iPhone "SDK" To Receive Improvements, Remain Web-based

[tuartboy]

I believe there have been like 80,000 downloads of AppTapp from distinct IP addresses.

I believe that statistic is not for apptapp, but actually Navizon. So just that 1 app had over 80,000 downloads.

Yeah, I forgot that Skype and VOIP services don't hurt AT&T's bottom line.

They make the same money off my plan no matter what. And they can set their plans to compensate if they have to.

Oh, I also forgot that IM doesn't take away from AT&T's text messaging revenue.

Well, they sure don't for me. I have IM on my phone and I still do over 1,000 txts a month.

I can't recall that free ringtones take away money for the record companies, and that most other services charge $2.50 and don't let you choose the snippet or keep the actual song.

Well, you already bought the song anyway. You are allowed to play it in any form, including your phone (it's probably already on there), so there is nothing legally wrong with ringtones. So, no, no money is being "taken from" the record companies because they never deserved it in the first place. If anything they are charging for the convenience. BTW, more than 50% of the people I have talked to that have tried it hate the fact they have to choose their own sections. Not everybody is an audio editor or likes to do it.

It escaped my mind that MMS is outdated and Apple is abandoning it like many other technologies (Floppy, Modem) to push e-mail as the preferred way of multimedia messaging.

MMS is nowhere near outdated as it is a standard across nearly every phone out there. My other cell phone can't receive emails on it, just MMS.

My memory is absolutely horrible.

No need to be sarcastic. That type of dialogue leads nowhere.

 

[3282872]

I don't see how any customer could be against having the iPhone open for third party development. What Apple are doing in closing up the platform benefits nobody but themselves. For the sake of making a few extra bucks Apple is absolutely crippling the iPhone.

Honestly, I already own an iPhone and had been recommending it to all my friends, but since Apple locked up the device I can no longer recommend it to anyone. In fact, I'm telling everyone to stay well away from the iPhone unless Apple get their head out their ass and open up the platform.

Agreed (but be careful, the kool-aid fan boys might flame you for those remarks). It's funny, I work at Apple, but even I have been disappointed in how the company has handled this fiasco.

I'm just waiting til they start selling applications via iTunes, you know it's going to happen.

 

[Unspeaked]

It's funny to hear a Mac-user dismiss "7%" like it's not worth anything. Is that what you think of yourself as a mac user in a PC-world? 7% share of the computer world Apple does not have, so why should anyone waste their time with it?

Exactly.

I don't think anyone is arguing the the majority of iPhone owners have hacked their phone - that would be ridiculous!

But the number seems to be between 5 and 10 percent, based on all anecdotal evidence, and that's still a whole lot of people.

I mean, how many Macs out there have (non-pirated) copies of Adobe Photoshop on them?

10% 20% at the most? And you don't see anyone ignoring them...

With that attitude, we're lucky we're not running everything in emulation on the Mac, since no one would bother writing anything for it - why waste their time on 4% of computer owners?

 

[Roy Hobbs]

It's funny to hear a Mac-user dismiss "7%" like it's not worth anything. Is that what you think of yourself as a mac user in a PC-world? 7% share of the computer world Apple does not have, so why should anyone waste their time with it?

Many software/hardware companies could care less about the small percentage of Mac users.

 

[tuartboy]

It's funny to hear a Mac-user dismiss "7%" like it's not worth anything. Is that what you think of yourself as a mac user in a PC-world? 7% share of the computer world Apple does not have, so why should anyone waste their time with it?

The problem is that the 7% in question are the most passionate users and could really create problems for Apple. I have gotten Apple at least 1 iPhone, 3 iPods, and probably 10+ macs sold in the last 3 years due to my evangelizing. They lose me and the rest of that 7% and they lose something more powerful than their marketing department could ever come up with.

 

[grappler]

I don't think it's about the phone. This whole situation reeks heavily of what most of us hate so much about other computer/technology companies. Apple was different, but that difference is starting to disappear and this is the first time in the almost 3 years that I have been a customer that I have been really questioning my relationship with Apple as a company.

Exactly. That is exactly it. Customers do not like to be told what to do, or locked into various schemes.

Take Google. They give you email, calendar, documents, blogs, web albums, etc. All kinds of data you have, they'll host on their servers. And you can get it back out any time you like, using standards-compliant formats and protocols. I like keeping my data with them precisely because they respect that it's my data and I can get it back out.

Take myspace. I don't really like the site, but look how well they did by simply letting people customize their own little personal page with whatever awful background they like.

Take Facebook. They gave their platform a big boost by opening it to 3rd party apps. Now if you want to write a social networking application, you can try to convince people to go to your site and enter their info yet again, or you can just build off of what Facebook already has by using their api.

