Is Apple crippling PPC users on purpose?

[emptyCup]

Since 10.4.9 + 10.4.10, my PowerBook seems to be stalling, lagging, slowing down and crashing alot more... Please, no questions about the specs of my machine, i'm more interested in seeing if there is anyone out there who believes Apple would do that?

There are still plenty of PPC machines out there, including mine which has not slowed with the current updates. It is entirely possible that advances in the OS might tax the capabilities of older machines. The sure way to find out is to revert to the last version you were happy with.

I would also check Activity Monitor to see if some program is using more CPU than it should (or if some recently added program is using it).

The short answer to your question is "No". I don't believe Apple is doing anything malicious. Their updates are processor specific and they have no reason to purposely make you unhappy. I am sure you realize that there comes a point when an old machine can no longer keep up with advances in software. I have an old G3 I still use, but I do not expect it to run 10.4.10.

Adding RAM is a relatively inexpensive way to extend the life of an old machine, but the simplest way is to just stay at the OS version where you happy. Best wishes.

 

[supremedesigner]

Hmmm, I've noticed the same thing to my mac too. The last Powermac G4 (before G5) w/ DP 1.42 with 2GB of ram, 300 GB of internal HD.

It got real slow down / laggy when I installed CS3 applications. I am a full time freelance graphic design so I had to restart my computer once or twice a day. My computer can not handle more than 3 CS3 (including bridge) (I have extensis fusion, iChat, Adium, Safari (for basecamp)). It sucks though.

Might get me macbook pro since CS3 will allow up to two computers. Pretty cool!

 

[chex]

I agree. Since 10.4.9.

I've been getting this too (PB 12"). My computer is running hotter, slightly less smoothly and crashes more often, not much, but definitely more often.

It's not that it doesn't work, it's that it doesn't work as well.

I don't think its a conspiracy though, it just happens - you can't guarantee a very high level of optimisation all the time.

 

[mkrishnan]

My (both PPC) Macs seem to behave fine under 10.4.9 as well as 10.4.10....

Besides, at the risk of being called a fanboy (jigga, please), if Apple were releasing very optimized Intel builds, it still wouldn't cause the PowerPC builds to actually get slower than the previous PowerPC builds. It would just cause them to not get faster.

 

[leekohler]

My PowerBook is also struggling with later Tiger builds, although I put that down to it only having 640MB RAM and a 32MB graphics card. I certainly haven't noticed any slowdown on my G5.

My G5 has actually only gotten faster with each update to tell the truth. It's never had any trouble at all.

 

[killmoms]

Oh god, you're sickening.

Rich.

And your sarcasm detector is SERIOUSLY broken. Calm down, man.

 

[MIDI_EVIL]

And your sarcasm detector is SERIOUSLY broken. Calm down, man.

I was being tongue in cheek.

Rich.

 

[Dustman]

My iMac G3 running 10.4.10 is running amazingly. I did ponder the same question though, after i updated to 10.4.9. All my computer did after that update was crash and fail to boot. My SMART status showed my HD as fine, but then, randomly when i had money, i chose to upgrade the HD anyways to a faster, larger one. Turns out my old HD was toast . Don't be so sketchy when it comes to upgrading older hardware. Instead of looking at is as wasting money on dated hardware, think of it as expanding your current hardware to match your current needs. People in this forum piss me off when they start telling other people that they need the latest and greatest. Very few people need more than 1-2 GBs of ram and a decent 7200 RPM HD, and yeah i know, PPC Macs have been discontinued, but that means NOTHING until PPC apps are discontinued as well, and that aint going to happen for a whiiile. Pick yourself up a new HD and maybe some ram if you have the dough, you will be overwhelmed by how fast your G4 can go. Heck, I have Photoshop CS 2 on my iMac and it is remarkably usable.

 

[Lau]

Iy's funny you say this, as I've noticed this too. I've got a newest build 12" iBook (1.33Ghz), which shipped with Tiger. It was snappy as anything when I got it, and now it's lagging for a lot of things. I haven't changed the software dramatically, it's still got a bit of disk space left, it's got 1.5 GB RAM. I was thinking of reinstalling OSX and seeing if that made any difference, but I would say it's been dramatically worse over the last six months or so.

