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iPhone SDK Limitations: Multitasking, Java, Emulators
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Once they go 3G there is little/no reason they can't do a worldwide rollout very quickly, or at least rollout to Europe/Asian tigers+Thailand/Japan/Australia/New Zealand.
That would solve the problem. Who knows, maybe it's coming for 2.0. We don't know all the new features that will be available by then.
we have to remember that it's not the same osx you find on your desktop or laptop. we know apple had to make modifications and trade-offs in order to "fit" the os into the cell phone, we just have no idea what those were. there are several reasons why this restriction was made, some technical, some business and strategy related, some related with co-operation with other companies. we can't know.
as i commented earlier, modern operating systems are able to handle processes idling (doing nothing) in such a way that there is (virtually) no performance penalty. if a os can't handle that, there is no reason to call it "most advanced smartphone os". in fact, it's about 10 years from state of the art. not 5 years ahead others.
if the process is not idling but doing something, it obviously has a reason for doing so (aim, msn as examples).
further, as i also commented, there are applications a user wishes to use while making phone calls, even more so when emailing.
one more example of multitasking: you might want to listen to music while editing your documents, or playing games. no multitasking -> you won't.
Hey Apple, how about let me decide which apps I want to run on my phone/touch. If I want to have it on AIM all day and it happens use a lot of battery life how about let me make that decision.
I think everyone on here is being a little dramatic. You have some app running that now prevents you from answering the phone right away? If that's the case, then the iPhone itself has problems that need fixing.
I think everyone on here is being a little dramatic. You have some app running that now prevents you from answering the phone right away? If that's the case, then the iPhone itself has problems that need fixing.
I think you are all forgetting that this rule may be designed to help developers as well as the end user. This way, when you design an application and debug it, you are GUARANTEED that it will run the same on everyone's phone, no matter how many other apps they have on it. This is the very first SDK for the iPhone, and getting things to run fast on limited hardware needs to be as simple as possible.
Perhaps, in the future, they could add some background ability, such as a limited % of CPU cycles or network time. It would be a nice thing to have of course, and would be part of a maturing iPhone OS. Apple has shown repeatedly with the iPhone that they are pushing things out the door as fast as they can make them, not holding things back for strategic reasons, so I would hope they could add this someday, perhaps when hardware gets faster?
Perhaps, in the future, they could add some background ability, such as a limited % of CPU cycles or network time. It would be a nice thing to have of course, and would be part of a maturing iPhone OS. Apple has shown repeatedly with the iPhone that they are pushing things out the door as fast as they can make them, not holding things back for strategic reasons, so I would hope they could add this someday, perhaps when hardware gets faster?
AOL and Sun are rather big companies. Heck, Apple probably has business deals with them.
I'm sure that they would allow an exception here. If Apple allowed everybody who wrote an application to do this stuff, then I'm sure the iPhone would get screwed up quickly.
I'm sure that they would allow an exception here. If Apple allowed everybody who wrote an application to do this stuff, then I'm sure the iPhone would get screwed up quickly.
Multi-tasking
The os is quite capable of multitasking (you would know this if you'd used it), and it *is* way ahead of anything else in the metric that matters - user experience. Out of interest, which phone OS do you think is 10 years ahead, WM? Symbian ? meh.
Core apps will multitask, as they do already. So you can listen to music while doing other stuff - for example with the OS as it is now you can edit notes and listen to music.
The restriction on 3rd party apps (save perhaps some like AIM which really would require it) is to stop too many apps running at once, ruining the experience, and also to ensure that apps properly save state at all times. Both of these are laudable goals in a device with a very limited amount of memory and battery power available. The OS wants to be able to quit apps at will, to conserve memory, and it can't do that unless apps are ready to quit at any time and start up very quickly.
Apps will be able to save docs to their own local sandbox, and to internet servers if they wish, the only restriction is they can't share local files between apps - I imagine that will be eased too for certain stuff like media as things mature a bit.
