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Longplays

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May 30, 2023
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I have an M2 Ultra Studio with 128Gb and 2Tb SSD arriving this week. But I’m going from a late 2019 16” MBP to the Studio so the performance bump should be insane.
I wish I never bought my 2019 MBP 16" 14nm and just stuck with my 2011 MBP 13" 32nm until the 2021 MBP 16" 5nm came out.

I knew about the performance per watt gap of the iPhone vs same year Intel MBP as early as 2017.

Conventional thinking wouldn't allow me to think out of the box that Apple would leverage their iPhone chip fab capacity to jump from 14nm Intel to 5nm Mac chips resulting in higher raw performance, higher performance per watt, lower power consumption and longer battery life.
 
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Homy

macrumors 68020
Jan 14, 2006
2,119
1,974
Sweden
Keep dreaming . https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html

In terms of power consumption yes, but it is just thanks to TSMC more than apple.

Well, M2 Ultra isn't on that list and that's just single thread. The closest is M2 Pro/Max with only 10-12 CPU cores as nr 28-29 on that Passmark list against the top CPU with 24 cores. We'll see how well M2 Ultra with 24 cores will do.

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ikramerica

macrumors 68000
Apr 10, 2009
1,555
1,849
Intel chips have come a far way since the old intel Mac Pro and the 13900k is faster than the m2 ultra . So is ryzen 7950x. Also, the x86 workstation class chips like sapphire rapids and Genoa blow the m2 ultra away in terms of multithreading. Of course apple leads in terms of performance per watt.

I think the m2 ultra is fine in the Mac Studio but the Mac Pro, with all the extra room, is underpowered. And it’s still using pcie4 with pcie switches and lane sharing, whereas sapphire rapids and Genoa use pcie 5 and have a ton of lanes available. Much more flexible and can access more RAM.

Faster x86 chips are coming: arrow lake, zen 5, granite rapids Xeons.

Unless apple creates a workstation class chip I think apple will lead in notebook perf per watt, but when it comes to workstation and desktop, x86 will pull ahead.

But regardless of all that, competition is great for consumers. And I am glad to see apple start to embrace gaming on the Macintosh. Maybe apple has some wild ambitions in terms of GPU performance and is now laying the groundwork to introduce high performance gaming hardware…
It’s 2x faster than it’s very outdated predecessor!

Ignore the competition and their modern workstations with upgradable RAM and graphics. All that matters is that it’s unimpressively faster than the much older machine it replaces.
 

crut

macrumors regular
Dec 26, 2009
146
43
I wish I never bought my 2019 MBP 16" 14nm and just stuck with my 2011 MBP 13" 32nm until the 2021 MBP 16" 5nm came out.

I knew about the performance per watt gap of the iPhone vs same year Intel MBP as early as 2017.

Conventional thinking wouldn't allow me to think out of the box that Apple would leverage their iPhone chip fab capacity to jump from 14nm Intel to 5nm Mac chips resulting in higher raw performance, higher performance per watt, lower power consumption and longer battery life.
I really like my 16” but the projects are taxing it enough that it constantly sounds like an aircraft taking off
 
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DestructoTim

macrumors member
Aug 30, 2021
72
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Intel chips have come a far way since the old intel Mac Pro and the 13900k is faster than the m2 ultra . So is ryzen 7950x. Also, the x86 workstation class chips like sapphire rapids and Genoa blow the m2 ultra away in terms of multithreading. Of course apple leads in terms of performance per watt.

I think the m2 ultra is fine in the Mac Studio but the Mac Pro, with all the extra room, is underpowered. And it’s still using pcie4 with pcie switches and lane sharing, whereas sapphire rapids and Genoa use pcie 5 and have a ton of lanes available. Much more flexible and can access more RAM.

Faster x86 chips are coming: arrow lake, zen 5, granite rapids Xeons.

Unless apple creates a workstation class chip I think apple will lead in notebook perf per watt, but when it comes to workstation and desktop, x86 will pull ahead.

But regardless of all that, competition is great for consumers. And I am glad to see apple start to embrace gaming on the Macintosh. Maybe apple has some wild ambitions in terms of GPU performance and is now laying the groundwork to introduce high performance gaming hardware…
Hmmm. I just checked Geekbench for the two processors you listed, and that doesn’t seem to be the case. They all have similar scores, though AMDs is slightly lower than Apple’s and Intel’s. So basically you can get the same performance on any brand you want, but Apple leads in performance per watt.
 

Zest28

macrumors 68020
Jul 11, 2022
2,191
3,034
Hmmm. I just checked Geekbench for the two processors you listed, and that doesn’t seem to be the case. They all have similar scores, though AMDs is slightly lower than Apple’s and Intel’s. So basically you can get the same performance on any brand you want, but Apple leads in performance per watt.

The $700 Intel i9 is faster in single score but slightly slower in multi score. And once you add a RTX 4090 to it, it will beat the M2 Ultra at a fraction of the cost.
 

ChrisA

macrumors G5
Jan 5, 2006
12,595
1,726
Redondo Beach, California
20% is not enough of a reason for me (as a casual user) to upgrade my M1 Mac Studio Ultra to an M2 Mac Studio Ultra but I can see why businesses may well consider if if they can complete tasks 20% faster. Time is money and it won't take long to recuperate the cost of upgrading.
No one ever upgrades one generation. You keep the computer 3 to 5 years then buy whatever is available at that time. Perhaps you g from an M1 to an M3 or M4.

It is the same with cell phones, very few people buy a new phone every year.

As for businesses, there is a 3-year period for capital depreciation. You can't write it off in only one year.

Apple does not bring out these new products every year hoping people will trade in one year old computers, there are plenty of people with Macs from 2019 and even older and also new customers

Finally, even if the new Mac is 20% faster, the job you are doing will not be done 20% faster. For example, the above text I just typed would take just as long if I used a new Mac Studio or my old 2014 Mac Mini.

Mostly what our Macs do is wait for the user to move the mouse or type the next character. Look at "activity meter", mostly you see the CPU is sleeping, even if you have 15 browser windows open.

A faster CPU only helps when you do some compute-intensive task where yu have to wait and can do nothing productive while waiting. Mostly this happens if you do media editing but sometimes also some kinds of engineering tasks. But even when I use 3D CAD, I only have to wait for the computer now and then, maybe for a render to complete. Mostly the computer is waiting for me to do something.
 
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Return Zero

macrumors 65816
Oct 2, 2013
1,307
3,735
Kentucky
I know people are tired of talking about M3, but can you imagine if they really are working on stitching two ultras together for an M3 ludicrous or whatever it would be called… you’d get the 30-40% expected bump from M2 to M3, then another double factor in multi-core. That Geekbench could hit 60k. Graphics would also rival any of the top cards in the industry. That would be absolutely insane, and would instantly change the entire conversation about the new Apple Silicon Mac Pro.
 

Zest28

macrumors 68020
Jul 11, 2022
2,191
3,034
All the whining in this thread means Apple is doing great.

MacRumors is simply cherrypicking Intel CPU's, because if you pick Intel their latest Core i9 CPU's, it beats the M2 Ultra in Single-Core while offering the same Multi-Core performance.

And the Intel Core i9-13900KS costs less than $700, so you can build such a system for very cheap.
 

dmr727

macrumors G4
Dec 29, 2007
10,428
5,176
NYC
M2 Ultra is perfect for the form factor of the Studio. It can't compete with the 13900KS, but that thing is just Intel jacking up the power consumption to retake the performance crown over AMD. At full load it's stupid hungry. I don't think Apple is ever going to care about competing in that space.
 
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