iPhone 7 Plus Qualcomm LTE Modem Outperforms Intel LTE Modem by Significant Margin

[jetlitheone]

Quick update: Spoke to Apple and they told me that they've had a good many people who paid full-price for AT&T and T-Mobile devices call with similar concerns and they are offering full refunds for people who want to go out and buy the Verizon or the SIM-Free models so they have carrier flexibility in the US, since they previously did have that with iPhone models until this year.

So, I have 2 weeks to source a VZW phone or a SIM-free phone if I want to return my AT&T one, I reckon. So, that's decent customer service, eh?

I'm glad they didn't try to feed me a line about how I should've known they'd switch these this year. That was nice.

When did you buy the iPhone?

 

[SystemHasFailed]

I have the intel modem (slower one), here is my speed test from this morning on the newest beta: View attachment 666857
Can’t say i am disappointed.

You would be if your ran the same test with the Qualcomm modem. My speeds in Bellevue on the iPhone 6s were 120Mbit down.

Look like I'll buy a SIM-less model for my next one and avoid the Intel claptrap.

 

[jetlitheone]

Apple pretty much said out of 14 day period blah blah blah. What a joke now I'm on T-Mobile cause I left att. Can't even get Verizon.

 

[bunnicula]

When did you buy the iPhone?

Launch day.
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Apple pretty much said out of 14 day period blah blah blah. What a joke now I'm on T-Mobile cause I left att. Can't even get Verizon.

Who'd you speak to? You can message me if you want.

 

[Jetro]

I think the intel modem is fine. It's a bunch of hyped up bologna that you need a Qualcomm one if you're content with service on AT&T or T-Mobile and most carriers around the world. I don't trust their testing as definitive.

 

[bunnicula]

I think the intel modem is fine. It's a bunch of hyped up bologna that you need a Qualcomm one if you're content with service on AT&T or T-Mobile and most carriers around the world. I don't trust their testing as definitive.

I think the modem isn't really the issue in the US. I think the issue is whether or not you think you might want to switch from AT&T or T-Mobile to Verizon or whether you think you may want to sell your device next year to someone who'd like to use it on Verizon or in a country where they need CDMA (like China or Japan).

That's really the issue, not the modem, exactly. If these phones were all the same EXCEPT the modem, I doubt I'd be too fussed over it if a slight speed difference in benchmarking tests was the ONLY difference.

 

[Jetro]

I think the modem isn't really the issue in the US. I think the issue is whether or not you think you might want to switch from AT&T or T-Mobile to Verizon or whether you think you may want to sell your device next year to someone who'd like to use it on Verizon or in a country where they need CDMA (like China or Japan).

That's really the issue, not the modem, exactly. If these phones were all the same EXCEPT the modem, I doubt I'd be too fussed over it if a slight speed difference in benchmarking tests was the ONLY difference.

Yeah Apple may have cheaped out or something. If a software update enabled the intel modem to get cdma also that would solve the problem.

 

[x1234]

You don't need CDMA in Japan/China/Korea/Taiwan/Hong Kong. Sure there's CDMA networks there but I've done the research and the LTE/UMTS and GSM carriers are dominant and nation-wide with CDMA networks having less or equal coverage. CDMA support is really ONLY needed in the USA. Period.

ALL the carriers in Asia that use CDMA are re-farming CDMA spectrum to LTE and launching VoLTE as well.

Also is it known in the industry that Asian Radio Access Network (RAN) vendors like Huawei have higher performance at lower signal strengths than their European counterparts (Ericsson, Nokia/Alcatel-Lucent).

I really would like a comparison of LTE performance of different RAN vendors like Huawei in Canada/Mexico versus Ericsson in the USA.

 

[err404]

They list the same SKU from Apple (MNQL2LL/A), but have different SKU's for the iPhone depending on carrier. Sounds like someone just copy and pasted the Apple SKU?

I am typing this on an ATT locked model 1661. At least on launch day, everyone at the Bestbuy location I was at seemed to be getting the same stock regardless of carrier.

