LG 5K Display - No "Rotation" option in MacOS display preferences.

Discussion in 'Mac Accessories' started by aerialbyte, Jan 28, 2018.

?

Does MacOS give you the option of "Rotation" on the LG 5k display?

  1. Yes

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. No

    100.0%
  1. aerialbyte, Jan 28, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018

    aerialbyte macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #1
    Is anyone having issues with their LG 5k monitors where in "System Preferences > Displays" there is no option to rotate the display? I have reached out to Apple Support and they say that it is an LG 5k monitor firmware issue. Both MacOS and my LG 5k monitors have been updated to the latest version.

    I have attached a couple of images that shows how my settings look for the monitor and the system report for the video card.

    Edit:
    Added screen capture of one of the LG 5k monitors rotated using SwitchResX. You can see that the display is partially rotated and the black part of the screen is unusable.

    I will also like to point out that at some point, months ago, I was able to rotate one of the two LG 5k monitors and when I looked at the system report, under the Radeon 460, it did say that the monitor supported rotation. It just doesn't say it anymore. I even bought the Apple TB3 cables and to see if it was a cable problem, but I am still having the same issue.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. tonyarnold macrumors newbie

    tonyarnold

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2016
    Location:
    Xcode, Newcastle, Australia
    #2
    I filed a radar with Apple, and engineering told me "This is expected for LG UltraFine 5K display" and when pressed further, "LG 5K hardware does not support rotation per LG."
     
  3. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #3
    Thank you for sharing!

    It is obvious that neither Apple or LG know what is going on.

    I spoke with two Apple senior advisors and they say it is LG’s fault. They say they ran out of procedures to follow when troubleshooting so it had to be an LG monitor firmware problem. I call LG and LG says their monitors are plug and play and that there is no firmware involved. Neither one of them wants to take responsibility.

    I used to be able to rotate one of the two LG 5K displays that I own. Now it doesn’t rotate. It just stopped after I unplugged the TB3 cable and plugged it back in to my second monitor during a troubleshooting session with Apple.

    What’s funny is that when I installed Windows 10 using bootcamp, Windows 10 allowed me to rotate the display without any issues. This is a problem specific to MacOS. I can even rotate the display on a CentOS VM running on top of MacOS High Sierra.

    Not sure what else to do at this point.
     
  4. tonyarnold macrumors newbie

    tonyarnold

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2016
    Location:
    Xcode, Newcastle, Australia
    #4
    Do what I'm doing: wait for Apple's new Cinema Displays to be released, and then sell the damned LG 5K's. They're unreliable and neither Apple, nor LG will accept responsibility for their faults.
     
  5. Brookzy macrumors 601

    Brookzy

    Joined:
    May 30, 2010
    Location:
    UK
    #5
    Rotation is difficult on this display because it's composed of two separate display streams. Even the iMac's built-in display does this, and Apple appears not to be interested in changing that. So I wouldn't be surprised if Apple's upcoming pro display also doesn't support rotation.
    --- Post Merged, Feb 4, 2018 ---
    Are you sure it's still running in true 5K though?
     
  6. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #6
    I uninstalled Windows 10 and to be honest, I didn’t even look. Just made sure I could rotate it. I will install it again and take a look. I noticed that windows 10 on VMware fusion doesn’t allow me to rotate either.

    It still doesn’t explain how initially when I got the monitor, I was able to rotate the image without any problems. There are also others who I have asked on Reddit that day they are able to rotate theirs. It seems to be hit or miss.

    Also at some point the monitor showed “rotation: supported” under the MacOS system report for the 460 card.
     
  7. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #7
    Today I plugged in my LG 34UC88 UW monitor and once I did, it restored the rotation option to one of the two LG 5k monitors. See screenshot for reference:

    If this doesn't scream software bug, I don't know what does.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. jthrilly, Feb 6, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2018

    jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #8
    Were you then actually able to use the rotate function, after seeing this? Can you confirm your firmware version for the displays? Are you able to get the other display to show the ability to rotate using any combination or ports or monitors?

    While working in bootcamp today after installing a bunch of updates (including a new GPU driver) I noticed I was able to rotate the displays without any issues. They were definitely running at the full resolution and at 60hz (I made sure to check). Thinking there had been an improvement, I switched back to macOS only to see that both displays are still unable to be rotated.

