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Latest Apple Music Beta for Android Adds Spatial and Lossless Audio
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On apple own support document about lossless and dolby Atmos in Apple Music.
Mac Os 11.4 and IOS 14.6 are required.
I was merely replying to someone who asked how to listen on Apple portable devices not carrying a headphone jack, confirming that with that accessory is possible.
Whether the adapter's DAC is good or bad, I'll leave that to the end user. I don't think the built in DAC in iPhones/iPads with regular audio jack is "Hi-Fi-grade" in comparison. Maybe a little bit better. I don't know because I can't make a comparison – I never used that adapter.
Apple lossless is definitely enjoyable even in hi-res with a proper setup (via USB DAC). You just have to know how to do it.
Admittedly, the whole Apple Music lossless launch was confusing, even for those who are into this kind of stuff, let alone for the regular users.
AirPlay is messy right now. Hope Apple will fix it.
It's so confusing that I thought to prepare a cheat sheet:
What is strange about the homepods, is that since day one they have been able to decode and playback, natively, FLAC and ALAC streams up to 24/48. At least it says so in the audio specs. So I do not understand the need of a software update to support apple music lossless, unless they internally transcode every lossless stream to AAC 256.
Perhaps their internal DSP/Auto EQ/Beamforming process only support AAC 256 files.
But then if that the case all the people who claim that they have been airplaying their local lossless colection to the homepods since the speaker came out in 2018... that wasn´t lossless?. The Homepod have been converting it to AAC 256 this whole time?.
Airplay 1 support up to 16/44. Is lossless because the audio gets transmited in an ALAC container.
Airplay 2 support up tp 24/48 in a LPCM container. If you sent a 16/44 stream over Airplay 2, it will be encapsulated in ALAC. If you sent a 24 bit stream, it will be encapsulated in LPCM because ALAC over Airplay only support 16 bits.
What do you think about this, @Marco Klobas?. Great post, by the way!.
Perhaps their internal DSP/Auto EQ/Beamforming process only support AAC 256 files.
But then if that the case all the people who claim that they have been airplaying their local lossless colection to the homepods since the speaker came out in 2018... that wasn´t lossless?. The Homepod have been converting it to AAC 256 this whole time?.
Airplay 1 support up to 16/44. Is lossless because the audio gets transmited in an ALAC container.
Airplay 2 support up tp 24/48 in a LPCM container. If you sent a 16/44 stream over Airplay 2, it will be encapsulated in ALAC. If you sent a 24 bit stream, it will be encapsulated in LPCM because ALAC over Airplay only support 16 bits.
What do you think about this, @Marco Klobas?. Great post, by the way!.
@B/D Let's forget for a moment the lossless icon shown (apparently a mistake) in Music app when a HomePod is used.
I guess that the AAC conversion is happening only when Apple Music is streaming. I mean, the subscription. Local files are streamed to HomePod with ALAC, in my opinion, as are other sources.
AFAIK AirPlay 2 uses two modes: Real Time and Buffered. The former uses ALAC, the latter AAC. Apple Music streaming uses the Buffered mode, thus AAC.
Ironically, if you use another source, say YouTube, and stream its audio via AirPlay 2 you get an ALAC stream. YouTube is of course compressed upstream, so the ALAC received actually doesn't mean that the source is lossless. It's like getting a PNG originating from a JPG. Even though PNG is lossless, its original source already "compromised" it.
Obviously all my talks are a speculation because very little is officially known about AirPlay protocol, let alone what's going on inside a HomePod.
To recap: local files are probably streamed to HomePod in ALAC. Apple Music to AirPlay 2 provides an AAC stream. Why did Apple do this is beyond me. Officially, as you know, Apple announced that an update is coming to "unlock" ALAC for Apple Music, too.
There're evidences by Naim (using AirPlay 2) getting AAC from Apple Music.
If I stream Apple Music to an Apple TV HD (again, via AirPlay 2) the lossless icon is present despite it shouldn't be there (as per Apple's informations which mention only Apple TV 4K). BTW, with Xcode it's possible to debug on screen what an Apple TV is getting. I haven't tried it.
My AirPlay 1 streamer gets ALAC (as confirmed by the manufacturer's representative).
As you can see, something is wrong. I hope Apple will fix/clarify the AirPlay (1 and 2) behavior, eventually.
Thank you very much, @Marco Klobas
So, correct if I´m wrong, but if I understood you correctly, the audio situation on the Homepod as of today goes as follows:
A). You can, indeed, stream local CD quality files in the Homepod in ALAC, FLAC, or AIFF. These files will be played as they are (ie, no sound quality loss), by the Homepods.
B). However if you Airplay a lossless CD quality file from Apple Music to the Homepods, it will be converted down to AAC 256kbps before playback on the Homepods.
