MP 7,1 MacpPro 2019 7,1 need advice for PCIe to USB A & C card

[Sean bh]

Just bought a new Macpro 2019 7,1.

Unfortunately, it has limited usb connections, almost halfof my old 2012 Macpro 2012 (although my old 2012 had only firewire 800 and usb2)

I normally buy all of my PCIE cards from OWC, but they do not have a combo and wanted to know if any one knows of these 2 cards and can give some opinions. I don't care to much for USB 3.2 Gen 2, since I don't have anything in my studio that uses it, but I guess it doesn't hurt to further future proof.

Here are the 2 I am looking at:

Inateck PCIe to USB 3.2 Gen 2 Extension Card with 16 Gbps Bandwidth, 6 USB Type-A and 2 USB Type-C Ports, RedComets U22

PCIe USB Card

www.amazon.com

PCI-E to USB 3.0 7-Port(2X USB-C - 5X USB-A) Expansion Card,PCI Express USB Add in Card, Internal USB3 Hub Converter for Desktop PC Host Card Support Windows 10/8/7/XP and MAC OS 10.8.2 Above

PCI-E to USB 3.0 7-Port(2X USB-C - 5X USB-A) Expansion Card,PCI Express USB Add in Card, Internal USB3 Hub Converter for Desktop PC Host Card Support Windows 10/8/7/XP and MAC OS 10.8.2 Above

www.amazon.com

 

[Matty_TypeR]

I use the top one in my 7.1 and it works perfectly, also use one in my 5.1 again works perfectly, just not as fast in the 5.1 but faster than USB 2 in the 5.1.

Good cards, with no issue's.

 

[choreo]

I have been using this card for USB expansion:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1442232-REG/sonnet_usb3_pro_4p10_e_allegro_pro_usb.html

I also still needed Firewire as I have about 20 external Firewire drives:

SIIG 3-Port FireWire 800 PCIe Adapter

Buy SIIG 3-Port FireWire 800 PCIe Adapter featuring Texas Instruments TI XIO2213BZAY Chipset, 3 x External FireWire 800 (1394b) Ports, Installs in Any Available PCIe Slot, Hot-Swappable, Onboard Power Connector, FCC, CE Certified, RoHS Compliant. Review SIIG null

www.bhphotovideo.com

Been using the above 2 cards for two years with no problems.

 

[zedex]

I break down usb add-in cards [pci-e] in to 2 categories. with switch AND without switch.

WITHOUT SWITCH: the two you are looking at fall in to this category. there are 40 different brands priced between $12 and $34 but they all do the same thing.. one channel of throughput at one lane of speed.
1 lane in the 5,1 is circa 385 mbps [max]
1 lane in the 7,1 is circa 770 mbps [max]

WITH SWITCH: Currently, only SONNET and HIGHPOINT make high quality PCI-e Add-In cards with integrated switches.

A switch allows you to use between between 2 and 4 lanes concurrently on these cards.

So connecting four USB3 SSDs configured in raid 0 will max out at 1500 mbps on the 5,1 (or 3000mbps with PCI-e 3.0).

My favourites are the SONNET ALLEGRO PRO mentioned above, the HIGHPOINT ROCKET U1144 or the ROCKET U1344

The CALDIGIT FASTA is also an excellent choice (but no longer in production).

The SONNET MCFIVER looks super cool. If i had a 7,1 i'd buy that for sure.

Check this one out....

 

[joevt]

Check this thread:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/usb-3-x-pcie-cards-for-classic-mac-pro.1501482/

macOS won't connect 20 Gbps devices (as far as I know - I haven't checked Ventura yet). USB 20 Gbps PCIe cards can still be used to connect USB 10 Gbps devices though.

The MacPro7,1 has PCIe gen 3 slots (8 GT/s per lane) so you can get full USB 10 Gbps speed from PCIe 3.0 x2 cards as long as the USB controller uses at least two PCIe 3.0 x2 lanes. PCIe 2.0 x2 and PCIe 3.0 x1 controllers will be limited to ≈800 MB/s instead of the max ≈1060 MB/s that you can get from a USB 3.1 gen 2 device.

