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But really 3 hours rMBP vs 5h + with the contenders.

It is a big difference, I dont see how one could deny that. And having a notebook to me forced to stay near a outlet 24/7 is just not good.

How do you feel about parallels or other VM? I'd be losing a lot of performance comparing to bootcamp right?
 
1) 1/2 the battery life on Windows as compared to OS X, due to lack of Optimus support. Unknown whether this is a lack of software support or a firmware compatibility issue, but I'm willing to trade continued driver support via reference drivers for battery life- most OEM drivers (the ones required for graphics switching) are never updated after the first year of life.

It has been extensively discussed on the forums. The issue is that rMBP does not implement anything similar to Optimus. With Optimus, the iGPU is connected to the monitor and is always used to produce the final image. If the dGPU is needed, it will perform all the work and then copy the framebuffer back to the iGPU for displaying. Instead, rMBP uses a hardware GPU switcher which allows it to route output from iGPU or dGPU as required. This would require special driver support in Windows and I don't think that Nvidia is keen on writing a specialised driver just for that.

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How do you feel about parallels or other VM? I'd be losing a lot of performance comparing to bootcamp right?

Depends on what you want to do. You won't really loose any performance for CPU-intensive work but your GPU performance will take a severe hit.
 
I trust you, since you are actually using the rMBP with windows, however I would like the know all the negative things BESIDES resolution that would make the windows experience bad.

You're at Apple's mercy when it comes to Windows' drivers. They finally updated them for Windows 8 just a few weeks ago. It's not a priority for them.

And to those people here that say a MBP will run Windows better than a PC... LOL! :D
 
Depends on what you want to do. You won't really loose any performance for CPU-intensive work but your GPU performance will take a severe hit.

Oh damn, that means viewport operations will take a severe hit :/ Guess VM are out.

Im thinking right now, I could get a regular mac bookpro with antiglare display and toss a ssd, replace the optical drive for a HDD and get some ram.

That would solve the resolution problem :)

BUT i'd still be trapped to the miserable battery life.

Thoughts on that?
 
Oh damn, that means viewport operations will take a severe hit :/ Guess VM are out.

Im thinking right now, I could get a regular mac bookpro with antiglare display and toss a ssd, replace the optical drive for a HDD and get some ram.

That would solve the resolution problem :)

BUT i'd still be trapped to the miserable battery life.

Thoughts on that?

Depends what you mean by miserable. Light workload: 5.5 hours. Medium: 3.5 hours. Heavy workload: 2.5 hours. If you look at most PC laptops, though, the max. battery life is around 4.5 hours on light use. So the rMBP would win against one of those.
 
Depends what you mean by miserable. Light workload: 5.5 hours. Medium: 3.5 hours. Heavy workload: 2.5 hours. If you look at most PC laptops, though, the max. battery life is around 4.5 hours on light use. So the rMBP would win against one of those.

Im comparing mbp's battery life with a dell or lenovo workstation. Even better, with other ~8000 MAH ~80 whrs notebook batteries..

And if people claim they have 4-5 hours of real WORK with those workstations (which have the graphic switching thing), I dont believe mbp would do any close to that while having gt 650m active all time.
 
Im comparing mbp's battery life with a dell or lenovo workstation. Even better, with other ~8000 MAH ~80 whrs notebook batteries..

And if people claim they have 4-5 hours of real WORK with those workstations (which have the graphic switching thing), I dont believe mbp would do any close to that while having gt 650m active all time.

Not true.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6023/the-nextgen-macbook-pro-with-retina-display-review

See the Anandtech review. They do battery life tests with the dGPU on for the whole time. Those numbers I gave you are based on the dGPU on the whole time. So browsing the internet, watching a movie and editing a word document will give you 5.5 hours of battery life in Windows on a rMBP. REAL, intense work will give you 2.5-3.5 hours (their test was a 1 MB/S download while looping an HD video trailer and hitting one website every 10 seconds with Flash enabled on the webpage).
 