 

[KPOM]

There wasn't a difference between last year's 16 and 64GB model as far as I remember from Anand tech review I think. These are NVMe SSDs/controllers adopted from MacBooks to work with the iPhone. Parallelism alone cannot explain the 8x difference. There's got to be cheaper stuff involved.

And besides, it isn't exactly hard to produce a 32GB SSD that does decent sequential writes(100MB/s+). But for cost reasons it made sense for Apple to put cheaper NAND FLASH or poorer controller or something in the SKU that would most likely be the most sold one. The read speeds are good and only people noticing the poor writes are people that pay attention, install big apps and/or do restores. Pretty small demographic.

And that demographic is likely going to want more than 32GB of storage.

 

[NOSFERATU]

intel model phones hiss, have bad battery life and suck in lte performation. WOW.... talk about sticking it way up to the customer of intel lte modem phones.

What in the hell is performation?

 

[davidf18]

I kind of thought my LTE performance was slower than before, but I wasn't sure if it was in my head. I'm on AT&T so I imagine I have the intel modem, but just ran a Speedtest at work and got 3.3mbps down and .3 up lol. 2-3 bars at work, in a smallish office building right next to a window in an area that doesn't have tons of traffic (smallish suburb). Guess I'm glad I'm on wifi a lot?

Slow rates might be caused by inadequate backhaul from the tower to the Internet. Try calling *3001#12345#* to see what your signal strength is.

 

[sbailey4]

For anyone who thinks a phone with CDMA support is a "world" phone, I'd be curious if they can name a single country that has only CDMA networks (and no GSM/EDGE/UMTS/HSPA/LTE networks). If such a country exists, I'm not personally aware of one, but it would be interesting to know.

I think the point is the VZW model can work on any carrier INCLUDING cdma. Yeah GSM is the rest of the worlds standard but having a device that will work on both is certainly more considered a "world phone". Like the iP6s does.

You know that "world" means that it actually will work anywhere in the world that has a cellular signal, yes?

I live in an area where there's full GSM coverage, but I can drive an hour and a half out into a rural area where I would have spotty coverage if I only had GSM.

Which is the only reason I actually care about having CDMA in a phone. If I take a trip to visit my rural relatives, my signal always has a chance of being iffy. If I wanted to sell my phone to someone who lived out that way next year, they might not want it and I wouldn't feel right about selling it to them.

I don't always sell my phones. Sometimes I give them away. Wouldn't want to give one away to someone who might have spotty coverage with it, either.

In fact, there are some neighborhoods that are about 10 minutes from my house, in a rapidly-developing area and I have always gotten a crappy signal (and sometimes, I drop carrier) in those neighborhoods. People who move out there usually get Verizon. And, I don't live in the boondocks, either.

It's really not an issue except that it's illogical until we don't have any major carriers in the US who use CDMA. Can you use the Intel model with Verizon? Sure. Will it perform far worse than the QC version on Verizon? Yes. Which is not good for people who buy phones full price and like to be able to tell their carrier to take a hike if they decide they want to switch.

That's really all it is to me. My iP 7 plus works fine. But, I am on AT&T. For now.
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I do wish Apple would just sell the same phone to everyone, though. It would prevent any issues. Yes, you could argue that the Samsung/TSMC thing was largely not a huge deal, but not having CDMA flexibility in the US could be.

Actually NOPE it wont work on Verizon. The Verizon device will work on all 4 carriers (VZW, Sprint, ATT and T-mobile) The ATT version only works on ATT and t-mobile.

But you still have to say 'Verizon version, please', right. Or you might get the AT&T with the Intel modem.

Well you get the "SIM-Free" version which is effectively the Verizon model. Look on Apples website as if you are going to purchase it. You either choose a carrier (which determines the device u get) Or you opt for the sim free version then can choose which carrier at any time.

 

[ahostmadsen]

You don't need CDMA in Japan/China/Korea/Taiwan/Hong Kong. Sure there's CDMA networks there but I've done the research and the LTE/UMTS and GSM carriers are dominant and nation-wide with CDMA networks having less or equal coverage. CDMA support is really ONLY needed in the USA. Period.

Not true. Check T-mobile website. They clearly state iPhone 7 (i.e, Intel modem) will not work in Korea. Period.