 

[dominicperry]

Sonnet has a number of cards. Expensive but reliable in my experience.

Here's one - several others inlcuding an 8-port card on their website if you hunt around.

Allegro Type A USB 3.2 PCIe - Sonnet

Dominic

 

[kvic]

Sonnet has a number of cards. Expensive but reliable in my experience.

Here's one - several others inlcuding an 8-port card on their website if you hunt around.

Allegro Type A USB 3.2 PCIe - Sonnet

Dominic

Amazon has it for $50. Expensive for what the card has little to offer.

It's no better than a four-port USB 3.0 hub for less than $10, and costs you a precious PCIe slot on 7,1.

 

[zedex]

Kudos to @kvic - this is in line with the point I made previously. If you are going cheap - don't pay a brand premium.

The only differentiator on low end cards is the chipset and the port count. Given that ALL chipsets deliver on the USB 3 max data throughput promise of 5 GT/s (or about 465 mbps) just buy the card that gives you the port count (usually 2, 4 or 7) and type (A or C) that best meets your needs.

 

[dominicperry]

Well, there are two controllers on the card I linked to, so not the same as a $10 hub.

 

[jscipione]

The YEELIYA looks pretty good with 5 USB-A ports and 2 USB-C ports and a matching PCB but unfortunately the VL820 controller used by the 2 USB-C ports on that card is unsupported by macOS. The USB-A ports use a FL1100 chipset though so they should work. The Inatech RedComets U22 you posted uses the ASM3142 chipset which is supported by macOS as does the Sonnet card mentioned by others in this thread. The Sonnet card has several dedicated controllers on it which is why it is more expensive.

In general try to find a USB card that either uses the Frisco Logic FL1100 chipset or an ASMedia chipset as those are the ones supported by Mac OS X. The FL1100 is getting a bit long in the tooth these days and the ASMedia chipsets especially the ASM3124 support more features like higher USB 3.1 and 3.2 speeds.

 

[kvic]

Well, there are two controllers on the card I linked to, so not the same as a $10 hub.

Allegro Type A USB 3.2 PCIe - Sonnet has one FL1100EX chip. So only one controller, max speed 5Gbps aka USB 3.0 Super Speed. The card comes with PCIe 2.0 x1. The four ports share 5Gbps bandwidth.

'USB 3.2 Gen 1' aka USB 3.0. While Sonnet is not illegal calling this card 'USB 3.2', the dubious practice certainly confuses many consumers.

If you believe your card has two controllers, perhaps you linked to the wrong page.

 

[joevt]

Given that ALL chipsets deliver on the USB 3 max data throughput promise of 5 GT/s (or about 465 mbps)

The FL1100 USB controller is only PCIe gen 2 x1 which is limited to 4 Gbps. USB 3.0 is also limited to 4 Gbps (both PCIe and USB 3.0 use 8b/10b encoding) but PCIe has more overhead which means you can get slightly better 5 Gbps performance from a 10 Gbps USB controller than you can get from the FL1100 USB controller. Probably you won't notice a difference and can only see the difference if you use a benchmark.

 

[kvic]

The YEELIYA looks pretty good with 5 USB-A ports and 2 USB-C ports and a matching PCB but unfortunately the VL820 controller used by the 2 USB-C ports on that card is unsupported by macOS. The USB-A ports use a FL1100 chipset though so they should work.

Interestingly earlier version of the card seems to come with two Fresco Logic chips. One is FL1100, and the other is probably a Fresco USB hub chip. New version of the card comes with FL1100 and one VIA chip. I can't read the silk print from web pictures. If it's VL820, then it's actually a 10Gbps USB hub chip which _connects_ to FL1100. The total bandwidth is still limited by 5Gbps of the FL1100 controller

Kudos to @kvic - this is in line with the point I made previously. If you are going cheap - don't pay a brand premium.

