iPhone Analysis and Palm Perspective

[matticus008]

Furthermore: If it had a very large battery, wouldn't they get a better talk-time than 5 hours then, considering that the screen is turned off when in phone position?

Every phone's screen turns off when you're on the phone. Whether it's 2 seconds or 5 seconds into the call doesn't really make a terribly huge difference. The only thing new about the iPhone in this regard is that it disables the touch surface and automatically turns off the screen with a sensor, rather than with a timer.

Well, the iPod doesn't have an on/off button either. It seems logical that you would hold the wake button down for 5 seconds or so to shut it off.

Yep. Even smartphones with power buttons don't turn off when you press the power button (it just turns the screen off, and depending on settings, sometimes the BT/wifi). You have to hold the button down to invoke a shutdown--and then suffer through the agonizingly long boot process, which is why no one actually turns them off.

 

[Zadillo]

oh, how about palm tx?
these are only products of palm with large screen and Wi-Fi

The Palm TX is ok, although even when it first came out the initial reaction was kind of lukewarm (pretty much because it was seen as Palm FINALLY responding to thinks people had been asking for in a Palm PDA for a couple of years..... and by the time the TX came out, it had already been leapfrogged by Windows Mobile-based PocketPC's).

Having said that, really, what exactly are you looking for the device to do? If you're looking for it to be a music player or web browser, I really might suggest looking elsewhere. Even with the TX's or LifeDrive's big screen, Blazer is still a pretty crippled browser.

The bigger thing is that I have a hard time recommending buying into the Palm OS platform now unless you just really like the Palm UI and third party apps available for it. It just seems a little strange to get into the Palm market now, especially with the existing Palm OS dead in the water (Palm isn't doing anything with it, and the new owners of the Palm OS, Access, are working on a new OS called the Access Linux Platform which is intended to be the successor to the Palm OS, but not a whole lot is known about it). Palm themselves seem to be hedging their bets by offering Windows Mobile-based Treos, while trying to make what little incremental improvements they can to the Palm OS on the Treo line.

But Palm has really seemingly given up on the non-Treo PDA market. Not only that, they are encouraging developers to make Treo-only apps, and really pushing that as the main development platform.

Of course, the Windows Mobile PDA market is also facing similar issues; with most of the hardware development coming in Windows Mobile smartphones, etc.

-Zadillo

 

[Zadillo]

Every phone's screen turns off when you're on the phone. Whether it's 2 seconds or 5 seconds into the call doesn't really make a terribly huge difference. The only thing new about the iPhone in this regard is that it disables the touch surface and automatically turns off the screen with a sensor, rather than with a timer.


Yep. Even smartphones with power buttons don't turn off when you press the power button (it just turns the screen off, and depending on settings, sometimes the BT/wifi). You have to hold the button down to invoke a shutdown--and then suffer through the agonizingly long boot process, which is why no one actually turns them off.

Yeah, I never turn my Treo off. No point.

I have to say I like the idea of the proximity sensor, not to mention the multitasking capabilities of the iPhone; with my Treo, I've always wanted to be able to be on a call and look up something on the web while talking with someone, and can't do it. That was one of the cooler parts of the demonstration to me at least. Multitasking on the Treo in general seems like a pain.

 

[pianojoe]

I've had a Treo 650 for a year and a half, and was thinking about upgrading to a Treo 680 or even maybe a 750w (as much as I dislike Windows Mobile), but those devices both look like jokes now.

I'm upgrading my Treo 650 to a 680 right now. No good waiting for a Phone that will be available in fall (over here in Germany). What I'd like to see:

1. 3rd party apps. I'm a musician, and I have my metronome, tuner, and a pro drum machine on my Treo. This is so handy! Anyone fore VoIP?

2. 3G/UTMS. Online flat rate is $30/month.

3. iSyncing not only via dock, but also via internet AND BT! Please! Cables are so last century.

4. I'm not concerned about battery life. 5hrs talk usually means 100hrs standby, right?

About branding: Over here there's a new business model: Some phone shops take over the phone that you get from your service plan, and give you another phone (for some extra $$, it's clear). This is cool if your carrier doesn't offer the phone model you want.

Phones that don't come with a plan seem to be rare in the U.S. I'm sure Apple will offer a non-branded iPhone in Europe. But without carrier subsidisation, it'll cost $799 or so. Plus 19% tax.

Anyway, I'm going to get me one.

 

[pianojoe]

Why modem? Of course!

Modems? Is this 2007 or 1980? Using a traditional modem (tethering) is a thing of the past. Who does that? Between WiFi in McDonalds to Broadband cards, why would I want to kill my Cell phones battery and lug around an unnecceary cable?

