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Karl...

Thank you for adding a needed dose of Norway-realism to this thread. One would think from TorbX's posts that Norway was a utopia.

Many countires with socialized medicine have similar problems - long waits, "clinic" style facilities, lots of beurocracy. I once remarked to the owner of HHB in London that it must be nice to not have to pay for health insurance for his employees (I pay a small fortune every month for my employees) and he told me that he wouldn't subject his emplyees to the UK's public health care system, and that he had private health insurance for all of them.

So not everything is as it first appears, or how it looks on paper.

-gil
 
The other problem with not getting back your original is that if you own a 1G model, and they send you a 2G or 3G as a replacement, you lose a very important function unique to the 1G - a real, moving scroll-wheel.

The 1G models are the only ones that allow you to use the iPod with gloves on. Many motorcycle riders use the 1G iPod mounted on their gas tank or between the handlebars, and of course they're wearing gloves.

So I'd want to be sure I got a 1G replacement.

The same people who do the $59 battery replacement (PDASmart.com) also repair and replace the scroll wheels when the start to stick (as my 5GB one does). They charge $55 to do it, so with the battery it's $114, or just $14 more than Appl echarges just for the battery replacement, lus I get my original iPod (with engraving) back.

Sounds like a win-win situation for 1G owners.

-gil
 
Originally posted by gilwave
Karl...

Thank you for adding a needed dose of Norway-realism to this thread. One would think from TorbX's posts that Norway was a utopia.

Many countires with socialized medicine have similar problems - long waits, "clinic" style facilities, lots of beurocracy. I once remarked to the owner of HHB in London that it must be nice to not have to pay for health insurance for his employees (I pay a small fortune every month for my employees) and he told me that he wouldn't subject his emplyees to the UK's public health care system, and that he had private health insurance for all of them.

So not everything is as it first appears, or how it looks on paper.

-gil

I did not ever say that it functions perfectly - it does not. But it works. Everybody gets the treatment.

... And we can se "Give me a new one!" :p
 
GIL

Gil...

By the way: Norway wos widely commented in 60 minutes a year back. An english bloke hade some serious decieses (deadly, if not treated). The fact was that he needed to live in warm environment. Spain was suitable. So he got himself a Norwegian citizenship - became a Norwegian on the paper. Then the government gave the guy a place to live in spain, during wintertime. And two nurses to go.

Utopia?
 
"Then the government gave the guy a place to live in spain, during wintertime. And two nurses to go.

Utopia?"

No. He spends his whole life paying taxes in and to England, which goes to pay their social programs.

Now he goes to Norway, where he has paid NOTHING his whole life (but you and your fellow Norwegians have), gets a passport with no intnetion of living in or supporting the Norwgian economy and social system.

He then uses that passport, and the goodwill of the taxpayers and government of Norway, to go to Spain, where he will contirbute to the Spanish economy.

I do not think this is ethically or morally right. Just because you CAN do a thing,
doesn't mean you SHOULD do a thing.

You seem to be proud of the fact that your tax dollars support a system that is so easily misused and abused.

Clearly, that is not what the public nor the gorvernment of Norway had in mind when they put these programs in place.

-gil
 
Originally posted by gilwave
I do not think this is ethically or morally right. Just because you CAN do a thing,
doesn't mean you SHOULD do a thing.

You seem to be proud of the fact that your tax dollars support a system that is so easily misused and abused.

Clearly, that is not what the public nor the gorvernment of Norway had in mind when they put these programs in place.

-gil

We are not very "Mine and yours". We believe in health and wealth for every Norwegian, both for new citizens and old.

It's good, and its getting better. It works. Some day, all Norwegians will be where 10% of the americans are today.

Let's end this now. I'm sorry for bringing this up in an iPod-discussion. My point was that we do not have to worry about any unpredictable battery-problem issues in the iPod within the first five years after purchase - only because it can't be replaced by the user.

THE END
:p
 
Page 50 of the iPod user guide says "iPod's non-removable internal battery was designed to last for the life of the product."

With a claim like that, they should replace the battery for free. Since that wont be feasible for apple they should do it at cost or with a low markup. Not $99 each!
 
Re: Re: Re: Over-exaggeration?! oh no!

Originally posted by groovebuster Fact is, that the smaller engines wouldn't sell in North America well and that's why you don't get them there.

Smaller engines that wouldn't sell? You mean like every special edition of the M3 that has come out in the past 14 years?

Why is it that companies don't bother to sell low volume/specialty cars in multiple countries (american car co.s do this too) it's because it costs money to certify them in each country to ensure they are in accordance with that country's laws. Why bother when you only have a few to sell anyway?

