MP 7,1 Mac Pro 7,1 Will Not Boot From Any External Volume

[Derived]

Just as the title says - I have been at this for about 10-12 hours now, and I am completely stumped.

The machine is running the latest version of Sonoma (which I'm learning has some serious issues with external drives) and no matter what, it cannot see any external volumes or devices as bootable. That includes the following:

Other partitions on the main internal SSD

A bootable Mac OS USB stick

A bootable Ubuntu USB stick

Worth nothing as well that it does not see my internal 4M2 raid array as bootable either.

SIP disabled, all security off, FileVault off, no encryption, secure boot totally off, external bootable devices allowed. Still, it only sees the Sonoma partition as a boot drive both in system preferences and in recovery mode, no matter what I do.

I am completely at a loss here, I've never seen something like this before. The most frustrating part is that I've made a partition on the main drive to downgrade to Ventura, however I can't even get the machine to see the bootable USB installer that I just made as a startup disk.

All my research so far seems to indicate that Sonoma basically flakes out constantly when it comes to external drives, and in fact have had my 4M2 raid array drop out and not come back without multiple restarts. Anyone else experience anything like this?

Thanks

 

[mattspace]

Just as the title says - I have been at this for about 10-12 hours now, and I am completely stumped.

The machine is running the latest version of Sonoma (which I'm learning has some serious issues with external drives) and no matter what, it cannot see any external volumes or devices as bootable. That includes the following:

Other partitions on the main internal SSD

A bootable Mac OS USB stick

A bootable Ubuntu USB stick

Worth nothing as well that it does not see my internal 4M2 raid array as bootable either.

SIP disabled, all security off, FileVault off, no encryption, secure boot totally off, external bootable devices allowed. Still, it only sees the Sonoma partition as a boot drive both in system preferences and in recovery mode, no matter what I do.

I am completely at a loss here, I've never seen something like this before. The most frustrating part is that I've made a partition on the main drive to downgrade to Ventura, however I can't even get the machine to see the bootable USB installer that I just made as a startup disk.

All my research so far seems to indicate that Sonoma basically flakes out constantly when it comes to external drives, and in fact have had my 4M2 raid array drop out and not come back without multiple restarts. Anyone else experience anything like this?

Thanks

Wipe and install Ventura to see if the problem persists?

 

[Nermal]

When you say "cannot see", do you mean when holding Option, or in Startup Disk, or both?

Edit: I see you mentioned Startup Disk, but what about when holding Option at boot?

 

[Derived]

Both yes. Only the Sonoma partition on the internal SSD is visible both in recovery and in system settings.

In fact because of this I’m not even sure how I would totally wipe it and erase + start over. I know of course system settings allows for a “reset” but that doesn’t erase the drive, or allow for another OS to be installed. And there’s no way to take the OEM SSD and put it into another enclosure, as far as I know. So it doesn’t even seem possible to truly start from scratch. Feels like I’m caught in a horror film.

Worst part is the machine came to me with Ventura installed….

 

[Derived]

Worth pointing out as well that I can’t even get any key commands besides cmd + R to work, which isn’t much help since it only gives me the option to reinstall Sonoma again on the existing Sonoma partition.

 

[flowrider]

Yes, others have reported this issue on Sonoma. I have no such issues and I have two PCI cards with six Samsung SSDs, reported by the OS as external. Four of the SSDs have OSs. All are bootable for me. From what I have read, the problems seems to be related to the cards, not the SSDs. My PCIe cards are a High Point SSD7103 and an IOCrest IO-PCE2824-TM2.

 

[startergo]

Reset NVRAM, SMC and run Apple diagnostics:

Use Apple Diagnostics to test your Mac - Apple Support

Apple Diagnostics, formerly known as Apple Hardware Test, can check your Mac for hardware issues.

support.apple.com

 

[profdraper]

Just as the title says - I have been at this for about 10-12 hours now, and I am completely stumped.

The machine is running the latest version of Sonoma (which I'm learning has some serious issues with external drives) and no matter what, it cannot see any external volumes or devices as bootable. That includes the following:

Other partitions on the main internal SSD

A bootable Mac OS USB stick

A bootable Ubuntu USB stick

Worth nothing as well that it does not see my internal 4M2 raid array as bootable either.

SIP disabled, all security off, FileVault off, no encryption, secure boot totally off, external bootable devices allowed. Still, it only sees the Sonoma partition as a boot drive both in system preferences and in recovery mode, no matter what I do.

