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philosopherdog

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Dec 29, 2008
743
518
I was pretty skeptical about the touchbar on the new MBPs. Seemed like a gimmick to me.

After actually using the new machine for a few solid days now I'm seeing what Apple has done with it in Xcode. I think this touchbar will be pretty useful once adopted.

So far other than XCode I'm noticing it's pretty useful for scrubbing video and audio. It's also very useful for the tap and slide controls like volume and brightness.

My take is that it's a lot better than I originally thought. Actually, it's pretty amazing.
 

honeybadger1022

macrumors member
Jan 2, 2017
32
14
It's not in its prime yet. Primitive and in need of love, but every now and then you find an app that makes proper use of it. If only chrome would adopt it. I've switched back to safari for the video controls and the tab previews.
 
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jackoatmon

macrumors 6502a
Sep 15, 2011
617
655
i never use it

i did a lot for the first week but then i stopped trying to and naturally went back to shortcuts for everything

but i also never used the function keys

so it's mostly a wash

i do, however rrrrrrreeeeeaaaallllly miss the escape key. the touchbar glitches too often to be a replacement for something so fundamental as escape

and i use capslock too often to make that my escape

waiting for a 3rd party to make something that can turn the `~ key into escape
 

WhiteWhaleHolyGrail

macrumors 6502a
Nov 14, 2016
620
426
Agreed - development will unlock the true potential of the TB.

I am also very excited by the prospect of people able to use the pen with the touchpad!
 

sunapple

macrumors 68030
Jul 16, 2013
2,761
5,191
The Netherlands
Touch Bar doesn't bring any negatives with it for me other than the fact that it can be glitchy at times and not all apps are optimized yet. This will however be resolved in the nearby future.

I can see why people would hate this Touch Bar because it replaces something that's been with us for so long and not everyone likes change.

Touch Bar however seems to me like a great solution until the touch screen keyboard shows up. I'm glad the normal keys are still available.

Function key row has never been this useful.
 

xmonkey

macrumors 6502a
Jun 30, 2016
687
932
CA
Poor substitutes for touchscreen ........... will go the way of other legacy devices .......
It's not supposed to be a substitute for a touchscreen. It's a substitute for the function keys.

Apple adding a touchscreen to their laptops is bad idea anyways. MacOS is not designed for that kind of input and Apple would have to make compromises to the UX to account for both touch/non-touch screens. Windows suffers from this problem.
 

TPadden

macrumors 6502a
Oct 28, 2010
760
434
Apple adding a touchscreen to their laptops is bad idea anyways. MacOS is not designed for that kind of input and Apple would have to make compromises to the UX to account for both touch/non-touch screens. Windows suffers from this problem.
More importantly it'd compete with the iPad Pro with keyboard. :apple: It's been a while since Windows suffered from compromises for both touch and non-touch screens; we obviously have differing opinions about the ground breaking usefulness of the touchbar and pen on touchpad :D.
 

xmonkey

macrumors 6502a
Jun 30, 2016
687
932
CA
More importantly it'd compete with the iPad Pro with keyboard. :apple: It's been a while since Windows suffered from compromises for both touch and non-touch screens; we obviously have differing opinions about the ground breaking usefulness of the touchbar and pen on touchpad :D.
It wouldn't really compete with the iPad Pro, in my opinion. If they ran the same OS, perhaps. Apple has already said they've experimented with adding touchscreens to their laptops in prototypes and didn't find it to add anything meaningful to the experience.

I've never said the Touchbar was "groundbreaking" :) But, I do think it's quite a lot more useful than the ancient function keys and I think it's a welcome addition with a lot of potential once developers start designing around it. That being said, they really need to release a standalone keyboard with the Touchbar ASAP to really get it to take off. Right now it's hard to be all-in because if I'm docking the laptop at my desk I don't get access to the Touchbar.
 

TPadden

macrumors 6502a
Oct 28, 2010
760
434
It wouldn't really compete with the iPad Pro, in my opinion. .........

Sure ..... most would buy a 12" iPad Pro 256 GB with keyboard ($999 + $149) if a MacBook 12" 256 GB ($1299) with pen capable touchscreen was available :rolleyes::D.
 
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thesaint024

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2016
1,073
888
suspension waiting room
Sure ..... most would buy a 12" iPad Pro with keyboard ($999 + $149) if a MacBook 12" with touchscreen ($1299) was available :rolleyes::D.
Why do people insist on this convergence? I am a normal "productivity" user (Office). This is most users I surmise. There is absolutely no application of regular touchscreen use for a laptop using Office. I've tried it on 2 in 1's, touchscreens, tablets - it simply sucks. There are plenty of use cases for touchscreen, but for most Office users the keyboard is just the only way to efficiently do input. Ipad with keyboard, it's floppy and you can't type on the lap.

