OWC has the base mode refurbished on sale for $995. I currently have a 2017 27” IMac and I suspect that will be discontinued next year. Or is it a bad decision to buy any intel macs at this point? I don’t want to spend a lot of money on the monitor and the new studio. Thanks in advance.
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Is it worth buying a 2020 27” IMac in 2022?
- Thread starter Jacoblee23
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By discontinued, I assume you mean no longer being able to load whatever the next macOS is after Ventura. I agree with you on that, especially since I have a pair of 2017 iMacs at home and at a vacation home. That being said, my wife who only does web browsing and e-mails has been running a 2010 Mac Mini with El Capitan and has not had any security issues. Since I need a more modern machine with better security and powerful enough to do photo processing, the age of my machines and potential lack of support weighs on me.
Iin my opinion, I would not buy the 2020 iMac, as it only gets you, at most a few more years and may be a less powerful machine than what you currently have.
My solution is going to be purchasing the new M2 Mac Mini when(if) it comes out and 2 decent monitors. Even the current Mini would do, but why not wait for the newer machine? Since its's small enough to transport, the one computer should be enough for me and I'll save the aggravation of loading backups when I change locations every 6 months. If you don't need a huge SSD, the current base Mini with 256GB lists at Apple for $699 and you can get a reasonable monitor for under $500 for a total investment for newer technology of only $200 more than the refurbished iMac.
Good luck.
One thing you need to bear in mind is that the PPC to Intel transition happened in 2006, and PPC support was dropped from Snow Leopard in 2009... I.e. it might not be that many years before all Intel support is dropped from the latest OS.
Of course, it's not a death sentence when the latest OS X won't run - probably at least 2 years of official support and a couple more years before it becomes a liability, unless you're unlucky and there's some catastrophic security bug that you must fix (in which case Apple may come under pressure to fix older OSs anyway).
Personally, though, I wouldn't pay serious money for an Intel Mac now unless you need it to run something that you can't run on Apple Silicon (e.g. Bootcamp, or x86 virtualisation). If your 2017 iMac is doing the job then I'd hold on until you see some attractive second hand deals on Apple Silicon Macs.
On the other hand, it's probably your last chance to get another Mac with a cheap 5k display. Currently, to get something in the base 27" iMac price bracket you need to pair a M1 Mini with a third-party 4k display.
You need to remember that the last time Apple transitioned they had a much smaller installed base. Now with many more intel Macs still in use it doesn't really matter what Apple wants to do. What matters is that if they drop support for Macs that they were selling just a couple of years ago they're going to get a big backlash from their installed base. And who knows, the EU may get involved and tell them how long they'll need to support the intel models to keep them from becoming e-waste. Especially since they have no affordable replacement for the 27-inch iMacs.
I wouldn't do it. Go refurbed 24" Imac or wait until the Mac Studio goes to the refurbed store and get a reasonable 4k monitor. It will be more than $995 but will last longer I suspect.
The 2020 has some value as the best/last 5K iMac for people who want 27" retina, but I don't think it is worth spending $995 to upgrade from a 2017/2019. The 2020 will likely only have 1-2 years more support.
A little perspective here. I am a 71-year-old retired graphic design professional. My first Mac was a Plus in 1990 and I've worked on nothing but a succession of Macs ever since. I am retired because I am losing my sight. I NEED a big screen. I am currently on a 2011 27" iMac. It hasn't been supporteed for eons, it's running High Sierra, but hey, it still works OK foe whatr I need. Still, I had been thinking of replacing it, and now Apple discontinues the 27" iMac. So much for the computer for the rest of us.
I was disappointed to read that there will be no more 27" iMacs. I would gladly buy that 2020 model, thanks for the tip. If that doesn't pan out, hello eBay. Not all of us are young, or healthy, or able to afford a new Pro setup, or want the latest and greatest. As an artist, I appreciate the colors on the 24" though, but it would make my photography work difficult.
I was disappointed to read that there will be no more 27" iMacs. I would gladly buy that 2020 model, thanks for the tip. If that doesn't pan out, hello eBay. Not all of us are young, or healthy, or able to afford a new Pro setup, or want the latest and greatest. As an artist, I appreciate the colors on the 24" though, but it would make my photography work difficult.
The transition to Apple Silicon started around two years ago and is still not complete. My 2020 27" iMac shipped with Catalina and by the time I upgrade to Ventura will have already had three MacOS upgrades.
OTOH Apple did drop support for a lot of older Intel Macs with Ventura and they are still selling the Apple Watch Series 3 which will not receive any more WatchOS upgrades.
There's a difference between "support" and "supported by the latest MacOS".
Apple are under no obligation to provide Mac owners with any new OS or other "feature upgrades" not promised when they bought your hardware. They could have announced at WWDC that Ventura would be Apple Silicon only - of course that would have been a PR disaster and was never likely, but they're basically free to drop Intel support as soon as they think that any backlash would be tolerable.
