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Until Apple makes a Mac Tablet it is impossible to say whether iPads sell more than Macs just because of iOS, because it's a touchscreen tablet, or simply because they are a lot less expensive.
Well, we can say iPad outsells Mac by a wide margin. We can also say that Windows outsells Mad by a VERY wide margin. We can ALSO say that the majority of people purchasing “computing devices” prefer iPad and Windows over Mac.

We can’t KNOW why, BUT we can speculate that cheaper devices sell better. That’s not too much of a stretch.
 
Impossible to draw your conclusion until Apple makes a tablet Mac in addition to the iPad Pro.
Impossible to make a tablet Mac. It’s either a tablet or a Mac.

Desktops, laptops, tablets and phones all have different design trade offs. A laptop is meant to balance portability with performance. A tablet is meant to prioritize portability. A tablet is limited in dimension and weight, so screen and battery and everything else are designed and scaled to purpose. Those decisions lead to different optimizations in the OS.

You’re asking to put a laptop OS on a tablet device— it doesn’t matter that they run on the same SoC, the system and customer expectations are different and most people won’t be happy with the results of that Frankenstein’s monster.

Like it or not, there is a massive audience of people who don’t want to deal with managing overlapping windows, clicking menus, managing flie locations, and dealing with spinning beach balls.

Just to underline that point:

1624752506106.png
 
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The main thing most people wanted is pro apps. That is not the type of thing Apple would just sneak in to a beta. They would have announced it at WWDC.
“Pro” apps don’t have to come from Apple and neither Apple nor third parties have to announce at WWDC. Now that increased memory usage will be possible when iPadOS 15 is available in the Fall, it will be interesting to see what app announcements will happen around that time.
 
And yet apple sells more units of ipads than macs, so the world seems to disagree.
You mean other iPads, not iPad Pro. That's a huge difference. Do you really think Apple sells iPad Pro more than entry level iPad? Clearly, you are thinking the opposite.
 
You mean other iPads, not iPad Pro. That's a huge difference. Do you really think Apple sells iPad Pro more than entry level iPad? Clearly, you are thinking the opposite.
So now you think apple should sell one line of ipads with ipados and another with macos?

Why not a third with Linux and a fourth with windows?

And a fifth that comes with a side of fries?
 
So now you think apple should sell one line of ipads with ipados and another with macos?

Why not a third with Linux and a fourth with windows?

And a fifth that comes with a side of fries?
People demand better productivity on iPad Pro like macOS and yet Apple doesn't want that. So what's the point? How ironic.
 
People demand better productivity on iPad Pro like macOS and yet Apple doesn't want that. So what's the point?
It’s pretty clear from reading these forums that there isn‘t any consistent set of demands on the Pro. Everyone seems to have a different opinion on what “Pro” means.

As a professional frisbee golfer, I’ve been disappointed in the fact that I can’t throw it further. I’d expect better for $2000.
 
All the people who claimed they returned their iPad Pros when beta 1 didn’t allow more than 5 GB of RAM per app must feel really silly right about now 🙃

you know outside you can't do this thing, return something because you simply didn't like it.
 
It’s pretty clear from reading these forums that there isn‘t any consistent set of demands on the Pro. Everyone seems to have a different opinion on what “Pro” means.
I think the problem is the people here are complaining about iPadOS limitations. They want iPadOS to be similar to desktop OSs like Windows, Linux, BSD, MacOS that have a desktop file manger, file access every where, be able to open file from the file manger, command line, be able to program on any platform of any programming language, format an external hard drive and partition it, unmount an external hard drive with out file corruption, control networks and servers, set up user accounts and file permission, floating window ,better RAM support, more desktop apps support.

They want the iPad to be similar to windows tablets where the OS is more desktop like.

When Apple said you don’t need a PC you can live on the iPad. I think they don't want to buy iPad and Mac.

And say Apple is taking baby steps and not moving fast enough.
 
It’s pretty clear from reading these forums that there isn‘t any consistent set of demands on the Pro. Everyone seems to have a different opinion on what “Pro” means.

