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mcled53

macrumors regular
Jun 15, 2022
170
167
West of the Cascades
I believe there’s another article here talking about how it actually cools well. Everything has compromises so yes, I’m sure Apple compromised some cooling for the form factor. If they didn’t compromise, it would look like a Mac Pro.

I suspect this isn’t meant to replace the Mac Studio so if you’re doing some heavy duty work, you might want to wait for the M4 version of that.
Noting that there is a MBP M4 Max but there is no Mac mini M4 Max. Probably gonna be in Studio.
 

rukind2

macrumors regular
Jul 8, 2012
224
131
PNW
I am quite confident it is going to be silent. That is something Apple cares a lot about, and it is a considerable part of their value proposition to many users. I very much doubt they would go forward with this chassis redesign if it resulted in loud operation.
Confidence is not fact, but I’m with you. ;)
 

tothemoonsands

macrumors 6502a
Jun 14, 2018
585
1,277
I am quite confident it is going to be silent. That is something Apple cares a lot about, and it is a considerable part of their value proposition to many users. I very much doubt they would go forward with this chassis redesign if it resulted in loud operation.

The concern about thermal throttling / heat just because the new Mini is smaller than before is completely unwarranted in my opinion. MacBook Pros are incredibly thin, comparatively the Mini is significantly taller. Heat dissipation is going to be comparable or better than the MacBook Pro. No way it is worse / louder. I’m speculating of course, but I share your confidence.
 

Otispit

macrumors newbie
Aug 19, 2020
1
5
This conversation is amusing....some of us remember when Apple was vilified for putting a 3.5 floppy in the original Macintosh......THE END OF THE WORLD!!!! Somebody always needs to lead the trends, and so many times for 45 years it just happens to be Apple. The arguments used to focus on sheer performance, but now that that is answered empirically, I guess we need to find something.....ANYTHING to bellyache about!
 

leman

macrumors Core
Oct 14, 2008
19,503
19,635
The concern about thermal throttling / heat just because the new Mini is smaller than before is completely unwarranted in my opinion. MacBook Pros are incredibly thin, comparatively the Mini is significantly taller. Heat dissipation is going to be comparable or better than the MacBook Pro. No way it is worse / louder. I’m speculating of course, but I share your confidence.

You are right, and the redesigned Mini is also taller than the old one. That should actually improve thermal performance since you have more space for heatsink and airflow.
 

hagjohn

macrumors 68000
Aug 27, 2006
1,862
3,685
Pennsylvania
I believe there’s another article here talking about how it actually cools well. Everything has compromises so yes, I’m sure Apple compromised some cooling for the form factor. If they didn’t compromise, it would look like a Mac Pro.

I suspect this isn’t meant to replace the Mac Studio so if you’re doing some heavy duty work, you might want to wait for the M4 version of that.
It is an article about a picture Apple put up on their website. There is no data, in the article, about how it works.
 
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MajorFubar

macrumors 68020
Oct 27, 2021
2,172
3,798
Lancashire UK
Hi,


I've been waiting for the "right" next Apple desktop to come along, still using my 2018 i7 Mac Mini.

Now with M4 Pro we get 10 performance cores + 64gb RAM, that's great stuff.

However, it seems yet again Apple is overdoing the segmentation of their products. The Mac Mini is a great option for those of us, that only need a powerful CPU (vs. GPU) for stuff like Logic Pro etc.

Why is the new Mac Mini so ridiculously small? Unless Apple has pulled off some engineering marvel, there's simply no way to effectively offload the necessary heat from the M4 Pro chip during sustained high CPU loads. There is a heat pipe there, but that's pretty much it.

This will most likely end up being a very hot computer easily reaching 100+ Celsius, thus throttling the CPU, with a noisy fan ramping up and down.

I get some people want a glorified iPad in a box for Office and Internet surfing, but again Apple gets too aggressive with their design (eg. previous MacBook Pro gen). They could easily have made the new Mac Mini 30-40% larger, and it would still be small and portable, but with more beefy cooling for a silent experience, and non-throttling CPU.

I'd definitely wait for the reviews on this one, for anything beyond Office work and web browsing...
Not being funny but your existing i7 Mac Mini is neanderthal compared to what this thing can do.
You're absolutely viewing it from the perspective of someone who seems to have only used Intel Macs.
This thing so exponentially more powerful than what you're used to, that even if its 'compromised size' throttled it down to half speed, it would still comfortably burn-off the antique you're using.

And trust me i'm not an Apple apologist. Try reading some of my other posts.
 

