Kohl’s Becomes First Retailer to Support Store Payments and Rewards With One Tap in Apple Pay

[Mac 128]

Not exactly anymore. Visa & MasterCard have rolled out payment solutions that take less than two seconds on chip read transactions.

Yes, but that's irrelevant depending on the retailers implementation. Here's a typical chip transaction:

Insert chip card, chose type of trnasaction, accept purchase price, wait interminably for authorization, remove card, sign for the transaction. And each one of those steps requires the customer's full attention, because the entire process is held up if the prompts go unnoticed. Many stores have loud alarms that sound if a customer fails to remove their card.

Will this improve? Yes it will. But I doubt it will ever be as fast as Pay, if for no other reason than the signature requirement and keeping track of inserting and removing the card. As I pointed out above, there's absolutely no reason for more than one tap with Pay, other than retailers have merely plugged it into their existing POST system rather than designing a custom routine for it.

 

[doelcm82]

while this is good news, the fact that it's taken so long to get a single retailer to implement this spells doom for the future long-term viability of Apple Pay.

No. It doesn't.

 

[gsmornot]

My understanding is that the chip works the same way at POSTs. I don't necessarily agree Pay is any more secure than a chip transaction, and to the extent it is, then there's absolutely no reason for any additional prompts, much less a signature.
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Signing my name or drawing an X is not the point. I had to put my phone down to sign my name. Drawing an X would be no different. Pay is supposed to be a secure payment system, so no need to provide ID, sign for the transaction, or acknowledge I really want to spend the money. One touch signifies all of that.

I can agree with you on the need for signature. I never sign with anything other than a scribble so its no real point unless its something the vendor needs due to a requirement for fraud. It should be the case that I authorized with my print already so it should be done at that point. Subway I scan my phone, the receipt prints from their terminal. One easy step. Its the store that is lacking when this happens.

 

[Dydegu]

This is awesome.

 

[American Hero]

Insert chip card, chose type of trnasaction, accept purchase price, wait interminably for authorization, remove card, sign for the transaction. And each one of those steps requires the customer's full attention, because the entire process is held up if the prompts go unnoticed. Many stores have loud alarms that sound if a customer fails to remove their card.

We really should implement the PIN system here in the U.S for all cards. I lost my Citi CrapYou Perferred card this morning, but I'm in the middle of switching it to the Double Cash card, so I'm not even worried about anyone using it.

However, and I know you don't need your fingerprint, but RFID should be built into the chipped cards in the U.S. Faster transactions would occur at that point.

 

[gsmornot]

while this is good news, the fact that it's taken so long to get a single retailer to implement this spells doom for the future long-term viability of Apple Pay.

It's been 3 years of broadcast already to get 4k to the point it is today and its expected to be 2025 or later before it even hits 50% or more homes with access to the service. Is 4k dead too? Nah, technology while in concept seems easy the process of deployment is always long when you witness it live.

 

[NufSaid]

I may be a magical unicorn but I have had my two cards linked on my phone for some time now.

 

[gaximus]

What's critical is the "one-tap" implementation. Of the few stores where I can use Pay, I'm still faced with a series of prompt and responses on a simple credit card transaction, with the ultimate insult having to sign my name.

Pay was supposed to be a convenient safer alternative. Right now the only advantage it has over the chip card, is that sometimes it processes faster.

I think this is because of how the retailer implements ApplePay. I know when Walgreens first had ApplePay, I had to type in my pin number, select no cash back, and decline the donation. Then they had an update and now it works by just getting my watch close to it, and getting a nice satisfying tap on my wrist that the payment is done.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Waiting on you Target...

Hey! Got any grapes?
[doublepost=1462375293][/doublepost]And Kohl's is the one store I don't shop.
Maybe it's time to give it a try.

 

[macduke]

Kinda ridiculous that Apple didn't think this through enough to get these sorts of things going right out of the gate, or even a year ago, but at least it's finally happening. Hopefully this is the domino that gets things rolling. I still feel like a major national brand like Target would do wonders to push Apple Pay forward.

