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I think (hope) you may be seeing both quite soon. The number of possible spin off products from this technology is huge. Both simpler as in a wi-fi (but no phone service) iPod (with all the apps) to a tablet with optional mouse, keyboard and pen seem to me to be do-able. I am drooling at the thought!


I agree. I may buy an iPhone just to play with the technology, but would love to have an iPhone nano (just phone), iPhone P-nano (w/ camera), iPhone V-nano (w/ video camera), and iPhone Beachcomber--9" x 12"x 1/2" tablet which you could use on the beach to read/surf about anything without worrying about wind, etc. (or on subway/bus/train, but that's boring).

BTW, everyone keeps talking about how expensive it is, without looking at the big picture. It's not really $600, and it is subsidized. AT&T's plans are priced anywhere from $10 to $20/mo. under what they reasonably could be. That translates to a subsidy of anywhere from $240 to $480 over the contract term. At the mid-point of $360 ($15.mo.), you're really paying only $240 for a handheld OSX enabled computer/ipod/phone/camera/wifi/etc., plus an additional $1.25/day ($35) for unlimited data/wifi on the fly. That's less that a small cup of plain coffee/day.
 
OT-Not just AAPL

Why is Apple!Fre@k posting negative comments about a flooded market and big hits to stock price??????????? This sure looks like the kind of crap that is posted by "bashers" (those constantly posting negatively intended to move stock price down for their own purposes, or paid to do so by hedge funds who can make $$$ on small price drops) on financial message boards such as the now discredited yahoo. Look at the yahoo financial message board for aapl sometime and you'll see exactly what I mean. Or like the negative "hit pieces" which have been run on cnbc recently.

ALL of the Yahoo message boards for stocks I used to read disintegrated into crap over the last 2-3 years. Now I don't read them at all. I read investorvillage.com. They're better for the ones I read about, but yahoo's boards just have losers.
 
First impresssions

First off- it is simply WAY better than I thought it would be. The reviewers have been very cautious. It is heavier than I thought it would be but the screen seems huge and the quality of the image is astounding.

The keyboard. There is audible feedback and that helps but in fact I was doing reasonable two thumbs typing immediately. I made less mistakes over the time it took to do two emails and the error correction facility is superb-- you just have to trust it and not backspace to correct errors!!!

The sycing of almost 2G of music took the same short time it did for my other iPods. The contact list was PERFECTLY imported with all my annotations coming over just a they are laid out in my Address Book. My other phones never could do this right, often making multiple entries under the same name with the fields incorrectly populated... not so, the iPhone.

This is one stunning device-- there IS NO other phone like it no matter what the panicked competitors are saying.

A word of praise for the ATT store-- they had about 100 phones and informed the 100th person that that was that-- some 5 hours before we got into the store which was great. They also kept a list of the order that people lined up, assigned everyone a number and let the first 5 people in at 6pm.
They had an escort who thanked each person for his/her patience, introduced you to your server based on whether you wanted a 4G or 8G iPhone, who said to pick accessories while a "runner" got the phone. In less than 5 minutes it was all over! Well done! I hate phone stores but this time it was a pleasure to go there. The staff was not very clued up about OSX but my server said, "After what I keep hearing from you guys, I am getting a Mac!" "So am I," said the escort. I think this phone is going to increase Mac sales no matter what analysts might say.
 
NYC Soho store still has 8 & 4 iPhones

I decided to skip yesterday's insanity and order on line. :)

I went to the Soho story at 9:15 this morniing to check the display iPhone out and was pleaantly surprised they still had plenty of 8 and 4 GB iPhones. I was out of there and back home in 10 minutes. Cancelled on-line order and unboxing 8GB iPhone now.

:)
 
My understanding is quite the opposite. Assisted GPS is already in the phone. It's required in the United States by the FCC. So I don't think the phone would have gotten FCC approval without it. AGPS also works more reliabily without line-of-sight to the GPS satellites because it also uses triangulation with the cell phone towers. My understanding is that the service providers have resisted making this information available to customers because it might creep them out to know this information is available to the service provider.

