iPod Battery Replacement Details from Apple

[mainstreetmark]

Originally posted by aldo
Yea, I'm pissed about Apple only offering it to US markets. They are _completely_ ignoring the international markets.

Retail stores: US only, with one Japan store. While I can see this changing it's taking them way too long for a rollout of Europe stores.

iTMS: US only. Europe is scheduled sometime next year, but what sort of pricing makret will we have to pay.

Pricing in general: Ignoring VAT (sales tax), Apple charges a hell of a lot more for European consumers than US ones. It's shipped from Taiwan anyway, so why should it be cheaper in the US?

While I love Apple, the amount it is closing itself down to US markets is astonishing. I hope this will change, but I can't see it being a lot better than this current situation .

Typical over-exaggeration. If they were "_completely_" ignoring the international market, as you so clearly emphasized, you wouldn't even HAVE an Apple.

I've decided not to even read the next two pages of this discussion thread if it's going to be all the international people complaining about how apple is ignoring them.

...as if the boys in Cupertino are going "Screw them commies! Let's make this US-only"

Apple is one of the MOST SUPPORTIVE members of the international community, as evidenced by the fact that OSX has like 50 different languages built right in! If I needed to, I could be typing in Chinese right now. And check this out: £ (You think that'll post? It's the 'Pound' sign - something the US has no internal use for)

The problem here, and with iTMS and Stores and ALL THAT CRAP is all about international law and international copyright.

It's the Lawyers, folks, not Apple. By a damn battery off of eBay and please, quit whining.

 

[macphoria]

This is a terrible after-sales customer service. I don't know why they have such lousy customer service when they make such great products.

 

[Nicky G]

Yes, Apple with the lousy customer service -- it's why they're the most highly rated in the computer industry.

Please.

How about everyone here who's a guerrilla Microsoft marketing lackey go away?

Or should I say, go away ALREADY. (Here in the USA perhaps we use "already" in a different fashion than Scots?)

I wish we had a moderation system like on Slashdot, so all the trolls would stop spreading their FUD left and right.

And by the way, I would be interested to hear how much of a Norwegian's income goes to taxes that in turn subsidize companies like Nokia, so they can afford such "progressive" consumer laws. We certainly prop up major corporations in the USA with our taxes, don't get me wrong -- but at least we're aware of the fact, and don't try to pretend we live in a progressive utopia that is only out to serve the needs of the common proletariat.

But alas, this is the wrong forum for that discussion, and I promise to stop now. Please, be my guest and continue to spread your FUD in any way you see fit.

 

[TorbX]

Originally posted by Nicky G
And by the way, I would be interested to hear how much of a Norwegian's income goes to taxes that in turn subsidize companies like Nokia, so they can afford such "progressive" consumer laws. We certainly prop up major corporations in the USA with our taxes, don't get me wrong -- but at least we're aware of the fact, and don't try to pretend we live in a progressive utopia that is only out to serve the needs of the common proletariat.

We pay a lot of taxes, from 30-48% depending on how much you earn. None of it goes to Nokia! (?) ..But it goes to free helth-care. If you drink and drive and crash in Norway - and end up 99% invalid, the governement will hire four people to watch over you 24/7 to give you a worthy life. Take you to the movies, the shop, anything. For free, no matter WHO you are, or WHAT you did before you got injured.

A fact: Norway (and Sweden, as well) are the two countries in the world where the highest % of the population has e cell-phone and a computer at home with internett. FAR, far, beyond USA. Northern Europe is a market where Nokia (and others) truly has succeded (sorry spelling).

 

[TorbX]

...other things than free helth-care as well, of course. We have cinemas owned by the government, subway, busses, kindergardens, schools, anything.

 

[brianbobcat]

Originally posted by MoparShaha
I don't like how they won't send your own iPod back to you. In fact, I find it unnacceptable. I guess it would be nice if they sent you one with less scratches, ect., but I develop a personal bond with my stuff. I don't like the idea of being given something different.

