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Microsoft is intended for the professional user whereas iWorks is intended for the casual user.

Even that is not quite right. I present and publish all the damn time, and I'm here to tell you that Keynote absolutely whips PowerPoint, for starters. Meanwhile Word and Pages each have their own use-cases, so I use one or the other depending on what I need to do. If I'm putting together a poster for a technical conference, Pages is the way to go, but if I need a multi-column, auto-flowing format for a published piece, I'll reluctantly open Word and put up with its crashiness and increasingly horrid user interface. Excel still dominates for spreadsheet work, but it's becoming less and less pleasant to use with every user-interface update Microsoft foists on us, and I've found a few occasions when I needed to make a spreadsheet look pretty, and it was much easier to do so in Numbers.

Based on the above, I'd say that in terms of relative merit for my particular professional usage,

Keynote >> PowerPoint,

Word ≈ Pages, and

Excel > Numbers

...But much depends on the user's work and what they need.
 
and what do you think of those posts that defend it because its free (ie included in the price of expensive computers and ios devices) or that every feature it dosent have is something that only power users require?

Not sure. What are you asking, exactly?
 
I agree. It's absolutely OUTRAGEOUS that you can't get everything you want from software that is completely free and for which you paid nothing. :rolleyes:

If you believe iWork is free you'll believe they offer it as an act of welfare whilst telling investors it's fine to throw away money.

Glassed Silver:mac
 
The fact that so few people have commented on this thread is a sad indicator that not enough people care anymore about iWork for Apple to do much with it. :(
 
MS Office is just better. I'm sorry but the new Office apps on the iPad are great. Look at what Google's been able to do with their office, they built it from scratch and it's a complete piece of software.
Google didn't built their office suite from scratch, they bought it from a bunch of companies, Writely (word processor), 2Web Technologies (spreadsheets), Tonic Systems (presentation) and Quickoffice.
It's a great product but it was not made from scratch either.
 
I have been using the iWork suite for years. Absolutely love it. I could never get the hang of Word or Powerpoint. iWork just simply made sense to me.

Any one know if there is a list of the 50 new fonts? That would be my only issue with iCloud Pages is that fonts that used to be there are no longer. I would like to see a list of any fonts that were added.

Thanks.
 
Even that is not quite right. I present and publish all the damn time, and I'm here to tell you that Keynote absolutely whips PowerPoint, for starters. Meanwhile Word and Pages each have their own use-cases, so I use one or the other depending on what I need to do. If I'm putting together a poster for a technical conference, Pages is the way to go, but if I need a multi-column, auto-flowing format for a published piece, I'll reluctantly open Word and put up with its crashiness and increasingly horrid user interface. Excel still dominates for spreadsheet work, but it's becoming less and less pleasant to use with every user-interface update Microsoft foists on us, and I've found a few occasions when I needed to make a spreadsheet look pretty, and it was much easier to do so in Numbers.

Based on the above, I'd say that in terms of relative merit for my particular professional usage,

Keynote >> PowerPoint,

Word ≈ Pages, and

Excel > Numbers

...But much depends on the user's work and what they need.
What I've discovered through my extensive use of ClarisWorks, iWork, MS Works, and MS Office over the years is that one's approach to a task is just as important as the feature-list of the particular tool being used.

Many people have become accustomed to (what I call) the "do it" button. Rather than understand the underlying concepts employed in creating content, people have become heavily reliant on "do it" buttons (menu options, etc.). The "do it" buttons are a simple one-click solution for tasks to be performed, or a very specific setting that adjusts the software's behavior.

If one takes an "MS Office" mindset in using iWork '09, they will see it as far inferior. But, by thinking differently, the functionality gap between the two is less than a feature spec sheet would imply.

I still use iWork '09 and MS Office (2003/2007/2010) extensively each day... I prefer iWork, but I know that those days are numbered. When that time comes, I'll most likely switch away from OSX to Windows... MS Office for Mac is not a preferable option.


If you believe iWork is free you'll believe they offer it as an act of welfare whilst telling investors it's fine to throw away money.
I'm surprised at how many people think that they can get an iPhone for "free" when signing up for a 2 year cell service contract.
 
MS Office for Mac is not a preferable option.

It's not much nicer on Windows, frankly. The one exception in my experience is the keyboard shortcuts implemented in Excel on Windows but not on the Mac version, at least the one I use.

On both platforms, Microsoft has doubled-down on its "ribbon" user interface, which festoons a quarter of the damn screen with cluttery garbage. Plus, they seem unable to resist moving stuff around in their menu system, and I keep encountering functionality that I've used for two decades moving around to the point where I have to fish for it with mounting annoyance. And Word is no more stable on Windows than it is on OS X, in my experience.

Bottom line: I used to like Office much more than I currently do. With each update it seems to embrace a more and more abysmal user experience, more and more clutter, and a more and more unintuitive rabbit-warren mindset.

Anyway, you can have your Mac and run Windows too, via Boot Camp or virtual machine. I do VMs all the time, both Windows and various flavors of Linux, depending on the task at hand. Even the lowliest of today's Macs and MacBooks are fully capable of running a VM smoothly, so why not, if there's something you need to do on some OS other than OS X.

