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Photorun said:
It's the users, stupid. This seems like just some lawyer's wetdream in the sue sue sue happy US of A. The lawyers are the ones hoping to make out with their fees being paid by winning the settlement, and what is lost, again, is the big business will, as they love to pick on the underdogs not the darlings, see this as another "screw up by Apple" when in fact the Dull DJ didn't hold up so well, my original RIO s***ed a** after a year of jogging (and died), but Apple is held to some godlike standard. I own a 2G iPod, it has some scratches but you know what? I DEAL WITH IT! They're minor, I've put that thing through hell, it's slid across my desk, I've dropped it, it's slid across my seat of my car while hooked to the stereo. It's not built to be impervious to life, clearly anyone hoping this frivolous suit goes through maybe should sue their parents for being born with the ability to get a cut or boo boo from a knife, or hell, sue God if they believe in them for making them so imperfect. The lawyers and people who think this is valid, who want some impossible level of perfection, who clearly aren't realizing other products have the same issues, are a disgrace to the human race. Get a friggin' life!!!

PS My girlfriend owns a nano, works out with it, gee golly it has a little bit of scuffing on it from being dragged to the Y, used in her car, used while jogging in a little sleeve, it doesn't look the same as the day she got it but looks pretty good. And has she complained? NO! She loves her iPod nano, but then again she's got a brain, a clue, and a soul, clearly unlike the people involved in this suit and quite possibly some of the posters in this thread.
Thanks, I agree! A lot of people here that are siding with the people suing apple are saying how they should be able to treat it roughly/a litte rough and have it come out perfect. Or are complaining about problems that apple sorted out for them anyway.
I'm not making excuses for apple, but they aren't perfect. Face it. And if their products start taking away their money, they might not want another iPod.
I'm guessing the people suing are pc users anyway ;)
 
maya said:
why do you see fit to protect Apple, they are a company trying to make a profit off you. People who stick up for companies make me ill at times, then several people have posted they experience with a product. :rolleyes:

Well I'm not so much backing Apple as I am backing sellers in general when it comes to things like this. Different materials take beatings differently. I would rather have the option to choose between a rubber-coated indestructible mp3 player and a more delicate, more refined one, than have that choice taken away because a bunch of people sued over cosmetic blemishes. This goes for most products out there.
 
maya said:
If we apply your backing of his example then a scratched pair of glasses, fine crystal, diamonds, etc... will hold they value when scratched up as you can still see with scratched glasses, still drink out of fine crystal and still flash a diamond. :rolleyes:

I never talked about the item holding its value. Of course it wouldn't. But who buys a car or a piece of technology thinking it will? Technology is obsolete the day you buy it, and cars depreciate the second you preset the radio stations. This is different from diamonds, fine crystal and your other examples - those don't really apply in this situation.

maya said:
Apple has posed its self and its products as "top of the chain" as far as the industry is considered, and customers will expect a triple "A" rating from those products for a reason. :)

Yep. :)

maya said:
I would not want to buy a BMW for 100K USD and have it scratched up while leaving the dealership, or have the signal lights fused.

Fused signal lights would be BMW's fault and is something which affects the performance of the car - legally, your signal lights need to work, so this would be BMW's issue to fix. Scratches however, don't affect the function of the car, are not BMW's fault (whether it's your fault or your bad luck) and should not be addressed by BMW.
 
maya said:
Don't say that to Honda and Toyota owners. ;) :)

Yes, they can be quite dillusional and sensitive about that. Denail is a wonderful thing... ;)

Seriously though, yes, Toyotas actually do have good resale value - my Dad has owned a 1993 and 2003 Camry, the 1993 sold for a nice amount (and still had its original muffler! :eek: ) - however the price still depreciates. Whereas as you could argue diamonds, etc. are assets, cars are liabilities. Money pits to be precise. ;) :cool:
 
age234 said:
Get rid of class-action lawsuits altogether

You are ****ing insane. That's right.

Eroding more of citizenry rights to protect another corporation that is more than capable of defending itself. Listen, if Apple cannot take a few class actions from time to time, it does not deserve to be in business.

Simple.

Leave our rights out of it.

What recourse will we have against manufacturers of dangerous cars, or poisonous drugs, or a whole myraid of other products we buy today, if not for the possibility that consumers can bunch together and take on a bigger legal entitly? NONE.

Leave our rights out of it.
 
generik said:
You are ****ing insane. That's right.

Eroding more of citizenry rights to protect another corporation that is more than capable of defending itself. Listen, if Apple cannot take a few class actions from time to time, it does not deserve to be in business.