I have also developed a bond with ALL my apple stuff. If my battery started to die, I would first buy that belkin accessory that uses AA batteries to power the iPod, and then later on if the problem got worse, I would probably buy one of the do it urself kits. Nice idea, but this is one of apple's flawed ideas.

-Brian

 

[macphoria]

Yes, Apple with the lousy customer service -- it's why they're the most highly rated in the computer industry.

If Apple keeps this up, their customer service rating won't be highly rated. Besides, I personally don't think their service should be highly rated. I've been using Mac for over 10 years and their service has been consistently disappointing. Matter of fact, I recently had to go through their customer service to fix my Power Mac and had to sort out them over charging my credit card. And when that was cleared I still got billed extra because of some late penalty issue caused by problem mentioned above. Basically it was a mess.

Having to send in iPod, because of dead battery, and receiving a replacement that could be a refurbished product is completely outrageous. I would rather they replace the battery only. Or provide me with a brand new one, which I admit is asking too much.

And chance of receiving refurbished product is high. Your iPod battery won't die for at least a year, maybe couple of years if you take care of it. After that much time has gone by, Apple will have its stock of used/refurbished iPods that were sent in, which will include same model that you bought. They will use them for your replacement.

Besides, would you want to send in your PowerBook when its battery dies and receive a different machine? With different settings? Also, as people here have mentioned, us Mac users become attached to their Macs, which is wonderful thing about using Apple products. Replacing our machine with something else is not a good way to reinforce that sentiment. Apple could say "Aw they'll get over it." They could say that about a lot of things. But do you want them to?

Again, Apple makes great product but this is a terrible way to go about servicing people who love their iPods.

 

[asphalt-proof]

Re: Re: Re: !

Originally posted by TorbX
Sorry, I did not make myself very clear on the phone-thing. The point is, with new Nokia-phones, that they are STUFFED with all the newest technology. It's a fact that MANY of these have to be repaired at some point, it be the battery, the screen, the bluetoot, whatever. The end-user shall not suffer because of this. Scenario 1 year ago: You buy a phone, go home, and discover that bluetooth does not work. You go back to shop, they say: "we fix within 4 week, have to send to Nokia". Scenario TODAY: Go back to store, get a new one.

Now, since there are so much faults with phones, we here in Norway have a laugh about that we allways have to go to the store and "update" Besides, we do not have to worry ever more about repair-time and stuff like that.

Then you ask me about batteries. If it was just the BATTERY in a phone that is default, we of course just get a new one. THE POINT IS THAT IN AN IPOD _WE_ CANNOT CHANGE IT, probably neither can the store. So? Get a new one. The store has its rights towards the producer of the product, agree? Then, let the store do what is has to do (towards apple), don't let the user suffer.

Then you ask me if a battery was sold seperatly. Do you not think that a single battery differs a lot from an iPod with a not-exchangabel battery? Everybody KNOW that a battery wil die out some day, you'll have to get a new one. But what about when you CAN'T exchange it, i.e. in the iPod?

WHY is this so bad to you? Do you not think that it is a good thing?

Hey I want my phone to have Bluetoot also. Can I get that in the US or do I have to but it in Norway.

Sorry I am not trying to be an A Hole... it just struck me as extremely funny.

 

[toughboy]

why dont they sell the battery itself instead of taking OUR iPods and replacing it with SOMEONE else's???

I remember that Genuis Bars in Apple Stores could add rams and fix stuff when you go to them, can't they just change our batteries too.. ( I guess I can change mine, I saw a disassembling of an iPod, it's simply not that hard...)

 

[toughboy]

Over-exaggeration?! oh no!

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
Typical over-exaggeration. If they were "_completely_" ignoring the international market, as you so clearly emphasized, you wouldn't even HAVE an Apple.

I bought my 12"PBG4 and iPod 3G 15gigs from US when I traveled, just because that they are much more expensive and it takes about a week to them to arrive when you order in Turkey...

I bought my old 2G iPod from Turkey, but I paid like 500 Euros + tax (not even dolars, which Euros worth more than USDs) when americans paid only 400 dolars..

