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MacBook and MacBook Pro: Penryn, Battery Life, Updates Sooner than Later?

jragosta said:
Isn't the bus speed faster on the new ones, as well?
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No, still at 800mhz. The new Centrino platform "Montevina" aka Centrino 2 will move the FSB to 1066mhz when it's released in June. This will use the same Penryn processors and then at the very end of the year Nehelam will replace Penryn.

flopticalcube said:
Mobility HD3870
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=218990
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My bad, I always forget that the iMac uses mobile parts. :mad::mad:

gkarris said:
We're just used to old Apple updates like with the PPC, where Apple updated their equipment about once per year.

The 4-6 month "PC" cycle is a bit dizzying...
Do I buy, do I wait, do I buy, do I wait...
I bought - 2 months later - oh shoot, a new one's out....

I just ordered the refurbed Black MacBook, so of course, Apple will come out with that Aluminum MacBook (looks like the Air, but thicker) that I've always wanted 3 months from now...
Click to expand...

Yep, I love the pace! At least it's exciting. I couldn't imagine going a year or more between updates. Holy crap!
The strategy is to buy right when something is released, then drool for 2-3 years as 5 new versions are released, then buy again. repeat. :):)
 
dante@sisna.com said:
A lot of people knew that this update would be very weak.

I watched them try to warn those who were desperately waiting for so many months.

If you look at Apple through business and marketing eyes, as opposed to the looking glass of a technology wish list, Apple updates are very predictable.

I will watch and learn for the future.
Click to expand...

Weak? Um, we were all pretty much expecting what happened. The only thing I was hoping for was a case redesign, but whatever I'm totally over that. The only people who are complaining are the same people that want unrealistic specs in a 1" notebook.

Anyone who says this was "weak" is crazy. What were you expecting? Blu-ray? Quad-core processor? Some crazy unreleased Nvidia GPU? 16GB of RAM? Yeah...

The reason I waited was because I didn't want to pay top dollar for July 2007 hardware. Stop trying to make people feel bad because they had the patience to wait and you didn't.
 
To Exchange or Not To Exchange

I just purchased a new MacBook Pro 2.2GHz with 160 MB HD for $1,799 at the local Apple Store 10 days ago. This was a "must buy" situation since I gave my G4 to my mother when her G3 Pismo started falling apart. Now I am wondering if upgrading to the new model would be worth the $180 restocking fee.

I will probably keep this MacBook for about five years. I often use Photoshop and iMovie, so the additional 40 GB HD would be a plus. However, this alone is not worth $180. Would the new Penryn 2.4 GHz processor, additional 128 MB on the NVIDIA, and multitouch trackpad make it worth the exchange? I will need to decide in the next day or two and would appreciate any advice. Thanks.
 
jragosta said:
And I'm personally glad to see the remote made an option. I didn't like paying for a remote on a laptop - I just can't see any possible scenario where I'd need it. So why should I pay for it?
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Who says you're paying for it? They could've afforded to throw it in without increasing the price. I'm still completely happy with my 2.2 Ghz WhiteBook. I use my remote all the time.
 
winterspan said:
The idea that Apple was "forced" to make a marginal upgrade rather than a major revision is just non-sensical. Why would the fact that Intel made Apple switch chips have any bearing at all on whether Apple made other improvements? By their own standards, Apple has had an enormous amount of time to prepare a significant update and failed to do so. Maybe this is just a minor bump, and you'll in fact see a totally redesigned MBP in a few months from now. Either way, how did you get all the way to blaming Intel?
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I'm just going by the original post by 'arn' who started "according to our sources, Apple was forced by Intel into upgrading the MacBooks at this time." This would mean that if Apple decided not to upgrade, then they would have faced supply problems. My opinions are based by what was originally posted which would seem correct as Intel is moving to their newer processors. Did you even bother to read the original post? If you did you wouldn't be questioning my statements.
 
arn said:
Based on this benchmark
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/442272/

The 2.4GHz Penryn MacBook Pro (3MB L2 Cache) scored the same as a 2.4GHz Merom MacBookPro (4MB L2 Cache).

These are benchmarks, not real world... even so the difference is probably negligable.

arn
Click to expand...

I had the 2.2 Merom MBP laptop for 2 weeks until today when I was able to update to the 2.4 Penyrn for the restock fee. Let me throw in on the L2 cache discrepancy.

I am a graphic designer and use multiple CS3 apps simultaneously . I have a 2.16 core 2 duo 24" iMac with 3 gigs of RAM. When I bought the 2.2 MBP, I expected an on par snappiness versus the iMac considering the frontside bus was higher and despite only 2 gigs of RAM in the laptop. Surprisingly, I found the merom 2.2 to be a little sluggish compared to the iMac.

