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MacBook Pro 2017 - wait for it?
- Thread starter NatalieThomas89
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I doubt that successor is going to be all that everyone is imagining it to be. As someone else already said, it'll be a bit faster, but don't expect it to blow away the current MBP. The main enhancement that people are anticipating for the 2017 MBP is that it MIGHT have an option for 32GB RAM which would wipe out any improvements in battery life if you were to upgrade that far.
As for improvements in battery life, who knows how much better it would get. We know they'll go to a more power saving CPU architecture, but nobody knows just how much that will translate into real world gains.
The only reason I see for waiting is if you're paranoid about 1st generation products or you really absolutely need 32GB of RAM. The MBP product isn't going to change too much otherwise. Sure it'll be better, but how much better is anyone's guess and likely not as much as most people imagine. If you can wait, you could also buy the 2016 in 2017 just like you bought the 2015 right now. My wife is using my old 2010 MBP. It's fine for her needs. These things last a lot longer than they used to.
What makes you say that? Apple still uses the fastest consumer CPUs in their latest laptops (as they always did) — in contrast to competitors like Microsoft and Dell. They have moved all their laptops to a colorspace that better suits digital movie production. They ship laptops that offer the higher stock storage performance in the market AND fastest I/O on the market. Their WiFi performance is also consistently on top, with 3x3 configurations where most of the competitors whip 2x2 antenna setups. They also use professional GPU for the first time in all the 15" models.
Overall, the current MBP lineup is the fastest and most 'pro' (feature-wise) in Apple's history — in both absolute and relative terms. It is very strange to me to read claims that Apple is quitting the 'pro' market in this context. If you believe that, then wouldn't it make much more sense to say that Apple was never in the 'pro' market to begin with?
That has always been the case.
I believe that one part of Apple's strategy and the reason why they are this successful is to avoid making niche products, whenever possible. The DNA of the MBP is not a professional workstation, which has always been a very niche type of laptop. Rather, MBP (and PowerBooks before it) were always conceived as flexible, adaptable machines which balance performance and mobility features and can be used for many different purposes, by "pro" and "non-pro" users alike.
Yes, but again, you're missing the point. Fewer and fewer people care about this stuff. Any decent modern-day laptop will suffice for the vast majority of the population for at least 1-2 years, regardless of any of what you've just mentioned. The 'huge' amount of negativity we see online about Apple soldering SSDs, skipping Kaby Lake, using the weaker AMD GPUs, etc., etc., goes nowhere. Why? Because you and I are in the niche who care about this stuff. We are a niche, and we're one of the worst to try and satisfy. From a business perspective, you don't want to be involved with that market. It's costly and a risk for your reputation.
The people who do care, though, are now fully aware of the under-clocking, thermal-throttling, over-pricing and QA issues that are spilling out of Apple right now. Hence the negativity on geeky forums and blogs alike - but as many have said, there'll be thousands of 2016 MBP owners out there who are over-the-moon with their laptop and will never come across the negativity surrounding some of the boring technical details. Hence the sales figures.
I do not blame Apple at all. It makes sense. Selling things that are 'good enough' is far, far more profitable than selling things that are 'outstanding'. It makes financial sense, and they're here to make a profit first and foremost.
They're out of the display industry, loosely partnering with LG to deliver some screens that are at least representative of this decade, and the MP is 3-4 years outdated. As you've mentioned, the MBP sits somewhere between what I would consider a 'pro' machine and a consumer machine. I'm suggesting you'll see them sway more and more towards consumer, possibly deprecating the line-up for the rMB in several years time. Tim Cook said himself, "why would anyone need a PC any more?". Enough said, really.
Indeed. But the rMB is enough for the vast majority laptop owner use cases, and it gives Apple absolutely fantastic margins. The more 'consumer' level they can make their future line-up, the higher their margin will be.
In a perfect world, I imagine they'll be looking to sell MacBooks on a one-year or two-year cycle to customers, just like the iPhone. Better cash flow, better margins, better customer retention.