Jamie0003

macrumors 65816
Apr 17, 2009
1,321
1,184
Norfolk, UK
See, this is the kind of Apple apologetics I don't get, with all respect obviously. So, if Apple had made the Mac Mini slightly larger, instead of overdoing the size reduction for the "wow-factor" during their presentation, you might as well get the Mac Pro? Seriously...

This is (most likely) Apple creating a problem that didn't need to exist. Just like with the previous MacBook Pro machines, which were so thin they become overly hot and uncomfortable to use, including the awful butterfly keyboard.

Don't get me wrong, I want it to succeed, as the Pro chip makes more sense for my audio/music work. Maybe Apple did some engineering "magic" on the new Mac Mini, but that seems unlikely given the limitations of heat transfer mechanics.
The mini is meant to be an entry level machine. If you need more power, that’s what the studio is for, which already has that bigger form factor
 

DCIFRTHS

macrumors 65816
Jan 25, 2008
1,298
652
Two questions regarding desktop Mac computers and the power button.

If the mini, or studio, is powered down using the physical power button, will the computer power up if the keyboard or mouse is used?

Same question, but powering down using the OS instead of the physical power button. Assuming it is the same, but not sure…

Obviously I’ve been using laptops exclusively since my mini with a CD drive hence my ignorance regarding this simple subject :oops:
 

hagjohn

macrumors 68000
Aug 27, 2006
1,862
3,685
Pennsylvania
This.

The M1 Mini's logic board was only 5.2 inches at its widest. With the redesign, they just put that into an enclosure that doesn't have all the empty space.

View attachment 2444438
You need space for the fan to work properly. I'm betting this new Mini will run hotter than M1 and M2.

I haven't noticed anything about power usage of the new Mini compared to previous models.
 
Last edited:
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cjsuk

macrumors 6502a
Apr 30, 2024
593
2,206
I can see people know very little about electronic and thermal design here.

Heat generated is wasted energy. We have a process shrink here and it probably has a somewhat higher efficiency power supply than previous units as well. End game is less watts getting turned to heat for the same workload. That means less thermal bulk required and less surface area required even if you have active cooling.

Also look at the old Intel Mac minis. I used mine to keep my coffee warm. The M1 didn’t even get warm after an hour of transcoding.
 

theluggage

macrumors G3
Jul 29, 2011
8,000
8,433
The mini is meant to be an entry level machine.
$1400 for the M4 Pro Mini (with BTO options that easily take it over the $2000 mark, even without resorting to the super-expensive 4G/8G SSD options) is not what I'd call "entry level" for a headless desktop sans display/keyboard/mouse.

I'm sure the base M4 will be fine - it's a chip designed for fanless laptops and tablets - and seems to be all-round better than the old $600 Mini. The question is over the M4 Pro model - we'll have to see about the cooling, but it's also lost a physical TB port c.f. the M2 Pro Mini (and more bandwidth on the 3 existing ports isn't going to pay off for most people without a TB5 hub or a super-expesive DP 2.1 display).

...and, so far, the Studio still has a 2-generations-out-of-date processor (not even a M3 Max, which was a big step forward from the M2 Max, with more cores, hardware ray tracing etc.) so its not a particularly compelling buy. Unless Apple are going to surprise us today or tomorrow (which would go against all the rumours).
 
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MajorFubar

macrumors 68020
Oct 27, 2021
2,172
3,798
Lancashire UK
Two questions regarding desktop Mac computers and the power button.

If the mini, or studio, is powered down using the physical power button, will the computer power up if the keyboard or mouse is used?
Nope. Also, annoyingly, for all Mac desktop computers, you can't program the BIOS to just switch the computer on when it receives power. I wanted to hide my Studio visibly out of the way in a place that also unavoidably would be difficult to physically reach, but because I choose to be one of those 'werdos' who powers their computer down every day (because why waste power), I would then have to go crawling around to physically switch it on. On most PC motherboards, you can program the BIOS to switch the computer on when the motherboard receives power, so all I would need to do is incorporate a reachable physical switch that turns the mains on and off. But no. Apple deems I cannot do that.
 

hagjohn

macrumors 68000
Aug 27, 2006
1,862
3,685
Pennsylvania
Nope. Also, annoyingly, for all Mac desktop computers, you can't program the BIOS to just switch the computer on when it receives power. I wanted to hide my Studio visibly out of the way in a place that also unavoidably would be difficult to physically reach, but because I choose to be one of those 'werdos' who powers their computer down every day (because why waste power), I would then have to go crawling around to physically switch it on. On most PC motherboards, you can program the BIOS to switch the computer on when the motherboard receives power, so all I would need to do is incorporate a reachable physical switch that turns the mains on and off. But no. Apple deems I cannot do that.
PCs have been able to do that forever. Would be nice addition to Macs.
 
