Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
I have 64gb in my current laptop. Xe graphics has access to 32gb if needed and I have 32 left for other system useage. I have 128gb in my workstation because....why not. It's worth more than a new system now. ha ha.
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Is windows 11 really bloated?
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Mr_Ed
macrumors 65816
Using the amount of “free” memory after boot is a useless metric and even comparing different machines with similar hardware configuration, is just as useless. The amount of background services (OEM bloatware, assistants, cloud syncs, virtualization, etc.), and “load at startup” apps impacts this some, but the biggest impact is from a chunk of memory Windows grabs to pre-cache some things. Most of this would be instantly released and available if you were to load large enough apps/tasks in the course of getting your work done. The size of this cache is influenced by the amount of physical RAM, where more RAM usually means the initial size is larger.
So in short, looking at “free memory” is useless and unless you are experiencing some actual issue causing you to try and diagnose it, just chill and go about your tasks with the computer.
So in short, looking at “free memory” is useless and unless you are experiencing some actual issue causing you to try and diagnose it, just chill and go about your tasks with the computer.
Wow just Wow it worse than windows now. I remember with Snow Leopard the System requirements where 1 GB of RAM.
Boy oh has it gotten really bloated like windows now.
This originally started in Windows 8 and it was based on the frequency of programs that you ran. When Windows 8 started, it was actually annoying as it would preload way too much stuff to use your available memory. Back then most were using hard drives so startup could take a while to load your programs. They got rid of that at some later point but the idea of pre-loading isn't a bad one with SSDs and especially if it's staggered rather than doing it all at startup.
I’m not sure why Microsoft will put 4 GB of RAM of minimum RAM requirements
This is just terrible.
This is just terrible.
Google AI:
Yes, Windows can preload or automatically launch applications at startup
, a feature designed to speed up app opening times, though it can slow down boot times. Windows 10/11 allows apps to launch via the Task Manager startup tab, while recent updates introduce preloading features like "Startup Boost" for Microsoft Office and upcoming preloading for File Explorer, which can be managed.
Key Aspects of Windows Startup Behavior:
- Startup Applications: Applications with shortcuts in the startup folder (accessed via shell:startup in Run) or listed in Task Manager > Startup tab will launch automatically upon login.
- Startup Boost (Office): Microsoft 365 apps use "Startup Boost" to pre-load in a paused state in the background to improve responsiveness, which can be disabled in Office settings.
- File Explorer Preloading: Microsoft is testing a feature to preload File Explorer for faster launch times, which can be disabled in Folder Options > View tab.
- Managing Startup Impact: You can manage or disable startup applications in Settings > Apps > Startup or via the Task Manager "Startup" tab to improve performance.
- UWP Prelaunch: Universal Windows Platform (UWP) apps can be prelaunched by the system to make them appear faster, depending on available system resources.
mansplains
macrumors 68000
Modern OSs interpret unused memory as wasted potential, and use it for things like cache opportunistically. I always think of it as kitchen counter space, you’re not gonna work in one small corner when you have several counters and an island. It may appear as though it’s a lot of resources for doing “nothing”, but if those resources aren’t tied up, why shouldn’t the system leverage them?
maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
but macos manages memory differently then windows, the old adage, free ram is wasted ram when it comes to macos.
I think it boils down better to see if there's any pressure being shown within the activity monitor.
But is this really problem now today with SSD are really super fast and computer can start up or open apps in seconds compared to hard drive that took minute to start up windows or open an app.
How does it know what apps to load into RAM?
It can be a problem on Apple's base models that have small and slow SSDs.
I hear about people complaining about beachballs with base configurations. I think that the Neo's base SSD is around MBps. My M1 Pro MacBook Pro runs about 5,500 MBps so much less of an issue but I'd just rather not swap at all.
Windows SSDs have run at PCIe Gen 5 since 2022. Apple just put them in their pro models this year so swap should be fast but if you're buying a pro model, you're probably sizing the RAM to minimize swap anyways.
From a pragmatic view, it's just easier to size well. Unfortunately for me, I didn't realize how much RAM WINE and Rosetta 2 could add to program usage.
mansplains
macrumors 68000
I fail to see where I listed a problem..?
The computer loads whatever it’s programmed to. Other replies here get into the actual content. The computer doesn’t work like us loading a vehicle, where I know there’s gonna be two passengers and equipment I need for a sport or activity. It has a routine, but it isn’t prescient.
QuarterSwede
macrumors G4
From boot to log in isn’t the issue. I have a work issued Lenovo E16 Gen 3 (newest) that has a Core Ultra 7 and it takes 5 minutes from boot up to actually be useable. That’s not an exaggeration. Even work managed MacBooks aren’t that slow since they can still be used while everything is still loading. Windows is embarrassingly bad these days.
I have 2020 Gen 3 SSDs in my i7-10700. Speeds are 3,500 MBps.
Gen 4 SSDs came out in 2019 and those could run at 7,500 MBps.
Apple's SSDs on base models have been pretty bad.
I just booted my Lenovo Yoga 2-in-1 Core Ultra 7 and it took 37 seconds from opening the lid to being logged in by Windows Hello.
Startup really isn't an issue as I don't normally ever shut it down. It mainly reboots for Windows updates.
My system does have a very fast SSD and it has the 8500 mt/s RAM.
QuarterSwede
macrumors G4
Well right, boot up to login isn’t normally the issue. That’s not what my point was. Specs are meaningless when a high powered CPU and RAM are crippled by a garbage OS.
But you complained about it taking five minutes on your system.
I've been quite pleased with this Yoga - it's comparable in performance to my MacBook Pro and I have them set up similarly.
QuarterSwede
macrumors G4
Sounds like it has the same CPU as my Yoga.
I'm actually really happy with the performance of the Yoga. Two of my programs take a while to startup but they are cloud-based and network latency is a bigger factor than CPU/RAM/SSD performance.
It's purely a choice by Apple.
Comparison of budget laptops:
I don't know how you find an SSD that slow. Gen 3 is 3,500. Gen 4 is 7,500. Gen 3 came out in 2013.