So things like a document editor (see notes which is already available), or a document reader will be quite possible.
The os is quite capable of multitasking (you would know this if you'd used it), and it *is* way ahead of anything else in the metric that matters - user experience. Out of interest, which phone OS do you think is 10 years ahead, WM? Symbian ? meh.
Core apps will multitask, as they do already. So you can listen to music while doing other stuff - for example with the OS as it is now you can edit notes and listen to music.
The restriction on 3rd party apps (save perhaps some like AIM which really would require it) is to stop too many apps running at once, ruining the experience, and also to ensure that apps properly save state at all times. Both of these are laudable goals in a device with a very limited amount of memory and battery power available. The OS wants to be able to quit apps at will, to conserve memory, and it can't do that unless apps are ready to quit at any time and start up very quickly.
Apps will be able to save docs to their own local sandbox, and to internet servers if they wish, the only restriction is they can't share local files between apps - I imagine that will be eased too for certain stuff like media as things mature a bit.
So things like a document editor (see notes which is already available), or a document reader will be quite possible.
Next, maybe Apple can dictate which apps we can write and run on our laptops and desktops </sarcasm>
Give me a break. I grew up believing that the consumer should have the choice if they want apps running in the background, not Apple. Don't be so brainwashed- if you installed a bunch of crap and it slowed down your phone, that's YOUR problem. Apple protecting you from yourself doesn't change the problem, it just masks it.
This entire SDK is so draconian that I'm surprised a picture of Jobs wearing a crown doesn't launch every time you run a third party app. It's certainly not in the spirit of OSS, which Apple pulls a large part of its work from and doesn't give back an equal amount (in fact, they hinder it by buying out products like CUPS). This all the more makes the iPhone look like an expensive toy rather than a real business productivity tool.
The point of having a cell phone that can run programs is so you can do things remotely, without a full laptop. Most of our activities involve the Internet in some way. And, the goal of an iPhone (or similar) is that you can do multiple things with it instead of several limited, single function devices. Not allowing background apps takes away one of the biggest advantages of using a smartphone.
Give me a break. I grew up believing that the consumer should have the choice if they want apps running in the background, not Apple. Don't be so brainwashed- if you installed a bunch of crap and it slowed down your phone, that's YOUR problem. Apple protecting you from yourself doesn't change the problem, it just masks it.
This entire SDK is so draconian that I'm surprised a picture of Jobs wearing a crown doesn't launch every time you run a third party app. It's certainly not in the spirit of OSS, which Apple pulls a large part of its work from and doesn't give back an equal amount (in fact, they hinder it by buying out products like CUPS). This all the more makes the iPhone look like an expensive toy rather than a real business productivity tool.
The point of having a cell phone that can run programs is so you can do things remotely, without a full laptop. Most of our activities involve the Internet in some way. And, the goal of an iPhone (or similar) is that you can do multiple things with it instead of several limited, single function devices. Not allowing background apps takes away one of the biggest advantages of using a smartphone.
Where do you get your information.
It seems to me that it was stated on one of the videos, I think it might of been the frameworks in depth one, I went through all of them in one night.
That multitasked running apps in the background is not supported.
Maybe the hardware supports it, but if the api's don't NO ONE using those api's is going to be able to do it.
There are a lot of things that the os can do but also a lot of compromises.
Just like the mac air, off topic but I've had my mac air for almost a month and love it. I'm wondering if the emulator supports gestures on the macair and macpro.
But back to topic
One of the envangelist stated that once you switch apps the other terminates, they promote a url scheme for one app talking to another.
I've been a developer for some time now, most java spring but I've delved into objective c on more than one occassion.
What I saw in the videos is very very impressive.
Blows the psp out of the water.
No One should be critical until they've watched all videos, and you better get some popcorn I started at 11:30 and finished the last at 2:00 am.
Well be a good consumer then and don't buy from Apple. It's something that has been disclosed upfront, before any third party apps have shipped. It's not like it's going to be sprung on people after they buy a third party app.