Simple.

Leave our rights out of it.

What recourse will we have against manufacturers of dangerous cars, or poisonous drugs, or a whole myraid of other products we buy today, if not for the possibility that consumers can bunch together and take on a bigger legal entitly? NONE.

Leave our rights out of it.

I second that motion.
 
Hey y'all saying this is just people looking for money/new nano's... It's not.
After one week of using my nano, it looks like it's been a kitten's chew toy for months!

And my 3rd gen is still fine (less scratched) after two years...
 
SPUY767 said:
I don't know how much exactly you know about manufacturing, but manufacturing of anything is an imperfect science. You see, the Earth has, what I like to call, gravity. Things made in a "Gravity Rich" enviroment tend to favor one sode or another. Imagine, if you will, a cup of yogurt with blueberries in it. After a while, the blueberries will all sink to the bottom. The rate that this occurs can be controlled by temperature, but barring the freezing of the solution outright, it will happen. Manufacturing is the same way, polycarbonates in plastics will "clump" together to form pockets of more and less dense areas.

Now, let's take the example of automotive glass. The glass itself in most cars is about as close to flawless as glass can get. The glass in BMW windshields is polished to such a sheen, that water will not stick. Windscreen glass, however, is three layers. Two layers of high strength glass, in between which is sandwiched a thin layer of lexan. Lexan is a plastic, its purpose in auto glass is to prevent the windshield from turning your face into jerky if a rock hits it. Even the windshield in my fine Bavarian automobile suffers from the deplorable refraction of light which you so knowledgelessly speak of. It's a fact of life. All plastics do it. BTW, if you leave your iPod out in a hot car ever, you'll notice that the effect gets worse. The high heat generated inside the car does just enough to excite the molocules in the polycarbonate to the point of mild shifting.

Oh please spare me all that OT ramblings. You have not seen how bad it is. I'm surprised you can survive so long driving that "fine" crapmobile of yours if your windscreen indeed has such *good* optical qualities! Under reasonably direct lighting, it looks like a BLOODY CRACK. No less.

It's not with the polycarbonates, it is with the LCD, mind you.

Now repeat after me. iRiver can do it without the same issue. iRiver can do it without the same issue. iRiver can do it without the same issue.

Seems like either Apple is paying for very cheap labour, or can't even shell out decent dough to get good LCD panels. I actually opened that very same iPod up to investigate the cause. The distortion originates from the LCD panel. Not these 'polycarbonates in plastics will "clump" together to form pockets of more and less dense areas' crap.

Shoddy manufacture is shoddy manufacture, by your same argument it is acceptable to receive iPods that has air bubbles within the Lexan casing too!

SPUY767 said:
Bottom line, your arguments are foundless and without merit. Bottom line part deux, find something else to whine about. How about you start off with that strange dampness you feel when you stand out in the rain.

Oh, indeed, so you are likening a consumer's decision to go Apple akin to standing out in the chilling rain? That I agree. In fact if you are worth half as much as you claim to be, perhaps you should start an advertising campaign on the media to spread that point too.

And tell me, what kind of premium product doesn't even have a charger?

It is like buying that same fine Bavarian automobile which you claim to own.. without a cover for your gas tank.

Wah! You can still fill your gas no? You don't need that gas tank panel for the vehicle to operate. Nevermind the fact that someone can conveniently drop a lighted ciggy in and blow up your luxury vehicle, or what have you.

Likewise... in omitting the charger Apple is effectively telling customers, "Oh, we don't give a darn about the occasional need that you have to travel from time to time, we are assuming everywhere you go will have a USB port! And oh yes, it does not hinder normal operation".

Like I said, you can either choose to be truly premium, or be in the ranks of the other consumer crap. There is no middle path in this.
 
Don't you think some of this is the black issue?

I recently bought a new car. My first black one ever which looks so cool when it is clean, BUT is shows the scratches much more than any other car I have ever owned. Even marks from fairly soft cloths show swirls. That's just the nature of black on these things. White is more forgiving. Should I sue Audi for my slightly scratched A3?

And regarding paper towel scratches. PAPER TOWELS ARE NOT SOFT-PAPER IS HARD. They will scratch the iPod and other similer items. Use a soft glasses cleaning cloth or a diaper.
 
it's b/c it fits everywhere

morons vs. Apple
is how the legal schtick should read!

while i highly doubt the screen is any different than the other models, it probably scratches b/c you can put it more places..ie. jean pockets. it fits everywhere and if it can fit everywhere, you know there will be morons who try to fit it anywhere.

then duh, of course it will scratch.

i think i'm going to sue Toyota b/c my Tacoma gets scratched when I take it deer hunting up trails where I can't drive our car.

moronic punks.

they give us Apple geeks a bad name.
 
mac_hine82 said:
Why would you say something like that? And why wouldn't you do it your self? Scared?

