Late-2014 rMBP what will be new?

[koyoot]

So much wishful thinking! There is about zero chance any of these things will happen in 2014.

Broadwell production starts in May-July, so for september Apple will have a lot of Broadwell chips. More - nVidia will be ramping up production by now, of the Maxwell GPUs. So we can expect september release of MBP's. If not - october and november are either good moments for release new MBPs in 2014.

People are saying that the change from the GDDR5 modified version of the 750M to the 850M is not that great, but keep in mind that if Apple tinkers with the GPU as it did with the 750M, I think it'll be closer to the 860M.

GTX850M GDDR5 will be way faster than GT750M. 100-120% inreased performance. Especially in games.

 

[leman]

Broadwell production starts in May-July, so for september Apple will have a lot of Broadwell chips. More - nVidia will be ramping up production by now, of the Maxwell GPUs. So we can expect september release of MBP's. If not - october and november are either good moments for release new MBPs in 2014.

You probably mean May-July 2015

GTX850M GDDR5 will be way faster than GT750M. 100-120% inreased performance. Especially in games.

Well, not 100%, but around 30-50% for sure.

 

[mcarling]

I think the likelihood of getting a new dGPU is actually quite high. I believe we will see a CPU bump + Maxwell GPU by end of the spring/mid summer.

Broadwell production starts in May-July, so for september Apple will have a lot of Broadwell chips.

Unless you two mean 2015, I hope you are prepared to be disappointed.

 

[leman]

Unless you two mean 2015, I hope you are prepared to be disappointed.

Why 2015? The updated Haswell + new-gen Nvidia GPUs will both be available in summer. Apple usually updates their line with refreshed parts in the middle of the cycle. I think the chances are quite good. On the other side, its clear that the next-gen Broadwell-based MBP won't arrive until 2015...

 

[mcarling]

Why 2015? The updated Haswell + new-gen Nvidia GPUs will both be available in summer. Apple usually updates their line with refreshed parts in the middle of the cycle.

The only GPUs that will be updated in the MBPs this year will be the integrated GPUs. Am I sure enough to bet my head? No. Am I sure enough to bet a finger? Nearly.

 

[emir]

Macbook Pro engraving / logo

Whatever they do, they should just bring back the "Macbook Pro" logo, engraving, whatever it was to the bezel.

 

[leman]

The only GPUs that will be updated in the MBPs this year will be the integrated GPUs. Am I sure enough to bet my head? No. Am I sure enough to bet a finger? Nearly.

I'm not really sure I get you. Upgrade the iGPU with what? There will be no improvements to Intel GPUs until 2015. Or did you mean that Apple will drop the dGPU completely?

 

[827538]

Broadwell is having problems with the new 14nm second gen FINFET process. I am massively sceptical that Intel will have enough chips ready for Apple by September. I reckon you are looking at September at the absolute earliest but realistically it will be between then and the start of 2015. If I had to bet, my money would be on late October/early November again.

DDR4 is a possibility, guess you haven't been reading the latest news? Expensive but still a chance it could be included.
http://www.guru3d.com/news_story/smart_modular_announces_high_performance_ddr4_dram_module.html

Maxwell will be included for sure, on the top models anyway. No way Broadwell's iGPU will come close to the 750M and with Maxwell offering huge gains (50%) then there would be a serious backlash if they didn't include it. Another thing to note is it would most likely be built on TSMC's new 20nm process. As the first batch of Maxwell chips is still being built on 28nm process.

Broadwell is a given, IGZO is a possibility but hardly as groundbreaking as people make out - LTPS and OLED are better techs but these will definitely not be in the new laptops for numerous reasons.

SSD's are to see a 30% price drop this year due to NAND over supply and better processes/yields. So that gives Apple a bit more leeway with their other specifications without hampering profits.

 

[lewdvig]

You probably mean May-July 2015

Well, not 100%, but around 30-50% for sure.

If they put an 860m it is in fact faster than two 750m chips in SLI.

Amazing.

 

[mcarling]

I'm not really sure I get you. Upgrade the iGPU with what? There will be no improvements to Intel GPUs until 2015. Or did you mean that Apple will drop the dGPU completely?

The newer Haswell chips which have been and will continue to be introduced this year are based on steppings with minor GPU improvements along with other minor improvements relative to the early Haswell steppings.

 

[Orr]

Whatever they do, they should just bring back the "Macbook Pro" logo, engraving, whatever it was to the bezel.

Removing this monstrosity was one of the best decisions Apple has made in recent memory.

 

[emir]

Removing this monstrosity was one of the best decisions Apple has made in recent memory.

Monstrosity? What makes you say that? Did it distract you from your work? Why did you hate it so much? I'm really curios don't get me wrong I'm not trying to bash you or start an argument.

