Is a new 12 likely in a few months

deepakvrao

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Oct 16, 2011
335
29
India
I live in India, and Mac prices here are absurd. Just sold my MBPro a few months ago and bought the 2017 MB 12. Love it. Want to do the same for my wife too, but this is really at the end of the life cycle. She is on a MBA 2011 and desperately needs a new laptop. So

1. Is a new 12 likely in a few months, and if not,
2. Which is the best deal that I can get on a MB 12 in the US?

Kind of urgent as my daughter is coming home for winter on 20th [from the US], and she can carry it for me.
 

Penlocky

macrumors member
Feb 7, 2017
82
20
Hey!

What do you mean that "this is really at the end of the life cycle"? Do you mean the 2011 MBA or the 2017 MB?

1. Intel just announced "Sunny Cove" range of processors. So it will be sometime in the year for the appropriate chip for the MacBook to arrive. Usually, the low power chips will debut before the high powered chips (usually 5- 6 months before high powered chips) because low powered chips are easier to manufacture (I heard its essentially a defect high powered chip rebranded). I have no idea yet when will they debut but it might be the middle of the year. So the new Macbook might be unveiled at WWDC? hahaha.

2. https://www.macrumors.com/2018/12/12/costco-now-sells-macs/ . I do not live in the US, I do not know a lot about the best deals, but I heard something from the link above and "Microcenter"!

I just bought a 2017 i7 16GB 512 MB, and I am really debating wether to keep it or wait for this new chip to come out! But we do not know if apple will even update the MacBook or not. They might wait until ARM implementation, or they might update.
 

turbineseaplane

macrumors 601
Mar 19, 2008
4,968
7,137
I think a new MacBook might be the very first Mac to go ARM w/ Apple designed chips.

I won't be surprised if the current rMB is the last one with Intel inside.
 

clarencek

macrumors regular
Apr 8, 2008
178
157
I couldn’t wait any longer and picked up a refurbished 2017 unit.
I owned the original and then switched to a MBP because it was too slow. The 2017 model is great and a lot faster than the original.
I would just get it now. Who know how long apple will take to update it.
 

Dominus Mortem

macrumors regular
Aug 3, 2011
149
13
My gut feeling is that there's not enough reason for Apple to invest the time and money into an upgrade of the 12". They'd surely do it if a new, appropriate chip were available; one is not, not yet.
 

KPOM

macrumors G5
Oct 23, 2010
14,399
2,992
I'm guessing that a new 12" is not going to come until late 2019 or early 2020. Since they did not update to the Amber Lake Y chips (which are really just Kaby Lake Y chips with a faster Turbo Boost) when they announced the MacBook Air, I doubt they will update the MacBook until the Cannonlake/Sandy Cove chips are available, which won't be until Q4-19.
 
  • Like
Reactions: radiologyman

Macalway

macrumors 68030
Aug 7, 2013
2,718
1,094
Just waiting on Intel. Not a big deal. My present 12" is just fine. If they switch to Arm (very unlikely), that's ok also.

However, if they discontinue it i'll go insane, and have to post from the psych ward. Internet access may be limited, not sure :(
 
  • Like
Reactions: HappyIntro

Macalway

macrumors 68030
Aug 7, 2013
2,718
1,094
What makes you say that?
Just is. It would be very unusual. Not a big deal either way don't you think? If they do, that would be fun, if they don't, the new Intel chip will give an already decent performance a boost.

It's not like we have issues with performance really. At least mine is decent. Then again, it's no work horse.

Having said that, I sure wouldn't want to be waiting to own one. That would suck.

Note: The base model may be slowish. I have the upper-end previous model (1.3ghz). It think the newer upper-end model is really good.
 
Last edited:

EugW

macrumors 604
Jun 18, 2017
7,312
4,692
Just is. It would be very unusual. Not a big deal either way don't you think? If they do, that would be fun, if they don't, the new Intel chip will give an already decent performance a boost.

It's not like we have issues with performance really. At least mine is decent. Then again, it's no work horse.

Having said that, I sure wouldn't want to be waiting to own one. That would suck.