AGPS is not required and AGPS is much different then triangulation.

E911 is what is required, which can be satisfied using AGPS among many other things.

IN other words the iPhone can fully support E911 requirement but that doesn't imply that the phone knows anything about its actual location.
 
Fun

I got to my local mall about 2 hours and 20 minutes before 6, and the line of about 40 people was a blast. Everyone was excited and fun. The guy next to me even got our group a beverage from Starbucks. Speaking of Starbucks, they actually rolled a cart along the line and distributed free coffee and water. Godiva chocolate distributed coupons for a free chocolate, too. During the wait, we talked with others in line, read a little, and worked on the computer. It was definitely a fun way to spend the afternoon.

Also, the store manager came around and assured us that everyone would get an iPhone, and if there was some hiccup, we could call him and he'd make it right. I wish Apple retail employees were always this thoughtful. Again, the whole experience was great fun.
 
Whatever "strategy" might be behind the 2-3 weeks ship time, it totally pissed me off. I got on apple.com at 6:01, put an 8GB iPhone in the cart, went to check out, chose the 2-3 day delivery and then saw the shipping time and said "screw you Apple!" After waiting all these months, the Apple website can't even ship out the product they've been hyping non-stop for maybe 2-3 weeks?! To me, that's ridiculous. Why didn't they allow pre-orders online so that they could gauge their inventory better? Or why not have several thousand available for shipping right away and then go to 2-3 weeks for later orders? As someone who's purchased a MacBookPro, G5, G4, iMac, 80GB iPod, iPod Shuffle, etc., etc. I was really excited about getting an iPhone. But now that I see how difficult Apple is making it to actually GET the product they've been dangling in front of people for months, I'm not so excited. It's like over-hyping a movie and then when you get to the theatre premiere they tell you can buy the ticket -- but you have to wait a few weeks before you can go in and see the movie. The Apple Online Store with no immediate delivery for their latest product? To me that's just not good customer service! For someone who's been a loyal customer and has spent thousands with Apple, I would have thought they'd have made it easier to actually buy and RECEIVE what they sell. I'm sure I'm not the only one who went online eager to spend $600 and then had second thoughts when the delay became apparent. I guess 'instant gratification' isn't part of their sales strategy...

no one feels sorry for you. in fact, if you wanted the device so badly, you wouldn't of been lazy and tried to order it online but got IN LINE with everyone else.

so stop crying about "not being able to order from apple online and waiting 2-4 weeks"

While I would love an iPhone, I don't think it's quite worth the investment, especially with cellphone service so expensive. I already pay enough as it is just for voice and text, which to me, is much more important than data transfer. For the average consumer, the iPhone is superfluous.

going to have to say your wrong here, its simply better than other phones and you will never know until you get your hands on it. the commercials do no jusitce. this is a device you have to touch to believe
 
I got to my local mall about 2 hours and 20 minutes before 6, and the line of about 40 people was a blast. Everyone was excited and fun. The guy next to me even got our group a beverage from Starbucks. Speaking of Starbucks, they actually rolled a cart along the line and distributed free coffee and water.

Wait for the cross-promotions, discounts, etc. with Starbucks, MacDonalds, and everyone else with WIFI.
 
I'm using the iPhone to type this post. Watching the news coverage and reading the blogs I think a lot of people are missing the point.

Yes the features are incredible and some of them also need some work. That will come, as it usually does with technology. And in the case of iPhone, the beauty is that those design improvements can largely be addressed in software updates that will be very easy to run from the iTunes management.

The real point here is the overall concept. We can talk about features all we want but the real advantage iPhone has over the competition is in the usability and elegance of the user interface and service.

This not only includes the phone itself, which has a very intuitive interface, but also the management of content, upgrades,even initial setup and registration. In addition to the ridiculously easy setup, consider the planning and execution around getting hundreds of people through the Apple stores so quickly and with courtesy. I went to a store at 6pm and there were 400 to 600 people who all got one or two iPhones within an HOUR. How many stores have you been to where you wait 15-20 minutes for service when the place is hardly busy?


The real revolution here is that Apple has raised the bar tremendously on service and usability, the user experience and expectations.
 