Not true.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6023/the-nextgen-macbook-pro-with-retina-display-review

See the Anandtech review. They do battery life tests with the dGPU on for the whole time. Those numbers I gave you are based on the dGPU on the whole time. So browsing the internet, watching a movie and editing a word document will give you 5.5 hours of battery life in Windows on a rMBP. REAL, intense work will give you 2.5-3.5 hours (their test was a 1 MB/S download while looping an HD video trailer and hitting one website every 10 seconds with Flash enabled on the webpage).

No, that's not true.

There is absolutely no way I can possibly get more than 4 hours out of Bootcamp on my rMBP. So 5.5 hours is a pipe dream.

You're underestimating Apple's horrid support for Windows drivers. It IS a lot worse than it sounds.

REAL intense workload under OSX (Photoshop and certain applications force the dGPU to be enabled all the time) is 2.5 - 3.5 hours, yes, but under Windows, that's closer to 1.5 - 2 hours. I have seen estimates as low as... 45 minutes (yeah, that's at 100% battery) while rendering.

I only keep Bootcamp around because occasionally I need Windows support either for some gaming or for certain things that the client require. But other than that, OSX should be the default (and only) OS on a rMBP.
 
No, that's not true.

There is absolutely no way I can possibly get more than 4 hours out of Bootcamp on my rMBP. So 5.5 hours is a pipe dream.

You're underestimating Apple's horrid support for Windows drivers. It IS a lot worse than it sounds.

REAL intense workload under OSX (Photoshop and certain applications force the dGPU to be enabled all the time) is 2.5 - 3.5 hours, yes, but under Windows, that's closer to 1.5 - 2 hours. I have seen estimates as low as... 45 minutes (yeah, that's at 100% battery) while rendering.

I only keep Bootcamp around because occasionally I need Windows support either for some gaming or for certain things that the client require. But other than that, OSX should be the default (and only) OS on a rMBP.

Rendering would use 100% CPU. This is a quad core part with turbo boost and hyperthreading. Of course it wouldn't last 2.5-3.5 hours. AnandTech has solid testing methods, I trust their data. In extreme scenarios, yes the battery life could be 45 minutes or even worse. No use pointing out the most extreme scenarios.
 
Alright so there's absolutely no way to make a macbook pro efficient with windows right?

Unless I have the charger with me all the time...

Damn I really wanted to make things work with the mbp!
 
Whats the problem of having the charger if u have to do proper work?????

Because I wouldnt be able to do proper work everywhere since it sounds a pain to bring the charger with me all the time.
 
Rendering would use 100% CPU. This is a quad core part with turbo boost and hyperthreading. Of course it wouldn't last 2.5-3.5 hours. AnandTech has solid testing methods, I trust their data. In extreme scenarios, yes the battery life could be 45 minutes or even worse. No use pointing out the most extreme scenarios.

Even without running anything intensive, battery life under Bootcamp is still horrid, and 4 hours is still the absolute maximum, which can only be achieved if the computer doesn't do anything at all.

You obviously haven't tried running Bootcamp on any MacBook...

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4205/the-macbook-pro-review-13-and-15-inch-2011-brings-sandy-bridge/15

It's not the Retina, but the 15" MBP (2011 model) is close enough.
 
Because I wouldnt be able to do proper work everywhere since it sounds a pain to bring the charger with me all the time.

EVERY laptop wont give you their real performance when under battery if they have even a mainstream gpu like the rmbp. Nor their battery will actually hold for more than 1.5h. The problem here is simple, batteries in their current state cant provide enough power

Another thing if you are really going into rendering and all that that use GPGPU, openCL, openGL, you are going to want a AMD gpu, not a kepler based nvidia gpu

The best thing is to get the 8770w with the m6000, if you get the dreamcolor2 display forget about good battery life, thats a 10bit display

or if budget doesnt allow, get the m17x with the 7970m
 
I'm a bit confused.

Why not consider a 15" Non-Retina? If you are considering Windows as an alternative, very few Windows machines meet the resolution of Retina with the hardware you need anyway.