 

[airjay75]

I think the point is the VZW model can work on any carrier INCLUDING cdma. Yeah GSM is the rest of the worlds standard but having a device that will work on both is certainly more considered a "world phone". Like the iP6s does.

I guess. When someone says world phone, I tend to think they are referring to international usage of the phone, not the ability to switch from AT&T/T-Mobile to Verizon/Sprint in the U.S. To me, both iPhone 7 models are world phones, it's just that the Qualcomm model also has support for CDMA networks which is really only relevant in the U.S. (and maybe a handful of Asian countries, although no one seems to be able to name one). And, in the U.S., there aren't many places where you have only a CDMA network available.

 

[ahostmadsen]

I guess. When someone says world phone, I tend to think they are referring to international usage of the phone, not the ability to switch from AT&T/T-Mobile to Verizon/Sprint in the U.S. To me, both iPhone 7 models are world phones, it's just that the Qualcomm model also has support for CDMA networks which is really only relevant in the U.S. (and maybe a handful of Asian countries, although no one seems to be able to name one). And, in the U.S., there aren't many places where you have only a CDMA network available.

I have named it many times: Korea

 

[airjay75]

Not true. Check T-mobile website. They clearly state iPhone 7 (i.e, Intel modem) will not work in Korea. Period.

See here: https://www.att.com/travelguide/cov...are&siteId=TnL5HPStwNw-E40OL7MYeArDTZyzqxtYGQ

South Korea has LTE and UMTS service on bands supported by the Intel iPhone 7.

I suspect T-Mobile is simply copying Apple's website (http://www.apple.com/iphone/LTE/) which does not list Korea as a country for either version of the iPhone 7 for the simple reason that Apple is not directly selling the iPhone 7 in Korea (yet). Doesn't mean the iPhone 7 will not work in Korea.

 

[alphaod]

Compared to my iPhone 6s, I haven't really noticed any difference, though I haven't seen any improvements either...
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I have named it many times: Korea

SK Telecom definitely works fine on the non-CDMA phone.

 

[ahostmadsen]

This is quite interesting. I went again to check on T-mobile, http://www.t-mobile.com/optional-services/roaming.html. Now they do say iPhone 7 does work in Korea. That has changed. One must assume that the update information is more accurate than the original information. So, perhaps the Intel phone does in fact work internationally. I do hope so

 

[Tec972]

With the iPhone 7 and the iPhone 7 Plus, Apple elected to use LTE modems from two different sources, Qualcomm and Intel. The A1778 and A1784 iPhone models use a GSM-only Intel XMM7360 modem while the A1660 and 1661 iPhone models use a GSM/CDMA-compatible Qualcomm MDM9645M modem.

Apple's decision has already caused some disappointment among customers because the GSM-only Intel modem is not compatible with as many carrier networks as the GSM/CDMA Qualcomm modem, and now independent testing conducted by Cellular Insights suggests there are some significant performance differences between the two modems, with the Qualcomm modem outperforming the Intel modem.

Using an R&S TS7124 RF Shielded Box, two R&S CMW500, one R&S CMWC controller, and four Vivaldi antennas, Cellular Insights created a setup to simulate LTE performance at different distances from a cellular tower using two iPhone 7 Plus devices, one with an Intel modem and one with a Qualcomm modem.

The goal of the test was to measure the highest achievable LTE throughput starting at a Reference Signal Received Quality of -85dBm (a strong signal) and gradually reducing the power level to simulate moving away from a cellular tower where signal is weaker. Three LTE bands were tested: Band 12, Band 4 (the most common band in North America), and Band 7.

In all three tests, both the iPhone 7 Plus models offered similar performance in ideal conditions, but as power levels decreased, Cellular Insights saw "unexplainable sharp dips in performance" in the Intel modem, finding a gap "north of 30%" in favor of the Qualcomm iPhone 7 Plus. In the charts, the Qualcomm modem maintains noticeably higher throughput speeds than the Intel modem as signal strength decreases.