Where they might be in legal/regulatory trouble is if they deliberately or through inaction, knobble older models - such as "Batterygate", failing to fix a bug, not patching a serious "don't go online until this is patched" vulnerability, or prematurely locking old models out of services like iCloud. Apple can deal with those issues by releasing "late" OS updates on a case-by-case basis.
I think Apple are cutting it a bit fine with their (unwritten) 'last 2 os versions' support policy - especially since the latest OS often isn't really stable until 6 months or so after release. However, that's not going to come to a head until there's a specific issue to complain about - I've never found it a problem to run 2-3 versions behind.
It's likely to complete this year, and if they don't announce the Mac Pro replacement this year they might as well say "if you need internal expansion or PCIe GPUs go buy a PC".
The sensible thing to do might be to drop Intel support from next year's MacOS release and declare either Ventura or Monterrey (whichever turns out to be the most stable) to be a "long-term support" version receiving 5 years of critical updates - and much rejoicing would ensue (especially, I suspect, from the sort of people still buying new Intel Macs).
Its not when they announce a replacement for the Mac Pro that matters. It is when they ship an Apple Silicon Mac Pro.
If it was going to ship in the fall I would have expected an announcement at WWDC but it is possible they could announce in October and ship in November. They did announce the M2 though which suggests the Mac Pro replacement may use an SoC based on the M2. If so, an October announcement seems unlikely.
Ventura does drop support for older Intel CPUs and AMD GPUs. It's more than just a marketing drop too, some of the low level code apparently uses SMID instructions that aren't supported on older Intel CPUs. So it seems that Apple is materially reducing its support for Intel hardware in this release but that doesn't mean they will drop Intel support completely in the next release. I would expect another couple of major releases.
Agreed. I’d have to look it up, but the PowerPC macs were supported for quite a while after the move to Intel (2 - 3 releases. Was it Tiger or Leopard?)
What I am interested in seeing is for how long current Intel Macs will be supported for in the future. 3-5 releases? And at what point will new “M-chip only” features start being introduced to coerce users to make the switch?
Well, really it's when they stop selling Intel Mac Pros (and Minis) that the "clock" for Intel support starts ticking. Except, as I said, how long that clock has to run for is entirely down to what Apple feel they can get away with - and I don't think the people still buying Mac Pros and Intel Minis are the sort who are desperately worried about being able to install a new, buggy OS every October.
Anyway, if it gets a "proper" launch I'd expect it to ship within a few weeks of that - it's only WWDC "previews" that sometimes announce products months in advance.
My guess is that either the Mac Pro will have some sort of re-branded SoC (having M1 or M2 in the name would be a hostage to fortune on a product that's typically had a 3-6 year product cycle!) or it will be some sort of multi-processor/cluster scheme using "regular" M1/M2 Max or Ultra processors - rather than an attempt to make a monolithic Xeon-W/Ryzen-killer out of the same building blocks as a MacBook processor
Logically, the next thing to go would be anything without a T1/T2 chip "because security" - but that's going to hit things like pre-2020 iMacs, so it might be the stage at which Apple rips off the Band-Aid and drops Intel. As I said, they can always extend critical support for the last Intel-compatible OS.
ANS: Since over a year ago when the Magic Keyboard with Touch ID (Apple Silicon Only) came out...
...and more to come with Ventura:
I was more thinking on-device features (think Stage Manager on M1 iPads only type thing), but fair point!
As an owner of a 27' iMac I absolutely love it but you already have a perfectly reasonable 2017 iMac and, in my humble opinion, will see you through to the end (for now?) of Intel Macs and well beyond.
With the much vaunted Apple Silicon almost fully upon us. Theres really no point wasting Money replacing, what I consider, an iconic Machine with definite potential.
I did consider buying a 2017 and investing in upgrades should the right machine at the right price come along and obviously factoring in the amount of what I regard as ideal updates for my current and future needs, but I went for a 2020 instead, purely at the time I needed a working machine with out time to spend upgrading and tweaking to my satisfaction, getting a bit old here to engage in "all nighter" trouble shooting sessions. LoL
As regards OS matters theres nothing you really can't do (with or without) the folk at the OCLP (Open Core Legacy Project) with a 2017 iMac, as regard "Official" Support for MacOS whatever version, until ARM takes over.
My 2020 is hanging on, just, and after Ventura, in my estimation, I doubt mine will be in support. Or if it still is then the next MacOS (next year) will be the last.
Although Apple seem to defy many predictions out there despite speculative postings on the Web and YouTube pontification, I bought in the knowledge that the end is well nigh but the allure of the aesthetics of an iconic design, good performance, ease of running Win10 and 11 in Bootcamp (sorry much of my work takes me over to the "Dark Side" 😉) possibly a little bias I used to have one of the original iMacs "Bondi?" back in OS 8 latterly 9 Days and hilariously ran Win95 better than an IBM compatible all the way back then.