Note: The base model may be slowish. I have the upper-end previous model (1.3ghz). It think the newer upper-end model is really good.
The base model 2017 m3 is almost as fast as the 2016 m7. In fact, in the Geekbench browser, it has the 2017 m3 faster than the 2016 m7, although if you look at max scores, the 2016 m7 is a bit faster.

Capture.PNG


More importantly though is that they all throttle since there is no fan, and when they throttle, even the 2017 Core i7 is only marginally faster than the 2017 Core m3. Here's my thread where we ran the 2017 m3, i5, and i7 with Cinebench repeatedly to see how performance decreases as temperature rises:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/this-is-how-the-2017-macbook-core-m3-i5-i7-behave-during-sustained-cpu-load-10-runs-of-cinebench.2073415/

MacBook2017-CinebenchR15-m3-wood.png


Note how the i7 is less than 5% faster than the m3 on the 10th run. On other runs, the max delta between the two chips is only about 7%. (I ran the test on two different surfaces for my m3, one being granite and one being wood. The m3 numbers I am using for the comparison are the m3's lower performing wood numbers.) The 2016 m7 seems to do worse than the 2017 in Cinebench though:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Face-Off-Apple-MacBook-12-Core-m3-Core-m5-and-Core-m7.172046.0.html

Capture.PNG


Their particular 2016 m7 unit was actually even slower than the 2016 m5, due to throttling, and way slower than my 2017 m3, but I suspect that was an anomaly.
 
Last edited:

Mainsail

macrumors 65816
Sep 19, 2010
1,138
980
I would not be surprised to see Apple give the rMB a refresh with the 3rd generation keyboard and touch ID. Also, the base offering will probably be dropped from 256 GB to 128 GB, which generally translates into $200 drop in Apple's pricing structure....so, $1099. The nTB MBP with 128 GB is probably not long for this world....it does not make sense for a Pro Model to have that level of storage, so they will sell the nTB MBP with base storage at 256 GB.

The Apple line-up would then make more sense:

Consumer & Ultraportable Laptops

  • 12 in rMB 128 GB: starting at $1,099 (replaces old 11 inch MBA as quintessential ultra-portable)
  • 13 in MBA 128 GB: starting at $1,199 (replaces old 13 inch MBA as quintessential everyday consumer laptop)
Pro Laptop Models
  • 13 in nTB MBP 256 GB: starting at $1,499
  • 13 in MBP 256 GB with Touch Bar: starting at $1,799
  • 15 in MBP 256 GB with Touch Bar: starting at $2399

In a year or two, I suspect the rMB and MBA prices will drift downward as the prior MBA price did during its 8 year run from 2010 - 2018.
 
Last edited:

HappyIntro

macrumors regular
Apr 30, 2016
193
196
[QUOTE="If they switch to Arm (very unlikely)

What makes you say that?[/QUOTE]


The rumors of Apple eventually switching to ARM processors are exciting, however some people seem to think that it's right around the corner. The current ARM processors in iPhones and iPad Pros are beasts, but it's a highly customized chip that has been optimized for its use - running iOS in phones and tablets. I'm pretty sure if you tried to just drop it into a MB or MB Air with a recompiled MacOS it would be very disappointing. So they're going to have to redesign the A series chips to be better optimized to driving a real, fully multitasking OS. I have no doubt Apple can create a new flavor of A series chips for running MacOS, but it's going to take time. Also, I think there would be more rumors of the hardware engineering coming out regarding newer, more diverse A series chips.

Also, I am not an expert in CPUs, but I wonder what architecture has the greatest long-term performance headroom. Could the ARM architecture run up against limits sooner than intel's? (I do realize this is all speculation on my part.)
 