    This is an utterly ridiculous state of affairs. Windows running on Apple hardware, with displays that are not even advertised as working with Windows, has functionality that macOS does not. It is all well and good suggesting people sell these, but Apple mislead a lot of us with the idea that they would stand behind these displays - and I for one still think they should.

    The fact this works on Windows shows there is no fundamental hardware or firmware issue. Over to you, Apple. I have filled feedback on this issue today as a result of these poor experiences. I encourage others to do the same so we can get this looked at.
     
  9. aerialbyte, Feb 6, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2018

    aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #9
    Thank you for filing feedback! As much as it sucks that other are having this issue, I am glad I am not the only one. Being the only one crying wolf hasn't got me very far.

    To answer your question, yes, I am able to rotate the monitor and it works just fine (screenshot attached). But it only ever works on one of the two LG 5k monitors when I have my 34UC88 plugged in. The funny thing is that out of the two LG 5k monitors, only the one on the left supported rotation. But now after plugging in the 34UC88, the one on the right is the one that supports rotation.

    And yes, if I unplug the TB3 cable and plug it back in different ports, I will eventually get the other LG 5k to show the rotation feature. I just can't get both to show it simultaneously.

    At some point I switched from 3 monitors back to just the two LG 5k monitors. While using jus the two LG 5k, rotation was gone and never came up. I figured there was some Apple update that removed it once and for all. But then today, it magically came back after adding the third monitor again.

    I agree that it is ridiculous and what upsets me is that Apple is pointing fingers at LG and LG is pointing fingers at Apple. We are the ones getting screwed at the end of the day.

    I am waiting for the Apple Senior Advisor that told me it was an LG firmware issue to call me back.

    Edit:
    When I spoke with the LG support rep, he said the LG Screen Manager software has nothing to do with the monitor rotation and is only used for the partitioning of the screen. Even so, I have both monitors updated to the latest version available.

    Attached second screenshot showing the monitor rotated in display preferences.
     

    Attached Files:

  10. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #10
    Fantastic! I have an LG ultra wide and will test this configuration, too, and report back.

    I've added your images to my RADAR bug report, along with my own picture of it working in windows 10. Hopefully this will stop the blame game.
     
  11. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #11
    Thanks! I didn't know about the RADAR system. I hope that helps.
     
  12. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #12
    Today I connected my own LG Ultrawide display via HDMI. I was able to reproduce the situation described by OP: full rotation capabilities on one Ultrafine 5k display! See my screenshots for proof. This is excellent, because it shows that the hardware and the operating system are 100% capable of this mode. This is definitely a bug. I've updated my RADAR report with the pictures below.

    IMG_4911.jpeg Screen Shot 2018-02-07 at 9.28.59 PM (3).jpg

    I wasn't able to get the other display to work with this setup, which I suspect is because of the limitations of TB3.
     
  13. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #13
    Great! I’m glad you had an UW monitor laying around to try this out. Now let’s hope they admit that it is a bug and they will fix it.

    Would it help if I also created a RADAR report?
     
  14. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #14
    I've indicated in mine that others have this issue, but perhaps if mine gets ignored for whatever reason you could try? You do need to be an Apple developer to access the system, I believe.

    I take it you have already done the conventional feedback process?
     
  15. shareef777 Suspended

    shareef777

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2005
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    #15
    There's almost zero chance Apple will do anything for us when it comes to the LG 5K. Seems that Apple has completely moved focus towards the Apple display they're supposedly working on. The rest of us will have to bear trough this buggy setup and toss it out for the new Apple system when that arrives. You've got the longest thread in the accessories forum dedicated to issues with the LG 5K. I've opened no less then a dozen cases with Apple in regards to my MBP crashing due to the LG 5K and all I get is this: "I expect your issue to persist until something changes." The tech says it's a known bug and that no software fix is available.
     
  16. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #16
    I still have not. I think I will just wait to see what happens with yours. I doubt this will ever get fixed.

    Today I decided to go with four monitors just to try another setup and now I can rotate both of the LG5k displays. It looks like you a need a non LG5k monitor for each LG5k monitor that you want to rotate ,lol. This is so lame and obviously a bug. Screenshots attached.
     

    Attached Files:

  17. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #17
    Ridiculous.