With the last few hours to evaluate, I find the new laptop to be much quicker than the previous model. Of course, the VRAM doubled to 256, but so far in my testing the loss of L2 cache down to 3 has not caused any noticeable slowdown, and, in fact, the machine feels faster than my iMac. I can't wait to see what happens when my 4GB RAM shows up on Thursday.

As far as I'm concerned as a student who regularly prices the low end MBPs, this model is a worthy update compared to the former low end model. The higher level 15" always seems a bit pricey for what is offered. I appreciate the larger hard drive, and who knows what functionality will be added to the multitouch track pad in the future?

We've all been moaning for this update for an eternity. I feel that any of you trapped in the order/shipping pipeline will be quite happy–the wait is over. Of course a redesign will come this year, but this is a tried-and-true quality build that will outlast the alpha update model which will be plagued with issues.

That's my 2 cents.
 
rdp322 said:
I just purchased a new MacBook Pro 2.2GHz with 160 MB HD for $1,799 at the local Apple Store 10 days ago. This was a "must buy" situation since I gave my G4 to my mother when her G3 Pismo started falling apart. Now I am wondering if upgrading to the new model would be worth the $180 restocking fee.

I will probably keep this MacBook for about five years. I often use Photoshop and iMovie, so the additional 40 GB HD would be a plus. However, this alone is not worth $180. Would the new Penryn 2.4 GHz processor, additional 128 MB on the NVIDIA, and multitouch trackpad make it worth the exchange? I will need to decide in the next day or two and would appreciate any advice. Thanks.
Click to expand...

I would say yes, just because I'd be pissed having an "older" model right when the new one comes out. But what GPU does the old one have? You say "extra 128MB" , but graphics cards are first and foremost always "rated" by the processor, with the amount of RAM being a far second.

The 2.4ghz Penryn is NOT just 200mhz faster than the older 2.2Ghz, but it has SSE4.1 instructions which will be able to speed up multimedia apps like sound editing, video editing, photoshop, 3d Graphics, etc by up to 40%.
It also is a 45nm Penryn chip which will run cooler and will give you a better battery life. Between the processor difference, and getting Multi-touch, I'd definitely say yes. If the Graphics chip is much better, Thats just icing on the cake!
 
rdp322 said:
I just purchased a new MacBook Pro 2.2GHz with 160 MB HD for $1,799 at the local Apple Store 10 days ago. This was a "must buy" situation since I gave my G4 to my mother when her G3 Pismo started falling apart. Now I am wondering if upgrading to the new model would be worth the $180 restocking fee.

I will probably keep this MacBook for about five years. I often use Photoshop and iMovie, so the additional 40 GB HD would be a plus. However, this alone is not worth $180. Would the new Penryn 2.4 GHz processor, additional 128 MB on the NVIDIA, and multitouch trackpad make it worth the exchange? I will need to decide in the next day or two and would appreciate any advice. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Oh yes, definitely yes. Faster and more efficient processor, more space, better graphics card, multitouch. You already hit on everything. Penryn also incorporates SSE4, which from what I can tell is a major plus for future apps.
 
rdp322 said:
I just purchased a new MacBook Pro 2.2GHz with 160 MB HD for $1,799 at the local Apple Store 10 days ago. This was a "must buy" situation since I gave my G4 to my mother when her G3 Pismo started falling apart. Now I am wondering if upgrading to the new model would be worth the $180 restocking fee.

I will probably keep this MacBook for about five years. I often use Photoshop and iMovie, so the additional 40 GB HD would be a plus. However, this alone is not worth $180. Would the new Penryn 2.4 GHz processor, additional 128 MB on the NVIDIA, and multitouch trackpad make it worth the exchange? I will need to decide in the next day or two and would appreciate any advice. Thanks.
Click to expand...

It's worth it, I just did the exact same thing. Internal hard drive space is a premium in my book, and your resale will improve. To me it's noticeably quicker as well.
 
I'm a little worried about Intel bullying Apple. Theoretically, couldn't Apple use it's eighteen billion dollar cache to hire hitmen for revenge? Just spitballing here. I'm going to make a list of exactly what I want in my next computer, and then I'll buy it when it's released. Multitouch, my foot. (I would insert an emoticon here if my morals allowed it. See signature.)
 
asdavis10 said:
I'm just going by the original post by 'arn' who started "according to our sources, Apple was forced by Intel into upgrading the MacBooks at this time." This would mean that if Apple decided not to upgrade, then they would have faced supply problems. My opinions are based by what was originally posted which would seem correct as Intel is moving to their newer processors. Did you even bother to read the original post? If you did you wouldn't be questioning my statements.
Click to expand...