Now take Microsoft. Sure, their stock did great in the 90s, but it has never regained the ground it lost when the first .com bubble burst. I'm sure a lot of the reason is they're already huge and can't keep up that pace of growth, but part of it surely must be their practice of ignoring interoperability standards and customer freedom, and the tremendous ill will those practices generated toward them.

 

[Unspeaked]

The problem is that the 7% in question are the most passionate users and could really create problems for Apple. I have gotten Apple at least 1 iPhone, 3 iPods, and probably 10+ macs sold in the last 3 years due to my evangelizing. They lose me and the rest of that 7% and they lose something more powerful than their marketing department could ever come up with.

Yeah - the sad thing is, you're right. Those 7% *are* the most passionate.

And like me, there's not much imaginable that Apple could do that would make me give up on their computers.

Maybe I'd stop using an iPod, maybe I'd find work-arounds to iLife, but as far as using a Mac and OS X, Steve Jobs would have to come to my house personally, trample on my flowers, kill my kitten, eat all my food and urinate on my front door on the way out while giving me the finger for me to even consider switching to Linux or Windows.

And I'd probably just go back when I saw Leopard!

(Though I'd have a very popular YouTube video to show for it...)

 

[tuartboy]

I'm sure a lot of the reason is they're already huge and can't keep up that pace of growth, but part of it surely must be their practice of ignoring interoperability standards and customer freedom, and the tremendous ill will those practices generated toward them.

That is precisely why I tossed my top-of-the-line AMD Barton +2500 years ago and downgraded to a more expensive 1.5Ghz Powerbook. Great post.

 

[shk718]

really, apple is getting as bad as microsoft in the depth of their control

APPLESOFT

 

[donlphi]

What is the big deal with the 3rd party apps? Let's be honest, many of us on here like Steve Jobs for a reason, he represents the way most of us think... control freaks. If we weren't control freaks, none of us would complain about not having 3rd party apps. We would all just let Apple do what Apple does, which is control everything.

I understand we liked having the Nintendo Emulators and the ability to use the disk space to save things, but some of the apps were just ridiculous and gimmicky more than anything. Is it necessary to have a dock on an iPhone? No, but it looks cool. If you want it "Your Way Right Away", go to Burger King. If you want an iPhone, buy one, but from day one, Apple said they wouldn't support those 3rd party apps.

I think I'll live without my 3rd party apps for now, but for those that can't will hold off on the update. I personally wish I had waited a bit longer for the update, but I started worrying about the "BRICK FACTOR". What is the point of no return?

 

[tuartboy]

Yeah - the sad thing is, you're right. Those 7% *are* the most passionate.

And like me, there's not much imaginable that Apple could do that would make me give up on their computers.

Maybe I'd stop using an iPod, maybe I'd find work-arounds to iLife, but as far as using a Mac and OS X, Steve Jobs would have to come to my house personally, trample on my flowers, kill my kitten, eat all my food and urinate on my front door on the way out while giving me the finger for me to even consider switching to Linux or Windows.

And I'd probably just go back when I saw Leopard!

(Though I'd have a very popular YouTube video to show for it...)

And that is what is so scary. I rely on so many apps that I just can't find in linux. For years I have been installing ubuntu distros as they come out just to see the status of the linux desktop. I have a BS in computer science and I am very comfortable in *nix environments, but I still don't see it as a polished alternative yet. Maybe in a few years. Maybe they will get at least 1 person who is a good UI designer...

 

[grappler]

To me, this is the crux of the matter: Apple wants me to think of the iPhone as a phone. But I don't.

My old Razr was a phone. On the other hand, two out of the three main functions of the iPhone (media player, web browser) are more computer than phone. Two of the main things I do on computers (email, web browsing) I can now do on the iPhone.

I spend way less time in the 'phone' part of the iPhone than the other parts. With my Razr, the phone part of it was the only part of it I used.

Apple can call it a phone, but it is a mobile computer. That's why I bought it. Because I want a mobile computer that also happens to be a phone. My old phone worked just fine.

And one thing I expect when I buy a computer is to be able to install and write programs for it. I assumed, perhaps wrongly, that they were in a hurry and just haven't yet gotten around to putting out a good SDK. I hope I'm not wrong.

 

[arkmannj]

It will all be better when leopard is released..
Apple is just holding the iPhone back because there's features we can't even dream of yet included so they don't want to pull the curtain off

Apple wants to have a killer Leopard release, and make every possible news they can by releasing 10.5, iPhone updates, Apple TV updates etc. all at the same time.

... yes folks someone was trying to tell me this a little while ago.
(Paraphrased, I wish you could have seen their face though.)

 

[Billy Boo Bob]

The iPhone doesn't let you do this?!

Not at the moment... You can drag and drop tunes into a playlist that gets synced to the phone, bit I agree, it would be nice to plug in the USB cable, expand the iPhone listing, and drag/drop fresh tunes into the phone, with easy delete (same as just deleting out of a playlist). Same goes with any video.

