iPhones to Get These New Satellite Features

[bviktor]

Give us more regions instead of more features...

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

Why in the world are they even dicking around with Globalstar? Starlink is one of the greatest things humans have ever done, I can use it while flying near the speed of sound crossing the Pacific ocean. Why isn't apple doing everything it can to get it into our phones?

Unfortunately this isn't the Politics forum or I could tell you how much of a lunatic the Starlink CEO is. 😉

 

[WarmWinterHat]

You should read up on the technology used by Starlink. They don’t blast out a signal in all directions like old communication satellites but they beam steer a signal to a circle on the earth surface. This means one satellite can simultaneously send/receive from multiple areas of the earth. They also fly lower so latency is much lower and can sometimes be lower if you are communicating to a location far away.

You should also read how it doesn't work indoors, under heavy tree cover, in a moving vehicle, etc. it's good in a pinch, for phones, but it's not going to replace the cell network.

Before we got fiber, we looked into Starlink, but would have to cut down a dozen trees to get a proper view of the sky. Our property, around the house, is completely wooded.

Maybe sometime in the future it will work but it's 100% clear view of the sky at the moment.

 

[Makosuke]

It's interesting that we seem to be moving toward two possible futures in, say, 10-20 years: One in which the terrestrial cell network is mostly or entirely replaced by a satellite network, or one in which the rampant and sloppy expansion of space stuff results in Kessler Syndrome, and we have no satellites in LEO at all.

 

[WarmWinterHat]

It's interesting that we seem to be moving toward two possible futures in, say, 10-20 years: One in which the terrestrial cell network is mostly or entirely replaced by a satellite network, or one in which the rampant and sloppy expansion of space stuff results in Kessler Syndrome, and we have no satellites in LEO at all.

We'll still have both in 20 years. For a multitude of reasons, the terrestrial cell network isn't going anywhere.

 

[Makosuke]

We'll still have both in 20 years. For a multitude of reasons, the terrestrial cell network isn't going anywhere.

I can think of a lot of reasons, both technical and practical, for the terrestrial cell network to remain the primary means of connection for the foreseeable future, but living and traveling in rural areas, and having seen how much infrastructure goes into coverage in rural regions while still resulting in spotty coverage and large dead zones, it wouldn't surprise me to see an improved satellite network iteration supplant at least much/all of the rural infrastructure, in the same way cell networks replaced wired networks in many areas.

 

[Tr55]

There is an elephant in this space, a big huge African elephant which Apple seems to be trying desperately to ignore.

Starlink

Starlink operates at far lower orbits than Globestar which gives it massive advantages.

Amazons Leo is still only an idea, Blue Origin hasn’t even the ability to launch it. Neither has anyone else. Except SpaceX.

 

[WarmWinterHat]

Amazon Leo already has close to 300 satellites in orbit and more on the way. They have been buying launches from spacex but will launch themselves eventually. Spacex doesn't care, and will sell launches to anymore if you're willing to pay. I've read that selling launches to Amazon, helps prevent antitrust action, too..

Starlink is fine, but I don't personally want one company to have a monopoly on satellite internet access, no matter who or what the company is.

 

[pbau]

i hope more EU will be covered by this as well

 

[svish]

Good to hear about this. Unfortunately still waiting on the original set of features to be available in my country. Looks like the new ones too will be limited to US and a handful of countries for the first few years at least.

 

[swm]

You should read up on the technology used by Starlink. They don’t blast out a signal in all directions like old communication satellites but they beam steer a signal to a circle on the earth surface. This means one satellite can simultaneously send/receive from multiple areas of the earth. They also fly lower so latency is much lower and can sometimes be lower if you are communicating to a location far away.

phased array antennas are nothing new, essentially the US version of apple's 5G devices all have a tiny patch of those for 28GHz. but they need
- unobstructed line of sight
- space
- power

starlink relies on Ka and Ku band, so between 12-18GHz and 26-40GHz, and as far I know they've been awarded rights to use E-band (72-90GHz) and V-band (60-70GHz) too. these are - from 26GHz onwards - in the mmWave range, that is the wavelength is less than 1mm. generally said higher frequencies are more light-like, so line of sight is crucial and need a lot of power - something that is not available on your phone. also, it's worth noticing that Starlink uses relatively large dishes (far larger than a cellular device itself) and those suck up almost 100W of power and get hot. you wouldn't want to hold them next to your head. and they have to face upwards - exactly because their phased antenna array nature.

starlink - extremely simplified - is very similar to a wifi repeater, because there's no content up there. whenever one streams a video, it has to be routed through the nearby terrestrial station, up to the satellite in its view and then down to the receiver. same applies to DTC services: even peer to peer calls will need to go through the PGW, which is not in orbit.

as for the distance: there's low earth orbit, which ranges from 160km to 2000km, but many sats usually are in the 700-800km range. the starlink constellation is around 540km height, so about 100x farther than your average cell tower. they planned to have a lower shell around 340km with v-band, but it simply doesn't make sense because of the constant boosting needed to avoid burn up due to orbital decay.

we use lower frequencies in cellular communication, because of the balance
- good enough propagation
- lower power consumption for the same distance
- reasonably high bandwidth

fun fact, spectral-efficiency-wise there's about a 10% difference between LTE and 5GNR, so from the same 20MHz spectrum you can get about 180-200Mbps with LTE, and around 10% more with 5G new radio. the big boost comes from being able to use 100-120Mhz spectrum at ~3500MHz - but here the issue is less optimal propagation (shorter reach) higher attenuation due to obstacles (walls, coated windows). you go higher with frequency, you'll face different challenges: the middle of the v-band you get oxygen absorption, throughout the mmWave range you get various amount of rain fading, absorption from water vapor. the only thing you can use here is either higher transmission power (limited by regulation on you phone) or simpler, more error-proof modulation (lower speed).
that's why I said: there's no free lunch.