I'm using the iPhone to type this post. Watching the news coverage and reading the blogs I think a lot of people are missing the point.

Yes the features are incredible and some of them also need some work. That will come, as it usually does with technology. And in the case of iPhone, the beauty is that those design improvements can largely be addressed in software updates that will be very easy to run from the iTunes management.

The real point here is the overall concept. We can talk about features all we want but the real advantage iPhone has over the competition is in the usability and elegance of the user interface and service.

This not only includes the phone itself, which has a very intuitive interface, but also the management of content, upgrades,even initial setup and registration. In addition to the ridiculously easy setup, consider the planning and execution around getting hundreds of people through the Apple stores so quickly and with courtesy. I went to a store at 6pm and there were 400 to 600 people who all got one or two iPhones within an HOUR. How many stores have you been to where you wait 15-20 minutes for service when the place is hardly busy?


The real revolution here is that Apple has raised the bar tremendously on service and usability, the user experience and expectations.

wow that must have taken a while to type on the iphone! Do you like the virtual keyboard? Do you find it takes a while to type, or just about the same as a trio or something...?
 
"Raidersmojo

no one feels sorry for you. in fact, if you wanted the device so badly, you wouldn't of been lazy and tried to order it online but got IN LINE with everyone else.

so stop crying about "not being able to order from apple online and waiting 2-4 weeks"


Not looking for anything from anyone -- just relating my experience. If I could have been in line at AT&T I would have. And there is only 1 Apple store in the entire state and it is not close by.

My point was, for all the "loyal" and new customers who were ready to buy on the spot and couldn't get to an Apple store or their AT&T store ran out, apple.com should have been a more viable option. A 2-3 week wait, after whipping up a frenzy to get people to buy the product for the last 6 months, seems counter-productive to cashing in on the hype. But that's just my reaction -- I expected to be able to buy one online with express shipping.

I'm sure the shipping times will shorten after 7/4, but the initial shipping delay yesterday gave me time to think twice instead of just hitting that "buy" button. Not what you want someone to do in a sales situation. But I'm talking to Mac maniacs here, so I don't expect much sympathy. Just trying to look at it from the perspective of people who may have been on the fence about buying and got caught up in wanting one on June 29th or soon after. Apple didn't deliver online and that's just my opinion.

And not to belabor the point, but according to the Houston Chronicle today, AT&T will be shipping phones in 2-3 DAYS to the people who couldn't get one after they ran out...

"June 30, 2007, 10:37AM
On your mark, get set, activate that iPhone

By PURVA PATEL, ASHLEY HARRIS and DWIGHT SILVERMAN
Copyright 2007 Houston Chronicle

They waited. They bought. They activated.

On Friday evening, buyers of iPhones in Houston, some of whom had waited in line all night, finally got their bragging rights.

After months of hype and at least a week of hysteria, the phone went on sale at 6 p.m. Friday at five Houston-area Apple stores and about 50 AT&T stores.

Forty-nine of 50 AT&T stores were sold out by 8 p.m., spokesman Dan Feldstein said. Apple did not have a sales report available. AT&T stores with no iPhones in stock will take reservations and ship them to consumers on a first-come, first-served basis in three to five days, he said. Apple also began online sales Friday evening."
 
i phone

I am pumped about the new iphone and have made a new blog. Please come and post anything you have on your mind about it, My blog also has many links about anythng you need to know about the iphone.

Thanks, chris
 
So I drove about 45 mins south to the nearest Apple store this morning and picked up an iPhone. ...just waiting for iTunes 7.3 and 10.4.10 to download on my MBP before the fun begins.

The device feel VERY solid... liking it so far. Also I played with one in the store while waiting in line... the virtual keyboard works well for me and I was able to type fairly well with two thumbs from the get go (I have average sized hands)
 
I love it

This thing is amazing! I love it. Way better than I thought it would be. Major lust factor will keep em' selling. The T-Mobile store across from the Apple store last night looked really pathetic. :)

I can only imagine what the CEOs of major phone companies are thinking as they try this thing.