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Yes, I'm a developer (some iOS apps) and currently are running 10.12.3 Beta (16D30a) on my 2016 13."
There are a couple of more subtle changes in the latest beta release that will effect the battery life and the most noticeable is the auto dim feature. Yes it seems as though my MB now acts like iOS and changes the screen brightness a while lot more (and quickly) when then ambient light levels change. This only seems to happen (like iOS) when I have the screen brightness set at a value of less than full bright, which is almost all the time.
It's also very similar to how the keyboard back lighting changes in the older MBs and OSX.
The results of these OS changes are more efficient screen brightness or at least less battery drain.
Yesterday, with just WIFI, MS Word 2011 and another program running I got about 12 hours out of the battery.
The current battery cycle, WIFI, BT, streaming video and two hours of dual display through a dongle to a 1080p 48" screen looks like close to 9 hours
Yes Apple responds to the issues.
The 2016 13" is a winner!
"The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated" Mark Twain
As has always been true. Doesn't mean Apple is leaving the pro market any more than from day 1 of the MBP. I see no reason to think fewer people care about the performance specs than before. It's always been a small portion of the market who do more than read the conclusion to a couple reviews.
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Can you give some example that which PC laptop can ahead MacBook Pro 3-4 years ?
How is the meaning of the "Pro" ? I with experiment of a Dell "Pro" Workstation but it very worst with poor display, poor keyboard and heavy, I also have experiment of use Panasonic Toughbook because i need travel to India for engineering work. It very solid and very pro but too heavy i will not buy by myself, both of those is much expensive that MBP, but those should required because the machine with extreme reliability and will not died on critical moment.
Nowadays Game users is more demanding that many "Pro" user, and they buy a very high config laptop named PRO computer. (Although it may poor reliability).
So based on computer config is not the only factor for PRO user considering. Most PRO user just require stable and reliability and enough power, and not mean "Consumer" customer not want, for example MacBook pro non touch is much enough that enough for music production.
I don't thing MBP is the PRO workstation that used on extreme enviroments or military that require very high reliability.
It just a machine for business, creative and home use.
Very much true. And also the prime indication that Apple is not exiting the pro market. They still do exactly what they ever did — deliver a highly mobile laptop with top-range CPU performance and balanced overall performance. At the same time where the competitors (such as Microsoft or Dell), lower the relative specs of their computers, exactly in the fashion that you describe.
But not nessesarily any higher margins than any MBP. That Core M is a fairly pricey CPU.
Why? Well, first of all, because most of this stuff is wrong and/or raised by a bunch of old-school users who can't understand what is going on in the industry and what Apple is actually delivering. Take the "skipping Kaby Lake" one, where people would actually criticise Apple for not using a weaker CPU! Absolutely ridiculous. Or "using the weaker AMD GPU", at the time where Polaris 11 was the fastest GPU on the market in its power bracket (sure, now we have 1050 GTX, which is 20% faster and draws 30% more power). Or the popular, "omg, its even thinner now! Apple is abandoning performance users!" while they literally made the GPU over twice as fast — sorry, this is not valid criticism, this is simply stupidity. Any person sufficiently familiar with technical details knows that these are incredible laptops and that they deliver insane amount of performance given their form factor and mobility.
Dunno, my laptop is very much fine in regards to all these issues (yes, I have tested it out quite extensively).
I think you are placing me in the wrong group here. Yes, I am a very performance-aware user. And I think that MBP is the best laptop on the market in its category. Of the closest competitors, the Surface Book suffers exactly from the issues you describe — cutting down the CPU, while Dell XPS does offer a better GPU, but instead sticks with entry-level CPU and uses a display that is not practical for a laptop due to its high energy consumption. If I want to stay mobile without sacrificing performance AND/OR the ability to connect my laptop to high-speed external storage, the 15" MBP is currently unmatched on the market — my opinion of course.
Why? That's not at all what I said, nor relevant. MP = Mac Pro.
