Kuo: iPhone 13 to Feature LEO Satellite Communications to Make Calls and Texts Without Cellular Coverage

[Internaut]

I’m betting it’ll only be US models that would get this feature. Bear in mind it would be illegal to bring such an iPhone into some countries. For a business trip to Kinshasa, a few years back, I asked about taking a sat phone for emergencies and was told Congolese customs would have my balls if caught.

 

[falainber]

There are 1,619 Starlink communication satellites, at 341 mile altitude at 53 degree inclination, with plans to put upto 11,000 in the next few years. SpaceX has US regulatory approval for 4,000 more immediately and we'll see them in the coming year or so. These are in the Ku and Ka bands and link to each other using laser transponders. At roughly 550 KM altitude, it takes about 1 hour 36 minutes to orbit the earth. It comes down to how the software implementation with the Qualcom X60 baseband chipset using the GPS receiver chipset in the iPhone can pick up on the Starlink satellites.

This seems doable, but signal power and antenna gain is the question. It may be only for emergency use applications. In any case, this is a game changer if true.

Did you see Starlink antenna?

 

[1909]

just a question , cause i don’t know this “Leo” firm:

I’m an hiker and i have a subscription with Garmin for emergency satellite communications (with the Garmin InReach Mini).

The service is powered by the Iridium Satellite Network, that has a global coverage.

so, this is the question;
IF CONFIRMED (i know is tricky to comment rumors), this feature could be a substitute of Garmin Satellite Services?

This “Leo network” has a good coverage?
My subscription with Garmin is monthly of 15 dollar, i’d like to understand if could be a good deal and what kind of satellite’s service could provides (eg Garmin in my actual subcription offers texts but not calls)

EDIT:

sorry: i didn’t have my glasses, i read now that the satellite partner could be the well know Globalstar, and Leo is just the kind of technology
So, just finger crossed, could be a game changer feature for several applications...

 

[JPack]

How come we never hear about Apple sending Cease And Desist letters to Kuo?

He seems to always have the inside scoop and divulges all this info to investors and media...

Yet Apple only goes after people living in their parents houses who tweet out 'predictions' and rumours?

Because there is nothing Apple can do about it.

Kuo doesn’t rely on Weibo to share his thoughts. Apple can’t ask Weibo to shut down an account. Kuo works for a large investment firm and sends out personal investor notes that are his own opinion.

Leaks like this is why Kuo gets paid big bucks. Investors rely on Kuo to determine which supply chain stock to invest in.

 

[Denzo]

Boom! That’s an incredible bit of a news. Super keen now.

 

[827538]

The engineer in me is highly skeptical but if it's true this would be great.

 

[jdclifford]

Does the user have to pay for this access or is that service provided (paid for) by Apple and Globalatar

”This means that customers of a partner network operator could use Globalstar's satellite communication service on the iPhone 13 directly through their network operator with no additional contracts or payments required.”

 

[CWallace]

How come we never hear about Apple sending Cease And Desist letters to Kuo?

He seems to always have the inside scoop and divulges all this info to investors and media...

Yet Apple only goes after people living in their parents houses who tweet out 'predictions' and rumours?

As JPack noted, Kuo works for a large firm with a large legal department who can go toe-to-toe with Apple's legal team.

The folks living in their parent's basement do not.

 

[falainber]

"The iPhone 13 reportedly features a customized Qualcomm X60 baseband chip that supports satellite communications. Other smartphone brands are apparently currently waiting until 2022 to adopt the X65 baseband chip necessary to implement satellite communications functions."
This part needs clarification. It's true that Apple might be the only vendor using X60 chip. As I understand the main reason for it is because hardly any vendor uses separate baseband chip in the smartphones these days. Most vendors use the processors with integrated baseband. For example Snapdragon 888 integrates X60 modem (used by Samsung S21 among other chips). Apple has to use separate modem chip because they have their own processor that lacks baseband features.

 

[CWallace]

Does the user have to pay for this access or is that service provided (paid for) by Apple and Globalatar

”This means that customers of a partner network operator could use Globalstar's satellite communication service on the iPhone 13 directly through their network operator with no additional contracts or payments required.”

You omitted the preceding sentence, which is pretty critical:

"Kuo explained that the "simplest scenario" for providing LEO connectivity to users is if individual network operators work with Globalstar.

This means that customers of a partner network operator could use Globalstar's satellite communication service on the iPhone 13 directly through their network operator with no additional contracts or payments required.”

 

[jseymour]

While I'm not current on modern LEO SatCom capabilities, I do know something of SatCom. (Extensive background in radio communications. Taught SatCom in the U.S. military long ago.) This strikes me as somewhat unlikely. There's a big difference between devices on the ground being able to "see" GPS constellation satellites and satellites in LEO being able to "hear" discrete signals from the ground.

E.g.: The transmit power of GPS satellites is in the vicinity of 500 watts, ERP (effective radiated power), while the output of a common cell phone is more in the range of one watt, max. True, the receivers in the satellites would almost certainly be more sensitive, but, still: The SNR (signal-to-noise ratio) over that distance would be phenomenal. (Signal strength decreases at the square of the distance. E.g.: Double the distance and signal strength decreases by four times.)