----------

ClarisWorks

Sigh. Now that was a great piece of software.
 
What I've discovered through my extensive use of ClarisWorks, iWork, MS Works, and MS Office over the years is that one's approach to a task is just as important as the feature-list of the particular tool being used.

Many people have become accustomed to (what I call) the "do it" button. Rather than understand the underlying concepts employed in creating content, people have become heavily reliant on "do it" buttons (menu options, etc.). The "do it" buttons are a simple one-click solution for tasks to be performed, or a very specific setting that adjusts the software's behavior.

If one takes an "MS Office" mindset in using iWork '09, they will see it as far inferior. But, by thinking differently, the functionality gap between the two is less than a feature spec sheet would imply.

I still use iWork '09 and MS Office (2003/2007/2010) extensively each day... I prefer iWork, but I know that those days are numbered. When that time comes, I'll most likely switch away from OSX to Windows... MS Office for Mac is not a preferable option.



I'm surprised at how many people think that they can get an iPhone for "free" when signing up for a 2 year cell service contract.

That seems a bit extreme to ditch OS X to get the version of MS Office that you need. What about Office 365 for Mac? I am admittedly speaking from ignorance here.
 
It's not much nicer on Windows, frankly. The one exception in my experience is the keyboard shortcuts implemented in Excel on Windows but not on the Mac version, at least the one I use.

On both platforms, Microsoft has doubled-down on its "ribbon" user interface, which festoons a quarter of the screen with cluttery garbage. Plus, they seem unable to resist moving stuff around in their menu system, and I keep encountering functionality that I've used for two decades moving around to the point where I have to fish for it with mounting annoyance. And Word is no more stable on Windows than it is on OS X, in my experience.

Bottom line: I used to like Office much more than I currently do. With each update it seems to embrace a more and more abysmal user experience, more and more clutter, and a more and more unintuitive rabbit-warren mindset..

This describes my feelings on Office to a T. Good heavens, that horrid ribbon!
 
That seems a bit extreme to ditch OS X to get the version of MS Office that you need. What about Office 365 for Mac? I am admittedly speaking from ignorance here.
Office 365 is nothing more than a licensing model. The actual software provided by Office 365 and shrinkwrap are identical.

As far as ditching OSX being extreme, I see the operating system as a means to an end. I use OSX because of the software that is available for it, not because I enjoy FINDER. Although there are aspects of OSX that I prefer over Windows, in the end those need to take a back seat to the actual work that I need to do.
 
Office 365 is nothing more than a licensing model. The actual software provided by Office 365 and shrinkwrap are identical.

As far as ditching OSX being extreme, I see the operating system as a means to an end. I use OSX because of the software that is available for it, not because I enjoy FINDER. Although there are aspects of OSX that I prefer over Windows, in the end those need to take a back seat to the actual work that I need to do.

Yes, Apple has needed to fix the Finder for a decade now
 
Then BUY SOMETHING ELSE if you are going to complain about it so much.

I will second what kcmac said. I have invested money into the suite over the years both in purchasing the 09 suite as well as continuing to buy the hardware that subsidizes it. If Apple wants to continue to brand itself as a premium technology service company with the best all around experience then they need to think carefully about what they do with iWork.
 
Google didn't built their office suite from scratch, they bought it from a bunch of companies, Writely (word processor), 2Web Technologies (spreadsheets), Tonic Systems (presentation) and Quickoffice.
It's a great product but it was not made from scratch either.
Thanks for this info. I was not aware of how Google Docs evolved. Interesting.
 
What I've discovered through my extensive use of ClarisWorks, iWork, MS Works, and MS Office over the years is that one's approach to a task is just as important as the feature-list of the particular tool being used.

Many people have become accustomed to (what I call) the "do it" button. Rather than understand the underlying concepts employed in creating content, people have become heavily reliant on "do it" buttons (menu options, etc.). The "do it" buttons are a simple one-click solution for tasks to be performed, or a very specific setting that adjusts the software's behavior.

If one takes an "MS Office" mindset in using iWork '09, they will see it as far inferior. But, by thinking differently, the functionality gap between the two is less than a feature spec sheet would imply.

I still use iWork '09 and MS Office (2003/2007/2010) extensively each day... I prefer iWork, but I know that those days are numbered. When that time comes, I'll most likely switch away from OSX to Windows... MS Office for Mac is not a preferable option.



I'm surprised at how many people think that they can get an iPhone for "free" when signing up for a 2 year cell service contract.

I dread the oversimplification as well, it's a direct result of many people lacking any motivation to grow beyond the simplest of tasks.
In order to make software work somehow for everyone companies are more and more going the way of dumbing down their products, which is also accelerated by the "feature parity" paradigm they strive for amongst their platforms.
(e.g. tablets/web/desktop)

Often times this would be perfectly avoidable, if a user was given the choice to get more options in return, if just hidden away in an "Advanced..." tab.
However, that is not happening as much as it should.

