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Live Forever or Go back in Time?
- Thread starter Squilly
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Scepticalscribe
macrumors Haswell
Great idea for a thread, OP. I'm only sorry I didn't think of it myself.
Maybe, I'd refine the first question a little......seriously, as you age, growing 'brittle' isn't the worst thing that can happen to you. Would you keep your mental faculties and personality intact in your original question?
And, wasn't there an ancient tale of a chap who was offered (and accepted) eternal life but forgot to ask for eternal youth along with it?
What we ask for in answer to such a query shows our own strongest needs and preferences. Me, losing my mind would terrify me, so any sort of aging which implies dementia would not make life worth living.
Bored, well, yes and no. Nah, I doubt boredom would be the problem; stress might be, though.....adapting to change for century after century (social, political, cultural, economic, sheer life challenges, now that would be a continuing challenge).
Time travelling movies (and books) tend to reflect the preoccupations of the societies the author lived in rather than those s/he fantasied about.
True. But - perhaps - the point of the future is that you would get to meet new people, and make new connections and form new relationships. Quite a few who have posted here seem to assume that their personal lives would remain in stasis, as it were, even if they themselves were to live eternally.....
Actually, I'm a bit surprised at how many people have written about the fact that 'everyone you know would die'; the people you know at present would, naturally, predecease you, (unless, of course, they have also been granted the same immortality). However, that in no way presupposes that you would not make fresh acquaintances, and/or friendships, and/or perhaps, even loves....even now, this happens when you move abroad to work and live; or change job, or place where you live. Seriously, how many of us keep all of the old relationships we have known through our lives alive and intact? Different relationships have different strengths at different times. To assume that they are unchanging in life seems to me, mistaken, and, if immortal, I'd imagine that one would not forget old close relationships, but would augment them with new ones....
Very good post.
I like this post, too.
Would you stop at Adolf and Jesus? What about the Black Death, the atom bomb, or are the retrospective changes confined to those which have occurred within our own life spans?
Again, great thread OP.
Yes, very good post as well. I'm in full agreement with your first sentence; as a small kid, I was in awe of exploration of our universe and followed it all with absorbed fascination. And still do, I must say.
Well, yes, but I think you might also meet new ones to love. That, surely, is part of the point of 'living forever'; you wouldn't stay static and unchanging; you would change in response to your changing world.
Wow. I'm impressed.
And yes, I haven't answered.....actually, I want to give this (OP's questions) more thought.
1) Yes. In a heartbeat. Assuming that one could choose to end your life at some point, which the I believe the OP has said would the be case. I'd hate to have all those I love around me predecease me, but I figure I'd also be making new connections. The pain would be balanced by the joy of new friendships, new loves, and new experiences. Of course, I'd like to read the fine print on this deal first... 😉
2) Yes. But... If we are talking about single time-line, then I don't think I'd change anything. I like the life I've lived (for the most part) and I have some people around me I love dearly. I'd hate to do anything that messed up their lives. At the most I might make some shrewd investments and sports bets, and live a bit more comfortably.
However, if we are talking about multiple time-lines... and if we are talking about more than one time-line, then we are talking about an infinite number of time possibilities... I'd combine immortality and time travel to have fun - lots and lots of fun - with the historical canvas. Knowing that those who I love are safe in their time-line, and that at some point I'd come back to them about 2 seconds after I left, with some wicked scars and stories. And a weird allergy to the pollen of an ancient Greek flower.
obeygiant
macrumors 601
Actually soon there may be a way to transfer your consciousness to a computer and live virtually after you die.
Scepticalscribe
macrumors Haswell
obeygiant
macrumors 601
I read somewhere a while ago that anyone (in North America at least, I can't speak for elsewhere) dying today before they hit 70 is considered a premature death. I see 80 as the minimum you should be aiming for. My Aunt recently turned 90, and is going strong. Her mother made it to 99 (nearly 100.) Unfortunately my Aunt married into the family, so I don't have her genes.