I wouldn't necessarily say it's deliberate sabotage, but it's certainly interesting you've felt the same way.

 

[PimpDaddy]

Hmmm, I've noticed the same thing to my mac too. The last Powermac G4 (before G5) w/ DP 1.42 with 2GB of ram, 300 GB of internal HD.

It got real slow down / laggy when I installed CS3 applications. I am a full time freelance graphic design so I had to restart my computer once or twice a day. My computer can not handle more than 3 CS3 (including bridge) (I have extensis fusion, iChat, Adium, Safari (for basecamp)). It sucks though.

Might get me macbook pro since CS3 will allow up to two computers. Pretty cool!

You do know that CS3 is optimized to Intel, right?

 

[MidiMonk]

FWIW, i have 10.4.10 on my 12" 1 Ghz Powerbook(1.25 Gb ram, 60 GB Hitachi 7200) with no issues yet.I use Logic Pro and various other audio programs with no ill effects other than slowness due to software requirements.It does take a backseat now that the MBP is here though.

 

[James L]

Everyone who works for Apple couldn't be a better human being - EVERYONE.

Wow. No offence, but if you are serious, you are delusional.

While I think the original poster's suggestion of a conspiracy theory at Apple is just plain silly... to think that any company with tens of thousands of employees has no bad people in it is just plain wrong.

I know many people in Cupertino. Most are great. Some are horrible. This is the same as ANY company.

 

[mBurns]

I was just going to chime in..

Although I don't have a PowerBook, I do have an older iBook G3 Clamshell. I'm running OS X 10.4.10 on the clammy, and it's running like a charm. Faster then it did on the earlier revisions of OS X 10.4. I don't mind it at all. As a comparison, I also have a MacBook Pro Core Duo.

 

[Aniej]

And your sarcasm detector is SERIOUSLY broken. Calm down, man.

After reading his second post, or rather the first one claiming how great every apple employee was, I thought it was sarcastic as well, but as not really positive. But, after reading his response and taking into account the language he used and how defensive he was, I actually came out the other way on this one and now feel pretty strongly he was not kidding.

It wasn't meant to be arrogant but your post is one of the most cynical I have ever read here - plus to make it a new thread is just so outrageous I couldn't help myself. It makes ye appear to be a blasphemer sir. Do you not realize that Apple employees are among those with the highest ethical standards in the history of mankind? They are all above reproach when it comes to proper behavior. They can't even get hired without passing rigorous ethical background checks.

OK if I was impolite to ask him to get a grip what was he insulting the entire Apple OS X development team plus Steve Jobs personally? If I'm a fanboy for defending their honor then I'll take it. Everyone who works for Apple couldn't be a better human being - EVERYONE.

I love Apple, no really I site Apple and their approach as a model for many illustrations of points I am making regarding innovative business cultures. But, seriously, while I don't for a second think Apple would do what the OP was simply questioning (see post #3) your posts far exceed the claimed delusional thinking presented in the OP's question.

I have seen most of your posts and know some of your background and usually respect most of the comments you make, but unless this is sarcastic, your view is deeply distorted. Furthermore, the question is not insulting, give me a break, Apple and its employees are not beyond reproach.

Moreover, the facts simply don't support what you are suggesting. Take for instance, oh I don't know, Apple's former CFO (number 2 or 3 behind jobs) and their General Counsel, in charge of the department most closely associated with following ethical obligations. Where are Nancy Heinen and Fred Anderson today? Oh wait indicted by the SEC for fraud. SEC Press Release.

 

[bartelby]

My 1.5GHz PB G4 with 1GB RAM has actually seemed a little snappier under recent Tiger updates.

No issues with anything.

 

[Xeem]

Actually, I'm considering rolling back, as everything has been a little buggier since 10.4.9. For example: disk images that used to mount perfectly fine now "appear to be damaged" upon mounting, which screws up a lot of programs from me. I'm on a laptop, so I tend to use disk images copied to my hard drive rather than carry game CDs with me; I set up Automator flows that mount the CD image and launch the game and stuck them in my dock, but none of them work ever since 10.4.9. Not a terrible issue, but frustrating nonetheless.