I had an XPS with touchscreen. I ended up returning it because I wanted battery life more than the touchscreen 4k screen. Because... I never used the touchscreen. I am the typical Office user and it just doesn't have a place (yet). Microsoft is heavily pushing touch and they make Office, yet they can't find a way to make it equally as usable as a laptop version. If I could be CLOSE to as productive with a touchscreen, I would use it. I would gladly sacrifice the added weight of the keyboard and the rest of the laptop for a good lightweight input method. I am open to any OS, any form. MR people may be more creatives, but Apple will sell many more MBP's if they give a laptop first, gimmicks second, because there are more of people like me. That's what they did here. No compromises on the regular laptop experience. Everything else is just gravy or a gimmick depending on your perspective.

I am finding the touchbar convenient for screen locking and the volume and brightness sliders, but it's not a must have for me personally. I would be happy with the nontouch too. The rest of the computer is super nice already.
 

TPadden

macrumors 6502a
Oct 28, 2010
760
434
Why do people insist on this convergence? I am a normal "productivity" user (Office). This is most users I surmise. There is absolutely no application of regular touchscreen use for a laptop using Office. .....
Your pen must have been broken :D ........
 

brookter1

macrumors regular
Aug 5, 2015
142
115
I doubt if I'd use a touchscreen laptop if you gave me one. None of the applications I care about use them -- and they'd be less effective if they tried.

Too many developers forget to make their programs keyboard-friendly as it is. Of course there are (a few) functions where a mouse is more effective, and occasionally essential, but it really annoys me when a function would be far more effective with the keyboard, but they neglect to give it even a menu option so you can't roll your own shortcut. Would be even worse if they forced you to use a touchscreen. Apple are absolutely right: touchscreens aren't needed on laptops and definitely not on desktops.
 

Jefe's MacAir

macrumors 6502a
Nov 21, 2010
556
524
Much more useful for my needs than the archaic F buttons, which can easily be accessed by now pressing the fn key. But wait, that's one extra keystroke now!
 

thesaint024

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2016
1,073
888
suspension waiting room
Your pen must have been broken :D ........
Are you the guy that uses tech because it's there? There's a whole world of Windows and Samsung out there for you. Go nuts. They will all out spec the hell out of any Apple device and be cheaper! You can even brag about them on MR. I honestly don't judge those who find use for them in their applications. Microsoft hasn't figured out Office for touchscreen.
 

TPadden

macrumors 6502a
Oct 28, 2010
760
434
Are you the guy that uses tech because it's there?
Were you the guy that said: "There is absolutely no application of regular touchscreen use for a laptop using Office"? Just because you don't use it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. :D

https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/austeachers/2015/02/02/microsoft-office-with-a-stylus-unleash-the-power

https://www.groovypost.com/howto/activate-use-inking-feature-word-2016/

For Dummies :cool::

http://www.dummies.com/software/microsoft-office/word/word-2016-on-a-touchscreen/
 
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jerryk

macrumors 604
Nov 3, 2011
7,418
4,207
SF Bay Area
Why do people insist on this convergence? I am a normal "productivity" user (Office). This is most users I surmise. There is absolutely no application of regular touchscreen use for a laptop using Office. I've tried it on 2 in 1's, touchscreens, tablets - it simply sucks. There are plenty of use cases for touchscreen, but for most Office users the keyboard is just the only way to efficiently do input. Ipad with keyboard, it's floppy and you can't type on the lap.

I had an XPS with touchscreen. I ended up returning it because I wanted battery life more than the touchscreen 4k screen. Because... I never used the touchscreen. I am the typical Office user and it just doesn't have a place (yet). Microsoft is heavily pushing touch and they make Office, yet they can't find a way to make it equally as usable as a laptop version. If I could be CLOSE to as productive with a touchscreen, I would use it. I would gladly sacrifice the added weight of the keyboard and the rest of the laptop for a good lightweight input method. I am open to any OS, any form. MR people may be more creatives, but Apple will sell many more MBP's if they give a laptop first, gimmicks second, because there are more of people like me. That's what they did here. No compromises on the regular laptop experience. Everything else is just gravy or a gimmick depending on your perspective.

I am finding the touchbar convenient for screen locking and the volume and brightness sliders, but it's not a must have for me personally. I would be happy with the nontouch too. The rest of the computer is super nice already.

