He basically did.
All that aside, he played incredibly well and the heat were the better team.
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Lebronnnn
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He basically did.
All that aside, he played incredibly well and the heat were the better team.
Wouldn't matter. At lebrons age, Jordan didn't have two other superstars on his team and a bench that came out of nowhere to make 3 point shot after 3 point shot. So don't even try.
yawn.
the point being they are in the same conversation talent and skill wise.
so lebron hasn't accomplished as much at 27 as jordan did in his entire career from a team perspective.
lebron at 27... more finals apperances, more career milestones, more championships, more MVPs, more finals MVPs, more all-defense selections, and more 1st team all nba selections (this i'm actually not 100% sure on) than jordan at 27.
but jordan is clearly better than lebron? hmmm, ok.
But 1 for 3? That looks like more wasted chances.
Although he could be 3 for 3 right now and people would still say he could never match up to Jordan.
so he had a few bad games in last year's finals. and should we punish lebron for reaching the finals with the cavs with, like, almost NO help?
the cavs went from contenders to one of the worst teams in the league when lebron left. i think the bulls were still a playoff team without jordan.
lebron is in the same realm as jordan. period. the only real area where jordan has that clear advantage is through TEAM achievements... and through age 27... advantage Lebron.
Lets not forget he is still pretty young for the NBA. I don't know the answers but at what age did Jordan win his first championship? Yes he as won 6 but that is the total for his career. Lebron hasn't finished his career. Just like Kobe, he isn't done so he still might get a few also.
Jordan went a couple times and didn't win didn't he?
Not saying Lebron is the best but his numbers are stacking up and now that this monkey is off is his back I am very interested to see how the rest of his career will play out.
Jordan went a couple times and didn't win didn't he?
Not saying Lebron is the best but his numbers are stacking up and now that this monkey is off is his back I am very interested to see how the rest of his career will play out.
This describes how I feel about the playoffs to a tee. I was disgusted by the atrocious officiating. I didn't even watch the finals because I would get pissed off within 10 minutes and I am not a fan of either team. The Heats bandwagon just got a little bigger -.-
Do you not realize that Lebron also joined the NBA at the age of 18? Jordan didn't need to join the likes of Magic and Bird to win a championship either.
How old are you?
Jordan, Bird, Johnson, Kareem, Chamberlain, Dr. J, etc were easily better, more respected, and more respectful players of the game. I won't argue LeBron's talent. He made some great plays last night, but he is nowhere near the class of those guys. He may get there eventually, but he has a long way to go.
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Not according to LBJ "5...6...7?"
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THANK YOU! I haven't paid attention to the NBA in years because after Jordan left, give or take a few years in the early 2000's, it became this crazy, single-man street ball. Not fundamental team ball like we saw in the 80's and 90's. After watching Miller sink 6 3 pointers last night, I pulled up the old clip of the Bulls/Suns game where Paxson sinks that 3 point game-winning shot. Jordan brings it to half court, passes to Pippen, then to Grant, then to Paxson for the score. There something rounded about the 90's Bulls, even with Jordan as the front-runner, that made watching basketball fun. Now we've got punk kids coming up from high school who are praised as gods thinking they are such.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993–94_NBA_season
After Jordan's first 3 peat, he retired and the Bulls were still a playoff team and won 57 games.
That is true, but that is more of an argument for Jordan. I said this before, Scottie Pippen was not a star. MJ made him that. MJ built that team and made them better.
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You forgot Jordan was a better shooter. And Jordan didn't have the equivalent of Charles Barkley and John Stockton (and Wade is probably better than that) at their prime on his team.
What's funny is, when all his set and done, Lebron will probably get his number retired by the Heat. They'll put his number in the rafters up by Dwyane Wade, making him the third number retired by the Heat. The first of which was Michael Jordan.
Dude, you could make that case for guys like Melo or Kobe, but Lebron has always been a distributor. He had 13 assists last night and he doesn't even run the point. I saw the Heat play great team ball last night - Miller, Chalmers, and Battier knocking down open 3's on account of Lebron attacking, collapsing the defense, and kicking the ball back out. Throughout the series I saw a ton of Wade/Bosh 2 man pick and roll game.