Do you get me now when we say that Apple (or lawyers, I really dont care) ignores international markets?!?

London, Berlin, Paris, Milano.. they deserve Apple Stores.. Istanbul is over 12 millions of population, there can be at least 1 Apple Store where CA, NY, Boston has many, even Buffalo (NY) has one...

 

[arn]

Originally posted by toughboy
why dont they sell the battery itself instead of taking OUR iPods and replacing it with SOMEONE else's???

You can still get batteries from 3rd parties and do it yourself.

arn

 

[Nicky G]

I think what it comes down to is, some people are upset the battery is simply not user-replaceable, and they are going to throw a hissy-fit over it.

The reason it's not user-replaceable comes down to size, and the fact that your iPod would be significantly larger and heavier if the battery were user-replaceable. Batteries that consumers are interacting with directly need to have extra casing and protection that the internal battery does not require.

I really don't understand why people are so upset by this. We all ought to know that batteries wear down over the course of a few years and thousands of recharge cycles. Chemicals deplete. This is not Apple's fault, it's the state of battery technology. When fuel-cells are out in a few years this will be a non-issue.

Knowing that the battery is internal, and will inherently wear down with repeated use, I don't see why so many people are surprised and/or miffed. Maybe the consumer should do a little more research on basic technological issues before plunking down $500 on a walkman.

 

[toughboy]

Originally posted by arn
You can still get batteries from 3rd parties and do it yourself.

arn

how? especially if you have any ideas about how to get them in Europe, I'd be really thankful..

 

[deepkid]

Re: The scoop

Originally posted by seamuskrat
So its a sweet deal for 1G 5 gigers.
It helps explain the 99 istead a more reasonable 69.00

Hmm... maybe I should send in my 1G sardine can ipod, since the battery and HD are scrapped. Could have avoided a 3G purchase earlier this year, if this option was available.

Anybody want a soon-to-be refurbed sardine can pod?

 

[andyduncan]

Re: Over-exaggeration?! oh no!

Originally posted by toughboy
I bought my old 2G iPod from Turkey, but I paid like 500 Euros + tax (not even dolars, which Euros worth more than USDs) when americans paid only 400 dolars..

Do you get me now when we say that Apple (or lawyers, I really dont care) ignores international markets?!?

The US is the biggest car market in the world, yet we still pay more for our BMWs than people in germany do. We also don't get as many models, and the models we do get are often crippled compared to their german counterparts. This isnt because BMW wants to screw Amercians any more than Apple wants to screw europeans. Its just that this is how international business works. You want free trade? Heck, so do I. But it's not Apple's fault we don't have it.

ps: liable means legally responsible.

 

[sushi]

Originally posted by acj
The battery is worth $5 tops. I'm sure Apple pays less than that.Here is something similar for $4 in bulk, just $5.50 each.

Obviously you didn't look closely at the add.

The battery in the iPod is much different that this particular model.

I doubt that the form fitting thin battery used in the iPod is available for $5 in bulk quantities.

Sushi

 

[bretm]

Re: Re: cheap upgrade...

And, to increase their profits even more, they're not even keeping up with who's is who's. That would require more logistics, keeping up with the pod as it goes through the system, then being responsible if it croaks. This way, they keep up with what came in, and make sure one goes out. In fact, they probably put them in a pile. In teh other pile is refurbished ones. Rest assured that "refurbished" means completely new external case. It would be too much trouble for them to deal with what everyone is discussing about scratches, etc. They'll throw yours in a pile. Someone in back sits around ripping the front and back off the thing. Then someone else puts a new battery in. Then someone else puts a brand new case on. Then it gets wiped clean and gets sent to someone.

Hasn't anyone ever returned a cell phone for repair before? That's what they do.

But I'm attached to mine too. Jut go buy a battery and put it in. Apparently $49. Apple SHOULD sell the batteries and have instructions on their own site. That would be the right thing to do.