Even if it did work (FSVO "work"), ISTM it would take very little to disrupt it. Buildings, terrain, heavy (esp. wet) canopy, weather...

I'm more than happy to be proven wrong.

 

[falainber]

Apple being the first to implement support for a wireless band/standard in a smartphone? That never happened before. Probably unlikely to happen now.

 

[jdb8167]

There are 1,619 Starlink communication satellites, at 341 mile altitude at 53 degree inclination, with plans to put upto 11,000 in the next few years. SpaceX has US regulatory approval for 4,000 more immediately and we'll see them in the coming year or so. These are in the Ku and Ka bands and link to each other using laser transponders. At roughly 550 KM altitude, it takes about 1 hour 36 minutes to orbit the earth. It comes down to how the software implementation with the Qualcom X60 baseband chipset using the GPS receiver chipset in the iPhone can pick up on the Starlink satellites.

This seems doable, but signal power and antenna gain is the question. It may be only for emergency use applications. In any case, this is a game changer if true.

Starlink uses an antenna the size of a pizza box and something like a 30 W computer for beam steering. Not even close to what would be possible in an iPhone.

 

[jgbr]

Still waiting to make a decent quality phone call on 4G….

 

[Apple_Robert]

How many U.S. carriers do you think are going to partner with Globalstar to offer a service that doesn't need their cellular towers? I don't see it happening with this release. If this is true, this is going to basically be an unusable new feature.

 

[Serban55]

"allow users to make calls and send messages in areas without 4G or 5G coverage"

I dont understand..i have 3G or even EDGE and can make calls and send messages when 4G or 5G is not available
how is this different ?

 

[Apple_Robert]

No one should ever use a phone as a safety net when off the beaten path in nature. Nothing more annoying that some jackass talking on the phone in a national park. I'm there to get away from that and not to use it as a safety blanket to phone for help.

What a ridiculous post.

If someone is off the beaten path as many outside exercisers are, how would a person get a hold of emergency services in an emergency, especially if someone has been injured?

 

[snakes-]

Many feature us only. maybe this one too..... for europeans is lucrative to switch to android.

 

[leonremi]

having some tech inside one chip means nothing. This functionality is most likely disabled and the iPhone has none of the necessary systems for this to work.

 

[dojoman]

Another great prediction from Kuo I hope he can predict my local weather too.

 

[ilvthld]

The iPhone 13 will feature low earth orbit (LEO) satellite communication connectivity to allow users to make calls and send messages in areas without 4G or 5G coverage, according to the reliable analyst Ming-Chi Kuo.

In a note to investors, seen by MacRumors, Kuo explained that the iPhone 13 lineup will feature hardware that is able to connect to LEO satellites. If enabled with the relevant software features, this could allow iPhone 13 users to make calls and send messages without the need for a 4G or 5G cellular connection.

The iPhone 13 reportedly features a customized Qualcomm X60 baseband chip that supports satellite communications. Other smartphone brands are apparently currently waiting until 2022 to adopt the X65 baseband chip necessary to implement satellite communications functions.

SpaceX's Starlink is a purveyor of LEO internet connectivity that some readers may already be familiar with, but the LEO satellite communication service provider that is "most likely to cooperate with Apple in terms of technology and service coverage" is said to be Globalstar. Qualcomm has purportedly been working with Globalstar to support the n53 band in future X65 baseband chips.

Kuo explained that the "simplest scenario" for providing LEO connectivity to users is if individual network operators work with Globalstar. This means that customers of a partner network operator could use Globalstar's satellite communication service on the iPhone 13 directly through their network operator with no additional contracts or payments required.

Kuo added that LEO satellite communications is a technology comparable to mmWave 5G in terms of its impact on the network industry and that Apple may leverage both technologies. Kuo says that Apple is "optimistic" about the trend of satellite communications and set up a specific team for research and development of technologies related to it "some time" ago.

The company is believed to have plans to bring LEO satellite communications to more devices in the future to "provide innovative experiences." These may include Apple's mixed reality head-mounted display device, electric vehicle, and other IoT accessories, according to Kuo.

Article Link: Kuo: iPhone 13 to Feature LEO Satellite Communications to Make Calls and Texts Without Cellular Coverage

Now follow this up with 120mhz and hidden fingerprint scanner like the S21Ultra and then I might look to purchasing a iPhone in the future..

 

[CARIB_APPLE]

Wasn't there something mentioned about being able to use FindMy when the phone is turned off. Could these two things be connected?

 

[Will.O.Bie]

"But, but, what about the battery life?!"

 

[Pezimak]

I hope that's limited to those markets that don't have cellular coverage, as it's something I don't want to pay extra for because in the U.K. we don't have LEO systems really, Starlink is in beta and doesn't cover the whole country.

 

[kevink2]

Big if true. But I believe it's going to be extremely difficult to transmit voice from phone to LEO satellite - not enough antenna power. So maybe low bitrate text.

This sounds like the reports I’ve seen over the last couple years. Then vague other that supposedly worked with cell phones. And I’ve expressed doubts elsewhere that a noreal cell phone would have enough power to reach satellites. Even low earth orb. Even outside with clear view. For right now I’ll just continue to have a prepaid phone and plan on multiple carriers.