It is only necessary if you are OCD like me. I am really only doing a clean install because I find it easier than manually removing all of the junk applications I have tested over the years. But that is just me.
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Isn't Archive Install or Clean Install Kind of Overkill Now-a-days?
- Thread starter TheSpaz
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Some people just want a "fresh start" by doing a clean install. That's their choice. But there is truly no negative to simply doing an "upgrade." If you did a clean install and then reinstalled every program and file that you had before Leopard, you would see absolutely no difference in performance or issues than if you had simply done an upgrade.
As a side note, I'm surprised that nobody put up a poll about this...
How are you upgrading to Leopard?
Upgrade
Archive and Install
Clean Install
Buying a new computer
Not upgrading to Leopard
As a side note, I'm surprised that nobody put up a poll about this...
How are you upgrading to Leopard?
Upgrade
Archive and Install
Clean Install
Buying a new computer
Not upgrading to Leopard
Yes, for most people, Windows upgrades work too. OTOH, unlike Windows, OSX doesn't have anything like the Windows Registry, which is so notorious for becoming fouled up over time. "Fresh starts" may make sense for Windows, but they don't make much sense on the Mac.
Even so, my main point is that we should not be representing clean OSX installs as somehow having some utility, let alone being a necessity. This kind of advice is really misleading, especially to new Mac users.
Yea the Windows registry can be a pain with upgrading the os. Though with vista, they did change it slightly with it installing Vista from an os image on the cd, though I'm not sure if that helps or hinders.
thanks for pointing this out. i was a bit alarmed by this thread, as one of the reasons our studio is going mac is to avoid all that registry/reinstall/crashing nonsense of windows. we could not wait, so all our machines are going to have 10.4.10 on them, and before we get really rolling we are going to upgrade to leopard, but our rep promised the upgrade would not even sputter our production. this is what we are hoping for. i guess we will see in a week or so...
I certainly never meant to indicate that wiping is necessary, but your claim that a clean install goes as far as to have no utility is a stretch.
Even although the Mac OS does not become "bogged down" in the same way that registry-based Windows does, the performance of the operating system can still become sluggish as more and more applications find their way into the startup routine and run silently in the background. And, contrary to what someone here suggested, not all of those programs can be removed in the "Startup items" area of the user Accounts settings (which I would argue that a lot of Mac users don't even know exists).
In fact, a lot of Mac users who aren't really aware of what they're doing have more such rogue processes running than the rest of us do. One day while diagnosing some sluggish performance on my mother's MacBook, for instance, I noticed that she had installed a printer driver which bundled a number of unnecessary PowerPC processes. These were eating up a non-negligible amount of system resources. Although it may be possible to get rid of these without a system format, to argue that a fresh start has "no utility" is, in my mind, an excessive comment.
But I agree that it isn't NECESSARY, and it is certainly less called-for than in the Windows world.
Yeah, I also use an new OS installation as a way to get a fresh start. Unnecessary stuff gets knocked out. I don't think there's anything quite as satisfying as a freshly-installed and pristine OS.
But, of course, I am a huge nerd.
But, of course, I am a huge nerd.
I don't see what the problem is, really. If people want an upgrade, let them. If others want to start off from a fresh slate, what gives?
I'm going for a fresh start myself. I don't care whether or not my system is clogged, I have lots of crap on my Mac I'd just like to get rid of. Besides, ever since I wanted to upgrade my Boot Camp partition from 20 gigs to 50 gigs, I couldn't get it back to work without reformatting my drive. Leopard seems to be the perfect oppertunity for that.
I'm going for a fresh start myself. I don't care whether or not my system is clogged, I have lots of crap on my Mac I'd just like to get rid of. Besides, ever since I wanted to upgrade my Boot Camp partition from 20 gigs to 50 gigs, I couldn't get it back to work without reformatting my drive. Leopard seems to be the perfect oppertunity for that.
I don't recall what you suggested specifically. My remarks were general, and directed towards those who suggest that it's somehow "better" to do a clean install. When you dig down, about 90% of the clean install rationale is based on how it makes some people feel. It's largely a psychological affect, which IMO is not a good approach to dealing with logical machines.
The problem with the phantom process argument is that (1) hardly anybody notices any real performance issues due to these background processes, and (2) if you reinstall all of your applications, these processes just come back, if only because they are necessary to the functioning of these applications.
I am really curious about your printer driver taking up processor cycles. I've got several installed, but I never see any printer driver appear in Activity Monitor except when I actually print a document.
Good God!
We are all so ready to fall into camps behind barbed wire and gates over what ever issue. OSX is not Windows; carrying logic from one OS to the other on the install issue seems to limp at best.
Here is the solution: if you want to do a Format and Install, an Upgrade, or Archive and Install; just do it. It's your machine, and it's your life so do what makes you happy. I used to install XP monthly to clean things up then every six months be that got just too time consuming. I do a fresh install of OSX about every six months as well because it makes me happy and I have the time.