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Jamie0003

macrumors 65816
Apr 17, 2009
1,321
1,184
Norfolk, UK
$1400 for the M4 Pro Mini (with BTO options that easily take it over the $2000 mark, even without resorting to the super-expensive 4G/8G SSD options) is not what I'd call "entry level" for a headless desktop sans display/keyboard/mouse.

I'm sure the base M4 will be fine - it's a chip designed for fanless laptops and tablets - and seems to be all-round better than the old $600 Mini. The question is over the M4 Pro model - we'll have to see about the cooling, but it's also lost a physical TB port c.f. the M2 Pro Mini (and more bandwidth on the 3 existing ports isn't going to pay off for most people without a TB5 hub or a super-expesive DP 2.1 display).

...and, so far, the Studio still has a 2-generations-out-of-date processor (not even a M3 Max, which was a big step forward from the M2 Max, with more cores, hardware ray tracing etc.) so its not a particularly compelling buy. Unless Apple are going to surprise us today or tomorrow (which would go against all the rumours).
The studio will get updated at some point, it exists for a reason
 

TracerAnalog

macrumors 6502a
Nov 7, 2012
789
1,456
Hi,


I've been waiting for the "right" next Apple desktop to come along, still using my 2018 i7 Mac Mini.

Now with M4 Pro we get 10 performance cores + 64gb RAM, that's great stuff.

However, it seems yet again Apple is overdoing the segmentation of their products. The Mac Mini is a great option for those of us, that only need a powerful CPU (vs. GPU) for stuff like Logic Pro etc.

Why is the new Mac Mini so ridiculously small? Unless Apple has pulled off some engineering marvel, there's simply no way to effectively offload the necessary heat from the M4 Pro chip during sustained high CPU loads. There is a heat pipe there, but that's pretty much it.

This will most likely end up being a very hot computer easily reaching 100+ Celsius, thus throttling the CPU, with a noisy fan ramping up and down.

I get some people want a glorified iPad in a box for Office and Internet surfing, but again Apple gets too aggressive with their design (eg. previous MacBook Pro gen). They could easily have made the new Mac Mini 30-40% larger, and it would still be small and portable, but with more beefy cooling for a silent experience, and non-throttling CPU.

I'd definitely wait for the reviews on this one, for anything beyond Office work and web browsing...
Again with all the assumptions... wait for the reviews!
 

G5isAlive

Contributor
Aug 28, 2003
2,844
4,886
I am quite confident it is going to be silent. That is something Apple cares a lot about, and it is a considerable part of their value proposition to many users. I very much doubt they would go forward with this chassis redesign if it resulted in loud operation.

regardless of reality, silent or not, there will be a loud contingent that swears its noisy. truth. go back and look at the Mac Studio forums.. people swearing it was loud, offended their ears, etc etc. and if you said yours was quiet, you were told your ears where not sensitive enough, or that your room was already loud, or apparently you were not standing behind it because thats where its loudest if you press your ear to the back.
 

Cape Dave

macrumors 68020
Nov 16, 2012
2,388
1,694
Northeast
You need space for the fan to work properly. I'm betting this new Mini will run hotter than M1 and M2.

I haven't noticed anything about power usage of the new Mini compared to previous models.
I disagree. Apple nailed the M3 Air cooling. So they probably nailed the mini also. I think it will run silent and cool and fast. But I wait for YouTube to prove me right :)
 

theluggage

macrumors G3
Jul 29, 2011
8,000
8,433
The studio will get updated at some point, it exists for a reason
...but if anybody wants to buy a powerful desktop Mac for serious content creation today or, likely, during the next 6 months - and isn't in the small niche that needs a Studio Ultra (or the even smaller niche who absolutely need the PCIe in the Mac Pro), the only choice is a M4 Pro Mac Mini or outdated M2 Max Studio.

Whether or not it is faster overall, the M4 Pro beats the M2 Max on bangs-per-buck, and will blow it out of the water for hardware ray tracing, and maybe AI stuff.

Likewise, the M4 Max may not reliably beat the M3 Ultra on all tasks, but it would give it a serious run for its money and likely beat it on tasks that didn't utilise all of the extra cores on the Ultra.

The only reason I can see for not releasing a M4 Max Studio now is that it might spoil the market for the M4 Ultra Studio if/when that arrives - but on past performance that's going to cost twice as much as the Max version, so would they really be in competition?
 
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2fx1989

macrumors newbie
Jul 21, 2016
25
25
You're complaining about something that hasn't happened yet. Can you not just wait a couple of weeks to check the in some of the inevitable thousands of YT videos that will be testing it for everything including noise and heat?
 
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