Did I read the post? Of course. Did you read mine? Because if you did, you would see I was referring to the updated Macbook Pro. I was stating that by their own standards, Apple was due to update the Macbook Pro. Whether Intel pushed them to use the new 45nm chips or not, I asked why that would affect the ability of Apple to make other upgrades to the laptop.
On the account of the Macbook, even if Apple wasn't planning on updating it and was "forced" into using the new 45nm chips, why would that preclude them from releasing the "complete" intended update a few months down the road when they were originally going to?




badNameErr said:
Personally I find the "crazed zealots" (i.e whinners) pretty annoying. Whatever.

Huh, maybe it is me who doesn't belong here.....:D
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yeah I was kidding. Rational discussion is great. People who irrationally defend Apple drive me crazy too.
 
ltldrummerboy said:
I'm a little worried about Intel bullying Apple. Theoretically, couldn't Apple use it's eighteen billion dollar cache to hire hitmen for revenge? Just spitballing here. I'm going to make a list of exactly what I want in my next computer, and then I'll buy it when it's released. Multitouch, my foot. (I would insert an emoticon here if my morals allowed it. See signature.)
Click to expand...


I think you've had just a little bit too much computer talk today, huh? :):):)

edit: oh wait, did you mean "cache" as in "vast storage" of money? or did you just spell it wrong because of too much talk of processor details... lol
 
rdp322 said:
I just purchased a new MacBook Pro 2.2GHz with 160 MB HD for $1,799 at the local Apple Store 10 days ago. This was a "must buy" situation since I gave my G4 to my mother when her G3 Pismo started falling apart. Now I am wondering if upgrading to the new model would be worth the $180 restocking fee.

I will probably keep this MacBook for about five years. I often use Photoshop and iMovie, so the additional 40 GB HD would be a plus. However, this alone is not worth $180. Would the new Penryn 2.4 GHz processor, additional 128 MB on the NVIDIA, and multitouch trackpad make it worth the exchange? I will need to decide in the next day or two and would appreciate any advice. Thanks.
Click to expand...


I agree with winterspan -- the faster processor, more VRAM, bigger hdd, multitouch trackpad are totally worth the restocking fee. Yeah, I know it sucks to have to "give: the money away :( if I were you, I would at least try to talk whoever it is you talking to into waiving the restocking fee. It's been known to happen, though there are no guarantees it will.

winterspan said:
I would say yes, just because I'd be pissed having an "older" model right when the new one comes out. But what GPU does the old one have? You say "extra 128MB" , but graphics cards are first and foremost always "rated" by the processor, with the amount of RAM being a far second.

The 2.4ghz Penryn is NOT just 200mhz faster than the older 2.2Ghz, but it has SSE4.1 instructions which will be able to speed up multimedia apps like sound editing, video editing, photoshop, 3d Graphics, etc by up to 40%.
It also is a 45nm Penryn chip which will run cooler and will give you a better battery life. Between the processor difference, and getting Multi-touch, I'd definitely say yes. If the Graphics chip is much better, Thats just icing on the cake!
Click to expand...
 
clay5destroyer said:
We've all been moaning for this update for an eternity. I feel that any of you trapped in the order/shipping pipeline will be quite happy–the wait is over. Of course a redesign will come this year, but this is a tried-and-true quality build that will outlast the alpha update model which will be plagued with issues.

That's my 2 cents.
Click to expand...

+1:)

I will be ordering my Penryn MBP tomorrow. I would have liked to see the old latch system be replaced with a magnewtic one... but oh well. One thing I noticed is that Apple reduced the premium that they used to charge for upgrading the RAM, its still expensive, but more tolerable IMO. I'm going to spring for the mid-range model, 2.5 GHz, 6MB L2 Cache, 200GB 7200RPM, glossy screen, oh, and of course, one $19 remote. Thanks :apple:
 
ltldrummerboy said:
I'm a little worried about Intel bullying Apple.
Click to expand...

There's nothing new here - as Intel moves to new designs and processes, production lines for the older chips are closed. Part of "ramping up" is the "ramping down" of the old lines.

"Bullying" doesn't sound like the right word - once Intel told Apple that the older parts were going EOL, Apple really didn't have a choice.

It's always been that way with Intel. A few months after the new product shows up, the older version gets in short supply. A few months later, it's out of the price books and virtually unavailable.