 

[polycat33]

I agree that it's not that they're looking to make the older computers slower with the upgrades, they're just making the upgrades best for the newest hardware and that happens to bog down older computers which can't handle it. It's not because they want your computer to get slowed down enough you feel you have to buy a new one, that's just a side product of the software being made best for newer hardware. My 5 year old PC could basically not handle running iTunes (it worked, but it was so slow I never had the patience to use it anymore) anymore because the updates had made the program so hefty my old computer just couldn't handle it. I think that sucks, but hey, they packed in all kinds of features that run flawlessly on newer machines. If they didn't do it like this, if they specifically tried to make all upgrades work perfectly on all machines, they might hold back on some cool new additions and upgrades to stuff that older computers might not handle as well as new ones. Yeah, it sucks, but if it's any comfort, I'll bet the upgrades won't bog your computer down so bad you can't stand it until at least a couple more years.

 

[iW00t]

Everyone who works for Apple couldn't be a better human being - EVERYONE.

Yes, better than you, that is apparent for sure.

People in the employ of people such as those forum mods on the official Apple forums who silence users who post with genuine problems.

Or that manager who was singled out in that recent thread that insisted on the poster paying $200 when doing a 1-1 exchange because he received some form of credit on his MacBook Pro.

Everone.

Yes.

 

[ProstheticHead]

I thought his reply sounded a bit rude.

Then again, I hate the forum surfers who jump into a forum and chastise you rather than answer your question. Just answer the damn question, I don't care about personal bias / opinions beyond anything that I asked.

However, to say that Apple is intentionally crippling its consumers does seem a little questionable, but at the same time I'm right there with you. I was one of the unlucky schmucks who bought the iMac G5 iSight as soon as it was announced, thinking I was getting this amazing new computer that wouldn't be outdated for a couple years. And what'd I get three months later? Quite a few scripted responses from Apple employees basically telling me I was SOL.

Steve Jobs and IBM just aren't great buddies at this point.

 

[Abstract]

It wasn't meant to be arrogant but your post is one of the most cynical I have ever read here - plus to make it a new thread is just so outrageous I couldn't help myself. It makes ye appear to be a blasphemer sir. Do you not realize that Apple employees are among those with the highest ethical standards in the history of mankind? They are all above reproach when it comes to proper behavior. They can't even get hired without passing rigorous ethical background checks.

OK if I was impolite to ask him to get a grip what was he insulting the entire Apple OS X development team plus Steve Jobs personally? If I'm a fanboy for defending their honor then I'll take it. Everyone who works for Apple couldn't be a better human being - EVERYONE.

How are your responses any different? They're actually more idiotic.


I say if your system is running fine, don't update it. I can understand the need to update from 10.4.0 to 10.4.1, but Tiger isn't new anymore, and updating from 10.4.9 to 10.4.10 seems pointless if things are working well.

Anyway, I only just updated to 10.4.10. I waited so that any issues with the update were addressed before I installed it on my system.

 

[JFreak]

my powerbook hasn't been "snappy" since I moved to 10.4 from 10.3. I know for me it's because of RAM and a full hard drive, but I don't have the cash to upgrade...

So, is there anything in Tiger that you absolutely must have? Just re-install the Panther (only upgrade up to 10.3.8 if you can avoid the 10.3.9 version) and enjoy a snappy laptop I loved Panther on PowerBook, they seem to love each other

 

[JFreak]

Iy's funny you say this, as I've noticed this too. I've got a newest build 12" iBook (1.33Ghz), which shipped with Tiger. It was snappy as anything when I got it, and now it's lagging for a lot of things. I haven't changed the software dramatically, it's still got a bit of disk space left, it's got 1.5 GB RAM. I was thinking of reinstalling OSX and seeing if that made any difference, but I would say it's been dramatically worse over the last six months or so.

