones than there are 3.5mm terminated ones. All you're doing is moving where the DAC is. Now you'll have cheapass headphones coming with cheapass DACs. They'll probably sound even worse than what they would have before using the built-in DAC. Nothing is going to change. You'll keep getting what you pay for.
I still can't say I really understand the negative sentiment towards high end audio. People spend lots of money to get really nice phones, laptops, TVs, cars, and whatever else, but as soon as someone gets nice headphones they're totally crazy or worse. I own a couple Audeze headphones including the Lightning-terminated Sine, and they're phenomenal. They have opened up a whole new world of music and listening. They make listening to music an experience, something you want to set aside time in your day to do. They've brought people to tears with a single listen. Feedback has included all the superlatives, including "better than sex". If you enjoy music and haven't listened to a good audio setup, you owe it to yourself to do so.
Overall I'm not sure this is really a positive change for the consumer. It reeks of a money grab by Apple.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
Next year:
"One less fixed battery to worry about wearing out is a win for me"
Next, next year:
"One less camera to get scratched or have to carry is a win for me"
Next, next, next, next year (Empty box for about $1000. Buy everything that used to be built in as accessories sold separately)
"Now I can get my iPhone exactly as I want it"
😉
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Money. This is not really about better. This is about the profits in proprietary. Sony used to be the king of pushing proprietary-loaded stuff on their loyal following. It even works for a while. And then the following starts seeing through the choice of profits over bona-fide consumer benefits. Look at Sony (proprietary dependent tech) now.
Not really. It's all about high-end headphones. My Ultrasone 500 Pros would no doubt sound much better in my iPhone 6 if they connected without any analog gunk getting in the way and had their own DAC. In fact if one becomes available I'll probably buy it.
It's the $50.00 good-enough-for-crappy-iTunes-downloads headphone user and the automobile analog pin plug connection that will suffer. I say keep both connections though I realize that the crazies at Apple do not like connections (options) at all.
Let's see. We can already play music from the Lightning port. Good headphones should come with a detachable cable, nothing stops them from including a 3.5 to 3.5, and a Lightning to DAC to 3.5 cable.
The overwhelming majority of people that listen to music on an iPhone are listening to compressed MP3. There does reach a point where the headphone quality does not matter anymore. We also listen to the iPhone while on the move, a lot. Do you really want to walk or exercise with big headphones on? To replicate the usefulness of earbuds, the DAC would be no better than what's in the phone already.
Enough crap to charge already.
I travel a fair bit. 15 years ago, I carried a laptop. Then it was a laptop and a cell phone, 2 chargers. Then laptop, phone, tablet. 3 chargers. Noe laptop, phone, tablet, watch. 4 chargers. I need to also carry a charger for my headphones??? It's already difficult to find enough accessible plugs in hotel rooms for my current stuff.
It's a solution in search of a problem.
The overwhelming majority of people that listen to music on an iPhone are listening to compressed MP3. There does reach a point where the headphone quality does not matter anymore. We also listen to the iPhone while on the move, a lot. Do you really want to walk or exercise with big headphones on? To replicate the usefulness of earbuds, the DAC would be no better than what's in the phone already.
Enough crap to charge already.
I travel a fair bit. 15 years ago, I carried a laptop. Then it was a laptop and a cell phone, 2 chargers. Then laptop, phone, tablet. 3 chargers. Noe laptop, phone, tablet, watch. 4 chargers. I need to also carry a charger for my headphones??? It's already difficult to find enough accessible plugs in hotel rooms for my current stuff.
It's a solution in search of a problem.
I think this is different. I have a several idevices (3 iPads and each kid has an iPod touch) in the house, and my kids watch youtube videos, listen to music, play games, etc on them. The buds don't work for them or my wife, so they use cheap headphones that also work on the computers. I am 100% not going out and buying $50 lightning headphones that work only with Apple.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
If you are an audiophile looking forward to Lightning connections, why haven't you already embraced it? It's ALREADY available. Getting rid of the 3.5mm jack doesn't make it more available or better than it is now. Go get your Lightning-based phones now. Those referenced in this article are considered an exceptional set of headphones connected via Lightning.