My Aunt was born in ~1922. Imagine what she has lived through? She grew up in Princeton NJ, and remembers seeing Albert Einstein ride his bicycle on his way to work. She was already 5 years old for the 1st trans-Atlantic flight, and has lived to see the Space Shuttle. Heck... she has lived to see the shuttle get created, fly for 30 years, and be retired. I'll bet half the people on MR weren't alive when the Shuttle 1st flew.
My point is... 100 is barely scratching the surface. Imagine if you merely added 50 years and were 150 today? You'd have lived through the Civil War, Canadian Confederation, the invention of just about everything we rely on in our modern world.
Yep... I'd want lots more than 100, if I could. Good health assumed, and not-with-standing a close inspection of the fine print. 🙂
Mac'nCheese
Suspended
Yeah, the one with the J.T. and he time is money, literally. Interesting idea but it just turned into a routine, b-grade action/chase movie.
Well, the op made the rules that we can only go back to our birth so all of that is out now. Sticking by his rules, I would go back and be pretty selfish I guess. Make some good money decisions, spend some more time with my dad who died early and stop 9/11. If we could go back anywhere, I guess if I had time to do the research, yeah, I could stop more then stuff that just screws up our lives now. Stopping the crusades would save how many innocent people? I'd like to get some footage of how things really happened and try to end these crazy religions we still have going. See, Jesus was just a dude! I followed him 24/7... no miracles. Or maybe I'd find him turning water into wine and boy would my face be red! I like the Hitler killing thing. Probably solve a lot of problems we have now. Not sure what else. Go back two weeks and win that powerball would be nice. Kill Hitler. Win powerball. Kill Hitler. Win Powerball. Hmmmmm, can I go back twice or just once?
Huntn
macrumors Penryn
No. I'd only consider it if I could keep a young fit container. Even then the routine might become boring after 500 years or so...
Only if I could see the outcome before committing. 😉
Ariii
macrumors 6502a
1.) If it's like TorchWood where nobody can die and they're just like staying incredibly sick and half-dead forever, then no 😱. (Also, since people's perception of time changes as they age, reality would go fast enough that days would seem to pass in minutes) Otherwise, that would be worth it until all life is wiped off of the face of the Earth, which will eventually happen, of course.
2.) Yes 🙂. I could prevent 1/2 of the major disasters that are out there today.
2.) Yes 🙂. I could prevent 1/2 of the major disasters that are out there today.
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Remember, once you go back, you can't go "back to the future" again. You're living in that present time fixing it, changing the world at the same time and eventually making your way back to present day (2012).
Plutonius
macrumors G4
Nope and Nope. All the positive and negative things in my life made me who I am today so I would not change anything.
mobilehaathi
macrumors G3
As much as I don't want to die, I feel that choosing to live forever would be an incredibly short-sighted decision.
As for the second, travelling back in time to change the present? Sounds great in theory, but it would be intractably difficult to figure out what changes would truly occur.
As for the second, travelling back in time to change the present? Sounds great in theory, but it would be intractably difficult to figure out what changes would truly occur.
Scepticalscribe
macrumors Haswell
Scepticalscribe
macrumors Haswell
Great post. This is the sort of stuff that I love.
Einstein on a bicycle - wonderful.
My grandparents were all born in the 1870s and 1880s (each of my parents were the youngest in their respective families) and I have long marvelled at what they lived through. An uncle of mine died recently at the age of 92, having full and total recall of everything.......awesome. I had visited him on his 92nd birthday and we had a long talk....
Kill Hitler, yes, no problem. However, given these parameters. I'd add to that, kill Stalin (one of history's monsters, too), and add to that, kill Mao, Pol Pot and a couple of others, too....indeed, it reminds me of the premise in that classic, wonderful Star Trek (original) episode, 'City on the Edge of Forever'....(not that I have a problem with that)......