Originally posted by Le Big Mac
Are you kidding? Of course they are. You can buy the battery for $50 at retail. Apple probably pays half that or less in bulk. But even at $50, they get $50 more to cover labor and shipping (if that's even included). No way it takes trained personnel more than 10 minutes to replace the battery. That's as much as many top lawyers make--$300/hour.

Apple could offer this for $49 and turn a small profit. $69 and a reasonable profit. At $99 it smells really expensive.

And, yeah, it's better to have a choice than no choice. But that doesn't mean we can't complain about the "choice" if it sucks.

 

[gilwave]

http://www.cellular.co.za/news_2000/news-11272000_iceland_penetration.htm
Nov 28 2000

Iceland has overtaken Finland for the first time in several years as the country with the world's largest number of mobile phone users per capita, a wireless market research group said.

The survey by EMC World Cellular Database showed that Iceland's cellular phone penetration stood at 75.8 percent out of the total population at the end of September this year compared to Finland's 73.7 percent.

Trends in the region are closely followed for indications of how much other, bigger mobile telecom markets can grow before maturing.

Favourable prices for mobile phone calls has helped Iceland boost the number of cellular phone users, EMC said.

Analysts also see the presence of Finnish Nokia , the world's largest mobile phone maker, and Sweden's Ericsson , the third biggest cellular phone producer and the top maker of mobile network equipment, to have helped push the development of the phone and its use in this region.

Nordic countries Finland, Sweden and Iceland are also the top users of the Internet per capita, according to recent research.

 

[gilwave]

Proud Little Finland Tops World Rankings
Dan Ackman, 10.31.03, 9:09 AM ET
from Foebes.com

Finland, the small Scandinavian nation, boasts the world's "most competitive" economy, beating the United States and fellow Scandinavian Sweden for top honors, according to a survey by the World Economic Forum, the folks best known for their annual confab in Davos.

Aside from Finland and Sweden, snowy nations did well in the survey, with fourth-ranked Denmark, Switzerland, Iceland and Norway all in the top ten along with Taiwan and Singapore. Australia rounds out the top ten.

<snip>

Finland, home to mobile-phone firm Nokia (nyse: NOK - news - people ), retained its top ranking from last year on the strength of its solid "all-round performance," the WEF said. The United States, home to giants like IBM (nyse: IBM - news - people ), Merck (nyse:MRK - news - people ) and Microsoft (nasdaq: MSFT - news - people ), is "commanding" technology, but this strength is offset "by some weakening in the quality of its public institutions and macroeconomic environment, particularly public finances," an area where the U.S. placed just 50th among the 102 countries surveyed.

<snip>

How did Finland, with a population of just 5.2 million, come out on top? Honesty is a big factor, as the nation had high scores for judicial independence, property rights and the absence of crime and corruption. Surprisingly, it was just tenth in cell-phone usage. The U.S., by contrast, was ranked just ninth in property rights and 13th in judicial independence.

Taiwan and Singapore, ranked fifth and sixth, are Asia's top scorers, the WEF found. Taiwan's position is largely due to its excellent performance in technology, and Singapore's to its sound macroeconomic environment and quality of public institutions.

<snip>

But the big story is the amazing success of Scandinavia. The entire region has just one company, Nokia, among the top 100 of the Forbes 2000 list of global public companies. It has just eight billionaires, none in Finland. But Sweden, with Volvo Group (nasdaq: VOLVY - news - people ), Norway and Denmark scored high on the public-integrity meters and all have GDPs per capita not far behind the U.S. The Nordic countries were also ranked the best places to live in the world by a United Nations survey, which ranked nations by factors such as education, democracy, income and public health.

But despite their economic success and their amazing livability, all have low birth rates and little population growth, raising the question: What do the Scandinavian people know that the folks in Davos and Geneva don't?

 

[groovebuster]

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
Typical over-exaggeration. If they were "_completely_" ignoring the international market, as you so clearly emphasized, you wouldn't even HAVE an Apple.

What kind of argument is that? Actually you can ignore a market even though you sell your products there. Please upgrade from b/w to color TV!