Seems to me the list of machines that "bit the dust" with support this time round (with Ventura) are the none T2 machines with the exception of, possibly? the 2017 iMac Pro.
Save the money, in my opinion, if the performance is a bit lack lustre why not upgrade in Situ? Faster Chip, NVMe and SSD if its a fusion Mac, more Ram even and you'll get a blistering Machine not only cheaper, but really quite fulfilling upgrading your self I find. You can even resell the Old bits, I normally buy a cheap enclosure for old healthy HDD's as you can never have too much Storage.
I am not sure what Tech Prices are in your neck of the woods but why not pay some one? especially if it's too challenging and it can be DIY as I won't "Sugar Coat it" its an Apple after all 😉
Just some "food for thought" there and I hope it helps, good luck.
With the much vaunted Apple Silicon almost fully upon us. Theres really no point wasting Money replacing, what I consider, an iconic Machine with definite potential.
I did consider buying a 2017 and investing in upgrades should the right machine at the right price come along and obviously factoring in the amount of what I regard as ideal updates for my current and future needs, but I went for a 2020 instead, purely at the time I needed a working machine with out time to spend upgrading and tweaking to my satisfaction, getting a bit old here to engage in "all nighter" trouble shooting sessions. LoL
As regards OS matters theres nothing you really can't do (with or without) the folk at the OCLP (Open Core Legacy Project) with a 2017 iMac, as regard "Official" Support for MacOS whatever version, until ARM takes over.
My 2020 is hanging on, just, and after Ventura, in my estimation, I doubt mine will be in support. Or if it still is then the next MacOS (next year) will be the last.
Although Apple seem to defy many predictions out there despite speculative postings on the Web and YouTube pontification, I bought in the knowledge that the end is well nigh but the allure of the aesthetics of an iconic design, good performance, ease of running Win10 and 11 in Bootcamp (sorry much of my work takes me over to the "Dark Side" 😉) possibly a little bias I used to have one of the original iMacs "Bondi?" back in OS 8 latterly 9 Days and hilariously ran Win95 better than an IBM compatible all the way back then.
Seems to me the list of machines that "bit the dust" with support this time round (with Ventura) are the none T2 machines with the exception of, possibly? the 2017 iMac Pro.
Save the money, in my opinion, if the performance is a bit lack lustre why not upgrade in Situ? Faster Chip, NVMe and SSD if its a fusion Mac, more Ram even and you'll get a blistering Machine not only cheaper, but really quite fulfilling upgrading your self I find. You can even resell the Old bits, I normally buy a cheap enclosure for old healthy HDD's as you can never have too much Storage.
I am not sure what Tech Prices are in your neck of the woods but why not pay some one? especially if it's too challenging and it can be DIY as I won't "Sugar Coat it" its an Apple after all 😉
Just some "food for thought" there and I hope it helps, good luck.
I think its worth it depending what you want to do with it or what you expect from it. I bought this model myself a month ago. If you can grab the configuration you really want, it can be a great deal.
If you plan to install Windows on it then its a no brainer. You'll get a very good computer at a decent price to even game on Windows. The fact that its the only "big" iMac left is also a point to considerate. For macOS support, even if Apple drop support for the latest version in 2 years, we'll still get 2 more years of security patches and its all that matters. I can count on one hand the number of new features they added since 5-6 years I really use or think its really useful in everyday usage so the latest macOS version is not a must. Yes its important for the longevity of the computer, but other than that I can easily live with the current OS for 2 years if the worst scenario of early dropping support is true.
All in all I love my new 2020 iMac. Its fast and very powerful. For now the M1 macs have nothing special that make me regret buying the 2020 iMac. My only advice is to buy the i7 model, avoid the i5.
If you plan to install Windows on it then its a no brainer. You'll get a very good computer at a decent price to even game on Windows. The fact that its the only "big" iMac left is also a point to considerate. For macOS support, even if Apple drop support for the latest version in 2 years, we'll still get 2 more years of security patches and its all that matters. I can count on one hand the number of new features they added since 5-6 years I really use or think its really useful in everyday usage so the latest macOS version is not a must. Yes its important for the longevity of the computer, but other than that I can easily live with the current OS for 2 years if the worst scenario of early dropping support is true.
All in all I love my new 2020 iMac. Its fast and very powerful. For now the M1 macs have nothing special that make me regret buying the 2020 iMac. My only advice is to buy the i7 model, avoid the i5.
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Not sure what you mean here. The 2017 iMac Pro is a T2 Mac, the regular 2017 27" iMac is not. Both will be supported in Ventura. The 2017 MBP is a T1 Mac and is still supported in Ventura but the very similar 2016 MBP (also a T1 Mac) is not.
That is true for hardware support. Doesn't appear that there is a published policy for software support. The following Ars article illustrates the point well:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/202...tes-than-they-used-to-heres-why-its-a-problem
Hopefully the cost of the Mac Pro keeps support around longer than the 2013 Mac Pro which was last sold in 2019.