Apple wants to maintain a positive user experience, if it's not the user experience that you want, then don't use it. It's just that simple. Go buy a Nokia, Palm, or Android when available.
I'm no longer a student, but think of this workflow before you dismiss multi-tasking, even if just third party apps.
Listening to music in the library, editing class notes notes on your wordprocesser, looking up words in your dictionary, taking glances at a pdf (3rd party, not a converted picture) to check the if your notes are correct.
although you would have to have access to the filesystem for the wordprocesser and pdf viewer to me feasible, the point is that multi-tasking would make such a workflow easier. With the jailbroken touch now, every time you want to switch apps, native or third party, you have to go to the home screen. and most of the thrid party apps fully close, leavihng gaps in the usability of the progs.
The real problem is that with true multi-tasking design, they would have to rethink the UI and add buttons and such to allow the user to indicate whether they would like to close the app or put it in the background and switch to another task, something that they don't worry about now with the simple "press home, go to desktop" setup. although easy to understand, very limited.
I, for one, will jailbreak my touch/phone (when they get the 3G one to Japan) regardless of what they do for 3rd party apps. With access to the filesystem i have beautiful wallpapers (not the grainy compressed ones from the photo app), wikipedia and dictionaries, a text editor, and all the games that people will have with the official progs too. Not to mention probably the best thing, have my background show up behind my icons on the homescreen.
I mean come on, who at Apple thought people would be content with just a black background... Even if you can only choose from preset choices, it makes no difference if you can only see it for a second or two while you uinlock your phone...
Listening to music in the library, editing class notes notes on your wordprocesser, looking up words in your dictionary, taking glances at a pdf (3rd party, not a converted picture) to check the if your notes are correct.
although you would have to have access to the filesystem for the wordprocesser and pdf viewer to me feasible, the point is that multi-tasking would make such a workflow easier. With the jailbroken touch now, every time you want to switch apps, native or third party, you have to go to the home screen. and most of the thrid party apps fully close, leavihng gaps in the usability of the progs.
The real problem is that with true multi-tasking design, they would have to rethink the UI and add buttons and such to allow the user to indicate whether they would like to close the app or put it in the background and switch to another task, something that they don't worry about now with the simple "press home, go to desktop" setup. although easy to understand, very limited.
I, for one, will jailbreak my touch/phone (when they get the 3G one to Japan) regardless of what they do for 3rd party apps. With access to the filesystem i have beautiful wallpapers (not the grainy compressed ones from the photo app), wikipedia and dictionaries, a text editor, and all the games that people will have with the official progs too. Not to mention probably the best thing, have my background show up behind my icons on the homescreen.
I mean come on, who at Apple thought people would be content with just a black background... Even if you can only choose from preset choices, it makes no difference if you can only see it for a second or two while you uinlock your phone...
The way I see it, then you simply don't download it.
But don't stop the rest of us from doing whatever we want.
Sounds like an excellent idea for the majority of users. That way they could install software without risking installing malware too.
As I have already argued at great length in this thread the user in general isn't actually capable of making that decision not to download malware, which is why there is so much spyware on Windows.
And that spyware doesn't just sit there, they can get their personal details stolen, which I have to pay for through higher charges, and they can also get into a botnet for sending spam etc. which I still have to deal with.
As the iPhone already has a 60% and growing webshare, it is very likely to be the first to get a significant mobile virus, forcing the process to be through Apple reduces that risk significantly.
Now if there was a "driving licence" for the internet this issue would go away but unfortunately there isn't.
Do you have any friends that run Windows PCs?
How many of them are running slowly? Full of viruses? Full of spyware? Security vulnerabilities? Software that crashes frequently? Issues of peripherals that don't get along? Incorrect driver versions or conflicting drivers?
... how many of them like to blame Microsoft for making a crappy OS?
... how many of US like to blame Microsoft?