As a professional frisbee golfer, I’ve been disappointed in the fact that I can’t throw it further. I’d expect better for $2000.

But everyone *thinks* they know what everyone else demands.
 
I think the problem is the people here are complaining about iPadOS limitations. They want iPadOS to be similar to desktop OSs like Windows, Linux, BSD, MacOS that have a desktop file manger, file access every where, be able to open file from the file manger, command line, be able to program on any platform of any programming language, format an external hard drive and partition it, unmount an external hard drive with out file corruption, control networks and servers, set up user accounts and file permission, floating window ,better RAM support, more desktop apps support.
Some of that already exists and people are apparently slow to learn, but it really sounds like those people want a laptop.

They want the iPad to be similar to windows tablets where the OS is more desktop like.
If so, they are in the slimmest of minorities. I’ll post this again:
1624761372225.png
 
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People who got mad over this need to lay in a darkened room to calm down. There are many powerful machines with a decent CPU and amount of storage that could capably run Apple’s pro apps, but Apple chooses to not port them over to that specific operation system. That operating system is called Microsoft Windows 10.

If people bought a Windows PC with the presumption that Apple (based on zero indication whatsoever) was going to bring its pro apps to the platform, then having a meltdown when it didn’t, I would think that those people are idiots.

I think the whole meltdown over M1/iPad/pro-apps-gate is pathetic/sad/hilarious
That is a bad analogy. People expected much more out of iPadOS since the iPad Pro, MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and Mac Mini all share identical specs under the skin. And what Apple delivered at WWDC was a very minor upgrade. People have a right to be upset that Apple appears to deliberately hold back the hardware and people excuse the heck out of Apple for doing so. I love Apple products, own many across their various ecosystems but it’s also ok to be disappointed with decisions they make from time to time.
 
That is a bad analogy. People expected much more out of iPadOS since the iPad Pro, MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and Mac Mini all share identical specs under the skin. And what Apple delivered at WWDC was a very minor upgrade. People have a right to be upset that Apple appears to deliberately hold back the hardware and people excuse the heck out of Apple for doing so. I love Apple products, own many across their various ecosystems but it’s also ok to be disappointed with decisions they make from time to time.
My interpretation was that since the iPad Pro now shares the same specs as the M1 Macs, this makes it easier to developers to bring their Mac apps to the iPad Pro. That and it's cheaper for Apple to use an existing chip than design a separate A14x chip.

I think it's one thing to be disappointed that the iPad didn't get a certain feature, and to blame Apple for it. Apple never promised users anything, and you can't break a promise you never made. Just admit that they were wrong, and move on.
 
That is a bad analogy. People expected much more out of iPadOS since the iPad Pro, MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and Mac Mini all share identical specs under the skin. And what Apple delivered at WWDC was a very minor upgrade. People have a right to be upset that Apple appears to deliberately hold back the hardware and people excuse the heck out of Apple for doing so. I love Apple products, own many across their various ecosystems but it’s also ok to be disappointed with decisions they make from time to time.
My criticism is very specifically aimed at those who presumed with zero evidence that Apple’s suite of pro apps were going to be ported to iPadOS and then had a meltdown when they weren’t. This was a situation and confected controversy completely stirred up in their heads.

It is not aimed at people who want iPadOS to be better or who identify issues with the OS.
 
That is a bad analogy. People expected much more out of iPadOS since the iPad Pro, MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and Mac Mini all share identical specs under the skin. And what Apple delivered at WWDC was a very minor upgrade. People have a right to be upset that Apple appears to deliberately hold back the hardware and people excuse the heck out of Apple for doing so. I love Apple products, own many across their various ecosystems but it’s also ok to be disappointed with decisions they make from time to time.
They don’t have identical specs, they share a component. Among the specs of the iMac for example, are a 24” screen and a wall plug— the iPP does not have those identical specs.

Aside from having different specs, they have different use models.

Why do people have such a hard time understanding that the processor is not the device?

It’s like all the people who think that moving Mac to Arm somehow means they’re going to adopt the iOS AppStore model— there’s no reason they couldn’t have done that on Intel, but people see one thing more the same and suddenly think everything is identical.
 
