Journaling Platform 'Day One' Transitions to a Subscription Service

Discussion in 'MacRumors.com News Discussion' started by MacRumors, Jun 29, 2017.

  1. teerexx52 macrumors 68000

    teerexx52

    Joined:
    May 1, 2005
    Location:
    Florida West Coast
    #376

    I have been using Dyrii for a week now and migrated from Day One. It works very well and seems to be a good replacement for those wanting to switch. The developer has been super responsive to me and corrects any issues very quickly. Worth a look at in my estimation.
     
  2. macintoshmac macrumors 68000

    macintoshmac

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    #377
    I just received another update to Day One. These guys have not brought out so many one line bug fixes in all my years of ownership. This is definitely not right. :p
     
  3. macintoshmac macrumors 68000

    macintoshmac

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    #378
    And hey, the critical issue that warranted an update was "Improved: shake to undo only shown in edit mode".
     
  4. Michaelgtrusa macrumors 604

    Michaelgtrusa

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    Everywhere And Nowhere
  5. newellj macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2014
    Location:
    Boston, MA, US
    #380
    I thought that wasn't possible. I guess I'm wrong?
     
  6. macjunk(ie) macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2009
    #381
    they are deleting those. A ton of negative reviews are nowhere to be seen
     
  7. BigMcGuire Contributor

    BigMcGuire

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Location:
    California
    #382
    Wow thanks for that video - that was very educational. How interesting... I've seen negative reviews disappear but I just assumed it was the user removing it on their own because they changed their mind. lol @ the bot reviews - didn't realize that was infecting the iOS / Mac OS app store.


    Warning: This is going to be long:

    In regards to his comments about Day One - yeah, most people I know don't journal and actually look at me weird when I tell them that I journal. I've journaled since I was a kid (with pen and paper). I probably spend a total of a few hours a week journaling (I try to do 30 mins a day but I only get to it a few times a week). Yes, it means a lot to me. It's a way for me to de-stress and deal with life in a way - I almost consider it a hobby.

    So I respect his disbelief that someone would actually pay for Day One. I did, I paid for Classic, 2, and now I'm paying the $24.99/year subscription for Day One.

    Those of us who paid for Day One Classic saw the discount for Day One 2 when it was released and many of us got it for $20 instead of the normal $40. Those of us with Day One 2 were given the ability to get Day One subscription for $24.99/year instead of $40/year. So those that actually use this app, it's a lot cheaper from our perspective than someone who looks from the outside in -- ($40 app, $40/year) etc...

    Yes, I think subscriptions are terrible. But for $24.99/year ($2/mo) - for something I use almost every day - Ok, I'll justify that. For someone who doesn't journal? They're going to freak out at $40/year ($3.33/mo) in pure disbelief.


    So even though I support the video, I think he isn't looking at it from someone who actually uses the app and doesn't have a problem with the price.

    Why did Day One 2 have to do subscription? They dumped iCloud / Dropbox (yes, I'm still mad about that) and went to their own cloud sync service (Amazon I believe). It resolved a TON of syncing problems that iCloud has (I experienced them on Classic) and made the app very reliable (100% for me). But, paying for their own cloud service - it costs for every pull, put, delete, list request (1/10th of a penny but x a thousand users, it adds up - especially when uploading photos). Those of us with a programming or technical background knew this was coming.

    I'm glad in a way they went subscription because I didn't see how their business model could continue if they didn't (and pay their monthly cloud fees). $24.99/year? I am not happy about it but I understand it. I pay Google $20/year for 100GB. I get 5x more usage out of Google than I do Day One. But I value Day One a lot, so I'll pay it for now.



    My routine? I open a Google Doc - one document for a month - and post all my "daily logs" in it with a horizontal line between the days. I may or may not put pictures in it. Then I copy the day to Day One and add a few pictures. Now, with Dyrii, I also put it there for another backup (love that it uses iCloud) and yes I pay $10/year for it. At the end of the month, I export all my Day One entries for that month to a PDF (20-40mb) and store it in the folder for my journal logs.


