Mac OS X Lion Notes: iOS Scroll Bars, Any Corner Resizing, Dock Changes

[freiheit]

Re: scrollbars hiding

Re: scrollbars hiding, [sarcasm] it's always so helpful to get rid of all visual cues that something can be done. [/sarcasm]

 

[Jon the Heretic]

No

The point is you don't NEED to. iOS has already proven this.

No, it hasn't. Before iOS 4.0, you couldn't multitask on an iOS device, so no need to show apps that were multitasking. Do you want the Mac to go back to Switcher, circa 1984?

In iOS 4.x, Apple introduced a class of services that use multitasking. If you want to multitask an app using one of these services, that app will show up as 'running' in the new multitasking bar. Apple considered just using these services enough of a resource drain that it was critical to show the user that the app was running.

So once again, given that MacOS X has full multitasking, not just a few services, and the entire app can run as an active process, why is it suddenly irrelevant to know whether an app is sucking up physical memory and CPU cycles? Because MacOS X is so amazingly advanced it makes no difference? Ha ha ha. Dream on.

 

[twilson]

But if 'launchpad' is an application that you need to keep running to keep tabs on what's running, doesn't it sooner or later make little sense when for how many years the dock has done that all by its self?

I don't know... Maybe this change isn't bad and I'm really not trying to piss on change because it's change but this sounds like potential badness... That coupled with the change of the switch on the iPad is making me wonder what the heck is up at Apple... To many 'committee decisions' for me...

But wait and see what Apple releases next year. It will either be this or some combination...

The dock isn't paged, and I don't see how that metaphor would easily translate to the dock either.

At the end of the day, Apple just wants to get some of the iPhone-Windows users to convert to iPhone-Mac users, after all they are familiar with iOS.

 

[ivladster]

I definitely want to know what is running! NOT COOL

I think that's what Mission Control is for. It shows everything what's running.

 

[arkmannj]

I was hoping they would add the glowing dots to iOS not take it away from OS X. Sigh...

 

[Jon the Heretic]

Unix

Did you, I had that back in 1985 on the Amiga. Stupid Windows took ages to catch up.

True enough. And UNIX had it since the early 70s. And that is what MacOS X is based on.

 

[KnightWRX]

But why wouldn't you be able to multitask? You can clearly see in the presentation that multitasking actually improves. The guy has multiple windows open, swaps between fullscreen apps screens, ... thats multitasking.

By your definition, OS9 multi-tasked. Suspending apps in the background is cooperative multi-tasking. It's what OS 9 and earlier used, it's what Windows 3.1 used.

Do I need to go on ?

But "where you are" is wholly irrelevant for a screen full of information. Surely "the actual information" (i.e. what's being displayed) is more important as there is no benefit your position?

Yes, it is. Sometimes when the GF is yelling asking me to come downstairs to help her with something, if the page I'm reading has 5% left, I'm going to finish. If it has 50% left and I know the first 50% were long, I'm going to go help her.

Quick. Visual. Cue.

 

[jeznav]

I think that's what Mission Control is for. It shows everything what's running.

Mission Control is for users. Activity monitor for geeks.

 

[i.mac]

This is crap.... its just unacceptable! like seriously atleast have it optional...i am not happy having it opening as it left off...i quit programs for a reason and thats for a fresh open when it runs slow!

Apple better be making alot of things optional otherwise i aint gonna upgrade!

I'm sure apple is scared...

You're obviously bluffing or you are not the target audience... Which is every one minus you and the like...

...are you from junior high?

 

[Jon the Heretic]

User processes

You can't tell that from the dock now. You can only see a fraction of what's actually running on the dock. Take a look at "All Processes" in Activity Monitor.

It tells you about user processes that have a user interface. If something is running in the background and has no UI, what exactly do you plan to do with it if it showed up as running in the Dock? Quit it and suddenly have Bonjour or printing stop working? 99% of Mac users wouldn't know what to do if there was a process sucking up resources that shouldn't be there, but most would know they can quit Word if there aren't using it and get a little SNAP back when it releases all of those resources and Rosetta (I use 2004) shuts down.

I repeat: iOS does show you whether an app is running or not (iOS 3.x doesn't have this feature because it doesn't multitask! You need iOS 4.x to see the multitasking bar.) Unless Apple suddenly has reinvented UNIX to be light years better than it is now, the distinction in MacOS cannot be erased either. This is all a FANTASY. Apple adds frameworks; they aren't radically reinventing UNIX, and never have.

 

[Millah]

Idk if anyone else mentioned this, but also you could see ever so slightly during Craigs presentation that scrolling has the rubber band physics and new inertial physics like in iOS. He was trying to not make it noticeable for some reason.

 

[QuarterSwede]

What if you want to jump to half way down a very long document?

I'm guessing you mouse over to where the scrollbar is hidden, it fades in and click it and drag where you want it to go. The only thing that will change is that the scrollbar will be hidden when not in use.

Also, those little dock indication dots are just about useless to me since I autohide the dock. Cmd+Tab will still work folks.

 

[ikir]

Imho these changes would be awesome!! Probably you will notice what is running with mission control or maybe dock will be populated only by running apps and you launch them in one click with app launcher? We'll see.

 

[NinjaHERO]

Bummer. I like the light under the dock icons.

 

[KnightWRX]

I'm guessing you mouse over to where the scrollbar is hidden, it fades in and click it and drag where you want it to go. The only thing that will change is that the scrollbar will be hidden when not in use.

I use the scrollbars constantly, as a visual cue. I don't want to have to click/mousover to do something that already works perfectly without any action required on my part.