 

[nomanstool]

The rumors point to a very minor refresh in or about September. I would buy now rather than any other time in the next 12 months. If you're willing to wait until summer of 2015, then it might or might not be worthwhile to wait for Broadwell.

Yikes so nothing on June/July?

 

[Zeov]

At this point, apple will never put discrete gpu on their 15" base models.

sure they will

 

[mcarling]

Yikes so nothing on June/July?

A minor refresh of the Haswell rMBPs could come as early as June or July but the rumors are pointing to September. One can always hope, but it would be unreasonable to expect any significant changes other than a 100MHz improvement in CPU speed at the same price points. There is a chance that Apple might drop the remaining cMBP and reduce the price of the entry-level 13" rMBP by $100. Changes in memory or storage options are unlikely. Other significant improvements, such a faster ports or a newer discrete GPU, are far-fetched.

It's nothing worth waiting for. If you need a MBP this year, buy one now.

In 2015, there will be more significant improvements when the Broadwell MBPs are introduced, but nothing earth-shattering.

 

[MacDevMike]

A minor refresh of the Haswell rMBPs could come as early as June or July but the rumors are pointing to September. One can always hope, but it would be unreasonable to expect any significant changes other than a 100MHz improvement in CPU speed at the same price points. There is a chance that Apple might drop the remaining cMBP and reduce the price of the entry-level 13" rMBP by $100. Changes in memory or storage options are unlikely. Other significant improvements, such a faster ports or a newer discrete GPU, are far-fetched.

It's nothing worth waiting for. If you need a MBP this year, buy one now.

In 2015, there will be more significant improvements when the Broadwell MBPs are introduced, but nothing earth-shattering.

I agree with this assessment for the most part. The machine is incredibly strong just the way it sits.

One thing that I am still trying to figure out is Broadwell's true release estimates. They had some issues building the fab centers to make the chips, and it put some of the CPU's behind schedule. I know that the low power "u" series seems to have been pushed back to late Q4 at a minimum, and there are conflicting reports on the more powerful chips like the 4860HQ and the 4970HQ that would power the 15" retina. Most seem to be looking towards January/February for that.

If Apple was originally planning to update the chassis in September to coincide with Broadwell, and also put the Maxwell chip in that unit, this would delay a MBP release until that timeline. I still think they may update the dGPU in the current retina to an 850m any day now. As its been six months since the last refresh, it just seems like something they might do. If they bump the GPU now, they could leave the machine alone until Jan/Feb when they do a major revision.

One minor piece of info: the 850m is an 860m with a 15% lower clock speed on the core clock and memory clock. The cuda shader count is identical. So if they call it an 850, you will be able to boot in to a Bootcamp partition and OC the card to 860 speeds without issue.

Food for thought.

 

[Narcaz]

I tend to disagree with an early 850m release. Performance is fine, but Apple always took its sweet time. The 750m was released in april and it took them until late october to release it. Even the 650m needed 4 months to show up in the first rMBP. And in contrast to 2012 and 2013 the base model will be stuck with Iris Pro. Unless their a selling a lot of the 750m top spec rMBP right now and run out of stock, there is no need to hurry. Beside gaming performance, I think the machine is still competitive.

 

[MacDevMike]

I tend to disagree with an early 850m release. Performance is fine, but Apple always took its sweet time. The 750m was released in april and it took them until late october to release it. Even the 650m needed 4 months to show up in the first rMBP. And in contrast to 2012 and 2013 the base model will be stuck with Iris Pro. Unless their a selling a lot of the 750m top spec rMBP right now and run out of stock, there is no need to hurry. Beside gaming performance, I think the machine is still competitive.

Would it be okay if Apple was just really ambitious this time?

 

[Starshadow]

I have no idea.

However I was wondering what else could be removed, now that we got rid of the Ethernet port, optical drive, removable battery etc.

- remove the clicky part of the touchpad?
- on/off button?

To follow the argument that is often given to people that need an optical drive, they could easily remove the display and keyboard, since one can easily use external devices for that
But that is called a Mac mini!

But the keyboard and display are useful...where as CD or DVD drives have been obsolete for 5 years.

 

[chelch]

Interesting read this thread is...

also interesting is the pro-iGPU vs pro-dGPU crowd... too bad Apple isn't one or the other and MS was the opposite so we could have a real fanboy war!

I've debated picking up a base I7 2.0 rMBP or base I5 2.9 21.5" iMac over waiting for a refreshed mini recently and this is what I've decided. 4 months ago I would have picked one or the other without much debate. The Iris Pro is so close to the 750m that IMO it's not worth going for the dGPU in this case. Not just $-wise but, why have it if you don't need it? Another component to power, update and worry about failing.