Lebron can play the 1-5, defend the 1-5, makes his teammates better on every team he's been on. Only thing is people still hate him for the Decision.
All the choke talk should've died in the Celtics series when Lebron came out and took over in the 4th. Even in Game 4 of the Finals, he cramped up, made the tie-breaking 3, and still wanted to close out the game but Spoelstra wouldn't let him.
Stephen A is one of the biggest clowns in sports. He just looks smart because he sits next to an even bigger clown (Skip Bayless)
And I think Jordan is better than Lebron but by his 7th year he also had the best coach in NBA history and was running the best system for a team full of mediocre players (the triangle). By his 7th, Lebron and his team of scrubs had video coordinator Mike Brown, who didn't know how to do anything except run high screens for Lebron. Wasted talent, I'm glad he moved to Miami
Sorry, but your argument is completely flawed because you can't possibly make this comparison across eras. There have been so many advances in athletic training, medical technology, etc to do this. If guys like Bird, Erving, Russell were in their primes now and had all of this technology and knowledge to use in their training, they would wipe the floor with Lebron.
Is this your first year watching basketball?
It's a TEAM sport. We're not talking about 1 on 1 street ball. In TEAM sports, CHAMPIONSHIPS are THE ONLY THING that matter.
come back when lebron has 7 rings and then we might be able to have this conversation. individual stats mean nothing if you aren't winning championships.
Team championships are the ONLY thing in this equation.
lebron needs to win at least 2-3 more championships and play at an extremely high level for the next 10 years to even be considered in the same company with Russell, Jordan, Magic, Bird, Erving, Chamberlain, etc.
and even if he does, he'll still be a smug, egotistical douchebag.
No they aren't. You just keep trying to compare them and say they are. They aren't.
Yup. All of that stuff is pretty much subjective (mvp, etc...), and honestly none of it really matters. Not once have I said anything about the number of championships or anything like that. Jordan was just the better basketball player, and probably will always be the best. Closest anybody has come in the modern era is Kobe, and he's still far from Jordan.
it's comical that you think when judging the best INDIVIDUAL players of all-time you guys think TEAM SUCCESS is an important indicator.
It's almost irrelevant. Was Garnett a scrub while he was in Minnesota? Not saying he was an all-time great by any stretch, but did the TWolves even sniff the finals?
From a basketball standpoint alone, Lebron is probably the biggest physical freak we've seen. I'd put Shaq in the conversation too. Lebron is a much better passer, rebounder, and yes, defender than MJ was. MJ was a better shooter.
To say Lebron isn't one of the 10 greatest to ever suit up is silly. He's 27 and is far more accomplished both individually and as a team (not that that really matters when judging individuals) than Jordan was at 27.
Tons of all-time greats took 7,8,9, even 12+ years before they won a title. It's hilarious to fault Lebron for taking 9 years to do it when he has absolutely carried teams his entire career.
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and lol zioxide probably thinks Derek Fisher and Robert Horry are better than Lebron because they have more rings, right?
Trent Dilfer is Peyton Manning's equal, right?
It's almost irrelevant. Was Garnett a scrub while he was in Minnesota? Not saying he was an all-time great by any stretch, but did the TWolves even sniff the finals?
From a basketball standpoint alone, Lebron is probably the biggest physical freak we've seen. I'd put Shaq in the conversation too. Lebron is a much better passer, rebounder, and yes, defender than MJ was. MJ was a better shooter.
To say Lebron isn't one of the 10 greatest to ever suit up is silly. He's 27 and is far more accomplished both individually and as a team (not that that really matters when judging individuals) than Jordan was at 27.
Tons of all-time greats took 7,8,9, even 12+ years before they won a title. It's hilarious to fault Lebron for taking 9 years to do it when he has absolutely carried teams his entire career.