Believe it or not: I often go online with my MacBook in strange places where WiFi is not available, or heavily overpriced. Connecting to my cell phone via BT (Look, mum! No cable!), and using the Treo as a modem. Works like a charm. The MacBook doesn't have a card slot. Nor has my other notebook, a Powerbook 12".

Actually, not having a modem (which every peasant Nokia phone from three years ago had) would be a dealbreaker for me.

 

[RollTide]

not that it is a big deal or anything, but is it a video camera on the iphone, or regular?

 

[sigamy]

Palm still has the LifeDrive on their site for $399. The iPhone is a much, much better LifeDrive and Treo.

Palm is hurting.

 

[Zadillo]

Palm still has the LifeDrive on their site for $399. The iPhone is a much, much better LifeDrive and Treo.

Palm is hurting.

I have to think the only reason Palm hasn't even bothered lowering the price of the LifeDrive on their site is that no-one is even thinking of buying one of them.

 

[edoates]

Eh, it's not that easy. Just getting the case open is a pain, and one false move and you tear a tiny ribbon cable and you're SOL. Or, you have to be without the device for a few days--as I said, not a tragedy for a luxury item, but undoable for someone who needs their phone every day.

I agree: internal replacement is not a good idea unless the phone is built for it. I was advocating external add-on battery packs. Since the iPhone is so thin, I can imagine a 1/4 inch thick battery pack into which the iPhone slides with the iPod connectors mating. Not the most elegant, but it will likely be among the first accessories if battery life turns out to be an issue.

Ed

 

[whatever]

Ahem.

In the past three days, I spent 4+ hours sitting in airports, (LAX and SFO) with NO public WiFi capability. You want WiFi?.. you have to pay TMobile $20/day. A business-class phone needs to be able to be used as a modem to access wireless services with your laptop. (Or you can buy a card for that, but that's a separate data charge for that).

Did Jobs announce that 3rd party developers were welcomed?... not yet.

He did say no wireless synching. That sucks. Having to dock to charge, and to just update your contacts bites.

So you want "free" WiFi. Do you also think that airport restauarants should give you their food for free too. I don't understand where people get off about having to pay for a service or a product. Did you know that some airports don't have any WiFi (or even a McDonalds)? I bet if you really needed to use the Internet or were in the airport for a couple of hours you would pay the $20.00.

A business class phone? What is that? You're talking business class, yet you or your company won't pay $20.00 for WiFi access? Something sounds off here.

A lot was not said in the Keynote, until there is an approved product that can be sold why should any promises be made. We were basically given an overview of the product. That's it.

When he said no wireless syncing, what was he referring to? Some people consider connecting to an e-mail service and downloading messages as syncing. Does that mean that won't be available? I'll answer that one, No. I beleive that the syncing that he's referring to is syncing up on the iPod side of things.

And how do you know that 3rd party developers aren't currently developing apps for this product?

 

[mick4394]

In the past three days, I spent 4+ hours sitting in airports, (LAX and SFO) with NO public WiFi capability. You want WiFi?.. you have to pay TMobile $20/day. A business-class phone needs to be able to be used as a modem to access wireless services with your laptop. (Or you can buy a card for that, but that's a separate data charge for that).

So you want "free" WiFi. Do you also think that airport restauarants should give you their food for free too. I don't understand where people get off about having to pay for a service or a product. Did you know that some airports don't have any WiFi (or even a McDonalds)? I bet if you really needed to use the Internet or were in the airport for a couple of hours you would pay the $20.00.

A business class phone? What is that? You're talking business class, yet you or your company won't pay $20.00 for WiFi access? Something sounds off here.

I think what wildmac means is that people tend to say things like, who needs 3G when you have Wifi?, as if there's free Wifi everywhere. He's not saying it should be free, just pointing out that it isn't.

I think you're connecting a lot of dots that aren't there.

 

[ssh]

I can't wait

The iPhone replaces my Treo 650 the moment I can get one. A real multitasking operating system, a human interface instead of a "user" interface, and a decent iPod all put together. I'm there. I'll miss the one eBook application that I use, but I'll live without it for the rest of this.

Frankly, the iPhone can't be worse than my Treo in terms of stability, and I expect it will be closer to my MacBook. Bring it on!

Those comments from Palm are just proof that they really don't understand the market, even after all this time. They don't understand the need for a real OS (where's their Linux one that's been promised?!?!), they don't understand that the phone has to first be a great phone and just work, and they have been sitting on their PalmPilot laurels for years. Wake up, Palm, or you're toast.

 

[whatever]

I think what wildmac means is that people tend to say things like, who needs 3G when you have Wifi?, as if there's free Wifi everywhere. He's not saying it should be free, just pointing out that it isn't.

I think you're connecting a lot of dots that aren't there.

Actually I think all of us are making assumptions about a product that we still know very little about.

I just watched a couple of the Mac Break podcasts from the show and that's the general concensus.