Nope, he is not scared. He just doesn't have to prove anything, unlike you.

You see, you were the one who claimed that it is "just scratches" that are "oh so cosmetic" and "nothing functional".

He is just calling YOU bluff, that's all. Eat it troll.
 
Can't be bothered to read all 11 pages but I've seen 2 people with Nanos and both are now scratched significantly after only a week of use. This is unacceptable.

Add into the equation 3 dead iPod batteries in my immediate family plus an iBook of mine that has had to go in for a new logic board within the fist 6 months and I think Apple has some serious quality control issues.
 
Keebler said:
morons vs. Apple

By the same token it can be "unethical corporation vs hapless users".

When you buy the PREMIUM product of a market segment, you do expect it to hold up at least as well as the competition don't you?
 
maya said:
I would not want to buy a BMW for 100K USD and have it scratched up while leaving the dealership, or have the signal lights fused. If Apple was selling a 20-50 USD mp3 player then I am pretty sure no one would give a dam .;)

But that's exactly it, that brand new BMW DOES have very similar scratches on it even before you buy it.

They're just going to laugh at you if you bring it back for scratches. There's no material defect, and to the poster the suggests plexiglass--obviously you don't know all the problems with plexiglass that would cause many more lawsuits.

People are obsessively whining about scratches, when they're no different now than any other iPod. I have NEVER seen an iPod that didn't have fine scratches on it. Yeah, the finish of the new iPod makes them more visible, but they certainly are there.

I have not seen a single picture that demonstrates the level of scratching that people are claiming. The hyperbole in this thread is absolutely incredible.

generik said:
By the same token it can be "unethical corporation vs hapless users".

When you buy the PREMIUM product of a market segment, you do expect it to hold up at least as well as the competition don't you?

No. The timeless parental chide, "don't touch that, it's expensive" holds true here. The iPod is physically very durable, more so than the competition. It's also been designed to be a mirror and a shiny object. That makes it more susceptible to having its fine scratches be visible.

There is no such thing as a premium MP3 player. A $600 premium watch is one thing, since you can get a watch that tells time just as well for $20. A premium car that is $80,000 gets you from point A to point B just like an $18,000 car. Do you see the price difference here, and the essential distinction between "premium" and everything else? Unless you can get the same MP3 player functionality for $50 or less, the iPod is not a premium anything. I am so sick of this argument. The iPod is a commodity item. End of story. It may not be cheap, but that doesn't make it indestructible.
 
Apple makes a bundle on the sales of an iPod... I don't really care if they get sued. That being said, you have to salute the legal system in the good ol' U.S. of A. Anyone have some hot coffee to sell these people?

/Happy I'm north of the border.
 
jicon said:
Anyone have some hot coffee to sell these people?

Oh no, you brought up a subject that is almost guaranteed to make any thread deterioriate into craziness.

Anyone interesting in arguing the McDonald's case for the 30 millionth time, please go to this thread or do a search for McDonald's and coffee and post in one of those threads. Pretty please? :)

In my opinion, we already have plenty to argue about without pouring coffee, err fuel, on the flames. :p
 
autrefois said:
Oh no, you brought up a subject that is almost guaranteed to make any thread deterioriate into craziness.

Anyone interesting in arguing the McDonald's case for the 30 millionth time, please go to this thread or do a search for McDonald's and coffee and post in one of those threads. Pretty please? :)

In my opinion, we already have plenty to argue about without pouring coffee, err fuel, on the flames. :p
That case also proves that pouring coffee on your crotch to cool your loins will not work either. :eek:
 
