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Kuo: Apple's 5G Modem to Rapidly Roll Out in iPhones Starting Next Year

I don’t want to beta test this, or even use it at all until it’s better than Qualcomm which is doubtful. Samsung does displays perfectly, Qualcomm does modems perfectly, and Apple does ecosystems perfectly. Apple wants to be the de facto monopoly, but I don’t think anyone here should want vertical and horizontal monopolistic behavior from Tim’s AAPL.

I love Apple, but I can’t stand Tim’s sell out the consumer for the shareholder bit. It’s beyond greed; it’s anticompetitive, and I want someone to stop them.
 
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ThailandToo said:
I don’t want to beta test this, or even use it at all until it’s better than Qualcomm which is doubtful. Samsung does displays perfectly, Qualcomm does modems perfectly, and Apple does ecosystems perfectly. Apple wants to be the de facto monopoly, but I don’t think anyone here should want vertical and horizontal monopolistic behavior from Tim’s AAPL.

I love Apple, but I can’t stand Tim’s sell out the consumer for the shareholder bit. It’s beyond greed; it’s anticompetitive, and I want someone to stop them.
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Well Tim was gonna find some way to save money because they are paying Qualcomm a Lot of money for there modems, a Lot 💰
 
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Sure, the Intel modems were sub-par--but that was back in 2019. It's now 2024 and given Apple's massive internal R&D, I think they've overcome a lot of the issues with the Intel modem design and the current test silicon for the radio modem chip is much, much better.
 
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Iconoclysm said:
it can be integrated into the primary SoC
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Most likely they won’t waste expensive silicon area for a modem they will only use on some devices, at least at start. Eventually they might integrate some of the digital components, but even then, that is small portion of the chip. Modems are largely analog and use older processes not only because they are cheaper but new ones are also unnecessary.
 
We cannot rule out they didn’t improve on Intels modem at all, but simply decided that it will have to do on the SE.
 
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SactoGuy18 said:
Sure, the Intel modems were sub-par--but that was back in 2019. It's now 2024 and given Apple's massive internal R&D, I think they've overcome a lot of the issues with the Intel modem design and the current test silicon for the radio modem chip is much, much better.
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I remember the iPhone 7. Some models with Intel modems and some with Qualcomm. Unfortunately, I ended up with an Intel on Verizon and it took them about a month to fix the issue before I can make a reliable call.

It will be interesting to see how the cell providers handle an Apple modem. I'm sure the majority of the cell equipment is designed to work best with Qualcomm.
 
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5 years and no modem, dang.

The benefit to their own chip is potential vertical integration, just like the M series. Less power, faster, etc.

I'm not sure how the W1 chip has worked out...or the custom little chips Apple has. I suppose they're a training ground for new people?
 
bzgnyc2 said:
I'd be surprised if Apple has a secret breakthrough in this area. In the framework of the Innovator's Dilema, Apple leaped ahead of Intel on mainstream CPUs by coming up from lower end chips in mobile applications. This doesn't apply against Qualcomm who was already intensely focused on this area.

I would never rule out breakthroughs but I suspect its fundementally hard to transmit (or even receive) signals in the 10s Ghz range without using a lot (relatively speaking) of energy.
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The exception of decreased heat and decreased power consumption come from integrating the component into the SOC and from fabbing it on a newer process node. the current Qualcomm modems are separate chips and they are built using older chip fab processes. If Apple could integrate the modems into their SOC, there are benefits of using less power and generating less heat. The 5G modems have often been big drains on power.
 
Tagbert said:
The exception of decreased heat and decreased power consumption come from integrating the component into the SOC and from fabbing it on a newer process node. the current Qualcomm modems are separate chips and they are built using older chip fab processes. If Apple could integrate the modems into their SOC, there are benefits of using less power and generating less heat. The 5G modems have often been big drains on power.
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Qualcomm X75 is fabbed on TSMC 4nm. Power savings only happen if there's a high speed link, which there isn't for a modem. There's basically no energy savings in this case. Same reason why Apple doesn't integrate Wi-Fi and BT into Apple Silicon even though every device uses those wireless technologies. It's a big handicap in terms of flexibility if integrated.
 