Leave the sync options in the way they are... I'm sure some people rely on the "sync most recent", and "sync oldest 5 unwatched" and all that, but I don't... I do manual syncing through checkboxes at the moment. Mainly because some of the items I've already watched on the computer or TV and don't need them synced, but iTunes would see them as unwatched.

 

[arkmannj]

Not at the moment... You can drag and drop tunes into a playlist that gets synced to the phone, bit I agree, it would be nice to plug in the USB cable, expand the iPhone listing, and drag/drop fresh tunes into the phone, with easy delete (same as just deleting out of a playlist). Same goes with any video.

Leave the sync options in the way they are... I'm sure some people rely on the "sync most recent", and "sync oldest 5 unwatched" and all that, but I don't... I do manual syncing through checkboxes at the moment. Mainly because some of the items I've already watched on the computer or TV and don't need them synced, but iTunes would see them as unwatched.

would be nice to do this, and be able to do this on multiple computers
(for songs + computers that are of course authorized on m own iTunes account) between My laptop, My Wifes, 2 Desktops, a mac mini (trying to get everthing sync'd to the mini as a server/focla point but work in progress), an older powerbook that's still kicking around it can be a bit confusing to try and get all of "My music" sync'd onto one machine lol

 

[blybug]

Oh and for God's sake - let me drag and drop individual songs and videos to my iPhone when connected to iTunes. I loathe playlist sync.

I see this complaint come up in all sorts of contexts and just don't get it.

Make a playlist called "iPhone" and drag whatever you want in there to your heart's content. You can even modify the playlist when your iPhone isn't attached. Set the iPhone to sync only with that playlist...volia! When you dock your iPhone it syncs, or just click the sync button if you're already docked.

How is this so much harder or more inconvenient than dragging and dropping "directly" to the iPhone? I'm always for more choices, it would be nice if you could do it both ways, but if you use playlists correctly, it's just not any more difficult the way it's presently implemented.

 

[rlreif]

really, apple is getting as bad as microsoft in the depth of their control

worse...
MS allows me to put whatever i want on a winmo phone

 

[twoodcc]

well i guess that's an improvement. i still want to just see apptapp for 1.1.1

 

[cdarlington1]

don't like your iphone or apple's stance...sell it and buy something else...

d

 

[peharri]

Web based or web technology based?

There's absolutely no issue with the SDK being Javascript and WebKit based. That's a solid, proven, platform that developers already have some familiarity with, and that can easily be sandboxed.

The issues right now have to do with the fact that the SDK is tied to a web browser and the Internet. As long as applications can be downloaded that do not need to access the web to run, and have APIs to access the iPhone's more interesting features, then it should work very well and "native" applications should be very possible.

It would be nice to see Java as an option too, preferably with a custom UI API rather than SWING/AWT/whatever J2ME offers, but Webkit isn't a bad idea - as long as the "tying to a web browser" thing is dealt with.

 

[Unspeaked]

I see this complaint come up in all sorts of contexts and just don't get it.

Make a playlist called "iPhone" and drag whatever you want in there to your heart's content. You can even modify the playlist when your iPhone isn't attached. Set the iPhone to sync only with that playlist...volia! When you dock your iPhone it syncs, or just click the sync button if you're already docked.

How is this so much harder or more inconvenient than dragging and dropping "directly" to the iPhone? I'm always for more choices, it would be nice if you could do it both ways, but if you use playlists correctly, it's just not any more difficult the way it's presently implemented.

Syncing may work for you, but not all of us have the same setup.

If the poster you're replying to is anything like me, they keep their music scattered across several sources that aren't always live on their Mac.

If I had to auto-sync my iPod, I'd constantly get errors about songs missing. I can't even imagine...

 

[Unspeaked]

don't like your iphone or apple's stance...sell it and buy something else...

Wow, it's about time you showed up!

That never occured to me or anyone else who'd like third party apps on the iPhone.

Now we can close all these silly threads and go drink cola from a hilltop...!

 

[Doctor Q]

To me, this is the crux of the matter: Apple wants me to think of the iPhone as a phone. But I don't.

That's a very interesting point, grappler. It's a reverse-bait-and-switch. Apple wants to sell us the iPhone for what it can do now, while we all know it is capable of much more.

 

[arkmannj]

don't like your iphone or apple's stance...sell it and buy something else... d

I don't think people are saying they don't like the iPhone, they're just frustrated at what it has the potential to do and how it's being held back from its true potential

 

[cdarlington1]

Wow, it's about time you showed up!

That never occured to me or anyone else who'd like third party apps on the iPhone.

Now we can close all these silly threads and go drink cola from a hilltop...!

Perfect...see you there.