 

[EdwardGreene]

What's critical is the "one-tap" implementation. Of the few stores where I can use Pay, I'm still faced with a series of prompt and responses on a simple credit card transaction, with the ultimate insult having to sign my name.

Pay was supposed to be a convenient safer alternative. Right now the only advantage it has over the chip card, is that sometimes it processes faster.

Really? As long as I don't get the blank stare from the cashier, it's been double tap side watch button, hold close, done (or double tap home button on phone, hold close, done). This has included Subway, Office Depot, BP stations, and Wegmans. Which stores do you use it at?

 

[scoobydoo99]

Problem is, Apple's clientele and Kohl's are at two different ends of the economic spectrum. Can't imagine most Kohl's shoppers having Apple Watches.

 

[igorsky]

What's critical is the "one-tap" implementation. Of the few stores where I can use Pay, I'm still faced with a series of prompt and responses on a simple credit card transaction, with the ultimate insult having to sign my name.

Pay was supposed to be a convenient safer alternative. Right now the only advantage it has over the chip card, is that sometimes it processes faster.

The stores have control over how many steps they want to implement in the NFC process. I've been to stores where my debit card is one-tap, and others where I have to enter my PIN.

 

[scoobydoo99]

Sure, if your card is set up with Apple Pay. It should default to your main card when you use touch ID with the rewards card while paying.
[doublepost=1462371607][/doublepost]

Not exactly anymore. Visa & MasterCard have rolled out payment solutions that take less than two seconds on chip read transactions.

Have "rolled out"?? Last I saw they made the news by announcing that they are "working on" faster readers. It will be a long, long, time before we see 2 second chip transactions. I already cancelled my Target card due to the outrageous "chip & PIN" requirement that extends transactions to 20 seconds or so. All for corporate bottom lines.

 

[MacBergin]

I wish Shaw's Supermarkets would take a course in how ApplePay is secure and works. Trying to use ApplePay there is a nightmare. If your transaction goes over $50 they want your device ID, your signature and a form of ID. I walked out.

 

[igorsky]

Just activated my card. Since my iPhone number is different than what is in on the Kohl's file, I couldn't do the SMS code verification. Called to activate - was expecting rep to not know about Apple Pay, but alas 60 seconds later and I was all set!

Hey retailers, do you realize that Apple Pay is faster than the chip readers? Look at Kohl's as an example, you get your loyalty cards + security + fast checkout.

Unfortunately retailers aren't as concerned about fast checkouts as they are with collecting your data. If it wasn't for Apple Pay's (thankfully) strict privacy requirements, all major stores would've implemented it by now.
[doublepost=1462376923][/doublepost]

Kinda ridiculous that Apple didn't think this through enough to get these sorts of things going right out of the gate, or even a year ago, but at least it's finally happening. Hopefully this is the domino that gets things rolling. I still feel like a major national brand like Target would do wonders to push Apple Pay forward.

What you're seeing is super slow implementation by retailers. Has very little to do with Apple.
[doublepost=1462376972][/doublepost]

while this is good news, the fact that it's taken so long to get a single retailer to implement this spells doom for the future long-term viability of Apple Pay.

Apple (Pay) is doomed.

 

[WiseAJ]

Target hates Apple Pay. They're a part of the MCX.

They have Apple Pay in their app (Not that it ever seems to work for me) they just need to add it to their stores and allow their Red Card to be added to wallet.

 

[_mdavenport]

Yes. More of this please.

 

[pjarvi]

I'm happy with Walgreen's 2 tap checkout. Tap once for the rewards card while the cashier is ringing up the items and then once more when the cashier is ready for payment.

 

[Bubba Satori]

Problem is, Apple's clientele and Kohl's are at two different ends of the economic spectrum. Can't imagine most Kohl's shoppers having Apple Watches.

How did you arrive at this?
Kohl's lot is full of $40K+ cars.

 

[bstpierre]

Problem is, Apple's clientele and Kohl's are at two different ends of the economic spectrum. Can't imagine most Kohl's shoppers having Apple Watches.

Can you imagine a lot of Kohl's shoppers having an iPhone?

 

[69Mustang]

Problem is, Apple's clientele and Kohl's are at two different ends of the economic spectrum. Can't imagine most Kohl's shoppers having Apple Watches.