... how many of us are quick to put down Windows for implementing a poor security and admin model that allows these bad things to happen? (And praise OS X, Linux and the like for implementing a stricter security model that does NOT allow these things to happen?)
Or do we say "If your Windows installation gets a virus, gets spyware, becomes unstable, is exploited... that's YOUR fault for installing crap?"
NO, thats called bad development and implementation. And it's hard to believe you would so readily give up such a fundamental and critical part of the platform because you happened to have a bad experience with some buggy firmware.
Ah, I see, treat people like morons and protect them from themselves.
Sounds like the state of the US government right about now.
True, but only allowing one app at a time helps make a bunch of other stuff simpler.
Actually, I run a Windows PC. It works fine and doesn't get bogged down by crap (occassionally it slows down because there is SOOO much Windows software out there you can go crazy downloading free stuff and have to keep track of that, but that's simply too much of a good thing. PC Mag just had their most read online article EVER about 157 free apps, most all were for Windows). I also like to blame Microsoft for making a crappy OS (well, I'm not running Vista, but I blame them for making Vista nonetheless).
However I don't blame Microsoft for the crap that attacks Windows, I blame the people who make the crap. Macs don't get it not because OS X is amazing but because it makes sense to target the 85+ % of people who have Windows rather than the 10+ % who run OS X. Plus, add the hate many hackers feel towards Microsoft, and that only worsens the situation.
Heck, if Macs ever start to get attacked (rumors have been floating around this past year), they'll be WAY more vulneralble. Norton and McAfee work pretty well, but you can't use them on a Mac. Plus, if Microsoft started to up security even more than they did in Vista (considered one of its better upgrades) everyone would start screaming "antitrust."
First of all, there are many legitimate use cases of multitasking that don't have anything to do with "scores of things running in the background slowing it down".
1) instant messaging ?
2) how about receiving information during a phone call which you need to write down?
3) how about checking your address book or accessing other data from another app that you need to provide over the phone to another person?
4) etc
And how dare you spew such unbelievably ignorant and misinformed crap about open source / freeware developers resorting to malware and spyware to "fund" the app development process. The vast majority of open source / freeware developers, including myself, work on an altruistic basis for the community or do it as a hobby. For others, they provide great freeware with an option to upgrade to a paid version or paid updates.
I suggest you get off your high horse and pay a little respect to these open source developers who MADE OSX and the iPhone possible...
That is unbelievable. You want Apple to dictate what software you can install on your own computer? Avoiding malware is actually incredibly easy if you are novice
of computer systems:
1) When you want software, STICK TO WELL REGARDED SOURCES FOR DOWNLOADING. Many of these websites, such as Cnet/download.com, actually pre-review
the software featured on their website for malware, viruses, etc.
2) Also a huge percentage of malware/viruses come from P2P file sharing networks. Stick to legal music, movies, and software and you'll eliminate a huge amount of problems.
3) When browsing on the web, use a browser such as Firefox, Opera, or Safari. Another option is to run IE7.0 in protected mode or use an application like sandboxie which places browsers into a protected sandbox.
Actually I say the later. It's the fault of the novice if they have all these problems. They need to educate themselves from the MYRIAD of resources on the web as to how to properly conduct the download and installation of software, and proper security precautions, such as using secure internet browsers, NOT opening email attachments from unidentified senders, NOT downloading from p2p file sharing networks, and making sure you virus protection and OS are up to date. A few simple precautions go a long way to keeping problems from happening.
Is it the job of anyone to fencing off the sidewalk If people want to go walking straight into south LA late at night to prevent them from being robbed??
Sure and I agree, but the vast majority of people aren't so enlightened and will blame Apple.
Um, I write software too, its also open-source. Check my sig for more details.
If you go to a country like Vietnam, where although they will be rich in 10 years, you do still get scams attempted on you every 5 seconds, it gets old, very old, very quickly. However if you live in a Western democracy you are protected from this and so are already protected more than you know.