Indeed, you're just further supporting my point - high-end machines are for a niche. I believe Apple will go down the route of more profitable, less powerful machines. These machines will be more than suitable for most people, and will likely be priced at a point where upgrading once every one or two years is feasible. This is how business works.
It's not how Apple's pricing is working, though. They were closer to that model years ago than they are now.
The MacBook is ~£1,000. The top iPhone goes up to ~£1,000, the iPad Pro goes up to £1,000.
All three products intended to be replaced after one or two years. Perfect cash flow model. The MacBook "Pro" doesn't fit this model and is targeted at an ever-decreasing niche. My point is, I'd be incredibly surprised if the MBP and MP lines don't fade away in coming years - the MP may already have gone.
The price points have gone up some on most of their laptop lines, not a move to cheaper. And they last for longer than a couple years.
And so too the iPhone and iPad pricing. And so too do the iPhone and iPad last longer than a couple of years - doesn't stop people refreshing every one or two years.
I'm waiting for this years MacBook Pro, but that's because I don't need a new one right now! My 2011 MacBook Pro is still working but does need replacing in the near future.
I wonder if Apple will add more features to the Touch Bar in the next MacOS update, will be interesting to see.
I wonder if Apple will add more features to the Touch Bar in the next MacOS update, will be interesting to see.
Hi there. Hope you are doing good
I’m aware that the 2016 MacBooks are an epic failure at least with the battery life.
Lol. Don't know about the 13", but the 15" has better battery life than the 2015. model.
At least the CPU will be way more power efficient if Apple is to planning for 32GB RAM(15") in such a thin machine.
The way I see it, battery life improvements and 32GB RAM will be the highlights for the '17 MacBook Pro. So, depending on how big of a priority those things combined are for you, I think you can answer your own question.
In terms of battery improvements, it was previously reported that Apple had planned a tiered battery design for the 2016 Pros, à la the MacBook, but it was scrapped due to production related issues. For those that don't know, the whole idea of a tiered design is to maximize battery real estate within the machine to increase longevity. I would be willing to bet that Apple is able to rectify any production-related issues and will be able to redesign the internal battery within the updated 2017 Pros, especially given so much of the negative press around the battery life; that's not just Consumer Reports, either. The cherry on top would be the implementation of IGZO displays, also previously reported, which would increase potential screen brightness and decrease power usage to power the display.
As many have pointed out, it's very likely that a 32GB RAM option in the 2017 Pros will decrease battery life, and I personally think that may very well end up being the case. However, with the potential for very significant battery life improvements via the previously 2 mentioned methods, I think it may end up being a moot point. Of course, there's always the potential for other new features to be introduced with new 2017 modes. However, battery life and 32GB RAM seem to be the only 'safe bets' at this point, given the rumors to this point and the press' reactions thus far.
In terms of battery improvements, it was previously reported that Apple had planned a tiered battery design for the 2016 Pros, à la the MacBook, but it was scrapped due to production related issues. For those that don't know, the whole idea of a tiered design is to maximize battery real estate within the machine to increase longevity. I would be willing to bet that Apple is able to rectify any production-related issues and will be able to redesign the internal battery within the updated 2017 Pros, especially given so much of the negative press around the battery life; that's not just Consumer Reports, either. The cherry on top would be the implementation of IGZO displays, also previously reported, which would increase potential screen brightness and decrease power usage to power the display.
As many have pointed out, it's very likely that a 32GB RAM option in the 2017 Pros will decrease battery life, and I personally think that may very well end up being the case. However, with the potential for very significant battery life improvements via the previously 2 mentioned methods, I think it may end up being a moot point. Of course, there's always the potential for other new features to be introduced with new 2017 modes. However, battery life and 32GB RAM seem to be the only 'safe bets' at this point, given the rumors to this point and the press' reactions thus far.