Last edited:

radiologyman

macrumors 6502a
Jul 23, 2011
632
174
Given Apple's lead in ARM processors, it will make sense for them to pursue using in house chips beyond IOS devices. Besides having cheaper processors, this will allow for greater customization and unique features. Not to mention that Intel seems to have hit the wall with low power processors. I remember Kuo had a research note suggesting ARM laptop in 2020 and later ARM processors for cars. Possibilities for new smart devices are there as well, for example for a house automation. Thats would put Apple ahead of competition and give needed boost given declining sales of iPhones.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: turbineseaplane

EugW

macrumors 604
Jun 18, 2017
7,312
4,692
The rumors of Apple eventually switching to ARM processors is exciting, however some people seem to think that it's right around the corner. The current ARM processors in iPhones and iPad Pros are beasts, but it's a highly customized chip that has been optimized for its use - running iOS in phones and tablets. I'm pretty sure if you tried to just drop it into a MB or MB Air with a recompiled MacOS it would be very disappointing. So they're going to have to redesign the A series chips to be better optimized to driving a real, fully multitasking OS. I have no doubt Apple can create a new flavor of A series chips for running MacOS, but it's going to take time. Also, I think there would be more rumors of the hardware engineering coming out regarding newer, more diverse A series chips.
I'd be surprised if such designs haven't been in development for years already.
 

HappyIntro

macrumors regular
Apr 30, 2016
193
196
I'd be surprised if such designs haven't been in development for years already.
Yes, you are probably right. I wonder how close the latest prototypes are to being worthy of release into the market. The rumors of 2020 release sound pretty reasonable.
 

lambertjohn

macrumors 65816
Jun 17, 2012
1,025
1,006
Why not just get a 2018 Air? It's the same computer, just a tad bigger with a much-needed, extra Thunderbolt 3 port.
 

Fozziebear40

macrumors regular
Apr 14, 2008
248
101
Newton-le-Willows, England
I'm not in desperate need, I can wait to see if gets an upgrade, however, I have seen a great deal on a 1.3GHz 8GB 512GB storage Space Grey with a third off! £1049 instead of £1,549. Decisions...
 

MacPoulet

macrumors regular
Dec 11, 2012
211
18
Canada
Why not just get a 2018 Air? It's the same computer, just a tad bigger with a much-needed, extra Thunderbolt 3 port.
It’s also very near the same weight as the 13” Pro. In my case, I commute on a bicycle and as silly as it may sound, it makes a difference.
 
  • Like
Reactions: KPOM

BODYBUILDERPAUL

macrumors 68000
Feb 9, 2009
1,532
1,213
Barcelona
Retailer or private?
John Lewis!
They had the rose gold 512GB 2017 model for £999 plus with a 3 year guarantee included.
I've never seen John Lewis offer as much as this off before so not sure why PLUS they have a habit of reducing prices online and then putting a 'out of stock' sign next to them. They did that on Black Friday week on the Tom Ford Neroli Portofino candles and perfume range (my fragrance). Got to admit i'm pretty disgusted with that way of trading. Offer something with a discount but in reality, there's none to buy and you can't reserve one etc. Pretty dirty trading!
 

KPOM

macrumors G5
Oct 23, 2010
14,399
2,992
Why not just get a 2018 Air? It's the same computer, just a tad bigger with a much-needed, extra Thunderbolt 3 port.
38% heavier more than “just a tad” bigger. Not everyone needs a Thunderbolt 3 port. If I were in the market for a 3lb Mac I’d recommend the 2017 nTB 13” Pro. It’s just a tad bigger than the Air and has a more powerful processor and GPU.
 

EugW

macrumors 604
Jun 18, 2017
7,312
4,692
38% heavier more than “just a tad” bigger. Not everyone needs a Thunderbolt 3 port. If I were in the market for a 3lb Mac I’d recommend the 2017 nTB 13” Pro. It’s just a tad bigger than the Air and has a more powerful processor and GPU.
Yep. The Air is the worst of both worlds. Screen class and CPU performance class of the MacBook along with a crappy FaceTime camera that's worse than its predecessor, with the weight and footprint of the MacBook Pro.

Personally I don't see the point of the Retina MacBook Air at this time, except for Apple to capitalize on the branding of the MacBook Air.
 

MacPoulet

macrumors regular
Dec 11, 2012
211
18
Canada
Yep. The Air is the worst of both worlds. Screen class and CPU performance class of the MacBook along with a crappy FaceTime camera that's worse than its predecessor, with the weight and footprint of the MacBook Pro.

Personally I don't see the point of the Retina MacBook Air at this time, except for Apple to capitalize on the branding of the MacBook Air.
It’s the most confusing one. The 12” MacBook should be called the Air, and the Air should be called the MacBook and be $200 cheaper.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mikeray