What? That's... Apple customers cover the economic spectrum, just like Android customers, or MS customers. In fact, they're often the same customer. Convenience store clerk at my local BP rocks an Watch. How in the world do you figure a Kohl's shopper to be in a different economic spectrum? What, are they somehow better than the Walmart customer? Walmart, where the Watch is sold.

 

[kdarling]

The main benefit is the one time transaction code tied to a device ID versus your credit card number. This added level of security is the main reason to use the service.

It's not one time. The account token stays the same per device.

The main reason a token is useful, is that if the merchant gets hacked, the hackers won't get your real account number.

Naturally, if you have EVER used your real credit card number in the past, they still have the real account number on file. Token numbers only help with merchant breaks if you use an account number that's never been used on a physical card (or online) at that store.

In other words, if you used account xxxx-1001 at Home Depot, and then later used Apple Pay, the security is pretty meaningless. Hackers into HD's servers can still get the xxxx-1001 number that you used before.

I just draw an "X" on the receipt or terminal. No one has even blinked yet. For that matter I don't think I've had anyone look at the back of a legacy credit card or ask for ID in a couple years either.

At least make it an unusual and repeatable 'X', so if you have to, you can prove it was not you who made the transaction.

For now I'm just really happy about the security of tokenized transactions and the anonymity between myself and the merchant.

No anonymity in this Kohl situation, since the loyalty card is apparently tied to your token.

It should be the case that I authorized with my print already so it should be done at that point.

The terminal does not know you used a print. You could've used your passcode instead.

In any event, it's no proof that it was the cardholder's print. It's just a very good likelihood that it was. But it could be anybody who had access to the passcode and/or registered their print on your phone.

That's why originally the card companies ran an experiment in France where terminals had fingerprint readers that sent your finger scan to the bank, where it could be matched up against a print that you had registered and was witnessed IN PERSON by a bank official.

However, that scheme would've required more expensive terminals, trips to banks, etc. The current method of letting it be done on phone by (hopefully) the cardholder, is "Good Enough" for the majority of situations.

 

[American Hero]

Have "rolled out"?? Last I saw they made the news by announcing that they are "working on" faster readers.

The readers themselves aren't slow, it's the software and programming behind them. Read some articles on how Visa & MasterCard are speeding up transactions with a simple software update. So yes, roll out.
[doublepost=1462379521][/doublepost]

I already cancelled my Target card due to the outrageous "chip & PIN" requirement that extends transactions to 20 seconds or so. All for corporate bottom lines.

Target doesn't want to be susceptible to charge backs for fraudulent transactions. The rest of the world uses chip and pin, so get up with the rest of the world or go back to cash, sorry.

 

[69Mustang]

It's not one time. The account token stays the same per device.

The main reason a token is useful, is that if the merchant gets hacked, the hackers won't get your real account number.

Naturally, if you have EVER used your real credit card number in the past, they still have the real account number on file. Token numbers only help with merchant breaks if you use an account number that's never been used on a physical card (or online) at that store.

In other words, if you used account xxxx-1001 at Home Depot, and then later used Apple Pay, the security is pretty meaningless. Hackers into HD's servers can still get the xxxx-1001 number that you used before.



At least make it an unusual and repeatable 'X', so if you have to, you can prove it was not you who made the transaction.



No anonymity in this Kohl situation, since the loyalty card is apparently tied to your token.



The terminal does not know you used a print. You could've used your passcode instead.

In any event, it's no proof that it was the cardholder's print. It's just a very good likelihood that it was. But it could be anybody who had access to the passcode and/or registered their print on your phone.

That's why originally the card companies ran an experiment in France where terminals had fingerprint readers that sent your finger scan to the bank, where it could be matched up against a print that you had registered and was witnessed IN PERSON by a bank official.

However, that scheme would've required more expensive terminals, trips to banks, etc. The current method of letting it be done on phone by (hopefully) the cardholder, is "Good Enough" for the majority of situations.

Heeeeeeey man. Don't come in here with facts and stuff. We like our assumptions about Apple Pay and how it functions. Facts... pishaw. Who needs 'em.