Two things I would dearly love to know are has any one ever NOT reinstalled the OS, after some initial process and what is the longest up time without a reboot. I think I reboot about twice a week, mostly because Firefox is doing something stupid, so I moved to Netscape IX.
We are all so ready to fall into camps behind barbed wire and gates over what ever issue. OSX is not Windows; carrying logic from one OS to the other on the install issue seems to limp at best.
Here is the solution: if you want to do a Format and Install, an Upgrade, or Archive and Install; just do it. It's your machine, and it's your life so do what makes you happy. I used to install XP monthly to clean things up then every six months be that got just too time consuming. I do a fresh install of OSX about every six months as well because it makes me happy and I have the time.
Two things I would dearly love to know are has any one ever NOT reinstalled the OS, after some initial process and what is the longest up time without a reboot. I think I reboot about twice a week, mostly because Firefox is doing something stupid, so I moved to Netscape IX.
Maybe this is a super noob question, but what is your recommended way for making sure you get rid of all the resources of a program that you have decided to trash? I've been trying to go through my different computers and clean them up in anticipation of Leopard.
Jsam
We are all so ready to fall into camps behind barbed wire and gates over what ever issue. OSX is not Windows; carrying logic from one OS to the other on the install issue seems to limp at best.
Here is the solution: if you want to do a Format and Install, an Upgrade, or Archive and Install; just do it. It's your machine, and it's your life so do what makes you happy. I used to install XP monthly to clean things up then every six months be that got just too time consuming. I do a fresh install of OSX about every six months as well because it makes me happy and I have the time.
Two things I would dearly love to know are has any one ever NOT reinstalled the OS, after some initial process and what is the longest up time without a reboot. I think I reboot about twice a week, mostly because Firefox is doing something stupid, so I moved to Netscape IX.
Yeah, if I catch anyone reformatting and reinstalling, I am personally coming over to their place and punching them in the kisser. It would only serve them right!
I have never reinstalled OSX on any of the four Macs I maintain. The Mac I use every day all day started with OS9. It's been upgraded to OSX 10.0 and every version since then to 10.4.10. When I upgraded the hard drive a couple years ago, I cloned the system to new drive and kept going.
Uptime is obviously a completely different issue. I reboot at least once a week, and I recommend that all Mac users do the same.
Most of the time, this is not necessary. If the application came with an installer, run it to uninstall. If it didn't, then just drag it to the trash -- it won't leave behind anything which will cause a problem.
OSX is built to do upgrades simply. I think clean ups should be addressed year 'round. I'll be upgrading.
No need to worry about anything that gets left in the user/library/... files?
Thanks by the way,
Jsam
I'm a new mac user, just bought my Macbook in July, and I must say I'm a little worried now about just upgrading as opposed to an Archive & Install. I didn't think I would need to do anything other than upgrading, as my Macbook is still basically new and I only use it for internet, iTunes, documents, and some widgets and other apps I downloaded from Apple.com.
Update
I was going to do the archive and install, but I think I will go with update now; for both iMacs and my MBP. As long as update is just as clean as archive ...
I was going to do the archive and install, but I think I will go with update now; for both iMacs and my MBP. As long as update is just as clean as archive ...
your right they dont but the other problem is over time files become damage and corupted including the OS files. Now most of the time this damage to the files does not effect the system much but they do add up. Do a fresh install (even reinstalling all the same software) the system preformaces will be better.
Coruption of the files effects Windows linux and OSX since it more caused by random errors that happen on the harddrive. It where a bit is just done incorrectly. It is not something the OS can really prevent.
This crap building up I was pointing to is impossible to avoid. Just accessing the hard drive over time will cause errors. An example of how a file think of a coping a piece of paper. You copy the paper then you take that copy and make another copy and so on. If you noticed the farther you go along the more damage the copy looks. Also if you look at the orginal you will noticed it is a little lighter in color. Over time that happens to files. Only way to solve the problem is do a fresh install.
Also remember the build up of crap is cause by hardware not the software.
By choosing Archive and Install, it will move them to a "secure" folder, and then install the new OS. What does that do with my old docs, iPhoto library, etc
And how does this differ from plain ol' upgrading?
I do have a 320gig external hard drive, so I could back everything up. I know how to transfer docs, music, pictures, but how would I do mail messages from mail? I'm using .Mac and gmail accounts
Nothing
Archive and install moves your system files to Previous Systems Folder.
Your mail isn't permanently stored locally. It can be pulled from the server again.
Eldorian, in spite of all your good and usefull help/explainations on this forum i still do not understand the diff between a archive & install and an upgrade. Could you or whoever be more specific about the differences?
Since it looks like i would not loose any apps or my photos etc doing an A&I what woud be the benefit of upgrading instead of vice versa.
Thanks
X
Since it looks like i would not loose any apps or my photos etc doing an A&I what woud be the benefit of upgrading instead of vice versa.
Thanks
X
An upgrade will remove previous versions and upgrade the necessary system files to run Leopard.
Archive and install moves your system files to Previous Systems Folder and installs OS X.
In neither of those situations is /Users in any threat.