And the masses will be affected. They'll be carrying adapters or another set of buds so they can easily unplug from a new iPhone Lightning and plug into anything else... even their own Macs. This will affect everyone that uses any audio device other than iDevices. As soon as one needs to plug into ANYTHING else, they better have an adapter... or ANOTHER set of earbuds or headphones with them.
Tell me how good the headphones sound when my battery is dead on a transpacific flight. This whole thing is just rationalizing a self-serving decision by Apple to remove the single most universal connector on the planet in favor of their proprietary licensed connector. It gives Apple a few bucks per set of headphones, and costs the consumer in functionality, convenience, and price.
You can twist around what I was trying to say, but my point still stands.
You stated: "the very best one would be to put the better quality DAC and AMP INSIDE the iPhone"
That is simply wrong, for the reasons I stated. It has nothing to do with whether or not the buyer is aware of the technology. All they care about is how they sound. And by building a custom DAC/amp into a set of headphones engineers are free to optimize other areas (like the drivers) to provide better sound.
You should read the reviews for the Audeze Since (there are lots of them). Many compare the performance with the iPhone 3.5mm jack and the Cipher Lightning cable. They found the sound was better with the Lightning cable. And this is due to more than just the fact it's digital. The amp/DAC/DSP combined are what make the difference.
Further, if you even bothered to read the source article at The Verge you would have found the Cipher cable is actually different for the two sets of Audeze headphones they tested. Why is that? Because they are customized for the differences in the drivers each headphone uses. Again, this is something that's simply NOT POSSIBLE with a built-in amp in a smartphone.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
For the time being i will stick with my €300 headphone with 3.5mm jack that work perfectly with my iPhone, macs and all the soundcards I’m using.
StoneJack
macrumors 68040
3.5 mm jack is the price of evolution. Yes, we want lighter, thinner phones. Eventually even Samsung gets it, because bendable is really just very thin display. Apple gets it too and wants to move there, but Samsung is right, and Apple is wrong? Huh.
Just like the CD drive or PS2 connector. They were ubiquitous, easy to use, well known, whats else?
Did they survive? No. They were replaced by faster, better connectors and technologies. Just because you have some old headphones with 3.5 mm jack, doesn't mean that new connectors like Lightning should not be offered. If you don't like it, you may not buy iPhone 7. No one forces it. You may have an easy and elegant adaptor, you don't like it - don't buy.
Just like the CD drive or PS2 connector. They were ubiquitous, easy to use, well known, whats else?
Did they survive? No. They were replaced by faster, better connectors and technologies. Just because you have some old headphones with 3.5 mm jack, doesn't mean that new connectors like Lightning should not be offered. If you don't like it, you may not buy iPhone 7. No one forces it. You may have an easy and elegant adaptor, you don't like it - don't buy.
cmichaelb
macrumors 68020
Not too sure about that. 😉
Right! I remember and he said the sound was so good he could do that. I'm not saying they get it all right, the earpod things only makes sense in they are trying to save money rather than make them sound great.
jmgregory1
macrumors 68040
I don't buy money as Apple's reasoning for "maybe" ditching the 3.5mm jack. Money is never what drives Apple in their design phase of product. Sure, the cost of some product will drive a decision one way or the other, but the headphone jack is one of those legacy technologies that is ripe for change. And that is what Apple is great at doing - taking a legacy technology and tossing it to push the market forward. For all those people who complain that they then can't use their old, expensive, fill in the blank device, there will be countless adapters and the new technology drives new products that at some point you'll likely want to own.
Disruption is disruptive and very few people want to change if they can avoid it, but change will happen, especially when it comes to Apple.
Gaspode67
macrumors regular
But you miss the point that these are Industry Standards that were agreed across a vast swathe of TV manufacturers, Camera manufacturers, Content Providers, Industry governing bodies around the world, etc that ALL had the same rights and had a concerted effort to move the consumer in an orderly way from one standard to the next standard.
Conversely, the rumour about Apple ditching the 3.5mm jack for the Lightning connector is one solitary manufacturer choosing to drop a worldwide industry standard for their own proprietary system. That's a completely different situation.
This will only make sense if there are two separate ports. One meant for power and the other for audio. Forcing your users to pick between better audio or enough battery for games just goes against the average consumer IMHO.