The 15 Non-Retina allows you to user-upgrade most of the components, still get the powerful GPU, dual boot in Windows 7 without any glitches or errors. (15" Non-Retina has great Boot Camp drivers, very established)

Plus a hard-drive caddy will allow you to set up a DIY Fusion Drive for incredibly fast hard drive response times with an amount of storage that would make a hard drive junky's eyes tear. (Personally I'm considering an SSD+Hybrid Seagate combo on my non-Retina 13 Pro if I decide to keep it. Two hard drive cable failures have dissuaded me away from keeping it.)
 
I'm a bit confused.

Why not consider a 15" Non-Retina? If you are considering Windows as an alternative, very few Windows machines meet the resolution of Retina with the hardware you need anyway.

The 15 Non-Retina allows you to user-upgrade most of the components, still get the powerful GPU, dual boot in Windows 7 without any glitches or errors. (15" Non-Retina has great Boot Camp drivers, very established)

Plus a hard-drive caddy will allow you to set up a DIY Fusion Drive for incredibly fast hard drive response times with an amount of storage that would make a hard drive junky's eyes tear. (Personally I'm considering an SSD+Hybrid Seagate combo on my non-Retina 13 Pro if I decide to keep it. Two hard drive cable failures have dissuaded me away from keeping it.)

Because it has the same drawbacks when using Windows (except the HiDPI screen). You will still get problems with battery, the Fusion drive is not supported under Windows and you lose quite a bit of mobility.
 
Hello!

Ive decided that I need a notebook to study and work with computer graphics, and it needs to replace my desktop for lets say, 90% of the time.

The past weeks I've been strugling with the decision of buying a mac or a origin/sager notebook.

Here are my fears towards the retina macbook pro:

- Will need windows half the time, so bootcamp is the way to go. But I've heard many complaints about windows 7 + retina resolution...

- rMPB may get TOO hot constantly and throttle as consequence.

- No matte finish for the screen.

- And of course all the current rMPB problems that have been popping up here or in the apple's forum.

The obviously GOOD points about rMBP is the chassis. Light and thin, more portability.

Anyways, can you guys give me a help deciding this?

Thanks!

Short version: For what you want, you need Windows. You're better off getting a Wintel system. End of story.

Apple's products emphasize elegance, not raw power. 3D production is NOT about elegance, it is all about raw power. Believe it or not, Windows is better optimized for 3D than OSX is.

Don't even think about VMware. The performance hit will kill you. Likewise, switching between bootcamp and OSX as part of your production will be murder for your workflow. Don't do it.

I'm going to assume that you will be creating content for games. I will tell you right now that 3D production for game development is sorely lacking in OSX. There are a slew of Windows-only utilities that many PC users take for granted which are unavailable for the Mac (i.e. xNormal, 3DO, Unreal Engine, etc.).

I have a Macbook of my own and for the last year I have tried to make a Mac-based workflow that can accomodate a heavy texture baking routine work. It doesn't. There are no decent programs that cover the wide-gamut of tasks required to prepare your models and make them game ready unless you don't mind hopping through 4 or 5 different programs - a huge time pit.

The situation is so bad for game developers that many will opt to use a PC over the Mac for iOS games that utilize 3D content. It's an incredibly embarrassing situation that Apple refuses to acknowledge and it shows just how far professionals have been kicked to the curb.

As for longing for extended battery life, forget it. 3D modelling is a very laborious task that will consume many hours before reaching other areas of the production pipeline. You WILL be spending most of your time connected to a power outlet regardless of what notebook you elect to buy.

Performance is another problem as well. A MBP retina isn't going to handle viewport navigation with dense geometry like a champ either. Rendering, especially architecture, will try your patience as well as that of your clients' if multiple revisions are necessary. As the saying goes, time is money.

If you are really serious about working professionally in 3D/Photoshop, you're going to need a full-sized keyboard, high DPI three-button mouse, Wacom tablet(it doesn't matter if you can't draw) and a dual monitor setup if you expect to be as efficient as your competition. In fact, if you plan on spending a lot of time in one place, staying with your PC desktop will really be a better investment for you because of the numerous GPU options available.

If you absolutely positively must get a Macbook, then do your modeling on the MBP and then transfer your files over to your PC remotely and have it start rendering. You should be able to do this with VNC/RDP for windows.