They don’t have identical specs, they share a component. Among the specs of the iMac for example, are a 24” screen and a wall plug— the iPP does not have those identical specs.

Aside from having different specs, they have different use models.

Why do people have such a hard time understanding that the processor is not the device?

It’s like all the people who think that moving Mac to Arm somehow means they’re going to adopt the iOS AppStore model— there’s no reason they couldn’t have done that on Intel, but people see one thing more the same and suddenly think everything is identical.

I had a car with a 6502 processor. Are you trying to say it wasn’t an Apple II? Because you’ll never convince me that my car wasn’t an Apple II.
 
I had a car with a 6502 processor. Are you trying to say it wasn’t an Apple II? Because you’ll never convince me that my car wasn’t an Apple II.
They clearly shared identical specs under the skin, so if it couldn’t run Oregon Trail it would appear the automaker was deliberately holding back the hardware and you have a right to be upset.
 
They clearly shared identical specs under the skin, so if it couldn’t run Oregon Trail it would appear the automaker was deliberately holding back the hardware and you have a right to be upset.

Well, I plugged a keyboard into the cigarette lighter and kept typing pr#6 but the car wouldn’t boot to basic, so it must have been deliberate.
 
That is a bad analogy. People expected much more out of iPadOS since the iPad Pro, MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, and Mac Mini all share identical specs under the skin. And what Apple delivered at WWDC was a very minor upgrade. People have a right to be upset that Apple appears to deliberately hold back the hardware and people excuse the heck out of Apple for doing so. I love Apple products, own many across their various ecosystems but it’s also ok to be disappointed with decisions they make from time to time.
I think it boils down to a basic mismatch between knowing something and understanding something , the fact both machines has the same CPU helps a little with optimizations and low level improvement you can share across your SW , but the gap between how MacOS works and iPadsOS are not easy to bridge , the UI for example , is a bigger hurdle to overcome then anything CPU version related.
Its going to take a LOT of work to bring pro level application that will work on a very high level with the iPad constraints , be it a limitation or an advantage of the machines.

Apple will not just port a Pro app that cant use touchscreen in a clean and meaningful way , and just let you run it on a mirrored screen off the iPad , it might want you want to have (i.e an headless desktop iPad) but its clearly not the standard we love from Apple , just porting a desktop app to a touch based iPad to say " we have pro apps on our iPad" is something other companies might do , its OK for you to be disappointed with it of course , but you should make the effort to understand the "Why" as well , might help.
 
Why? Because that’s what other older OS’s do?
Only reason I think it’s needed is because drives that are removed without unmounting get corrupted. There are numerous sources indicating that if a drive is just removed that a repair needs to be run to fix them. If Apple figures out a way to keep them from getting corrupted, then I’m fine with no eject.
 
Only reason I think it’s needed is because drives that are removed without unmounting get corrupted. There are numerous sources indicating that if a drive is just removed that a repair needs to be run to fix them. If Apple figures out a way to keep them from getting corrupted, then I’m fine with no eject.
I’m just lucky that with all the memory cards I’ve used, even loading data from other folks, that I’ve never corrupted their drive. Don’t know how I was able to avoid it!

Figured I’d google it, now I know how I was able to avoid it. :) I’ve never had to deal with files larger than 4 gigs shared with PC’s, so I’ve never been forced to use exFAT. If you NEED exFAT and also NEED to use an iOS/iPadOS device, I don’t think this problem has been resolved. If you’re not using exFAT, you’re likely as ok as I am.
 
I think it boils down to a basic mismatch between knowing something and understanding something , the fact both machines has the same CPU helps a little with optimizations and low level improvement you can share across your SW , but the gap between how MacOS works and iPadsOS are not easy to bridge , the UI for example , is a bigger hurdle to overcome then anything CPU version related.
Its going to take a LOT of work to bring pro level application that will work on a very high level with the iPad constraints , be it a limitation or an advantage of the machines.