Apple does it again. :apple:
 
count me as also a little pissed about the 2-4 weeks listed on the apple site. I missed getting an 8gb at my local at&t hole....errr, store by about 8 people. The line moved soooo slow there and the nearest apple store is 2 1/2 hours away from me. If that 2-4 weeks doesn't change in the next couple of days i'm going to rage. I haven't heard of one apple store selling out but the online store is a 2-4 week wait??? :mad:
 
iPhone Is Missing Several Key Features That Keep Me From Wanting One

Great. Now we can finally put all this iPhone crap to rest and focus back on Mac.
Thank you.
Am I the only one who does not give a damn about iPhone? Bring on Leopard, iLife an Mac updates!!!
Nope You're not alone at all.
ha, ill second that!
Third..... lol
...fourth...
Yay iPhone!

Now can we get back to rumors about macs? :p
Really.
I think the same... bring innovation to Mac:apple:
Zactly. Bring on the Stoakley-Seaburg 8 Core Mac Pros in August please.
While I would love an iPhone, I don't think it's quite worth the investment, especially with cellphone service so expensive. I already pay enough as it is just for voice and text, which to me, is much more important than data transfer. For the average consumer, the iPhone is superfluous. But a lot of people on here seem to have bought it just because it's Apple and it's cool and you can swipe your finger across it to do cool stuff. I imagine that a lot of people will pull out the iPhone and use its amazing web browser and whatnot just because they have it, not because they actually need to.

But to those few people who truly need something like the iPhone, to keep up with business easily and whatnot, congratulations to you. The wait is over.

Now, if Apple released a nice touchscreen tablet using iPhone's technology and Leopard's resolution independence... then I'd listen up.

How about an iPhone without the phone? iPod with web browser and Wi-Fi? Make something for the masses, Apple!
Yes.
I think (hope) you may be seeing both quite soon. The number of possible spin off products from this technology is huge. Both simpler as in a wi-fi (but no phone service) iPod (with all the apps) to a tablet with optional mouse, keyboard and pen seem to me to be do-able. I am drooling at the thought!
  • Cant Get Video Out From Headphone Jack in Video iPod or Web Mode
  • Can't Record Video With The Camera
  • Can't Use Voice Commands To Make Calls Which I Use All The Time In The Car
  • Can't Use iPhone As Modem For a Mobile Mac which most others allow
  • Typing on the Virtual Keyboard is Quite Tedius although it may get easier over time
These are the reasons the "Frenzy" is on hold for me. Without Video output and recording capability and Voice Command, I can't rationalize buying one at any price.
 
2 1/2 hours away from me. If that 2-4 weeks doesn't change in the next couple of days i'm going to rage. I haven't heard of one apple store selling out but the online store is a 2-4 week wait???

I drove from mount pleasant mi to novi (like a 2 hour 45 minute drive or so when you stop for gas)

then I stood in line for 6 hours and waited for the phone was 36th in line!

shoulda drove ;)
 
wow that must have taken a while to type on the iphone! Do you like the virtual keyboard? Do you find it takes a while to type, or just about the same as a trio or something...?

You'll have to pardon my laborious response but I think it's important to take a step back and lay some foundation so you really see why I have the opinion I do of the keyboard...

I'm a rather fast typer as it is... but I hate the Treo and the Blackberry. In fact, I've hated PDA's so vehemently I originally refused to buy one until speech to text dictation was incorporated and highly accurate.

I'm typing this from my laptop just so I can get a lot of thoughts through faster... my previous post was just to serve as a sort of "proof of concept" that hey, look, I'm using the iPhone to do this... and it works well.

Here's the thing... I haven't spent much time on a Treo or Blackberry, chiefly because three minutes of fiddling with pulldown menus, etc. drove me up the freaking wall. The interfaces are so nonintuitive that whatever speed is gained on the keyboard is lost in other areas of productivity.

Where most companies tend to approach the problem of UI design like this, "Everyone likes small keyboards, we need a small physical keyboard," that doesn't really solve any problems other than how to be like the next guy to hopefully squeeze out some sales. But innovation requires a different mindset... The kind of mindset that asks, "How and why did it come to BE this way?"