Do it, that will help! The reason for the slowdown is the system drive has been somewhat fragmented, thus moving some of the system files to the slower part of the hard drive.

If you trust your tech skills, you should partition the hard drive also. (You can call the disk utility during the installation procedure...) For example, dividing the disk into two equal-sized partitions - System and Storage - forces all system files to the faster part of the hard drive, even though the drive would fragment over time. It would just fragment within the faster part of the drive

I keep my iTunes and iPhoto libraries on the "Storage" partition, because it's always going to be fast enough even though it is the slower part of the drive. Changing iPhoto library location is very easy and it's not very hard for the iTunes either.

More unix-savvy people can put in "System" and "Users" partitions and then mount the "Users" partition into the proper place, thus having all user files on a separate partition. This would mean radically less fragmenting on the System drive. It would also mean should you ever have to re-install the OS, your users partition would be kept intact and ready to be used after re-mounting to its place.

And of course, gurus know how to make a dedicated swap partition too, thus virtually eliminating the System drive fragmention

 

[Chef Medeski]

It wasn't meant to be arrogant but your post is one of the most cynical I have ever read here - plus to make it a new thread is just so outrageous I couldn't help myself. It makes ye appear to be a blasphemer sir. Do you not realize that Apple employees are among those with the highest ethical standards in the history of mankind? They are all above reproach when it comes to proper behavior. They can't even get hired without passing rigorous ethical background checks.

lool.

Ethical background checks that were created by the managers, no? And what about the managers, what ethical tests did they have to go through?

I'm pretty sure if ethics were an issue in a corporation it would be with managers or bosses when it comes to product development. I doubt the average Apple worker really feels like hes rewarded if Apple sells a couple hundred more computers a month cause all the old ones feel slow now.

You are being kinda harsh for a polite question. Hes not making a rant or anything just espousing a theory for discussion and thats what these forums are for. You can have your opinion and we would all appreciate it if you presented it in a more mannerly fashion. But you should not attack someone for merely asking about a topic.

Apple is not god. I'm not going to take that ethical argument just because its Apple no one gets kickbacks on their stock options.....

 

[Chef Medeski]

Yes, I agree that Apple wants our money and is pretty happy with shorter product life cycles. Fortunately they exploit this not by downgrading old products but by upgrading new ones and making some people feel like they have to have every new revision...

That said, I think it's a bit absurd to assume a direct ploy to slow down older systems. What happens is that software is inevitably designed for the newer hardware (ie using more RAM, widescreen iTunes store that annoys the hell out of me on my 12" Powerbook) and our older software just can't keep up after awhile.

That's my 2 cents...and it is a legitimate question, considering things like proprietary headphone jacks (iPhone, other mp3 players) and all the other little anti-consumer details that we often tend to look past.

I think thats a logical reasoning. They are optimizing it to work with faster hardware more and thus the older specs just feel slower and slower, maybe its not a purposeful act but merely a natural progression of software. My suggestion like previously stated is to stop updating. My PB worked just great with 10.4.5 or .6. And I never noticed any differences after those updates. so, rollback is my best suggestion.

OK if I was impolite to ask him to get a grip what was he insulting the entire Apple OS X development team plus Steve Jobs personally? If I'm a fanboy for defending their honor then I'll take it. Everyone who works for Apple couldn't be a better human being - EVERYONE.

LOL. What are you Steve Jobs' Mother?

Like honestly we are not allowed to be critical of a company because its Apple. Thats walking a fine line on trying to bind our right to free speech. Hes espousing a theory very politely not attacking anyone, theres a difference. This is a discusion not an attack or an argument against Apple. If you must defened the honor of a company in a disucssion and try or believe the discussion should be closed down; thats binding our right to free speech and I'm a fanboy of Free Speech and the Constitution not some company that finally woke up 5 years ago to realize how much in the ******** it was. Once again Apple is not god. And its not your baby! I'm sure Steve feels good enough about himself having turned around a bankrupt company into almost the number one tech company in the world. I doubt he needs little minions defending his honor on forums boards because his feelings will get hurt.

 

[Queso]

No issues with anything.

Except the weight of course