    As someone who has spent way too much money on the iOS and Mac store - I dislike subscriptions a lot. I find of all the apps I bought (thousands maybe) - I use a small subset. I don't see a one time purchase as a waste. If all those apps required subscriptions, I wouldn't have gotten a 10th of them and those I did pay for I'd feel obligated to use because of the subscription. I don't like subscriptions.
     
  8. macintoshmac macrumors 68000

    macintoshmac

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    #383
    Mildly off topic but centred around Day One only: Could anyone remind/ tell me exactly what did they gain from having their own server and increasing their costs? (please do not post comments regarding data hostage and all that, I am asking genuinely, considering iCloud is a solution that works mighty well for a lot of other developers)
     
  9. BigMcGuire, Jul 16, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017

    BigMcGuire Contributor

    BigMcGuire

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Location:
    California
    #384
    Very good question and I hope we get a few responses to this (not just my own) --- I know Day One's justification for doing this was problems with iCloud syncing. iCloud syncing was problematic - Dyrii users are experiencing this (but it is nowhere near as bad as it was in 2014). iCloud is a LOT better now than it used to be, but in the past it used to be HORRIBLE. You could wait hours for a journal entry you put on your Mac to appear on your phone (or other way around). Sometimes it would just never transfer. I had issues like this with Day One Classic. Dropbox was far better (for Day One Classic) but not perfect.

    Their cloud service (Amazon servers) is a lot more reliable and a lot more instant. I've never had data loss with their cloud like I had with iCloud and Day One (back in the day). As long as you were patient and willing to work with deleting a day/readding a day so it would sync, iCloud and Dropbox weren't that bad - but their forums were full of complaints about data loss from users. That had a huge decrease with their own cloud.

    Still not happy bout it - happier now with "end to end encryption" tho. lol. I'd still be using Day One Classic if it didn't limit me to one picture an entry.


    I really REALLY wish they'd give you the option to sync to your own cloud service along with their own. I'd gladly still pay the $24.99/year knowing its going to finance their cloud service if I could have an option to use Google Drive (my cloud service). lol.
     
  10. newellj macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2014
    Location:
    Boston, MA, US
    #385
    Read the post directly above yours. iCloud syncing is not problem free. DO's proprietary sync has been, whatever other issues that has created.
     
  11. macintoshmac macrumors 68000

    macintoshmac

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    #386
    I wanted to know in a little bit more detail as McGuire (the big one ;) ) has later gladly provided, such as long delays in sync and occasional data loss, etc. :) Of course, then, as a professional service provider they would ave had to consider offering their own cloud sync. I can comfortably pay for it knowing they are on top of it. $25 a year really sucks, even though I would be very glad to pay $49 for DayOne 3 knowing I would pay $49-59 for DayOne 4, biennially, give or take. That just feels more right, even though it works out to be just the same, simply because at any point in time, you are not really a hostage at all. You may or may not buy v3, you can keep using v2, etc. You can skip v3 and go with v4, if you wish. Just feels slightly more open than anything else, and I am sure that's all there is to it with many others out here.

    However, DO guys resorting to releasing so many updates, so frequently, is .... pathetic. They do not quite know that these tactics are only causing them to lose the loyalists. All it takes is one credible competitor and they will jump over without a blink. Because the users feel their trust is betrayed when reviews get deleted and new versions get released so soon as has never happened in history.

    Imagine Things 3 releasing 3.1 and 3.2 and 3.3 in 3 weeks just because people bashed them for being late to deliver. Admitting, accepting and embracing the public sentiment is important if they want to build any long term relationship with the public who they expect to subscribe to their aha moment of going SaaS.
     
  12. newellj macrumors 603

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2014
    Location:
    Boston, MA, US
    #387
    I think your point about updates, reviews and the comparison to Things is right on. My guess is that DO basically *hopes* that they have locked in their existing user base at a price that guarantees that they will never need to attract another full price subscriber. I can't believe they expect to compete at the current full price. This is all very unfortunate, because DO is an outstanding piece of software - at a reasonable price, and if marketed and sold on an ethical basis.
     