Here's the other thing worth considering: You'll be using only a select few specialized programs, right? Your experience between OSX and Windows under those circumstances will be a non-issue. OSX works better than Windows when you're trying to take on everything (especially print). But when you're confined to what is necessary for a 3D workflow, OSX doesn't just lose its advantages, it becomes a liability.

It's a hard pill for you to swallow as it was for me but in the end, you'll be better off with a PC solution since Windows is where you'll have to stay.

P.S. For heaven's sake, get something with an Nvidia GPU!
 
^this is right!!

Get a 15" mbp with a 1050p screen, or get a proper windows machine, like a vaio or similar.
 
P.S. For heaven's sake, get something with an Nvidia GPU!

I wondering why nvidia, if their GPGPU capabilities have retained or even lowered since kepler? the 7970 is leaps and bounds faster than the 680, titan is the only thing that is worthwhile in that mess, and there is no titan anywhere to be seen on mobile

his/her best bet would be the m6000

^this is right!!

Get a 15" mbp with a 1050p screen, or get a proper windows machine, like a vaio or similar.
there are no vaio workstations
 
Who needs a workstation? Get a powerful laptop. Rendering can be finished through online renderfarms.

Otherwise get a proper tower. You cant have everything...
 
There is absolutely no way I can possibly get more than 4 hours out of Bootcamp on my rMBP. So 5.5 hours is a pipe dream.

With Windows, I'm lucky to get 2.5-3 hours with WiFi on, display brightness set low, and not doing anything more intensive than basic web surfing and word processing. 5.5 hours is bogus.

You're underestimating Apple's horrid support for Windows drivers. It IS a lot worse than it sounds.

I agree with your premise, but I found it not to be quite so awful. A lot of people don't seem to realize that Boot Camp is merely a courtesy, with support thereof being a very low priority for Apple. The drivers are there only to provide the most basic functionality. Fortunately this isn't problematic for most of the hardware. The two tricky ones are the trackpad and GPU. For the former, you can install Trackpad++ to alleviate some of the hurt. For the latter, at least on MBPs equipped with AMD GPUs, reference mobility drivers will work so you can keep it up to date.
 
Who needs a workstation? Get a powerful laptop. Rendering can be finished through online renderfarms.

Otherwise get a proper tower. You cant have everything...

that is seriously thick and you know that
 
Hello!

Ive decided that I need a notebook to study and work with computer graphics, and it needs to replace my desktop for lets say, 90% of the time.

The past weeks I've been strugling with the decision of buying a mac or a origin/sager notebook.

Here are my fears towards the retina macbook pro:

- Will need windows half the time, so bootcamp is the way to go. But I've heard many complaints about windows 7 + retina resolution...

- rMPB may get TOO hot constantly and throttle as consequence.

- No matte finish for the screen.

- And of course all the current rMPB problems that have been popping up here or in the apple's forum.

The obviously GOOD points about rMBP is the chassis. Light and thin, more portability.

Anyways, can you guys give me a help deciding this?

Thanks!

If you need Windows for the majority of the time then I would just buy a Laptop that comes with Windows. I prefer Dell, but hey that's me.
 
You know, this is just curiosity piquing my interest but, what if he combined a mid-low range tower with a 13" Classic and used SplashTop HD?

Think about it:
A $500-600 tower will have a much better GPU than even the 15" Retina and he would have $1500 to spend on a Classic that would have the upgraded i7, 16GB of ram and offer mobility he desires. The main advantage being that SplashTop can give him full access to his rendering machine.

You get the best of both worlds: A mobile platform with much better battery life, build quality and value and a render beast at home that you can easily access on the road.
 
Guys nice inputs but let me clear this out first:

With a 15" mbp I would get at top 2 hours of full work in bootcamp, right?

do you think that a dell m4700 or a lenovo w530 would really give me, lets say, more that 3 hours?

If you need Windows for the majority of the time then I would just buy a Laptop that comes with Windows. I prefer Dell, but hey that's me.

I'd probably be using windows 50% of the time. Web browsing and regular multitasking is just SO much pleasing with the mac...trackpad and all the gestures is just awsome
 
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