Kiwikat88
macrumors 6502
LOL. That is all.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
What twist? You are arguing audiophile minutiae that the "average Joe" probably has never even heard of before. And by zeroing in on that, you are trying to marginalize all the hoops those same masses will have to jump through to keep using iPhones and their other audio-producing gear exactly as they do now.
Shall I counter by suggesting we link the iPhone to home theater-quality amplifiers, speakers and subwoofers for far superior sound? That will crush just about any compact headphone... even the expensive ones. We could break out some scientific instruments and draw some waveforms comparing one to the other vs. the same performance live in the same room. I'm certain I can find a combination of equipment that will yield a better production of sound... and that will sound better... than any given set of headphones with a Lightning jack.
The problem: is the masses going to want the hassle of carrying around a room full of amplifiers, home theater speakers & subwoofers because I can show them some waveforms, etc that illustrate that it is a better production of sound? Of course not. Masses are not audiophiles or engineers. In other threads, we'll make passionate arguments to choose convenience over maximized quality (see iTunes music vs. CDs or iTunes video vs. BDs). Here we're arguing very fine variables in maximizing quality at a great expense of convenience. How do we reconcile that? In both kinds of threads, the way Apple wants to go is the way we want to argue.
I appreciate the audiophile arguments as much as anyone. I have not exactly "cheaped out" on my own AV purchases. But, as is almost always the case with these "tow the company line" arguments, those concerned with such minutiae can ALREADY buy Lightning-terminated headphones- even those exact ones referenced in the article- to enjoy whatever difference they can- or think they can- hear. I take no issue with such options. My issue is with killing the extraordinarily ubiquitous (and thus extraordinarily convenient) option of 3.5mm to try to somewhat "force" this change upon us.
If Apple really believes this change is necessary... that it is good for us consumers (instead of their own accessory and licensing revenue)... I'm with others in suggesting they should have done away with Lightning and embraced USB3C. As much as I don't care for this option, THAT would make it more palatable to me. Replacing extreme ubiquity for extreme proprietary is only a good change for one player here... especially since any of us that swallows that spin can ALREADY embrace the "superiority" of the Lightning-connected options if we really are concerned with "impedance" details and any such differences in optimizing drivers of headphones. You care about such details? Fine, there's an option for you. But we don't need to force such care upon everyone for "thinner" or whatever else... especially via a proprietary solution that should itself clash with "thinner" in how many more generations?
lordofthereef
macrumors G5
This analysis somewhat misses the point. I haven't heard anyone suggest that audio over Lightening is a bad thing; it clearly is not. What I and many others object to is getting rid of the headphone jack, which many of us rely on for our existing high-quality audio needs. What Apple should do is to add the audio-over-lightening feature now, but keep the headphone jack for several years. This would avoid stranding the very large number of us who have made significant investments in audio gear that uses a headphone jack, and would avoid the inconvenience of having to carry around dongles with our phones.
They don't need to add it as it is already there unless you mean analogue audio through the Lightning port.
ThisBougieLife
Suspended
I am an audiophile of sorts, but that means I never use my iPhone for "serious" listening. Until Apple offers lossless music through iTunes (either streaming or downloads) then this whole thing seems moot to me.
Mac 128
macrumors 603
Oh is that why my ATSC TV is compatible with a DVB signal -- oh wait, it's not.
Apple is not replacing 3.5mm with Lightning. They're simply dropping 3.5mm. If anything wireless is replacing 3.5mm. Digital is the new standard. The connector is merely the delivery method just like ATSC is for TV signals in North America and DVB in Europe. You need an adapter/converter to access that signal depending on your device.
I'm sorry, but it doesn't make sense to me that they'd suddenly offer a Lightning-only headphone solution on the next iPhone while simultaneously being outright hostile to iPhone external DACs and Amps all this time. You refuse to give me a straight digital output for a DAC, but will gladly let headphone makers use Lightning cords for connectivity?
No, I'm sorry, but that's a pretty bad idea on their part. Don't preach to me about "it'll be good for quality!" when you've largely ignored such a point for years now. My only options for digital out shouldn't be Lightning Headphones or a $300 Wadia dock.
No, I'm sorry, but that's a pretty bad idea on their part. Don't preach to me about "it'll be good for quality!" when you've largely ignored such a point for years now. My only options for digital out shouldn't be Lightning Headphones or a $300 Wadia dock.