 

[lepetitnicolas]

Hey Macrumors, I like you a lot (that's why I'm here 😺) but can you stop with "annoying" titles please. What do I mean by "annoying" ? Let me explain.... imagine if all my comments on your forum would be something like : 

• Surprising iPhone feature I just discovered.
• 1 reason not to buy an Android
• My comment will show you 3 shocking facts about iPhones.

I get it it's 2026 you want to be "cool" and attract young people who didn't know "the internet" is not just Facebook+Instagram+Youtube and subscriptions is not something normal, I get it, I totally follow you in that idea of attracting new people to the Apple side of things and opening people's minds to something new and different 🍎 but please please please in doing so don't en 💩 ify yourself. Don't become an other dumb website for millennials (I think now we have to say "Gen Z" ?) full of crappy titles and astonished faces (you don't know what I mean ? Look at YouTube thumbnails and video titles and you'll understand).

That being said I like you a lot. I just don't want you to become crappy like .... like pretty much everything we see on the internet nowadays 🙄

Thank you

 

[chucker23n1]

And the latency of cellular networks couldn't compete with copper wire phone lines.

Nobody is trying to play call of duty 🎮 on satellite 🛰️ internet 🛜

The original assertion was: "This could be precursor to Steve's long unstated goal of bypassing the telecoms."

Nothing that's always going to have significantly worse latency than telecoms, for simple physics reasons, is going to achieve that goal. Steve's grand motto wasn't "eh, it's good enough".

 

[iPay]

Find My Satellite is kinda cool

 

[kyjaotkb]

I would love to try using satellite features on my phone but… I have owned my 15 Pro since launch day (2.5 years) and never have I ever found myself (I) out of cellular range and (II) with a clear view of a cloudless sky and a satellite connection.
Like, the only times I lose cellular or WiFi access are when I am in a vehicle or building. Perks of living in London I guess… but even travelling throughout Europe and to far flung destinations, I have never ‘needed’ satellite or to the point of using it. I would probably buy a cheaper iPhone without the satellite feature as it seems, based on skimming through comments, that only hikers use it, and even then, mostly outside Europe.

 

[urnotl33t]

This technology is moving fast.

Heh.. pun intended? 😆

 

[Parowdy]

Can’t wait for the Amazon promotion „Before Your Next Hike 😉“ after getting lost.

 

[CarlJ]

This could be precursor to Steve Jobs' long unstated goal of bypassing the telecoms. There was discussion in Apple early on to become an MNVO but it never came to be. Apple wanted to control the entire experience and the telecoms were the notoriously bad bottleneck. "What makes Apple special is that we make the whole widget" — Steve Jobs

Instead, Apple ended up substantially changing the cellular provider landscape - they broke the carrier's hold on the customer, in a good way - rather than heavily carrier-branded phones that the carrier deigned to offer )with the features dictated to the manufacturer by the carrier), with a pitiful selection of apps/games, again from the carrier, Apple negotiated a deal where they retained basically full control over the device - no carrier branding, no carrier game/ringtone store, Apple controls the onboarding experience and such, and suddenly the carrier is just providing data / text / voice service, rather than having a complete monopoly on the experience. This is one of the best things Apple has ever done for the consumer.

I don't see satellite communication bypassing cell towers any time soon - as others have pointed out, the latency to/from a satellite is noticeably higher than to a local cell tower, and there are substantial limitations on bandwidth and on access if you don't have clear line-of-sight to the satellites. An Apple MVNO could have been really cool, but I don't think that'll ever happen at this point.

 

[Bauer24]

I suppose this is cool, just, don't expect anything free other than maybe the "emergency" services ...

Apple's current satellite features:

• Emergency SOS via satellite
• Find My via satellite
• Roadside Assistance via satellite
• Messages via satellite

All of the features are currently free to use in supported areas without Wi-Fi or cellular connectivity. Availability varies by country.

 

[jz0309]

Apple's current satellite features:

• Emergency SOS via satellite
• Find My via satellite
• Roadside Assistance via satellite
• Messages via satellite

All of the features are currently free to use in supported areas without Wi-Fi or cellular connectivity. Availability varies by country.

Yea, and there are currently no ads in Maps either, but that is changing, right?
So sure, continue dreaming of "free" services

 

[cdsapplefan]

The original assertion was: "This could be precursor to Steve's long unstated goal of bypassing the telecoms."

Nothing that's always going to have significantly worse latency than telecoms, for simple physics reasons, is going to acheive that goal. Steve's grand motto wasn't "eh, it's good enough".

I’ll be satisfied with 100mbps satellite internet from Apple 🍎 and also if they start providing their own cellular service. Anything extra than that would be beyond my expectations.