There are many people on this site that argued how important dGPUs are when video editing. They made a great argument. I'm sure Apple knows this as well and will update their line up with 850m dGPUs. The mini won't get one, but the rMBP and iMac will, and IMO are worth waiting for. Maxwell is a great first step towards closing the gap between mobile and desktop, and iGPUs will never keep up.

 

[mcarling]

One thing that I am still trying to figure out is Broadwell's true release estimates. They had some issues building the fab centers to make the chips, and it put some of the CPU's behind schedule. I know that the low power "u" series seems to have been pushed back to late Q4 at a minimum, and there are conflicting reports on the more powerful chips like the 4860HQ and the 4970HQ that would power the 15" retina. Most seem to be looking towards January/February for that.

It's not impossible, but I would be surprised if the refresh occurs before there are updated CPUs available in sufficient quantities for every rMBP model.

I still think they may update the dGPU in the current retina to an 850m any day now. As its been six months since the last refresh, it just seems like something they might do.

Updating the discrete GPU before Broadwell would be insanely expensive in terms of engineering issues, production issues, and risk. I think the only reason Apple would even consider a motherboard redesign before Broadwell would be if they were having issues with the motherboard (of which I have not heard).

Changing the discrete GPU mid-cycle would also send the market a very bad marketing signal i.e. that discrete GPU performance is somehow important which is exactly the opposite of the signal Apple have been sending and need very much to continue sending. If one accepts the fact that Apple are incrementally phasing discrete GPUs out of the MBP line (as they already did with the MBA line), then why would they send a self-defeating signal to the market?

 

[Joelist]

Didn't you know?

The new rMBP will have the entire case plus the screen made of sapphire!

It will also have a new logic board with four sockets each holding a quad core Broadwell CPU, 64GB of RAM, 4 TB of PCIe flash storage and a special SLI interlink for all 4 iGPUs. All this plus double the current battery capacity and it will be only 5mm thick!

 

[leman]

There are many people on this site that argued how important dGPUs are when video editing. They made a great argument.

This is something I really don't get. Why would a dGPU be important for video editing? A mid-range dGPU is not any faster (actually, its often slower) than a modern iGPU for computing tasks.

If one accepts the fact that Apple are incrementally phasing discrete GPUs out of the MBP line (as they already did with the MBA line), then why would they send a self-defeating signal to the market?

Interesting point, but I don't really thing this is what happening here. Apple is not phasing out the dGPU, the whole computer industry is (simply because iGPUs become more capable at very fast pace). I believe it is only a matter of time until iGPU reaches performance levels which would make a dGPU unnecessary. What Apple does it adapting to the situation. They already had a whole generation of laptops which used integrated graphics only in the bad configuration (because it was fast enough) and then brought the dGPU back in the subsequent generation (as the dGPUs became much more capable). Right now, we have Nvidia's new GPUs, which are something of a game changer (because of their unprecedented leap in performance). Existence of these GPUs (which will undoubtedly find their way into the competitor's machines) makes iGPU-only solutions somehow less attractive in the high-end sector.

 

[chelch]

This is something I really don't get. Why would a dGPU be important for video editing? A mid-range dGPU is not any faster (actually, its often slower) than a modern iGPU for computing tasks.

I didn't get it either, but video editing software is designed to load rendering to the dGPU when it's present. Some effects are even dependent on CUDA in some software. I'm not a pro by any means but I've been editing video/audio for about 15 years starting with VHS tapes. I used FCP7 on a late 2009 mac mini for a while and it was fine. The rendering took a while but I'm not in production so it didn't matter. Then trying to use FCPX and Motion I hit the wall. The whole process became extremely painful. When I had a high-end rMBP w/650m the difference was obviously impressive but it was overkill. I had 3 different Motion templates rendering at the same time and it could take it.

Since I wanted more gaming performance I returned it and bought a Win8 laptop with a 675m. Unfortunately the video editing software I've tried with it is equally painful, but it is fast. I was blown away at how fast things like stability improvements could be added to clips. Instant. And looking back, it's the dGPU that makes the difference. Think of it like having 2 people (1 roofer and 1 jack-of-all) help you roof a house instead of 1 jack-of-all.

I know a new mini or base iMac or base rMBP would still blow my old mini out of the water, but why not have that extra hand around for when there's more to do in a few years. Plus the main reason is the giant leap from the 750m to 850m. The 850m puts it close to my 675m so it could also replace that machine if I decide to spend the extra $K on a rMBP.

 

[WardC]

Didn't you know?

The new rMBP will have the entire case plus the screen made of sapphire!

It will also have a new logic board with four sockets each holding a quad core Broadwell CPU, 64GB of RAM, 4 TB of PCIe flash storage and a special SLI interlink for all 4 iGPUs. All this plus double the current battery capacity and it will be only 5mm thick!

Holy **** ! This is it! This is the news we have been waiting for! It's all been revealed. Quick, grab your wallets. Only $250,000!