I agree with your sentiment that buyers would have to access their need, and spend the money wisely. Given one 7,1 is $6000, perhaps it's wise to spend between 2% and 10% on a good USB expansion card. If you plan to invest $600+, then make sure you have such necessity and can utilise the bandwidth in daily tasks.

 

[Sean bh]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I have tried calling Apple tech support on several occasions and NO ONE knows anything about the speed of the PCie lanes. Port count is important, but this will be used in an Audio Post Production studio. I've read all of your posts and countless others and YouTube and still confused as to which one to get from my original post. Mostly other USB docks that I am using on my current 2012 5,1, Logitech 1080 camera, Midi keyboards, G-Technology 10TB G-DRIVE USB-C (USB 3.1 Gen 1), MIDI keyboards, etc.

I have about 5 USB devices and with my last 5,1 2012 Macpro I had to constantly unlplug and replug USB cables.


So can the 16 core of the new 2019 Macpro push out speeds to handle inateck 3.2? Or with the Innotech behoove me at all over the other 3.0 version?

 

[joevt]

Interestingly earlier version of the card seems to come with two Fresco Logic chips. One is FL1100, and the other is probably a Fresco USB hub chip. New version of the card comes with FL1100 and one VIA chip. I can't read the silk print from web pictures. If it's VL820, then it's actually a 10Gbps USB hub chip which _connects_ to FL1100. The total bandwidth is still limited by 5Gbps of the FL1100 controller

FL1100 is a PCIe USB controller.
VL820 is a USB hub which would be downstream of a PCIe USB controller. It would be kind of a waste to connect a 10 Gbps hub to a 5 Gbps controller.

 

[dominicperry]

Allegro Type A USB 3.2 PCIe - Sonnet has one FL1100EX chip. So only one controller, max speed 5Gbps aka USB 3.0 Super Speed. The card comes with PCIe 2.0 x1. The four ports share 5Gbps bandwidth.

'USB 3.2 Gen 1' aka USB 3.0. While Sonnet is not illegal calling this card 'USB 3.2', the dubious practice certainly confuses many consumers.

If you believe your card has two controllers, perhaps you linked to the wrong page.

Apologies, you are correct. The card I bought is this one, which does have 2 USB controllers, and is three times the price (in the UK).

Allegro Pro Type A USB 3.2 Gen 2 - Sonnet

Dominic

 

[jscipione]

FL1100 is a PCIe USB controller.
VL820 is a USB hub which would be downstream of a PCIe USB controller. It would be kind of a waste to connect a 10 Gbps hub to a 5 Gbps controller.

If VL820 is a USB hub chip then the YEELIYA would probably work fine. It's got a pcie x1 connector with a 5gbps controller which should work just a little slower yet it is cheaper and has a sleek black pcb. You could pay more for the Inatek with the x4 connection, the better power delivery circuitry and the faster 10gbps controller (advertised as 20.) but you'd have to suffer that red pcb.

 

[kvic]

You could pay more for the Inatek with the x4 connection, the better power delivery circuitry and the faster 10gbps controller (advertised as 20.) but you'd have to suffer that red pcb.

I think OP's use case won't benefit from power delivery. Anyway, YEELIYA is more honest in describing their card's power delivery capability: up to 15W per port; up to 60W combined total. INATEK is a bit dubious in their marketing speak. By looking at the PCB, I would say it's also up to 60W combined total, and up to 15W per port. So it's a wash.

If budget is limited, the INATEK card is an acceptable compromise for OP in my opinion. You get two USB controllers with a combined bandwidth of 20 Gbps, more ports (less plug/unplug), both Type-A & Type-C port (no need for converters), and best of all _at half the price_ of the two-controller offering from Sonnet (with way less feature).

With more budget, I would go Highpoint 4-port RocketU 1344A (all type-A) or 4-port RocketU 1244C (all type-C)... if you can still find them. Add one or two USB hubs as necessary for more ports and for both Type-A and Type-C.