We weren't always using small keyboards. There was a time people had to get used to them. How and why did we go that route? Is there a better way?

Well, there are tremendous gains in productivity and speed from navigating the iPhone interface and those cannot be overlooked... web browsing is ridiculously easy, navigating with depth-nested menus (click an icon, the next set of nested options takes its place, etc.) instead of two-dimensional small-print pull downs that could be endlessly messy and hard to immediately spot where you want go... and so on.

So then we come to the keyboard and it seems like a lot of people think this is going to slow you down. I submit to you that in less than a day I was typing faster on it than the Treo I wanted to throw through the window.

The key is, and this is not Apple RDF or fluff... you really do benefit by starting slow. This will give you time to see how the thing responds, where the buttons are, get the feel for how the auto-correction works, etc, without reading a tutorial. You can read all the tutorials you want, but there's no substitute for patience and experience... you might not notice something if you try going too fast. For example: In a few minutes I noticed that if I hit the wrong key and DON'T lift my finger but slide it to the correct key, wait a fraction of a sec for the key "blowup" confirmation and THEN release, it'll register that letter instead. A physical keyboard WON'T do this... fatfinger and "slide" over and you'll have two keystrokes and need to correct one of them.

Then you've got the autocorrection... It works similar to T9 prediction but a little smarter because the correcting word appears next to, not inline with, the text you're typing. Knowing when to hit the spacebar to accept the correction will seriously speed you up.

So Apple probably approached the problem by first trying to make the overall user experience a lot more direct... there's nothing more intuitive to a human being than manipulating objects in the real world and developing direct hand-eye motor coordination skill. Psych studies show that toddlers who play educational video games do not learn nearly as fast as kids who get more physical hands-on input in the real world. The problem is not the nature of simulation itself... it's how simulation is done. In those educational games, as long as they keep mashing a button eventually some button will produce the right result and often the wrong button will not produce a detrimental response.

Look at the iPhone interface... when you scroll slowly, there's no retained momentum... scroll-stop. Apply more force, and there's momentum... screen keeps scrolling a while. Apply even more force, even more residual scrolling. That's physics simulation. There are many different ways in which these clever design attributes have been incorporated into iPhone to replace the lack of tactile feedback with several layers of feedback.

If you're one of those people like me who stopped after a few minutes of using the iPhone wondering why it feels weird when you go back to a normal computer and why you got acclimated to the iPhone interface so quickly... it's BECAUSE of the way they combined direct object manipulation (e.g. pinching/stretching instead of using a magnifying glass icon and repeatedly clicking) with some basic physics simulation and responses that make operating the iphone as simple as knowing how to move objects anywhere in the real world.

That is the genius of multitouch. Apple would have been fools to put the question backwards and start with a physical keyboard to satisfy current market desire and try to get everything else other than text input to work harmoniously with such a clunky, non-direct input device.

Granted, I can type a LOT faster on a full-size keyboard than a multitouch interface... BUT, let's take a second to think about that. I've been typing on full-size keyboards for almost 30 years. Of COURSE I'm faster on this keyboard... I'm many, many times faster on this than I am on a small Treo keyboard. But within less than a DAY, I'm already typing many times faster on the virtual keyboard than I ever did on a Treo, or a Blackberry or the god-awful conventional phones I've had til now where while using SMS you have to click through each letter on the 10-digit keypad.

I will always be faster on a conventional full-size keyboard as long as I keep using it while I'm using multitouch... Perhaps check back with me in thirty years and see how lightning fast I am on a multitouch keyboard.

It's pretty amazing, I think, how they worked in additional features on the multitouch keyboard (such as the one-touch magnifying glass edit mode) to compensate for where you might ordinarily lose speed... Consider how any other company would have implemented a multitouch keyboard. Do you think with their tendency to follow linear, gradualistic progression (one baby-step tweak at a time, instead of paradigm shifts) that they would have anything even remotely as intuitive if they attempted (and they will very soon) to mimic the iPhone's way of doing things?