63dot
macrumors 603
If I could live forever, I would eventually be able to be around when time travel would be common place. And given enough time, I could figure out how to travel in time myself.
Let's say I lived for 200 years and born here around 1810. I would have seen the British attack Washington and burn down the White House, the Civil War, industrialization on a mass scale, human flight, the rise of the auto industry in Detroit, World War II and the atomic bomb, the computer age bringing forth the Macintosh, and everything since then. If I were to live 100 more years, maybe I could see lasting peace in the Middle East, world population stabilization, and public space travel.
ravenvii
macrumors 604
Live forever? Not sure about that one. On one hand, the whole everyone-you-know-dying thing isn't great, but the idea that you'll... cease to exist is disturbing. Maybe I'll do the die-then-wake-up-from-time-to-time like the empress chick in The Worthing Saga (Scott Orson Card).
Go back in time? Only in a "virtual" timeline -- go back in time, mess around without any worry, then go back to the "real" world. That'd be a blast.
Go back in time? Only in a "virtual" timeline -- go back in time, mess around without any worry, then go back to the "real" world. That'd be a blast.
You are a lucky person. Unfortunately, I think you have come the closest to living forever, even though it was just a number of decades longer than most.
That's the last thing I'd be doing. Fate has a way of playing jokes, and our decisions are full of unintended consequences. What if those people ended up being the (relative) sane ones who kept the totally insane people out power? For example, Hitler was terrible at military strategy. Didn't really start losing the war until he had removed most of the German Army commanders who knew what they were doing. What if you killed Hitler, and the fellow who stepped into his shoes was just as big a monster and knew a thing or two about military strategy. And you can't say you'd kill Hitler as a child because I believe, personal opinion, that people like Hitler simply step into a role that a confluence of events have made possible. If not Hitler in that role, then somebody else.
Me... if I could go back in time... I'd want to go back further than birth, and I want to learn and meet people. I'd roam the world, as a traveller. Imagine going back far enough.... you'd know that there were more continents than anyone else. You'd know that there are people there who have left no written records - how cool would it be to head over there before they had met anyone else?
0007776
Suspended
I think it would depend a lot on if you were the only one living forever, or if everyone does. If you're the only one then you would have to watch everyone that you ever cared about die, which would be quite depressing so I can see why people wouldn't want to. If on the other hand everyone that you care about was also living forever then I think it would be pretty awesome.
iJohnHenry
macrumors P6
1. Yes. Wo wouldn't want to live forever?
2. Yes, as long as I can do what I'm doing now. I'd like to go back and pay attention in school, which I regret doing.
2. Yes, as long as I can do what I'm doing now. I'd like to go back and pay attention in school, which I regret doing.
63dot
macrumors 603
That could be a great plot for a movie. Also what if Japan, Germany, and Italy won World War II? What would the world be like in the 1950s?, '70s, '90s, now? Would we go through rock and roll, the hippies, and the dot.bomb phenomenon? Would we live in a more conservative, more liberal, or pretty much the same society we have now?
My take is that any one person cannot make that big of a difference because of the bigger pull of events and many other people.
Somebody would have come into power in Germany had there been no Hitler and a county felt wronged by reparations may have very well invaded other counties. Japan, in search of resources, would have expanded their empire with or without a Germany to have their back. Italy would have been prime for a dictator at that time even had Mussolini never had been born. Following events, regardless of winner, would have come along give or take a few years. The restless youth of America's 1950s were so ready to listen to music other than what their parents liked. Rock and roll would have pushed through and achieved extraordinary success. Society was ready to change and the late-60s and '70s were a great time for the hippies to spread their wings. And as for technology, the promise of great wealth and control would have lured San Jose just the same to be a high tech giant.
Short of thermonuclear war or getting hit by a big object from space, history on the large scale would play out pretty much the same with individual events and people perhaps being different. The very nature of humans and their propensity for greed and war have caused, and will cause untold suffering and damage to this planet.