 

[Sean bh]

I think OP's use case won't benefit from power delivery. Anyway, YEELIYA is more honest in describing their card's power delivery capability: up to 15W per port; up to 60W combined total. INATEK is a bit dubious in their marketing speak. By looking at the PCB, I would say it's also up to 60W combined total, and up to 15W per port. So it's a wash.

If budget is limited, the INATEK card is an acceptable compromise for OP in my opinion. You get two USB controllers with a combined bandwidth of 20 Gbps, more ports (less plug/unplug), both Type-A & Type-C port (no need for converters), and best of all _at half the price_ of the two-controller offering from Sonnet (with way less feature).

With more budget, I would go Highpoint 4-port RocketU 1344A (all type-A) or 4-port RocketU 1244C (all type-C)... if you can still find them. Add one or two USB hubs as necessary for more ports and for both Type-A and Type-C.

So i just go the Redcomets U22 card. What is the best PCIe slot to install this?

 

[kvic]

So i just go the Redcomets U22 card. What is the best PCIe slot to install this?

Redcomets U22 is a PCIe 3.0 x4 card. So insert it either in the x4 slot (which occupied already by the Apple I/O card) or one of the x8 slots.

 

[LeonPro]

^ Just install it below the Apple I/O card since the x4 PCIe slot is already occupied as mentioned.

 

[Sean bh]

So installing it on a x8 wouldn't increase or have better performance for the card?

 

[LeonPro]

So installing it on a x8 wouldn't increase or have better performance for the card?

No, the speed is limited by the slowest part of the chain.

e.g. Adding 4 lanes to a highway when there is only one car on the road will not make the car travel any faster than it's already going.

 

[kvic]

Redcomet U22 is an acceptable compromise for your usage of _everything_ taken into consideration in my opinion. You get the full aggregated speed you paid for the add-in card, a plentiful number of ports, a good mix of both Type-A and Type-C.

Also if the budget is higher (like triple the cost of U22), I would go for the 4-port 4-controller AICs from Highpoint or 4-port 4-controller equivalent AICs from Sonnet (seems unavailable or even more expensive? I didn't check). You'll get double the aggregated speed, no wasted bandwidth of a x8 PCIe slot, much more breathing room for full speed per port if you connect a couple of very high speed devices which I assume you don't (because audio devices aren't known for high bandwidth demand). However, since each port has its own controller, I believe you'll get better latency from your audio devices, which also means lower jitter. In general, lower jitter is gospel to audio devices.

As simple as USB AICs, it's an interesting optimisation game in both budget and performance in fixed constraints of 7,1.

 

[LeonPro]

I took delivery of this card yesterday from Amazon:

Sinefine PCIe to USB 3.2 Gen 2 Extension Card with 10 Gbps 5 USB A Ports, PCI Express to USB A Adapter Card, PCIe USB Motherboard Card for PC Desktop

Sinefine PCIe to USB 3.2 Gen 2 Extension Card with 10 Gbps 5 USB A Ports, PCI Express to USB A Adapter Card, PCIe USB Motherboard Card for PC Desktop

www.amazon.com

- I was looking at more expensive options like Sonnet, but didn't really need independent controllers as I would be using it for relatively slow USB devices like audio DACs, monitor hub, and a webcam (albeit a 4K Logitech). Faster connections like external hard drives will go through the USB-C port.

Plug-and-play. No issues with installing. It was showing up as a USB 3.1 Bus just like the internal ports in the Mac.

I used it to replace the CalDigit TB3+ Dock which I was unecessarily using and supplying power just for the said above devices. So that's one junk out of the cluttered desk.

- I was also looking at a card with more ports (i.e. 7 ports, 5 x USB-A + 2 x USB-C), but was hesitant on the arrangement of the ports which would be vertical. Also, I don't know how much more power these cards can take and draw from the PCIe slot.

Anyway, for those looking for a cheap solution. The above works great in my case.