Step. Backward.

Also, those little dock indication dots are just about useless to me since I autohide the dock. Cmd+Tab will still work folks.

So I guess because you don't use them and auto-hide the dock, it's fine for us that do use them right ? I can't wait for Apple to remove something you do end up using and I don't so I can serve you the same. Except I won't, because I realise choice is important.

 

[blybug]

Another example is iTunes. I've configured everyone's iTunes in my house to point at a shared folder (to avoid copying the lions share of 4GB of music for every login). The main problem with that is that whomever has it open has it locked. So if I want it open on my account, I have to switch to anyone else who may have it open and shut it down on theirs.

It would help to have an indicator of whether or not it was running when I switched to their account.

Kinda off topic...but what you really should do is simply point the location of the iTunes Music/Media Folder in each iTunes to the shared folder, and let each client computer keep its own local "iTunes Library" file in their Music folder. Then you won't have this problem at all.

 

[QuarterSwede]

I repeat: iOS does show you whether an app is running or not (iOS 3.x doesn't have this feature because it doesn't multitask! You need iOS 4.x to see the multitasking bar.)

Actually it doesn't. It only shows you a recent most run list. There is absolutely no indication that it is actually running or not. You have to install SwitcherMod in Cydia (jailbreak) to give you that indication.

 

[twilson]

Horizontal scrolling is one example. Do you think of scrolling horizontally all the time ? What if there is more content there ? Is there even more content there ?

As for vertical scrolling, I use it as an indicator of how much there is left to read. Do I stop at this paragraph to go do something or can I easily finish reading the entire page ? Again, just a nice quick visual indication of how much there is left.

On initial viewing on iOS, the scroll bars are visible (but fade away), to give you an indication of where you are. I see no reason for Apple to change that behaviour on the desktop.

It is a step backwards as far as usability goes, I didn't say it was a show stopper. Same for the lights. It's a step backwards in visual cues, doesn't mean it's a showstopper problem.

I wouldn't say it's a step backwards in either case. The information is wholly irrelevant.

Windows, Linux have all had usability problems all these years, even OS X and no one died because of it. It just seems counter-intuitive to introduce new ones for no good reason.

So basically, because other OSes suck a bit at usability, there's no reason for Apple to try and improve things by removing unnecessary information. Good job Apple aren't as blinkered as you, isn't it.

 

[jeznav]

App state saving/Auto resuming = seamless crashes?

When an app is about to crash, the OS will let it crash and saves your document, then relaunches with your document. Users hate to see when an application crashed. This way they can claim OSX is crashproof.

 

[QuarterSwede]

I use the scrollbars constantly, as a visual cue. I don't want to have to click/mousover to do something that already works perfectly without any action required on my part.

Step. Backward.

Sigh. That has nothing to do with what I was replying to.

So I guess because you don't use them and auto-hide the dock, it's fine for us that do use them right ? I can't wait for Apple to remove something you do end up using and I don't so I can serve you the same. Except I won't, because I realise choice is important.

No. I was just saying there are other ways of telling whether an app is running in Lion as shown. I used myself as an example.

 

[KnightWRX]

On initial viewing on iOS, the scroll bars are visible (but fade away), to give you an indication of where you are. I see no reason for Apple to change that behaviour on the desktop.

Initial viewing doesn't matter after spending time reading the document. And I see no reason for Apple to change the current desktop behavior which provides added benefit on top of the iOS method. iOS devices have limited screen real estate, Mac devices don't.

I wouldn't say it's a step backwards in either case. The information is wholly irrelevant for myself.

Fixed that there. It is highly relevant to me and others.

So basically, because other OSes suck a bit at usability, there's no reason for Apple to try and improve things by removing unnecessary information. Good job Apple aren't as blinkered as you, isn't it.

Uh ? You're twisting my words. The information is relevant. They are moving backwards, removing this relevant information.

You're making the classic egotiscal mistake : Because you don't use it doesn't mean no one else does.

No. I was just saying there are other ways of telling whether an app is running in Lion as shown. I used myself as an example.

Sure there are, by why remove one of the most efficient ways ? Visual cues that are "just there" and don't require action are superior to any ways that requires keystrokes or gestures.

 

[Digitalclips]

Personally I'd like to have the option to have the dock show the active marker below icons (or not if that is preferred). Not for myself so much but for many users that are unsure what they are doing half the time it is a visual reminder to quit apps not in use. Many coming from Windows still forget many apps don't close when the window is closed.

 

[CplBadboy]

Im sure Lion will run like a dream but all in all OS X is starting to look a little dated IMO. Of course its a great OS but I hope Apple have kept a lot of GUI enhancements and other bells and whistles for the official release.

Snow Leopard was a welcome addition but sat next to Windows 7 its hard not say that Windows 7 looks a bit more attractive.

 

[GroundLoop]

Re: scrollbars hiding, [sarcasm] it's always so helpful to get rid of all visual cues that something can be done. [/sarcasm]

Did you feel this way with Quicktime X where everything hides (frames, controls, etc)?

GL

 

[ny3ranger]

wouldn't that be confusing? Not knowing what's running at a glance?

Agreed it would be a bit confusing. But maybe thats where an apple tab would come into play. Switching would tell you what apps have an instance open and then you can do into that and close it if you want to free up the stance resources.

I dont think they will close apps with state when you switch to a different app. Because even though you get back to exactly where you left off. It does take that extra time to open the app and read the state from the hard drive vs the ram.

Again I dont know how OS x currently handles all open applications now in memory.