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Jony Ive and Designer Marc Newson Interviewed on Charlie Rose Show [Updated]

Design

Hardware design is different than print design and computer interactive/usability design. All three should share the same goal of simplicity (remove what is not needed) but when you are working with interactive touch screen software, you're in a middle zone and it can be difficult to define "what is needed".

iOS lives in the gray area and 7 fails because they moved it too far to the print side. Too many references to real-word button and scroll interaction was removed. Whether this is due to a lack of understanding of designing for different uses or an over shoot of synergy between Mavericks and iOS, it doesn't matter. iOS is used under different circumstances than OSX. It requires a design that bridges the gap between real world and desktop software.
 
obliquity said:
...but from the UI part it does look and function very well. Keep in mind this is his first crack at designing software UI and he is just getting into the swing of things.
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So...it looks "very well" or it's only his first crack at it and it needs improvement. It can't be both.

iOS 7 is a step backward. It wasn't just simplified. The usability was altered.
 
pintoman65 said:
So...it looks "very well" or it's only his first crack at it and it needs improvement. It can't be both.

iOS 7 is a step backward. It wasn't just simplified. The usability was altered.
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iOS 7 is literally a rare piece of art compared to iOS 6. When I look at iOS 6 after having used iOS 7 I am amazed at how truly awful iOS 6 looked. Just to point out one thing that was particularly embarrassing about iOS 6: the menu bar colors, dear god that was awful, and it completely distracted from the ability to read anything in the menu bar because it was all the same color except very minute fading of the same color to display the menu bar icons and time. It was an abomination as soon as I saw it I was disgusted.
 
This old red Fiat looks really cool. Not that I'd be able to afford it. :)

red6_1020_verge_super_wide.jpg


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gugy said:
Jony needs to design some shaving blades to Gillette and use on him. The guy always look like he just got out of his bed.
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Must have learned that from Steve too. :D
 
IMO, Ive is not a super-great designer. He's an extreme *minimalist*. His designs overlook what is sometimes better human/machine interface and ergonomics.
 
pintoman65 said:
Hardware design is different than print design and computer interactive/usability design. All three should share the same goal of simplicity (remove what is not needed) but when you are working with interactive touch screen software, you're in a middle zone and it can be difficult to define "what is needed".

iOS lives in the gray area and 7 fails because they moved it too far to the print side. Too many references to real-word button and scroll interaction was removed. Whether this is due to a lack of understanding of designing for different uses or an over shoot of synergy between Mavericks and iOS, it doesn't matter. iOS is used under different circumstances than OSX. It requires a design that bridges the gap between real world and desktop software.
Click to expand...
The year is 2013. Normal people know how to use a computer and they know the rows of things along the top and the bottom of the screen do stuff. The future has no need for the level of demarcation between content and UI that was previously there. Now if YOU need a button to have a box around it, a drop shadow, a clashing color, and a little arrow pointing to it with a label saying "you can click here" that's fine. Maybe you could make a Linux skin for that? The vast majority of present smartphone users, and all future generations, no longer need ties to the physical world. Apple has always designed for where the puck is going and it bodes very well that they have continued. You can choose to turn your back tot he play and stare at the whole where the puck used to be for as long as you want. Times have changed and the principles of UI design have changed with them.
 
Considering Ive helped design both a custom Jaeger-LeCoultre Memovox watch and Atmos clock, I'm wondering if he's pulling in some design ideas from JLC to apply to a future Apple 'iWatch'.
 
MacFather said:
5C Cases needed care as well. I can't believe he approved it.

Image
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I like them. Very 80's, all thats missing is some neon strips.

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Jony is a great designer and I like the simplistic flat direction of iOS 7. The only issues I have is the developers for the programs not the the look of them.
 
proline said:
The year is 2013. Normal people know how to use a computer and they know the rows of things along the top and the bottom of the screen do stuff. The future has no need for the level of demarcation between content and UI that was previously there. Now if YOU need a button to have a box around it, a drop shadow, a clashing color, and a little arrow pointing to it with a label saying "you can click here" that's fine. Maybe you could make a Linux skin for that? The vast majority of present smartphone users, and all future generations, no longer need ties to the physical world. Apple has always designed for where the puck is going and it bodes very well that they have continued. You can choose to turn your back tot he play and stare at the whole where the puck used to be for as long as you want. Times have changed and the principles of UI design have changed with them.
Click to expand...

Tell that load of "normal people understanding" rubbish to my mother. She is what is considered normal. We, even though we consider ourselves normal, are just a bunch of nerds who think the whole world is into Apple and PCs as much as we are.
 
people enjoy watching Jony's interviews? feel like he says the same thing over and over. he'll never give you REAL info. because he doesn't want people stealing his ideas.

simplicity this. rethink that. strip down that.
 
somethingelsefl said:
Can we stop idolizing this guy? I appreciate his work, he is a master and an icon at what he does.

But, God forbid, if he were to die or to leave Apple...there would never be an end to "Johnny Ive would have never..." posts all over MR.

Apple needs to create a company independent of superstar celeb-esque management. It's killing them in the long run.
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While I first tended to fully agree with you, I also believe this actually is what kept Apple alive and kinda unique for so many years - not being led by managers but personalities. On the other hand you're completely right: being such dependent on single persons can make the company fall apart after losing such a personality. Conclusion: what makes you alive, kills you in the end... ;)

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proline said:
The year is 2013. Normal people know how to use a computer and they know the rows of things along the top and the bottom of the screen do stuff. The future has no need for the level of demarcation between content and UI that was previously there. Now if YOU need a button to have a box around it, a drop shadow, a clashing color, and a little arrow pointing to it with a label saying "you can click here" that's fine. Maybe you could make a Linux skin for that? The vast majority of present smartphone users, and all future generations, no longer need ties to the physical world. Apple has always designed for where the puck is going and it bodes very well that they have continued. You can choose to turn your back tot he play and stare at the whole where the puck used to be for as long as you want. Times have changed and the principles of UI design have changed with them.
Click to expand...

Actually, some #1 rule of UI and UX design is: if there are users having a problem with using a layout or design, then it's simple: the design is faulty – it's not the user being the problem, but the design and designer are wrong.

"People already know...", "This is made for pros...", "If you don't get the UI, this is not for you..." have been lame excuses for decades, made by lame UI designer (often from the Windows world). Since when is it actually cool, to accept these in "our superior" Apple world...? ;)
 
iOS 7 is half assed and he have time to make some other projects? In every normal company, he would be working to fix this...but not Jony. I guess, Steve made board of directors to sing contract to not fire Ive (strangely, he forgot to do the same for Forstal :) ).
 
Sounds like he rehearsed his lines for the iPhone 5s promo video too much and now he can't stop repeating them.
 
Boris-VTR said:
iOS 7 is half assed and he have time to make some other projects? In every normal company, he would be working to fix this...but not Jony. I guess, Steve made board of directors to sing contract to not fire Ive (strangely, he forgot to do the same for Forstal :) ).
Click to expand...

Did he tell you himself that they aren't working on improving ios7? I bet you they are. It was just released of course it will have some issues. By ios8 it will be much improved. Same thing that happened with maps.
 
Jony Ive, I dig your designs and way you spell your first name and all, but when you say stuff I just get kinda … well I … feel like … zzzzzz-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z---z …
 
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