I am completely at a loss here, I've never seen something like this before. The most frustrating part is that I've made a partition on the main drive to downgrade to Ventura, however I can't even get the machine to see the bootable USB installer that I just made as a startup disk.

All my research so far seems to indicate that Sonoma basically flakes out constantly when it comes to external drives, and in fact have had my 4M2 raid array drop out and not come back without multiple restarts. Anyone else experience anything like this?

Thanks

How odd and annoying, though this wouldn't be the first time we've been soooo annoyed at Sonoma. I've had none of these particualr issues you mention, but, have indeed had consistent problems with not mounting or seeing a Sonnet 4xM2 PCIe card. The only answer there has been to either i) boot back into Monterey & then back into Sonoma & when then 'sticks' for a few boots, or 2) reset the NMC immediately followed by zapping the PRAM - this always works in the first instance (but then gives up again after 3-4 boots).

So perhaps try the NMC /PRAM combo in the first instance & see if that gets you going into the methods you have already attempted?

Another option perhaps would be to try to boot the macpro in Target mode & assuming you may have another computer or can borrow a laptop or similar? if that works then your will be able to reformat and/or install a new system on the macpro.

Only other thought would be to go back to Monterey (not Ventura); in my experience, Monterey is the last, best OS for the 7.1 macpro & I keep this on a spare boot volume becuase it works perfectly with all the thrid party apps, drivers and installs that have proved problematic on Sonoma.

Hope that helps.

 

[Derived]

Yes it seems the more I read the more I see similar issues with Sonoma all over. I have reset NVRAM and didn't result in any change.

I am fairly confident the machine itself is fine, it has no problem seeing these disks and interacting with them, Sonoma simply will not allow me to boot from any of them.

I also own a 2019 16" MacBook Pro, tried using target disk mode and still no luck, Mac Pro will not boot from it. That includes a Catalina partition on that machine's disk. My next move is trying to use the Apple Configurator app on the MBP to nuke the 7,1 and start fresh, seems to be the only real option left.

Between this and constant glitches in iOS 17, the last few months have maybe been the most disappointing ever in 20 years of being a full-time Apple user.

 

[flowrider]

^^^^As posted above I'm on Sonoma (have been on all Betas) and now on OS14.4 Beta1 and have six SSDs mounted on two PCIe cards as outlined in post #6, and have no such issues. Again, my thinking is that's it's not the OS, but the hardware.

Lou

 

[Tratkazir_the_1st]

A bit extreme...
https://logi.wiki/index.php/DFU_Mode_Restore_(Macs). Just a theory .

 

[macguru9999]

you may need to do recovery mode first and change the settings, but mine boots off an external no probs. also i have reverted to monterey , its great !

 

[Derived]

A bit extreme...
https://logi.wiki/index.php/DFU_Mode_Restore_(Macs). Just a theory .

This is next on my list, would prefer not to do all this but may be the only choice.

 

[steve123]

Did you resolve this issue? I have encountered something similar with a Mac mini 7,1. Holding the option key during boot will not bring up the Startup Manager (or the OCLP bootpicker). I did a PRAM reset and managed to get Startup Manager to recognized the internal disk and EFI partition. However, my externally connected USB drive does not appear. If I boot to macOS (current installed OS is Monterey), the USB drive is connected when I log in. So, I do not think there is a USB connection issue. Note as well, I have used this USB drive to install Sonoma on a couple other machines already so I know it is a bootable volume.

I wonder if this issue could be related to a recent firmware update from Apple? My firmware is showing 483.0.0.0.0.

 

[profdraper]

Worth pointing out as well that I can’t even get any key commands besides cmd + R to work, which isn’t much help since it only gives me the option to reinstall Sonoma again on the existing Sonoma partition.

FWIW, I have had various idioitic issues with wireless keyboard & mouse in this respect (both Apple & Logitech). I keep a wired keyboard for just this & where the key commands work as they should.

 

[Derived]

Did you resolve this issue? I have encountered something similar with a Mac mini 7,1. Holding the option key during boot will not bring up the Startup Manager (or the OCLP bootpicker). I did a PRAM reset and managed to get Startup Manager to recognized the internal disk and EFI partition. However, my externally connected USB drive does not appear. If I boot to macOS (current installed OS is Monterey), the USB drive is connected when I log in. So, I do not think there is a USB connection issue. Note as well, I have used this USB drive to install Sonoma on a couple other machines already so I know it is a bootable volume.

I wonder if this issue could be related to a recent firmware update from Apple? My firmware is showing 483.0.0.0.0.