You can't sell high volume product using last generation Intel stuff, it's been that way for a decade or two.
 
winterspan said:
Did I read the post? Of course. Did you read mine? Because if you did, you would see I was referring to the updated Macbook Pro. I was stating that by their own standards, Apple was due to update the Macbook Pro. Whether Intel pushed them to use the new 45nm chips or not, I asked why that would affect the ability of Apple to make other upgrades to the laptop.
On the account of the Macbook, even if Apple wasn't planning on updating it and was "forced" into using the new 45nm chips, why would that preclude them from releasing the "complete" intended update a few months down the road when they were originally going to?
Click to expand...

Then you clearly missed my whole point. Forcing Apple to use the new chips means that when they make the upgrade they wanted regardless of the model, people are going to have buyers remorse and feel that Apple did them wrong. Along with the fact that Merom to Penryn is not as big an upgrade (aside from the 6MB L2 cache) as we would have seen from Merom to the next processor upgrade which may come later this year should Apple have decided not to move to Penryn.
 
i want to buy BUT...

i am concerned about the latch. i'm typing this on my 12" powerbook which has been awesome EXCEPT FOR the latch system. it has been broken for about 2 years (i'm in grad school and this is mainly my wife's machine so it isn't a huge priority to fix).

unlike other complainers i am happy with the new specs and i'm excited to upgrade but this latch on the 12" is *****. i just do not understand how the "high end" machine in apple's portable line-up doesn't have features (mag latch) that the low-end machines have.

please don't lump me in with the whiners complaining about the lack of blu-ray, et cetera because i think that the new specs are great, i think it is a legitimate complaint about the latch system.

i currently have a Dell that i bought for grad school BEFORE the whole intel/bootcamp thing came into being (i'm in an architecture program). my goal was to wait until spring of my last year of school to use my last loan check to buy my shiny new mac and sell the dell and the 12" powerbook. since i don't really *need* the MBP this second because my Dell will get me through the last 2.5 months of school, should i hold out for the next machine? i don't want to hear the litany of "if you need it, get it...blah, blah, blah." i want to hear the speculation that the next revision will include the new mag latch. what are the odds? 50%? 75%?
 
winterspan said:
Whats the deal with Apple people hating quick updates? Wouldn't they rather have up to date equipment all the time than to "eel like their computer isn't "outdated" for longer?
Click to expand...
I'd rather not pay for meaningless upgrades. It costs Apple money to change a whole product line. A lot of money. Inventories go all squirrely, last weeks machines come back for return or exchange-- this on top of all the design, qual and test. If Apple pays for it, we pay for it.

If they're going to roll over the product line, I'd like to see it make a difference on my desktop. If it doesn't, just discount the current line. Intel EOL, etc, but as a rule: no point in updating more than twice as fast as most people buy new machines. I'll bet you sampling theory says as much.
gkarris said:
We're just used to old Apple updates like with the PPC, where Apple updated their equipment about once per year.
Click to expand...
It's clear by now that PPC didn't set the update schedule...
Stridder44 said:
The reason I waited was because I didn't want to pay top dollar for July 2007 hardware. Stop trying to make people feel bad because they had the patience to wait and you didn't.
Click to expand...
I think what he meant by "weak" is that you just paid top dollar for July 2007 hardware... ;)
 
jmerk said:
i am concerned about the latch. i'm typing this on my 12" powerbook which has been awesome EXCEPT FOR the latch system. it has been broken for about 2 years (i'm in grad school and this is mainly my wife's machine so it isn't a huge priority to fix).

unlike other complainers i am happy with the new specs and i'm excited to upgrade but this latch on the 12" is *****. i just do not understand how the "high end" machine in apple's portable line-up doesn't have features (mag latch) that the low-end machines have.

please don't lump me in with the whiners complaining about the lack of blu-ray, et cetera because i think that the new specs are great, i think it is a legitimate complaint about the latch system.

i currently have a Dell that i bought for grad school BEFORE the whole intel/bootcamp thing came into being (i'm in an architecture program). my goal was to wait until spring of my last year of school to use my last loan check to buy my shiny new mac and sell the dell and the 12" powerbook. since i don't really *need* the MBP this second because my Dell will get me through the last 2.5 months of school, should i hold out for the next machine? i don't want to hear the litany of "if you need it, get it...blah, blah, blah." i want to hear the speculation that the next revision will include the new mag latch. what are the odds? 50%? 75%?
Click to expand...

I think the next MacBook Pros will include magnetic latching, but I won't be expecting them for a while.
 
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