I've bought a 5G 1st gen, 20G 2nd gen, 2 3rd gen.'s 20G, 4G Nano and yes, a 30G 5th Gen. I can honestly say that the nano's do SEEM to scratch easier. I'm not sure if it's 'cause they're so small and it really shows up or they in fact are made w. a less durable material. I've had the new 5th Gen. for a few days now and can't seem to reproduce the same scratch susceptability as the Nano. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the nano - long battery life, svelt formfactor, nice display but darn it - the scratches! One thing I think was an oversight was the lack of a decent case at the products release. I for one am still waiting for an Agent 18 case or something similar to house my wee little one and offer 100% functionality. Every iPod I've bought has always had the option of case availibility at purchase, and I usually buy one. My nano is still housed in an "invisible shield" which I don't really like but it does keep it safe until an abundance of cases hit the market and are available.
I'm not one for lawsuits but it seems every Apple product released gets a bit cheaper. I still have powerbooks that were made in Ireland that are working - albeit slowly - while my 2nd Taiwanese 15" PB 1.67 GHz has had multiple problems, including crappy jumpy trackpad that Apple denies is crappy. My 3rd Gen. IPods came with case, wall charger, dock, cable and firewire which can be nice if needed for a bootable disk. The 5th gen came with a REALLY cheap case, a USB cable, CD, headphones - that's it. The Nano came with even less.
I've been an Apple user for going on 18 years and the quality is slipping. Face it people, I've been a rider on IPod 3rd gen. battery settlement, Powerbook settlements and various product recalls. If there is a problem, many people will be happy the filers of the suit took action and I'm sure many of the "take the scratches and shut-up" will jump aboard as the settlement papers hit their mailboxes.
I've always applauded Apple innovation and one thing they've always had over competitors was quality which has taken a backseat recently.
 
Kobushi said:
Buy better paper towels. If anyone bothered to read a manual once in a while, they'd know to use a "soft, lint-free cloth" on just about everything (tv screens, cd's, dvd's, computer monitors, etc)
Exactly. Hate to see that their butts look like with the toilet paper they use ;)
 
matticus008 said:
No. The timeless parental chide, "don't touch that, it's expensive" holds true here. The iPod is physically very durable, more so than the competition. It's also been designed to be a mirror and a shiny object. That makes it more susceptible to having its fine scratches be visible.

There is no such thing as a premium MP3 player. A $600 premium watch is one thing, since you can get a watch that tells time just as well for $20. A premium car that is $80,000 gets you from point A to point B just like an $18,000 car. Do you see the price difference here, and the essential distinction between "premium" and everything else? Unless you can get the same MP3 player functionality for $50 or less, the iPod is not a premium anything. I am so sick of this argument. The iPod is a commodity item. End of story. It may not be cheap, but that doesn't make it indestructible.

Really?

If you are not paying for the brand, then what are you paying for here? Erm, don't make me laugh, but quality? Or maybe Kualetty?

NC MacGuy said:
I
I'm not one for lawsuits but it seems every Apple product released gets a bit cheaper. I still have powerbooks that were made in Ireland that are working - albeit slowly - while my 2nd Taiwanese 15" PB 1.67 GHz has had multiple problems, including crappy jumpy trackpad that Apple denies is crappy. My 3rd Gen. IPods came with case, wall charger, dock, cable and firewire which can be nice if needed for a bootable disk. The 5th gen came with a REALLY cheap case, a USB cable, CD, headphones - that's it. The Nano came with even less.

It never is cheaper, if you'd observe Apple products, they do not fall in price, a newer product merely takes the place of an older one and it stays in the same price point.

What you meant to say however, is it has been getting cheaper for Apple to produce these Powerbooks. Same with these iPods.

If you thought your Powerbook was bad, wait till you see the newest ones, these are now made in China.
 
generik said:
It never is cheaper, if you'd observe Apple products, they do not fall in price, a newer product merely takes the place of an older one and it stays in the same price point.

What you meant to say however, is it has been getting cheaper for Apple to produce these Powerbooks. Same with these iPods.

If you thought your Powerbook was bad, wait till you see the newest ones, these are now made in China.
Maybe that explains why i have a WORKING yes i repeat WORKING powerbook 160 used on a regular basis, and went through 4 ibooks with faulty logic boards (and still got screwed by apple even after extended repair...really long story)

but i guess everythign is being made in china, i guess they have to make it there to remain competitive, doesn't quite fit in with their laid back california image..making products in a country that can't guarantee basic human rights or wages

making ipods is not revolutionary...making in the united states and employing americans for good factory jobs that are part of american culture..THAT would be revolutionary..the US acts like a 3rd world country..we export raw materials to china in exchange for buying back tvs and computers

that's why apple has to go out of their way to say designed in california on everything...it's a bit telling and histrionic and rather rude to the chinese who really have to deal with the logistics of making ipods
 
generik said:
Really?

If you are not paying for the brand, then what are you paying for here? Erm, don't make me laugh, but quality? Or maybe Kualetty?

Find me an iPod competitor that offers the same specs at the same price as a nano. As for quality, yes. It has a nicer screen than anything in its class, a higher capacity, better audio reproduction, a better design, and it can still play music after being run over twice by a car. Got anything in mind with better quality?
 
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