I have not, and given how many others seem to be dead-ended here, I am not hopeful that I'll get around it. I think the firmware might be the issue, as no matter what OS you downgrade to, you are stuck with the firmware you have once it's been updated. Unfortunately I did not know any of this before I did the software & firmware updates as soon as I received the machine.

Since I still have a 5,1 as well, something I may try is putting my OWC 4M2 into that, then installing Linux there on that machine, then putting it back into the 7,1 to see if it can boot from it.

To be honest though, for my purposes, I might just capitulate and install Windows via Bootcamp and use the WSL2 subsystem for my Linux needs for now, can't waste too much more time trying to figure this out.

 

[ZombiePhysicist]

Just as the title says - I have been at this for about 10-12 hours now, and I am completely stumped.

The machine is running the latest version of Sonoma (which I'm learning has some serious issues with external drives) and no matter what, it cannot see any external volumes or devices as bootable. That includes the following:

Other partitions on the main internal SSD

A bootable Mac OS USB stick

A bootable Ubuntu USB stick

Worth nothing as well that it does not see my internal 4M2 raid array as bootable either.

SIP disabled, all security off, FileVault off, no encryption, secure boot totally off, external bootable devices allowed. Still, it only sees the Sonoma partition as a boot drive both in system preferences and in recovery mode, no matter what I do.

I am completely at a loss here, I've never seen something like this before. The most frustrating part is that I've made a partition on the main drive to downgrade to Ventura, however I can't even get the machine to see the bootable USB installer that I just made as a startup disk.

All my research so far seems to indicate that Sonoma basically flakes out constantly when it comes to external drives, and in fact have had my 4M2 raid array drop out and not come back without multiple restarts. Anyone else experience anything like this?

Thanks

USB thumb sticks are not bootable. USB external drives are bootable. Are you using a stick or a drive?

 

[KingofGotham1]

Im having this EXACT same issue! I have 3 Mac Pro 7,1 at home and 2 of them I am able to press "option" and go to my boot picker, however on this one machine it just goes to a black screen. I even used one of my other 7.1 machines to make a Windows drive, put that back in the machine with the issue, it can now see a second drive, but will not boot from it, it simply hangs and then goes back to the default OS/drive.

 

[Derived]

USB thumb sticks are not bootable. USB external drives are bootable. Are you using a stick or a drive?

Not according to official Apple documents...besides there are many people right now booting T2 Macs from USB...in fact I was able to boot it from a USB Ventura installer after many attempts and install it on another partition. I don't doubt that there are a lot of issues with USB sticks given my own experiences and the experiences of others...but as far as I can tell that is not supposed to be the case. I have to imagine the latest firmware is the culprit as it seems others have been able to install Linux on these machines prior to recent times.

To anyone reading - I have not resolved the situation, as you can probably tell. Even starting with Ventura I am unable to make the machine see a bootable Ubuntu installer on a USB stick and at that point I gave up, it's been a few weeks since I touched the system. I do intend to try an external bus-powered 4tb USB HDD, and also still need to try my idea of installing Ubuntu on the OWC drive in my 5,1 and then putting it back into the 7,1 to see if it will boot there. Hoping to get back into this soon.

 

[steve123]

Could there be some issue with the EFI partition? Maybe try mounting it and see if there is any crud on there? I am not sure if there is a way to wipe it and reinstall?

 

[ZombiePhysicist]

Not according to official Apple documents...besides there are many people right now booting T2 Macs from USB...in fact I was able to boot it from a USB Ventura installer after many attempts and install it on another partition. I don't doubt that there are a lot of issues with USB sticks given my own experiences and the experiences of others...but as far as I can tell that is not supposed to be the case. I have to imagine the latest firmware is the culprit as it seems others have been able to install Linux on these machines prior to recent times.

To anyone reading - I have not resolved the situation, as you can probably tell. Even starting with Ventura I am unable to make the machine see a bootable Ubuntu installer on a USB stick and at that point I gave up, it's been a few weeks since I touched the system. I do intend to try an external bus-powered 4tb USB HDD, and also still need to try my idea of installing Ubuntu on the OWC drive in my 5,1 and then putting it back into the 7,1 to see if it will boot there. Hoping to get back into this soon.

The installer stick is HFS+ formatted and not booting into a full OS. You can NOT boot to the desktop with Big Sur or later off a thumb drive or SD card. Apple dropped that ability with Big Sur, and perhaps with APFS.

Not sure what apple documentation you have, but the reality is it cannot be done. If you can, please tell us how. Per the thread above, it is established fact that you cannot.