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
I've decided not to even read the next two pages of this discussion thread if it's going to be all the international people complaining about how apple is ignoring them.

Yeah, since you have what you want, who cares for the others, huh?

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
...as if the boys in Cupertino are going "Screw them commies! Let's make this US-only"

Nobody said that... For some people discussing logical seems to be really hard!

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
Apple is one of the MOST SUPPORTIVE members of the international community, as evidenced by the fact that OSX has like 50 different languages built right in! If I needed to, I could be typing in Chinese right now. And check this out: £ (You think that'll post? It's the 'Pound' sign - something the US has no internal use for)

*LOL* Wow! You are really funny! Your are not serious, right? *LOL*

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
The problem here, and with iTMS and Stores and ALL THAT CRAP is all about international law and international copyright.

You seem to be a real expert in that field. Congrats!

Originally posted by mainstreetmark
It's the Lawyers, folks, not Apple. By a damn battery off of eBay and please, quit whining.

So the lawyers are the reason for everything? You should try a career as a comedian dude. You don't have a clue what you are talking about. And I don't wonder why, considering you always skip the parts of a discussion you finally could learn something from...

groovebuster

 

[Fahd]

Re: ENVY ME

Originally posted by TorbX
As a law student in Norway, I love to brag about our legal system. Check this:

If my iPod's battery goes dead within the five first years after purchase, I can just go back to the store and say "give me a new one".

The battery on the 3rd gen is not supposed to be changed. I mean, the iPod is not built to be opened. It SHOULD last 5 years, without being opened for an battery-change. Because of this, I can just say "give me a new one" at the store.

If it happens AGAIN (third time) within 5 new years, I can say "give me my money back. I don't like the product you sold me".

It just rocks... "Everyone" in Norway has new cell-phones all the time. These laws are actually hated by Nokia and Ericsson and other flaw-full phones. It's a really big issue these days. "Consumer before company profit". Probably the work of som left-wing semi communist-partys...

Heh...sounds awesome, any chance you could do some buying and shipping for me?

 

[Fahd]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: !

Originally posted by andyduncan
...Apple never advertised, listed or represented their product as being capable of lasting indefinitely, they didn't even say it could last five years...

If thats your attitude, then I believe apple should post a prominent "disclaimer" with every ipod before the purchase process that says "Battery is non user replaceable". The currently accepted norm is that portable electronics have batteries that are user replaceable.

(I agree with the rest of your post!)

 

[groovebuster]

Re: Re: Over-exaggeration?! oh no!

Originally posted by andyduncan
The US is the biggest car market in the world, yet we still pay more for our BMWs than people in germany do.

This is just bogus! One of those ferrytales... When did you personally check the prizes in Europe the last time? I bet you never did, otherwise you would know that prizes are almost exactly 1:1.

Originally posted by andyduncan
We also don't get as many models, and the models we do get are often crippled compared to their german counterparts.

Also not true. Fact is, that the smaller engines wouldn't sell in North America well and that's why you don't get them there. Actually the Z4 (which is build in the USA) was introduced 6 months earlier in the US than in Germany! How does that fit together with your astonishing theory? Other than that you get pretty much the same features and extras as in Europe.

Originally posted by andyduncan
This isnt because BMW wants to screw Amercians any more than Apple wants to screw europeans. Its just that this is how international business works. You want free trade? Heck, so do I. But it's not Apple's fault we don't have it.

Another expert in that field! I am amazed about the deep knowledge of international business some people on this board seem to have...

Maybe you can elaborate a little further how that "international business works"? I am eager to learn something from you!

Fact is, that even though the € is relatively strong compared to the US$, Apple charges about 16% higher prizes in Europe. Since the hardware is shipped from Asia, no matter if it is sold in Europe or North America, the difference can't be explained by "import taxes"... get your facts straight! Thank you!

It is also fact, that Apple charges the same or even higher prizes for products that don't have the same functionality or features outside the US. Interesting, isn't it? Best example is .Mac. Same prize but less features for people outside the US. And it's a software thing in first place. So that's how international business works?