Apple will not just port a Pro app that cant use touchscreen in a clean and meaningful way , and just let you run it on a mirrored screen off the iPad , it might want you want to have (i.e an headless desktop iPad) but its clearly not the standard we love from Apple , just porting a desktop app to a touch based iPad to say " we have pro apps on our iPad" is something other companies might do , its OK for you to be disappointed with it of course , but you should make the effort to understand the "Why" as well , might help.
And it isn’t just a UI constraint. iOS, is derived from the same kernel as MacOS with a number of very intentional changes to adapt it to a mobile platform. Those changes aren’t because iOS was running on lower performance processors because MacOS and NextSTEP before it were running on much weaker hardware than the original iPhone. Those changes are because these devices have different customer expectations about how they’re used.

In general, mobile devices are personal devices so they don’t need to be designed to be shared. They have smaller batteries while simultaneously carrying expectations of all day battery life, so everything is designed to focus on power first. Phones for sure, and tablets to an extent are mostly used intermittently and handheld rather than for extensive work sessions on a desktop or lap, so they need to be able to context switch as quickly as possible and wake up, operate, and sleep with minimal latency. Brief handheld interactions also don’t make extensive use of complex multi-window cross application workflows.

Eventually iPadOS was branched from iOS in recognition of the fact that tablets are used differently than phones— and I suspect the branch indicates that the differences between them aren’t solely at the UI level.

These different requirements drive differences in how permissions are handled, how memory is allocated, how multitasking is handled, how interprocess communications are handled, how background tasks are managed, how swap is utilized, etc, etc, etc. Those are all OS responsibilities. Finder, Terminal and Network Utility are not OS components, they are applications exposing OS components to the user.

Part of achieving the customer experience of iPad was Apple taking a more active role in managing developers to ensure they play nice with others. That has meant restricting access to memory to enforce more efficient resource sharing and sharply limiting background processes from consuming battery or performance while other dev’s apps have the foreground. This is why entitlements are used for certain extended features. There are legitimate reasons for Affinity Photo or Procreate or Juno to want more RAM available, but raising the ceiling for everyone just leads to bloat.

While you can certainly run MacOS on a 12.9” display, the user experience as a tablet will be abysmal because MacOS isn’t designed for that purpose.

What makes people’s expectations seem out of touch to me is when they talk about apps like Final Cut Pro. A small screen tablet with limited battery life just isn’t suited for that kind of detailed editing or for extended composite and export sessions.

I think what people are asking for is an Everything Device. That’s not possible, but moreover it’s not a typical professional approach to work. That’s a hobbiest or prosumer mindset— “I want to have pro tools but I can’t afford to invest in my hobby like it’s a career, so I’d like to do as much as I can with the fewest tools.”

A pro wants the best tools for a job. These tools are tax deductible because they contribute to economic output. A MacPro with a Pro XDR display for edit and export. A system with a reference display for color grading. A good laptop for the hotel room or plane. A tablet as an aid in the field. The needs for the application on that tablet is fundamentally different than the needs in the office. They don’t want to lug a MacPro and 3, 32” displays into the field anymore than they want to use a tablet in the office for editing.


What I could eventually imagine, and what might go some way towards mollifying people, is a dual boot system that runs iPadOS when portable and MacOS when docked but share a common file system. I‘d expect it would require fat binaries for dual personality applications, and I’d expect that any applications loaded into the MacOS side from outside the AppStore ecosystem would not or be available under iPadOS.

I don’t expect that anytime soon. I kind of get the feeling that they put M1 in iPad because they realized they could, not so much because they planned it all along. The environment is catching up.
 
Since when is there 16GB of ram in a iPhone
There is no iPhone with that amount of RAM. However, the iPhone 12 Pro and 12 Pro Max do feature 6GB of RAM. Right now all iPhones currently supported have anywhere from 2GB to 4GB outside of the 12 Pro's. Assuming apps can request more RAM on iOS means we might see developers be able to harness the power of the hardware a lot faster.
 
i Just hook my iPad up to my MacBook, drag and drop whatever I need, whether from the MBP or an SSD, and go on about my day! I really don’t understand the need for macOS on an iPad!
 
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