If so, seems dumb to me. An ALAC stream is an ALAC stream, and Airplay is lossless in real time mode. Why the Homepod would differentiate between local files and files from Apple Music, allowing lossless in one case but not in the other, and changing airplay modes (real time vs buffered)?.
What are we missing here?. Thanks again.
So, correct if I´m wrong, but if I understood you correctly, the audio situation on the Homepod as of today goes as follows:
A). You can, indeed, stream local CD quality files in the Homepod in ALAC, FLAC, or AIFF. These files will be played as they are (ie, no sound quality loss), by the Homepods.
B). However if you Airplay a lossless CD quality file from Apple Music to the Homepods, it will be converted down to AAC 256kbps before playback on the Homepods.
If so, seems dumb to me. An ALAC stream is an ALAC stream, and Airplay is lossless in real time mode. Why the Homepod would differentiate between local files and files from Apple Music, allowing lossless in one case but not in the other, and changing airplay modes (real time vs buffered)?.
What are we missing here?. Thanks again.
@B/D
A) Correct (with the AirPlay intrinsic limit of 44.1 kHz for audio).
B) Local files (those present in your Music Library and stored locally) are streamed ALAC. Those coming from iCloud (Apple Music catalogue) are streamed AAC.
It's definitely dumb. This is the reason why many AirPlay users (e.g. Naim users) are disappointed to see coming an AAC stream from lossless Apple Music. As you said, if everything were working as expected, Apple shouldn't have announced a lossless update for HomePod.
Most of us, me included, took for granted that lossless Apple Music would have supported AirPlay as expected: lossless at 44.1 kHz. Unfortunately, that's not the case. At least for AirPlay 2.
It's not the receiver (HomePod or whatever) that messes the AirPlay stream. It's specifically the Apple Music app.
A) Correct (with the AirPlay intrinsic limit of 44.1 kHz for audio).
B) Local files (those present in your Music Library and stored locally) are streamed ALAC. Those coming from iCloud (Apple Music catalogue) are streamed AAC.
It's definitely dumb. This is the reason why many AirPlay users (e.g. Naim users) are disappointed to see coming an AAC stream from lossless Apple Music. As you said, if everything were working as expected, Apple shouldn't have announced a lossless update for HomePod.
Most of us, me included, took for granted that lossless Apple Music would have supported AirPlay as expected: lossless at 44.1 kHz. Unfortunately, that's not the case. At least for AirPlay 2.
It's not the receiver (HomePod or whatever) that messes the AirPlay stream. It's specifically the Apple Music app.
Thanks again, @Marco Klobas
Yes, is a very weird situation. i thought the upcoming software update to the homepods would be required only to enable Siri to request the ALAC version of a song (if available) to the apple servers when you ask her to play something, but that in the meantime, we would be able to stream apple music lossless from our Macs and IOS devices to the Homepods. That´s not possible, unfortunately.
But wait a minute, when the update arrives to the homepods you will be able to play Apple Music lossless directly on the homepods (either by Siri or by remote controlling them from IOS or Mac Os, which is NOT Airplay), but if you use Airplay, it still will be AAC, because the problem, as you said, its in the airplay 2 implementation of the Music app regarding Icloud Music content. Am I right?.
What a mess...
PD: I guess this also means that, currently, I can´t Airplay lossless Apple Music to a Sonos speaker either. The direct stream of Apple Music lossless (ie, using the Sonos app), is currently not possible (a software update is required, just like the homepods), and I was thinking of using Airplay to circumvent this limitation.
Damn.
@B/D
On Apple's support page regarding Apple Music lossless curiously AirPlay is completely absent. Never mentioned.
I suppose that the Apple Music AirPlay handling by Music app will be fixed for all AirPlay devices, HomePod included of course.
iOS 15 beta shows already lossless audio for HomePod. I guess ALAC will be eventually available in both ways, either directly (e.g. invoking Siri) or via AirPlay.
I see no reason why Apple should't leverage its AirPlay technology to provide lossless audio (within the current 44.1 kHz limit). I even hope they will upgrade it to hi-res. I'm not holding my breath, though.
On Apple's support page regarding Apple Music lossless curiously AirPlay is completely absent. Never mentioned.
I suppose that the Apple Music AirPlay handling by Music app will be fixed for all AirPlay devices, HomePod included of course.
iOS 15 beta shows already lossless audio for HomePod. I guess ALAC will be eventually available in both ways, either directly (e.g. invoking Siri) or via AirPlay.
I see no reason why Apple should't leverage its AirPlay technology to provide lossless audio (within the current 44.1 kHz limit). I even hope they will upgrade it to hi-res. I'm not holding my breath, though.