And at last I want to ask you why you try to excuse the misbehaviour of one company with the misbehaviour of another one (considering your example would have held any water)?

I just had a huge hassle with the Apple Store Europe regarding my order of an iBook G4. After that I will never buy anything from the Apple Store anymore since they were proving themselves incompetent. And actually I am so not impressed by the way Apple treats its international customers, that I would be more than happy to abandon the Mac platform. Unfortunately there is no real alternative on the market and I hate Windows even more. But if Apple really goes on like that on the long-term, one day a "divorce" is inevitable...

groovebuster

 

[ogravdal]

Originally posted by TorbX
We pay a lot of taxes, from 30-48% depending on how much you earn. None of it goes to Nokia! (?) ..But it goes to free helth-care. If you drink and drive and crash in Norway - and end up 99% invalid, the governement will hire four people to watch over you 24/7 to give you a worthy life. Take you to the movies, the shop, anything. For free, no matter WHO you are, or WHAT you did before you got injured.

I wish I could agree on what you are saying now...

Free health care: To a certain extent I agree, but only if you accept waiting many months for even a simple surgery. Last time I needed to go see the doctor I would have to pay NOK 180 ($25) only to get an appointment and in addition I would have to wait about two hours.. Because I was lucky to be close to a private clinic I went there instead. I paid almost three times more, but I got two more hours of paid salaries that day.

Some years ago my mother suffered a cerebral haemorrhage (I don't know if it has a better translation but it's what's written in the dictionary). She has recovered quite well and has even tried for a while to return to her old job (which is related to the public health care). Now however, she has given up and decided to get a status invalid/disabled. It's been a very difficult decision as there is so many things she wants to do, but she is simply not able to. For her to finally accept that she is disabled was hard.. Well, she now receives next to nothing from the government. Only a symbolic amount of money, but no more help than that... If anyone has been hired because of my mother, I'm sure they sit in an office somewhere in Oslo, running our annoyingly expensive bureaucracy... (Personally I've worked as a support person for someone who was disabled, but that was only a few hours a week).

...other things than free helth-care as well, of course. We have cinemas owned by the government, subway, busses, kindergardens, schools, anything.

For a ten kilometre bus ride I pay NOK 31 ($8,2) and only Oslo has a subway (as far as I know). The only thing that is free for most people is the schools... But, not everything is perfect there either.. Because of few teachers it's become a standardisation machine with no time for the individual pupil.

Even most colleges and universities in Norway are free. However, most people need to leave their hometown to study, and therefore are required to get student loans. Although I don't pay anything now while I'm a student I have to pay back about $50000 + interest to the government when I start working. In addition it was no public colleges that offered my studies so I had to attend a private college. I got extra student loans to pay half the study fee ("only" $6000 per year). The rest I had to cover by working while studying, or by getting extra loans in other banks.

In addition I should mention infrastructure... I live on an island on the west coast of Norway.. Until a few years ago it was impossible to leave the the island by other means than by ferry. Since the main-road along the coast crosses the island it was therefore decided that we would get a bridge and tunnel that would connect us the mainland in south. Calculations showed that the price of this project would be so high that the whole population on the island (20000) could instead have travelled for free, including a free dinner onboard the ferry, for their rest of their life.

Now the project has been finished and I can leave the island with no worries about the ferry-schedule. However, who must pay for this project? It's us who live there (which sounds reasonable), by paying $12 every-time we pass, as well as extra fees every time we use any of the other ferries that connects to our island.

The truth is simply that we pay too much, for everything.. In addition to all the taxes that are supposed to cover the same things...

 

[Hattig]

Not acceptable

That is a very expensive price for a battery that they are likely paying very little for. Yeah, it must include posting and packing and all that, which is fair enough, but I don't think that would be $70.

Maybe it includes a new case for the iPod as well, so that even though the costly interior components are reused, the outside is pristine. I doubt that the case is that expensive to make.

However I don't want to get an iPod back, say "Hurrah!" go out and then get some other persons Reggae collection!