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VulchR said:
I was about to write 'This should result in lower iPhone prices, right? RIGHT?' 🤣
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Some people forgot what happened with Apple Silicon. They're still dreaming about price drops or even price holds.

Apple Silicon segmented the Mac lineup based on the number of USB-C ports, with more ports on higher-tier models. External display support was reduced and is now offered as a Pro feature. Additionally, the presence of a cooling fan has become a key differentiator. Overall, prices went up after Apple Silicon was introduced.

Apple Modem would probably make consumers pay for 5.5G vs. 5G, hotspot capability, and faster download speeds. Those are Pro features.
 
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SactoGuy18 said:
Sure, the Intel modems were sub-par--but that was back in 2019. It's now 2024 and given Apple's massive internal R&D, I think they've overcome a lot of the issues with the Intel modem design and the current test silicon for the radio modem chip is much, much better.
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Apple certainly has full confidence in their modem. I guess that's why it's going in the SE4 and only one of the mainstream iPhone 17 models.
 
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I would be surprised for them to "beta" test this on the SE model. Would it be incorrect to say the SE is how a lot of people new to Apple get their first impression? I would think that would be the market you'd want to shield from beta tests.

If they're going to put this on a particular model I would guess it would be on the rumored iPhone Air/Slim. If this modem is integrated into the SoC, then it could be one of the reasons that allow them to make the slimmer phone in the first place, no? Plus, if the rumors claiming that the new model is quite expensive, alongside lesser components than the Pro models, then I expect the first run's target market likely overlaps customers who are eager to beta test new features already. So, why not sweeten the pot by giving those customers the opportunity to also test the new modem?
 
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Well, I’d be wary of buying a new SE. It’ll be interesting to see if there are connectivity or speed issues with Apple’s modem.

That being said, the royalties Qualcomm extracts are absolutely outrageous. According to CNET (as reported here by Motley Fool), Apple was paying $7.50 royalty per iPhone in 2019 to Qualcomm. I’d like Apple to succeed just to see them be able to drop Qualcomm. Back in 2019 that was $1B in royalties.
 
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Wanted797 said:
That is a logical thing to do.

We know Qualcomm is leading in this industry. its makes sense to test with devices basic consumers use for minute differences only “pros” (enthusiasts) would complain about.
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It's completely illogical. Apple's approach has been to do rigorous internal testing, not beta test stuff with the public. That's one of the reasons consumers pay the Apple premium. It's supposed to just work.

1_67VnoVW3Oh3DZpRJoEIPPQ.png
 
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Apple is paying Qualcomm heaps of money 💰 It’s too much of a Monopoly for Qualcomm to be the only modem manufacturer in the US. Apple does not want to pay Qualcomm billions of dollars till 2030 when 6G arrives.
 
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asdfjkl; said:
Well, I’d be wary of buying a new SE. It’ll be interesting to see if there are connectivity or speed issues with Apple’s modem.

That being said, the royalties Qualcomm extracts are absolutely outrageous. According to CNET (as reported here by Motley Fool), Apple was paying $7.50 royalty per iPhone in 2019 to Qualcomm. I’d like Apple to succeed just to see them be able to drop Qualcomm. Back in 2019 that was $1B in royalties.
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I never understand this argument. How is $7.50 for the technology that allows the iPhone to communicate "outrageous"? The CDMA technology (2G,3G,4G, 5G) that Qualcomm and others developed is what has allowed the iPhone to be such a huge success. We (Apple) charge ~30% for app's purchased through the App Store, but a one time fee of $7.5 is excessive?

BTW- the royalty fee's won't be going away if/when an internal modem is rolled in. We'll be able to avoid purchasing the discrete modem from Qualcomm (which is far more $$ than the royalty).
 
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