I always ask myself what would the iMac have looked like if Dell made it. They'd have started by insisting it cost less than half the iMac and then that condition would hang like a noose around their neck forcing use of cheaper materials... you can just imagine a display swivel arm made of cheap plastic with two tightening knobs at each joint... "Hilarious" is a word that comes to mind.
 
Cant Get Video Out From Headphone Jack in Video iPod or Web Mode
Can't Record Video With The Camera
Can't Use Voice Commands To Make Calls Which I Use All The Time In The Car
Can't Use iPhone As Modem For a Mobile Mac which most others allow

Can't stop moaning, :rolleyes:
Don't buy one then. Jeez!

The iPhone is to the Phone what the Mac Plus was to the personal computer. Maybe it isn't doing everything that everybody can think up (it doesn't double as an egg beater either) but it is a paradigm shift of immense proportions.
 
I'm sort of amazed and disappointed at how myopic some of the opinions expressed here are about the iPhone. Some of you keep saying things about how you're tired of hearing about a phone and want some Mac news. Well, hullo... pay attention. You're seeing Mac news--it's just not labelled as such. The "iPhone" is really a tiny, mobile Mac that can make phone calls and emulate an iPod. Considering that it runs OS X, it's a little hard to argue otherwise.

If you're a Mac fan and want to see the Mac marketshare increase, you should be 100% behind the iPhone. In a sense, it's a trojan horse for getting OS X into people's lives--directly this time, not just by stirring interest amongst iPod owners. If the iPhone sees even a fraction of the success that the iPods saw, I think we're going to see an amazing halo effect and a considerable increase in interest in Macs.

I just don't get why some people are so down on the iPhone. Despite the name, it's really the newest addition to the Mac line.
 
Not Looking For An Egg Beater, Just What Other Phones Already do.

Can't stop moaning, :rolleyes:
Don't buy one then. Jeez!

The iPhone is to the Phone what the Mac Plus was to the personal computer. Maybe it isn't doing everything that everybody can think up (it doesn't double as an egg beater either) but it is a paradigm shift of immense proportions.
  • Cant Get Video Out From Headphone Jack in Video iPod or Web Mode
  • Can't Record Video With The Camera
  • Can't Use Voice Commands To Make Calls Which I Use All The Time In The Car
  • Can't Use iPhone As Modem For a Mobile Mac which most others allow

Those are all normal included features in almost all other cell phones and the iPod - which is what part of the iPhone is advertised to be. I'm not buying one. I thought I made that abundantly clear. And I'm not moaning. I'm shining a light on some rather obvious glaring omissions I've not seen others post here.
 
"The haters offer their assessment. The forums are ablaze with vitriolic rage. Haters pan the device for being less powerful than a Cray X1 while zealots counter that it is both smaller and lighter than a Buick Regal. The virtual slap-fight goes on and on, until obscure technical nuances like, “Will it play multiplexed Ogg Vorbis streams?” become matters of life and death."

stolen from http://www.misterbg.org/AppleProductCycle/
 
I think you hit on something with the observation that it's like a mobile mac. There's enough evidence that Apple is going into mobile computing and communications, and that the iPhone is really the toe in the water product that will usher in a series of multitouch platforms with wifi, 4G/wimax or whatever comes next.


I'm sort of amazed and disappointed at how
myopic some of the opinions expressed here are about the iPhone. Some of you keep saying things about how you're tired of hearing about a phone and want some Mac news. Well, hullo... pay attention. You're seeing Mac news--it's just not labelled as such. The "iPhone" is really a tiny, mobile Mac that can make phone calls and emulate an iPod. Considering that it runs OS X, it's a little hard to argue otherwise.

If you're a Mac fan and want to see the Mac marketshare increase, you should be 100% behind the iPhone. In a sense, it's a trojan horse for getting OS X into people's lives--directly this time, not just by stirring interest amongst iPod owners. If the iPhone sees even a fraction of the success that the iPods saw, I think we're going to see an amazing halo effect and a considerable increase in interest in Macs.

I just don't get why some people are so down on the iPhone. Despite the name, it's really the newest addition to the Mac line.
 
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