@Marco Klobas
It seems that if you stream lossless music from Tidal and Deezer, Airplay 2 real time is used and thus the playback on the homepods (and other wifi speakers) is indeed lossless, which would delimit the issue with Airplay and Apple Music to the IOS/Mac Os music app, and the way it incorrectly changes the Airplay transmission method depending on whether the content played from it has DRM or not.
What a mess of a release this whole thing has been...
It seems that if you stream lossless music from Tidal and Deezer, Airplay 2 real time is used and thus the playback on the homepods (and other wifi speakers) is indeed lossless, which would delimit the issue with Airplay and Apple Music to the IOS/Mac Os music app, and the way it incorrectly changes the Airplay transmission method depending on whether the content played from it has DRM or not.
What a mess of a release this whole thing has been...
@B/D
I'm quite confident that gradually the AirPlay side will be fixed.
Just the fact that choosing AirPlay from the menu bar or within Music app makes the lossless logo behaving differently, tells that something is still to be ironed out.
A lot of buzz came out just after the lossless launch with many questions, doubts and speculations. This thread is an example.
It's not a coincidence that Apple released that support page a few days after the launch to calm down a little bit the folk.
I was actually surprised to see how this whole lossless topic gained interest, especially among regular users – i.e. not audio enthusiasts or audiophiles – making the confusion even more evident.
I'm quite confident that gradually the AirPlay side will be fixed.
Just the fact that choosing AirPlay from the menu bar or within Music app makes the lossless logo behaving differently, tells that something is still to be ironed out.
A lot of buzz came out just after the lossless launch with many questions, doubts and speculations. This thread is an example.
It's not a coincidence that Apple released that support page a few days after the launch to calm down a little bit the folk.
I was actually surprised to see how this whole lossless topic gained interest, especially among regular users – i.e. not audio enthusiasts or audiophiles – making the confusion even more evident.
Fair-play Apple, this is actually pretty cool. I turn off dolby atmos on my s10+ samsung options bar.... Go into apple music, play a dolby atmos track and it automatically re-enables the phone dolby atmos option. Must be detecting it properly as a Dolby Atmos stream.
Sounds great too.
Sounds great too.
In case you haven’t heard, the iPhone 8 or later features integrated wireless charging that allows for an easy and intuitive charging.
I wouldn’t consider listening to Apple’s Lossless Audio up to 24-bit/48 kHz on my iPhone using the Lightning to 3.5 mm Headphone Jack Adapter a miserable experience. Fortunately, I have the required gear to listen to Apple’s Hi-Res Lossless Audio on my iPhone 12 Pro.
Since Apple removed the headphone jack (>=iPhone8), and decided to include a lightning to 3.5mm adapter, people started to moan that their iPhone listening experience started to suck.
E.g. they could not simply sit in their bed, and hold the iPhone, charge, listen, browse the web at the same time anymore.
Now a days with "wireless" charging, this experience is still cumbersome, holding the iPhone with a massive wired magnetic puck in your bed + adapter + headphones does not make this experience better.
Removing the headphone jack was one of the worst decisions that Apple ever made, specially without having a adequate widely compatible replacement solution.
And now with lossless audio popping up everywhere, this wrongly made decision is throwing up again.
They were even so stupid to *not* build an extended bluetooth coded solution like Sony's LDAC, simply to make the buyers of their 600$ Airpods Max happy. And no doubt that the Airpods Max were in development for approx 2-4 years, it's not something that couldn't have been achieved during that dev time.
Sorry, but their so highly praised "ecosystem" just failed hard here, again.
Nobody wants weird cascaded audio solutions for a mobile listening experience, and run around like a moron.
Sadly most people wont understand how the system works. You will need a DAC to decode all music higher than CD quality on anything. And forget about getting 192/24 on your phone, home pod or anything but a system like pictured above. Most people wont even hear the difference because they simply dont have the headphones or speakers to reproduce the sound in any form higher than an AM Radio. I enjoy reading comments that show my thoughts are true.
I agree with a lot of the things you are saying. With ‘Spotify HiFi’ launching soon, I think Apple panicked and announced Apple Lossless Audio before they were ready to.
You are wrong. I have been listening to ‘Hi-Res Audio’ >24-bit/192 kHz on my iPhones for a few years now. All you need is the proper gear.
Thats what im saying. Most people wont know what they need and expect the Beats they got for Christmas three years ago to be good. YOU NEED A PROPER DAC.
You are right. I use Sony’s PHA-1A and PHA-2 Portable High-Res DAC and Headphone Amplifiers, Sony’s Hi-Res XBA-H3 IEMs, and Silver Dragon’s USB to Lightning Cable for Apple iDevices.
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