Few things in computing are as frustrating as software thinking it's smarter than you when you don't ask it to do something the easy way, but the advanced right way.

It's nice that more people end up being empowered to get started with the application, I welcome that, but to break power users' possibilities is just ridiculously overblown and when applications get recoded from ground up and the old code base doesn't see substantial love for YEARS the recode better be done thorough and not ask you to wait even longer to wait for features being readded.
Yes, I look at you, iWork.
I wish Apple was the only developer acting by this terrible principle.

Oh and: thanks for the notice you gave me regarding iPhoto for iOS past iOS 8.
I enjoyed being forced to stay out of the app a lot! /s

Apple says you can't use private frameworks, because apps would break too easily, once a developer makes changes that break another developer's software as well.
So you have to bundle the framework code.
Fine, but when Apple breaks apps BY INTENTION like with iPhoto or when often apps that don't get updates anymore break with high certainty after a few iOS major versions then this is quite ironic.

Apple and compatibility, it's really a horrible story.
Yet here we are, with Windows getting a bit better again after the ridiculous nannying Microsoft had in store with Windows 8: No, you do not need a start menu.
Fast forward to Windows 10: You asked for it, here it is! Star menu is back!
This is similarly ridiculous, but it's not as tragic. Especially as Microsoft saw their mistake and worked on it.

I still very much love my Mac and the OS I still much prefer to Windows in various aspects, but it's hard to trust Apple with compatibility.

Glassed Silver:mac
 
I will second what kcmac said. I have invested money into the suite over the years both in purchasing the 09 suite as well as continuing to buy the hardware that subsidizes it. If Apple wants to continue to brand itself as a premium technology service company with the best all around experience then they need to think carefully about what they do with iWork.

Beyond the issue of whether the technology is premium, Apple needs to more carefully think through the results of stranding the people who adopt their products on islands of abandoned software. A certain amount of this is inevitable, but in the case of iWork, it was not. Apple chose to stick their thumb in the eye of those of us who made the error of assuming they were committed to improving iWork. Instead they went backwards and hoped we would not notice. This is not something people easily forget. Many of us really longtime Apple loyalists find this attitude particularly galling, not only because we stuck by Apple through some very dark times, but also because in the past Apple has gone to great effort to make their technology transitions as seamless as possible to users.
 
works fine for me.

what you have to understand is that iWork is *not* trying to be MS Office. it's not trying to be "everything to everybody" like Office. no. it's the 80% rule -- simple functionality to cover the needs of 80% of their customers. most of which are non-techies. it's perfect for these people, and costs $0.

mission accomplished.

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that was in the past. it's $0 now and that's how it will be judged.

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whoosh, the point went over his head. he said he bought a computer in 2008 (which was much more than your software) that is now outdated and doesn't do the job.

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1) iwork isnt "crap" software. its casual software; if you're confusing it as enterprise software thats your shortcoming.

2) how many years was gmail in beta? google glass? etc.. not sure if you were crying about those too

IT IS NOT 0$!!!!!! You HAVE TO BUY NEW mac to get iWork, otherwise it is still priced 20 dollars a piece.
Learn your stuff before bending over to apple.

----------

Then BUY SOMETHING ELSE if you are going to complain about it so much.

Luckily that, unlike you, people don't drink apple kool-aid. They are also smart enough that they know that iWork IS NOT FREE. It is only included in NEW macs(incorporated in MAC price, so it is still not "free"), for everything else is 20$ a piece.
 
Why people say this always mystifies me. Actually it doesn't, but suffice to say that it has no basis in fact rather only in cultural conceit.

As for facts, I'm neither British or American, but anyone knows that England already existed ages before America was even populated by people who speak English. So anything else can only be a variation on the source, IMHO.

As for cultural conceit, if I understand correctly, there is no officially recognized dictionary of 'US' English, the US doesn't even have an official language.
 
Beyond the issue of whether the technology is premium, Apple needs to more carefully think through the results of stranding the people who adopt their products on islands of abandoned software. A certain amount of this is inevitable, but in the case of iWork, it was not. Apple chose to stick their thumb in the eye of those of us who made the error of assuming they were committed to improving iWork. Instead they went backwards and hoped we would not notice. This is not something people easily forget. Many of us really longtime Apple loyalists find this attitude particularly galling, not only because we stuck by Apple through some very dark times, but also because in the past Apple has gone to great effort to make their technology transitions as seamless as possible to users.

I agree 100% with all of this.
 
As for facts, I'm neither British or American, but anyone knows that England already existed ages before America was even populated by people who speak English. So anything else can only be a variation on the source, IMHO.

As for cultural conceit, if I understand correctly, there is no officially recognized dictionary of 'US' English, the US doesn't even have an official language.

Hardly the point. English is actually a Germanic language according to the people who study such things, so perhaps the Germans ought to take credit for being the first English speakers. If that sounds silly then it is no sillier than trying to credit one dialect of a language with as many dialects as English as being the first. And if you think the British speak only one dialect of English, then clearly you haven't been to Manchester or Lancashire, just to name two parts of the country where the spoken dialects can be virtually unintelligible to outsiders.
 
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