Until users actually get the product in their hands everything here is just hearsay and rumor. But then again this is MacRumors! I can't believe I've once again allowed myself to be suckered into this.

 

[Jim Campbell]

Sorry if I've missed this elsewhere ...

... But one potential killer feature I'm surprised no-one's speculated on yet (that I've seen) ...

What if the iPhone runs Apple Remote Desktop?

Think about that for a minute. Instead of having a smaller, crappier version of your computer inside your mobile, your mobile is a portable terminal for your home computer.

You don't need a separate e-mail account/address for your phone, because you can access your main e-mail, and everything else on your computer via your mobile.

Just a thought ...

Cheers!

Jim

 

[2ndPath]

... But one potential killer feature I'm surprised no-one's speculated on yet (that I've seen) ...

What if the iPhone runs Apple Remote Desktop?

Think about that for a minute. Instead of having a smaller, crappier version of your computer inside your mobile, your mobile is a portable terminal for your home computer.

You don't need a separate e-mail account/address for your phone, because you can access your main e-mail, and everything else on your computer via your mobile.

But all applications on your desktop are set up to be controled with a keyboard and mouse. Thus they probably cannot be controled nicely with the touch screen. At least presently remote desktop does nothing else than displaying the normal user interface on a remote screen and transmitting the keyboard and mouse commands from that screen. Opposed to this, the applications running on the iPhone have a user interface optimezed for the touchscreen and small display size.

 

[jettredmont]

If my wife's Treo broke, it would be a catastrophic event. She keeps her whole life on that damn thing.

There's the problem.

Why are people happy with their "lives" ghettoized to a device? I absolutely, positively hate that. I'm a lot closer to having a working sync solution now with my Treo and Missing Sync, but things shouldn't be so hard. I shouldn't have to periodically do some voodoo over my Treo to get it to sync again (I am convinced that the problem is with Windows Mobile, not Missing Sync; they've done an admirable job reacting to a really flaky system). I shouldn't have to keep telling WM5 that the change Entourage made really was correct and I don't want it to undo it. I shouldn't have to re-enter things like speed dials and settings and call logs if I replace my Treo.

It should all just work. If my Treo gets run over by a train, I'll lose anything I put in it since the last sync, but otherwise I should just need to pick up a replacement Treo at the nearest kiosk, sync everything back over, and be on my way as though nothing happened.

That's how things should be. There's no reason why our cell phones should be so locked up, why people should feel like if that device fails on them they've lost all memory of events and contacts. Move out of the ghetto! Hopefully Apple's phone fixes this. From what I've seen, I have some very high hopes that it does!

 

[jettredmont]

Steve said that phone calls are the killer app for the iPhone, but I think he's being disingenuous. You can get any number of phones that make acceptable calls. The UI is the killer app on the iPhone. As mentioned everywhere, this phone has few truly "new" features, but what it has is implemented so seamlessly, so elegantly that they seem like a whole new experience.

"Killer App" has two manifestations.

1. It's the app that makes Platform X a viable platform, something which will drive people to adopt Platform X.
2. If you are introducing a new take on Platform X, you had better make damned sure you either flawlessly run its Killer Apps, or that you have a viable alternative.

Phone calls are the killer app of mobile phones. This sounds obvious, but IMHO that's been lost on many mobile phone makers.

 

[mick4394]

There's the problem.

Why are people happy with their "lives" ghettoized to a device? I absolutely, positively hate that. I'm a lot closer to having a working sync solution now with my Treo and Missing Sync, but things shouldn't be so hard. I shouldn't have to periodically do some voodoo over my Treo to get it to sync again (I am convinced that the problem is with Windows Mobile, not Missing Sync; they've done an admirable job reacting to a really flaky system). I shouldn't have to keep telling WM5 that the change Entourage made really was correct and I don't want it to undo it. I shouldn't have to re-enter things like speed dials and settings and call logs if I replace my Treo.

It should all just work. If my Treo gets run over by a train, I'll lose anything I put in it since the last sync, but otherwise I should just need to pick up a replacement Treo at the nearest kiosk, sync everything back over, and be on my way as though nothing happened.

That's how things should be. There's no reason why our cell phones should be so locked up, why people should feel like if that device fails on them they've lost all memory of events and contacts. Move out of the ghetto! Hopefully Apple's phone fixes this. From what I've seen, I have some very high hopes that it does!

I hope Apple gets it right, but I'm not that optimistic. The lack of Outlook support is a big deal, especially for those corporate types.

 

[theheadguy]

I don't know ... 3G seems redundant with Wi-Fi.

I can't imagine where I'd be out in the middle of nowhere and then bam, have to surf the net or check email at 700 kbps.

This is funny to look back on!

 

[Daysight]

No kidding! I was a Palm early adopter and resisted getting a "smartphone" back in the early days. Times certainly have changed. Good chuckle.