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and lol zioxide probably thinks Derek Fisher and Robert Horry are better than Lebron because they have more rings, right?
Trent Dilfer is Peyton Manning's equal, right?
They better have won the Championship, I'm just surprised it wasn't sooner. The team was built upon the idea to win, so saying that titles doesn't matter and only factor in a "TINY, tiny part of the equation" is just ignorant.
I respect LBJ and Wade, and think that they are both extremely talented players. But they're a long shot from the class and sportsmanship from the players of the old. Every other player on the Heat are mostly douchenozzles (Chalmers in particular) and have made this year/series very unenjoyable to watch. Oh and factor in the bandwagon Heat fans who talk smack day in and day out.
Did you hear on the ref's briefing by the NBA today: "if Heat has the ball in possession make sure you have your whistle in the ready to blow position!"
I respect LBJ and Wade, and think that they are both extremely talented players. But they're a long shot from the class and sportsmanship from the players of the old. Every other player on the Heat are mostly douchenozzles (Chalmers in particular) and have made this year/series very unenjoyable to watch. Oh and factor in the bandwagon Heat fans who talk smack day in and day out.
Did you hear on the ref's briefing by the NBA today: "if Heat has the ball in possession make sure you have your whistle in the ready to blow position!"
I am a Celtics fan and based on your user name it's a good assumption you are too. The Heat only won that series because of horrendous officiating. The first game, 5 technicals is outright ridiculous and that game was close. That is momentum swingers. Then all of the no calls and stupid calls that were called against the Celtics. One thing that really pissed me off was when Lebron had a dunk in the final game of the series against the Celtics and he hung on the rim for like 10 seconds. If any Celtic did that he would've gotten a tech. Seriously, its like the NBA wanted the Heat to win this year. I don't know, I'm just bitter I guess, but all of the things I have said are true. A lot of my friends were talking about Hardens flops last night, I didn't see them because I didn't watch the game but obviously they haven't watched their beloved Heat throughout the playoffs.
If anyone thinks I am wrong, go back and watch the games for yourself. If you don't see it then you're blind. Granted a lot of non calls went in the Celtics favor but none of them were as drastic to the outcome of the game as the ones for the Heat.
Edit: Okay, the Heat didn't win the series strictly because of bad officiating but it surely helped their cause.
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I swear the leagues look at a couple of things;
1. What team (s) would or will sell the most merchandise?
2. What team(s) would benefit the league in ticket sales and merchandise.
3. Would it be better for the league if the premiere players win?
4. TV rating
I watched nearly 40 NHL play off games.
Two teams inparticular stood out in favorable calls, Capitals and Canucks.
I feel the league would benefit from seeing ovechkin or the Sedins hoist the cup more so than Jersey or LA.
Are refs steered one way or the other, of course not
1. What team (s) would or will sell the most merchandise?
2. What team(s) would benefit the league in ticket sales and merchandise.
3. Would it be better for the league if the premiere players win?
4. TV rating
I watched nearly 40 NHL play off games.
Two teams inparticular stood out in favorable calls, Capitals and Canucks.
I feel the league would benefit from seeing ovechkin or the Sedins hoist the cup more so than Jersey or LA.
Are refs steered one way or the other, of course not
The Caps got some really nice calls! This was my first full year watching NHL, so how about I make a sakau style sweeping statement:
Ovechkin is better than Gretzky (now where's that sarcasm tag? :lol
Ovechkin is better than Gretzky (now where's that sarcasm tag? :lol
It's a team sport. TEAM success is all that matters. The greatest players are the ones who play the sport as a TEAM and make everyone else on their team better. If Lebron did this for his entire career, he would have won in Cleveland, and he wouldn't have needed to assemble his superteam and have the refs hand him a championship on a silver platter to finally win something.
It's crazy to even try to make that comparison, because he is only 27. Come back in 10 years. If he wins a few more rings and keeps up his high level of play for that span, then maybe we can talk.
No, but guys like Bill Russell, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Wilt Chamberlain and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar are. Championships trump all. It's why they play the game.
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