In real world conditions, this would suggest the Qualcomm modem does better in areas where the cellular connection is weak, with faster throughput speeds. Cellular Insights describes the Band 12 test below:Cellular Insights also created a chart that compares the edge of cell performance of several different smartphones. The increasing numbers on the X-axis below represent increasingly poor signal strength, while on the Y-axis, a higher throughput number indicates better performance. The iPhone 7 Plus with an Intel modem demonstrates the poorest performance of all phones tested.

According to Cellular Insights, in every single test, the iPhone 7 Plus with a Qualcomm modem "had a significant performance edge" over the iPhone 7 Plus with an Intel modem.

For more information on the testing methodology and greater technical detail on the results, make sure to check out Cellular Insights' full comparison article.

Article Link: iPhone 7 Plus Qualcomm LTE Modem Outperforms Intel LTE Modem by Significant Margin

[doublepost=1477104388][/doublepost]This is not a surprise folks! This was known about before the iPhone 7 even released. It was reported that the AT&T phones were going to be using a crummy intel modem for the first time since early iPhone models and that it would be worse than Qualcomm's. Why? Because Apple sucks like that and they don't care about shafting their customers. They probably saved money and that's all they really care about.

The fact that thee 32Gb phone is slower shouldn't be a surprise either. This is common with USB drives in smaller vs. larger capacity drives within same model lines.

 

[Wowereit]

Easy choice, in Germany you aren't even able to get the Qualcomm modem.

 

[ephemeralreason]

In order to save a few $ by pitting suppliers against each other, Apple shortchanged their customers. I have the Intel version, and I'm very upset with this. First, it is severely constrained when traveling abroad. And now, even when at home, it is inferior to the same price Qualcomm version. Shame on you Apple. Give a partial refund to customers with an Intel modem. You sell two products at the same price, one is clearly inferior to the other, but you don't tell customers. You should charge less for the Intel version.

Given that GSM is the standard in most of the rest of the world, I wonder why you state that iphones with intel modems are "severely constrained when traveling abroad". Perhaps I'm mistaken but I believe that China is the only other major country with significant CDMA infrastructure.

 

[zhenya]

I'm thinking that in practice this is a non-issue. I just spent a couple of days working in the rural hills of southwestern PA tethering my iPhone 7 with Intel modem, usually with just barely 1 bar of LTE. Connection speeds were still fast enough that I could hardly tell the difference from my 50Mbps home connection, and my phone seemed to have a bit more reliable connection than my co-worker's 6s+.

 

[mrgq]

Why oh why doesn't Apple single source these key components,

Nothing ticks off a customer more than the feeling that their phone is performance-disadvantaged to other same model iPhones due to chance.

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Why oh why doesn't Apple single source these key components,

Nothing ticks off a customer more than the feeling that their phone is performance-disadvantaged to other same model iPhones due to chance.

Not only this is a problem but it will greatly impact the resale value of the phone. Those with Qualcomm modems will be able to sell the phone (unlocked) to basically anyone. Those with Intel modems can only sell their phones to people on ATT or T-Mobile. You basically are paying the same for an inferior product. This will likely end in a class action lawsuit for apple.

 

[wigby]

A buyer does not care really if he has a Samsung vs TSMC SOC, but he/she would really care if the the phone they're buying from you will/will not work on their network. So your claim of equivalence is moot. There's this thing called supply/demand and when you have 2 iphone 7's for sale, which do you think will have a better price? The one that only works on 2 networks vs the one that will on all networks? A TSMC/Samsung iphone 6s works on ANY NETWORK in the US.

Sure, to 10% of the buyers it might matter. People hate carrier contracts and yet most stay with the same carrier for years. Carriers know this and so do buyers and sellers. If you're buying an iPhone to work on your network, you're not going to worry if it works on other networks too in case you might change carriers down the line. The only people that think like that are heavy travelers and sellers on Ebay that ask an extra $25 for that phone.
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Not only this is a problem but it will greatly impact the resale value of the phone. Those with Qualcomm modems will be able to sell the phone (unlocked) to basically anyone. Those with Intel modems can only sell their phones to people on ATT or T-Mobile. You basically are paying the same for an inferior product. This will likely end in a class action lawsuit for apple.

If you go on Ebay right now you can see about a $25 price difference between unlocked phones and carrier specific phones. No big deal.