Try OneNote on an iPad Pro or Windows machine with a pencil/stylus. I have a 9.7 iPad Pro and Pencil and it is the only thing I often take to meetings. You can type notes and draw images or highlight slide PDFs. I have it sync to my OneDrive account so everything is instantly available on my MacBook Pro and Windows systems. I would love to have this capability on my MacBook Pro, but would need to be able to draw on the screen to add notes to presentations and other materials.
 

thesaint024

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2016
1,073
888
suspension waiting room
Were you the guy that said: "There is absolutely no application of regular touchscreen use for a laptop using Office"? Just because you don't use it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. :D

https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/austeachers/2015/02/02/microsoft-office-with-a-stylus-unleash-the-power

https://www.groovypost.com/howto/activate-use-inking-feature-word-2016/

For Dummies :cool::

http://www.dummies.com/software/microsoft-office/word/word-2016-on-a-touchscreen/
Nice contrived application. I didn't say it doesn't exist, I said it works for some. No one I know actually writes handwritten notes onto an Excel file. Sure you can, but I'm not going to force it into my work. What is it you do besides search MS blogs for uses of touchscreen?
[doublepost=1483578284][/doublepost]
Try OneNote on an iPad Pro or Windows machine with a pencil/stylus. I have a 9.7 iPad Pro and Pencil and it is the only thing I often take to meetings. You can type notes and draw images or highlight slide PDFs. I have it sync to my OneDrive account so everything is instantly available on my MacBook Pro and Windows systems. I would love to have this capability on my MacBook Pro, but would need to be able to draw on the screen to add notes to presentations and other materials.
That is cool. Really. It would be nice if I actually did that in an office or a meeting. They don't issue ipads for us. If they did, it might work. I also don't fault people who find uses for a touchscreen/stylus. It just isn't practical for me when I type faster than I write. I could see an application if I reviewed work frequently, but I don't. Like I said, I am all for new tech, just not going to force it if it's not easily integrated into my work (and faster).
 

TPadden

macrumors 6502a
Oct 28, 2010
760
434
I didn't say it doesn't exist, I said it works for some.
Sorry I completely misunderstood :(.
There is absolutely no application of regular touchscreen use for a laptop using Office.
to mean it didn't exist, when you meant there are applications that work for some using touchscreen laptops and Office but they don't work for you. It was all a misunderstanding on my part, and as I now understand what you said, we completely agree. :cool:
 
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thesaint024

macrumors 65816
Nov 14, 2016
1,073
888
suspension waiting room
Sorry I completely misunderstood :(.

to mean it didn't exist, when you meant there are applications that work for some using touchscreen laptops and Office but they don't work for you. It was all a misunderstanding on my part. :cool:
I'm going to keep feeding you because I'm a masochist and you're mildly amusing. Yeah, I didn't write it clearly and thoroughly. I believe I posted prior in this thread about other professions that people utilize touchscreen. I find it interesting that those with no real world usage choose to pick on semantics or some other irrelevance. I assume because you have no real world use cases to actually discuss. @jerryk was very clear how he uses it. It actually helped me rethink some things. You pointing to an MS blog on how MS recommends I use a touchscreen for MS Office on an WinPC, that's not real helpful. They also told me that DOS works great. I'm sure I wrote something wrong or have bad grammar in this post too. Enjoy pointing it out. Add some more emoji's for effect too. :(
 

TPadden

macrumors 6502a
Oct 28, 2010
760
434
....I find it interesting that those with no real world usage choose to pick on semantics or some other irrelevance.
See if you can do this on a non-touchscreen with Office :).........

dMxSP3mGUU3wQ9VEguCp_CwH_LCZ-e_dn50oz1jnzdYPPe-eBGvxfDxim2P6PMjf4SY2yOX5KpOxgGxZk_Xc46b5IQ5irSf2ULIqqXkPpwBD2QRaY8fliR7D8H3yhm89WTB5nEmoJiIhUF0J9yPEagmwqNuMfjfbe7WfDt-1WbzndMPkm6TD37Dz6aByB7oHoETk7wAH7YULx6kXz_lSFpojYAgDLffTwhotHQCHC2HtPRRCKh-njRkCz4EmWGu-6_M4y7F5_S293FbxNfrFRsQeSuJSuiWLbxfP61itJBx6L9gVGvrayNTXunpQuP7xN_KttKHob1SoohlRRn9LmX1dDZIwmgnbQjPu75SaMV7Edcx4LPduAc-W_84-zt3zidrjw9dp9sHpy8zTSlZ4cs7bQEX22-kMyNU3KdNn8z60ySkbSWsvCr8vRvANzH4kptJyeHFo0OkH-y4EnoZX1bzpJoOsSGgPvhpr_hJtj0OFi5NEHPMfz9_rPWwfrRX871aMHH40cj-BtkaLZ65B9kOmIF1wH1rdqinjBam2DGzmm4jDsZkvG3w5JPs7XfzV5SMb8xYI8CtV1enD7ZDSABijoZ4mclCc4hN747qROVShQUdTedKNpg=w408-h794-no
 

xmonkey

macrumors 6502a
Jun 30, 2016
687
932
CA
Not all touchscreens also have digitizers that allow the use of a stylus... plenty of touchscreen Windows laptops won't be able to do what you posted.
 
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