  13. BigMcGuire Contributor

    BigMcGuire

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Location:
    California
    #388
    I'll be honest, as nice of a product that Day One is, the ability to use my own cloud service is huge for me.

    This is what first intrigued me about Dyrii --- the fact that iCloud sync is so much better now --- and imo (as other posters here said) - more secure than someone else's proprietary cloud. I trust Apple more than I trust some small company. So the fact that Dyrii is using iCloud, I'm going to start using it as my primary journaling app. It has a ton of features and syncs between my Mac, Air, and iPhone via iCloud.

    I've tested it and for $10/year ... lol --- and the fact that it uses iCloud. That's win for me on several levels. Add on top that the developer is super active and communicates well. Win win.

    I told them I'd get the app if they made an import from Day One, they did, I imported, it's going great. For people not wanting to pay a subscription they have a onetime app purchase - since it uses iCloud, you're golden. Just perfect.
     
  14. teerexx52 macrumors 68000

    teerexx52

    Joined:
    May 1, 2005
    Location:
    Florida West Coast
    #389
    I agree. Dyrii has been working very well for me as a Day One replacement.
     
  15. macintoshmac macrumors 68000

    macintoshmac

    Joined:
    May 13, 2010
    #390
    You are right.

    At $25 per year, this is still very good value for money for those who use it and they hope that the current user base remains loyal because of it.

    At $49, this software will not attract many new buyers. Evernote is $49, if I am not wrong, and I stopped using it.

    Subscription software works for that software whose cost otherwise runs into hundreds of dollars. Adobe subscription model works very well (I am talking especially for the Photography package) since it is very cheap and wallet-friendly compared to full price. This however holds true for other apps as well.

    Same goes with Microsoft whose Office 365 subscription (I subscribe to Business Premium) works for me because:

    - I get 1TB OneDrive storage
    - I get 50GB inbox
    - Hosted email
    - Microsoft Word
    - Microsoft Excel
    - Microsoft Powerpoint
    - Microsoft Outlook
    - Microsoft OneNote (even though it is otherwise free)
    - Access to 5 devices via ONE subscription so I have my MBP, iPad, iPhone all using Office apps and in sync.

    Out of all these, for about $12 a month, I am getting:

    - At least 4 (if we take out the free OneNote) pieces of top notch software
    - These software titles are individual "apps" in themselves because:
    - They all allow me 5 different kinds of uses
    - document writing
    - spreadsheets
    - presentations
    - email client
    - note-taking

    Apart from this, the goodness of hosted email and the storage and such.

    $12 a month, x12 months = $144.

    $144 divided between 5 apps + 1 storage + 1 email service so $144 / 7 = $20 per app per year.

    Suppose you exclude OneNote (although there is no reason to) we are still at $144/6 = $24 per app per year.

    TWIST

    There is a way for me to get the same Business Premium for $8 per month if I prepay for the year. This is good, because DayOne or any other subscription goes for per year.

    So, $8 x12 = $96 /year for 6 apps = $16 per year, or for 7 apps = $14 per year.

    This is such a fantastic pricing for such a complex piece of software that is very well integrated and maintained now.


    DAY ONE

    Day One is a single purpose app for $50 per year for a new user? Bwaahahahahaha...

    It is only really good and acceptable value for money at $25 per year, and even then, compared to Microsoft and its Partner pricing, it is roughly $10-$15 costlier for an annual subscription.
     
  16. LDNA macrumors newbie

    LDNA

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2017
    #391
    I just checked Day One in the browser iTunes listing (not logged in) and my 1-star review is still up (re-published it with the latest update).

    Plus I'm not sure how they could delete a review.

    All I know is that developers can report a review to Apple for further investigation, but I can't see Apple deleting a review just because the developers don't like it.
     
  17. Ibalek macrumors member

    Ibalek

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2017
    Location:
    Sunnyvale, CA
    #392
    Apple doesn't allow developers to delete any reviews. It must be a system glitch which causes reviews to sometimes disappear. But I have seen it reappear after a couple of days. Apple should take some notes from Amazon's review system which works remarkably well given their scale.
     