The laws affect the availability/price of mass-production cars too, and either we don't get the cars at all, or like in the current m3, we get a version with less horsepower and a more restrictive Cat. (our M3 only puts out 333ps)

Translation? The regulations cause the companies to cripple their product or not sell it at all. I think thats pretty applicable to what i was saying about the Norweigan laws. How? If the law sets technical requirements on devices sold in that country, the users who purchase those devices will eventually pay for those increased requirements, the offending feature will be cut out (if possible), or they won't get the product at all.

Originally posted by groovebuster Maybe you can elaborate a little further how that "international business works"? I am eager to learn something from you!
What a troll! This isn't an international business forum, but I'm sure if you found one, you'd see that doing business across countries involves costs associated with complying with local laws. If you don't think THAT'S true, you have larger issues. Please, at least make an attempt at an argument here, rather than dismiss the point out of hand.

I think the closest similarity in this analogy is that of the SMG gearbox in the m3. In europe there is a feature that allows you to perform a computer-controlled start. I'm sure you're familiar with it, its a pretty cool system, and it's gotten a lot of press. The thing is, you are limited to a certain number of starts before you void your warranty (actually a portion of your warranty), as this type of thing is rather hard on the tranny. In the US version, the feature is still there, but instead of revving the engine to 5k or whatever it is, it only revs to 2.5k before it drops the clutch. Why? glad you asked, because there are laws in the US that say (more or less) that you can't provide a feature that you know your customers will use and you know will void their warranty.

Did BMW go out and improve their clutch for the US version so that we get a better car, as the Norweigian law would imply. IE: better laws make for better engineering? No, they just crippled that feature.

If Apple has to re-tool the iPod to make it fit the laws for that country the cost of the product in that country will likely increase to cover the increase in expense. Remember how Apple had to dampen the audio output for France? What might have happened if that couldn't be done in software? Apple probably swallowed the cost of the softare update, but I doubt they would have been so generous if France required a different type of hardware.

Even for devices that are identical across markets, you make it sound like I must be retarded. You make it seem like the only possible variable costs across countries would be the import tax or the exchange rate. I think you know that's not true, and we don't need to go into each of the laws of every individual country to come to the agreement that there ARE differences, and those differences often cost money.

Originally posted by groovebuster I just had a huge hassle with the Apple Store Europe regarding my order of an iBook G4.
Is that what this is all about?
 
Tax

Originally posted by aldo
Yea, I'm pissed about Apple only offering it to US markets. They are _completely_ ignoring the international markets.

Retail stores: US only, with one Japan store. While I can see this changing it's taking them way too long for a rollout of Europe stores.

iTMS: US only. Europe is scheduled sometime next year, but what sort of pricing makret will we have to pay.

Pricing in general: Ignoring VAT (sales tax), Apple charges a hell of a lot more for European consumers than US ones. It's shipped from Taiwan anyway, so why should it be cheaper in the US?

While I love Apple, the amount it is closing itself down to US markets is astonishing. I hope this will change, but I can't see it being a lot better than this current situation:rolleyes: .

Apple have to pay larger amounts of VAT in the UK. Britain also tax computers more as well, that's why computers are more expensive in UK and the rest of Europe.
 
Originally posted by bignumbers
I'm mixed on this... $99 really isn't that bad for what they're doing - processing and receiving your iPod, cracking open an iPod, replacing the battery, sealing it up, formatting/testing, packaging and returning. If the battery costs $50 at ipodbattery.com, the extra $50 is for the labor and return shipping, along with (I assume - I haven't checked) some sort of additional warranty, probably 90 days. Most hardware service centers won't breath on a peripheral for twice that.

I think if they were to track each user's iPod the cost would be higher. I also think they risk scratching some percentage of iPods while cracking them open, and just saying you might not get yours back is a way of covering their butts for those cases.

For the concern of getting someone else's scratched-and-beaten iPod, I'd be surprised if they did that. They'd have too many peeved customers. I think they'll be replacing many cases while doing this.

My bigger problem is with the design of the iPod, not (easily) allowing a user-replacable battery. If there was a reasonable way to pop it open, none of this would be at issue.

I have also wondered why Apple hasn't allowed a user-replaceable battery option like Creative has done with the Zen NX. It would seem like a simple thing to do, and Apple could still make the Ipod attractive. (maybe have a panel that comes off like the memory (RAM) panel on their Powerbooks) Because with only 8-10 hrs of battery life. (Sometimes less) It would be nice to be able to replace the battery if you couldn't charge it immediately.
 
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