    Just so you know, they closed my radar as a 'duplicate' of another closed issue. I have no way of knowing the content of the closed issue, but if it is the one referred to in the earlier thread (where the Apple engineer claimed this is a design limitation of the monitors), they cannot have reviewed the evidence I provided.

    I am determined to use these screens on my own terms, despite Apple's complete lack of support. I'm putting together a desktop build running Linux using a Thunderbolt 3 add-in card, which is known to work with this display. Needless to say, it will have full rotation support, and will support the software development tools I need for the most part. I'm going to relegate my MacBook Pro to Xcode compilation/signing until I can migrate completely away from this ecosystem. Yes, I feel that strongly about this experience. This is not the Apple way.
     
  18. jowparks macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2018
    #18

    I have never programmed at the operating system level, but is there anyway we can take this into our own hands and modify the System Preferences app to force visibility on the rotation dialogue? Seems like the code associated with the rotation works fine it is just a simple bug. Not sure where to start with this though...
     
  19. aerialbyte thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    #19
    I don't think forcing it will fix the issue. If you use SwitchResX, you get the rotation option inside the SwitchResX application, but when you rotate the screen, only half of the display works. Actually, it is more like a little less than half of the display that works.

    I think that if there is a way to fool MacOS into thinking that there is one or more non LG5K displays connected, it should work. I am just not sure how to make MacOS think that there is an external display plugged in.
     
  20. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #20
    The hackintosh community might actually be your best hope of you want to pursue this approach. One option that comes to mind is modifying the monitor detection in macos to fool the system into identifying the ultrafine 5k as an apple cinema display or iMac display. I've seen this done, and I think it's a matter of a plist edit. I'd ask the hackintosh people and see what they suggest.
     
  21. jowparks macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2018
    #21
    Well I posted on a hackintosh forum we will see whats up. I agree though, I think the best option is spoofing the monitor or trying to emulate another virtual display to make the rotate option show up. Pretty crazy that I have to work this hard to get something to work on a mac, I feel like this would be easier on Ubuntu :p
     
  22. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #22
    I know you're joking, but I have this configuration up and running in linux without any issues. That's what I switched to for my daily work.
     
  23. jowparks macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2018
    #23
    Wish I could. Work runs a lot of applications that are only on MacOS or windows. Running Ubuntu at home..
     
  24. joevt macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2012
    #24
    I have a Dell 5K display with the same issue. There is no rotation option for Nvidia or AMD graphics for this display. The Dell 5K uses dual DisplayPort cables. The LG 5K uses a Thunderbolt 3 cable to transmit two DisplayPort 1.2 signals. So they are very similar. macOS Nvidia drivers only support 5K on the Dell 5K - there is a hack to make the Nvidia work with the LG at 5K.

    The Nvidia seems to allow rotation at 5K on the Dell 5K using SwitchResX with no problem. When rotated, I only see the 5K mode (non-retina) and 2560x1440 HiDPI (retina) modes though.

    Maybe there's a bug with macOS AMD rotation? I tried a rotation of 90° with a MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2015) (AMD Radeon R9 M370X 2048 MB) and got exactly the same situation as #1 which seems to confirm a macOS AMD rotation issue. Apple was probably too lazy to fix it, so they removed the option for every graphics driver. The black rectangle that cuts off the bottom of the rotated display starts exactly at vertical pixel 2880, so that the visible image is 2880x2880. The bottom 2240 pixels which are black are still part of a valid framebuffer (Command-Shift-3 will capture those pixels as what they are supposed to be - the desktop image extending to all four edges plus whatever windows exist on that display, 2880 x 5120). The mouse cursor draws correctly everywhere on the rotated display which means the hardware cursor is unaffected.

    Windows Nvidia driver has no problem with rotation.

    The problem is with Apple's macOS AMD and macOS Nvidia graphics drivers. They are less capable then the corresponding Windows drivers. Apple's drivers also don't support MST for display chaining.

    Whoever at Apple that said it was a firmware issue with the display is a liar.
     
  25. jthrilly macrumors newbie

    jthrilly

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2016
    Location:
    Leicester
    #25
    I just wanted to let any interested members know that this feature is working as of Mohave DP 8. It seems our constant pestering has finally paid off!

    Just goes to show that if something is seriously broken, you shouldn't give up on getting Apple to fix it.
     

Share This Page

29 January 28, 2018