  18. Lioness~ macrumors 6502

    Lioness~

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2017
    Location:
    Gothenburg, Sweden
    #393
    I use both DayOne AND MacJournal.
    They complete each other in a good way.

    I have no intentions to migrate to the subscription service of DayOne.

    I hate subscriptions!

    For now I intend to continue to use the Plus service that it's called for us who buyed DayOne v2
    http://help.dayoneapp.com/day-one-2-0/day-one-premium-faq

    No intentions whatsoever to pay for subscription. Have no need for its extras.
    We have to see if there's will be a Plus version, or if all will be subscriptions, when they upgrade to 3 :cool:
     
  19. LxHunter macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2010
    #394
    I would pay for each major update.
    Didn't know this was not possible.

    Using Day One on iPad, iPhone, MacBook.
    Great app.
    Subscription price just not worth it to me.
    Will move to Notes or Pages.
    Am I correct?
    For twice the price I can buy Office365?
     
  20. TMRJIJ macrumors 68030

    TMRJIJ

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2011
    Location:
    South Carolina, United States
    #395
    You clearly don’t understand the people posting in this thread. We are fine with pay ONCE for an app but subscriptions in general usually means that we don’t necessarily own what we have. I rather pay $200+ to keep this app for life than to pay monthly fees where I may not have the money for it in the future.
     
  21. Lioness~ macrumors 6502

    Lioness~

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2017
    Location:
    Gothenburg, Sweden
    #396
    Some developer get 1 hit & milk it as much as they can instead of broaden their perspective. Which could benefit everyone & evrything.

    Think the more serious developer today stay away from Appstore as much as they can to serve a better purpose for themselves, there apps & the buyers, instead of starting with this insane subscription milking.
     
  22. BigMcGuire Contributor

    BigMcGuire

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Location:
    California
    #397
    Agreed. I just found out about this company yesterday: http://marinersoftware.com/about/

    They have a journaling app that is $40 - looks like an older company but it corresponds to what you say. A lot of the good companies have their own website and do their own thing.
     
  23. Lioness~ macrumors 6502

    Lioness~

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2017
    Location:
    Gothenburg, Sweden
    #398
    Yes, I've had this and some other of their app(s) for ages. They are serious about writing.
    Haven't been upgraded for awhile, I thought...
    But I checked now and now I can sync through iCloud Drive, wasn't possible last time I checked.
    Because I didn't buy it through AppStore. Long before that existed.
    So I couldn't use iCloud to sync through and used DropBox instead.

    Great that Apple have opened up more for devs, so now that is possible.
    Super great:D

    I had sync problem with DayOne earlier when actually a long text disappeared with their sync-service.
    I was damned pissed because it was an important and long text.:mad:
    So from that day I started to use MacJournal more again and stopped trust DayOne with longer texts.
    With shorter notes I continued.

    So during this time MacJournal have been upgraded in silence....:cool:
    Great Guys:)
     
  24. macjunk(ie) macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2009
    #399
    I have been experimenting with my iPad Pro and the Pencil the past few days. And it struck me...why not literally write down my journal into a note taking app? So the past few days, Notability has got a few of my journal entries. It can take audio and pictures. Export functions are great. Can backup to multiple backends.

    The only con I see so far is native support for tags.

    Did anyone else try a similar setup?

    A good note taking app seems to be able to kill two birds with one stone: you can take notes and you can journal...
     
  25. IscariotJ macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2004
    Location:
    UK
    #400
    I've been testing creating entries in Notes. I was considering OneNote, but it doesn't appear to work as well with Workflow. I've pretty much covered the functionality of DO that I use ( step count, location, weather ) with a couple of Pythonista / Workflow scripts. The only thing I miss, is having emedded YouTube links. Plus, I don't have to mess about with Family Sharing ( which has caused no end of issues in our house, thanks to the accounts reverting to Basic ).

    I don't think I'd be as miffed with the subscription, if the sub-only features hadn't been on their roadmap since V2 launched. Suppose it was to be expected with the move to only supporting their sync ( FWIW, I used to use Dropbox with DO Classic, didn't run into any sync errors.... ).
     

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