Depends, as long as the dev tool chain for ios is not ported to windows, Apple needs a Macbook pro line. As long as the machines sell (and heck even the 15 inch model atm sells like hotcakes, despite the ridiculous over the top pricing) they will produce them. Apple did a lot wrong with the MP but desktop machines are a fading market currently kept afloat by gamers machines (the only nieche where desktops are sold on rising numbers), a segment apple never really cared about. Add to that their braindead product policy of not allowing to extend machines. The MP never really fit into Steve Jobs - Jonathan Yves consumer electronics mentality of modern Apple. The last MP was a half assed attempt with a design which was designed to fail just to prove a point and let the line die. Apple usually either does silently discontinue a like (aka Airports, Mac Minus) or make one last half serious attempt to revive it (Mac Pro). I do not see that happening yet, with the Macbook pros.
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The battery strain of additional ram is rather neglectable. Higher display resolutions are a bigger problem. This might be the reason why Apple yet has not moved to 4k in their retina line yes. The difference between 4k and their retina resolutions is mostly neglectable on 15 and 13 inch screens but the impact on battery life is huge. Btw. the same goes for hdr, which sucks a lot energy (my tv basically needs 30% more energy in hdr mode)
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Actually the 13 inch version will benefit most by Kaby Lake. After all Kaby Lake is basically Skylake with an added HEVC core (which the 15 inch model can handle perfectly fine with the integrated gpu today) and a better frequency stepping algorithm to save a few extra % of battery life. So I do not see to much where the 15 inch model can benefit, Apple will probably sell it over additional extra options like 32 gig and a better battery design. But the 13 inch will finally get better HEVC support.
If I would be in the market of buying a 13 inch machine I definitely would wait for the Kaby Lake update. In the 15 inch case it is less a matter of really having to wait, but of if you benefit by longer battery life (due to a revamped battery design probably coming out in autumn)
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I wouldn't say it's neglect-able, but I get your point. There are certainly other areas which would impact battery life more than just the RAM. But, as has been reported, the KabyLake chip Apple is likely to use in the next-gen MBP will NOT support LPDDR4 natively, so it is something to consider when assessing battery life on these machines. To quote Phil Schiller on why 32GB was not included in the 2016 models, "To put more than 16GB of fast RAM into a notebook design at this time would require a memory system that consumes much more power and wouldn't be efficient enough for a notebook."
Now, I agree with you that battery life is probably the only reason Apple hasn't included a higher-res display in these notebooks. For most users though, I really don't think there's a tangible benefits to 4k panels at this point in time, which is probably why Apple is skipping them altogether. If 4K media were more ubiquitous, maybe, but it's just not at this point in time. And for Pros who really need the 4K panel, you can utilize a variety of 4K displays. Personally though, I think Apple is wise investing their time in ensuring these panels are as bright and efficient as possible (see: IGZO). Because, to me, these are more tangible, useful benefits to most users then just labeling the panel '4K'.
Edit: changed to LPDDR4
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That's extremely unlikely, as it would damage Apple's reputation and lose customers for all their products. The way to let a line die is to simply stop making it, not to put out one better in almost every way than its predecessor.
The problem isn't 32 GB, it's having to use desktop RAM to get to 32. That does use significantly more power.
Yeah, that's the problem. (It's LPDDR4 they've been waiting for.)
What people don't realize is that waiting for the 2017 it's possible Apple does offer 32 ram and yeah they might increase the battery size but it just might end up being a wash in the same battery times as the 2016 MBP. If your thinking Apple is going to claim 12 to 14 hrs on battery for 2017 your dreaming.
Not true.
Go check out the Intel web site and you will see the Kaby is not a huge improvement in CPU or battery consumption. What it is an improvement over the current model is graphics capabilities.
But this has been pointed out many times here on MR.
The way the 2017 will improve in battery life over the 2016 model is a bigger battery and or improved other hardware and not CPU performance.
So why wait for 2017?
1. Maybe 32gig of RAM, (for the majority if users this will never be used, but it sounds cool).
2. You can say, "I didn't buy the 2016 MBP!"