MacWorld Expo!

[jessemann]

fine for making dvds of your gand kids...but help the working user

With all of this focus on video... why cant i have a realtime card that runs in osx for less than 1 grand? i think that apple has abandoned the pro user. at least the pro video user. A 17 inch powerbook is really useless to me unless i can do realtime compositing...and although apple likes to wave the "fcp is realtime" flag around...it isnt for professional users because fcp alone does not process video that is viewable on an ntsc monitor. the matrox rtmac still does not support osx and it is debatable that it ever will. my only option is an igniter card and for mac thats a grand easy. hate to say...editing pro dv on a pc is MUCH cheaper... and MUCh more expandable... upgradeable...

the pb/desktop systems would be great if there was realtime hardware. there isnt. if i can get paid for making home movies of my kids they would be great...but final cut pro should be called final cut home movie.

and realtime hardware literally saves 10-20 hours a week. but hey...i can have a 17" powerbook and leave the house! thats way better than a realtime desktop system...because when i make the smallest of compositing changes i will have the privilege of having an hour to consume a pot of coffee at the internet cafe while i wait for a render.

 

[matttichenor]

FCP Realtime

Give me the specs and the software / hardware pieces that is so cheap on the Windows Platform that also offers realtime Compositing? I'm not familiar with any cheap windows solutions that offer much better realtime previewing than what you get with FCP, for that price. $300.


m

 

[RogueLdr]

Re: nostalgia

Originally posted by spikeovsky


Hard Drive??? 120 Megs??? Luxury!
Now *I* remember when I got my external double-density floppy drive for my Mac Plus - before that, if a program couldn't fit on one diskette, it would take ages to load - I had sit there waiting for it to read data off one diskette, then eject it and ask me for the second one, then eject that and ask me for the first and so on. I can still remember sound of a Mac Plus ejecting a diskette - it haunts my dreams.

This is sounding rather like "Four Yorkshiremen", though the guy with the 8088 beats me - my first computer was the Plus, may it rest in peace. I got it confused with a 220 volt model I got when my school was throwing it out, and plugged it into a 220 Volt outlet. It ran fine for about 5 minutes until I heard a bang and smoke started pouring out the sides. That was a bad day .

-spikeovksy

LOL Bummer of a story there!

Both you and Tom800 reminded me of my old 20MB external SCSI hard drive that I had for my Mac+. It was about the size of a dictionary but I just KNEW that I would never be able to fill it up!
And I do know that sound from the FDD to which you are referring. It was anathema to playing Uninvited!

RL

 

[Deltan]

802.11g

I really don't mean to troll.. but...

I see people nattering on about AlBook specs, how neat Safari is, and iLife, but doesn't it piss you off that 802.11g isn't available to current ibook and tibook owners?

I'm absolutely livid!

 

[RogueLdr]

Re: 802.11g

Originally posted by Deltan
I really don't mean to troll.. but...

I see people nattering on about AlBook specs, how neat Safari is, and iLife, but doesn't it piss you off that 802.11g isn't available to current ibook and tibook owners?

I'm absolutely livid!

If you don't mean to TROLL, then try to avoid phrases like "nattering on."

[edit]And if it actually makes you livid, then you are not a troller but a concerned owner of a recent iBook/TiBook....right??? And doen't it just burn you that you can't put an AGP card in a B/W G3!

RL

 

[kmac]

I was very excited when I heard that there would be a sub-powerbook but after the release I'm thinking along similar lines as a few posts above that is it just an iBook in disguise?

My two biggest concerns are about the displays, personally I feel 1024x768 is just too small for OSX (it's plenty for windows but OSX just shines with more room) personally I think they could have gone with 13" wide screen, it'll only be increase very little width and not much else.

The second concern is the fact that there is no DVI out for external monitors, only VGA, would this be good enough for future Apple displays?

But all in one I'm happy with this macworld and I will definitely be buying many things including the powerbook, but I'm now just not sure if I should get the 12" or wait for the current 15" to be updated with aluminium, airport extreme and bluetooth (anybody cares to guess when they'll be updated?).

 

[Paul Turpin]

Well - with all you folks bitching about what the 12" lacks - let me tell you why I bought one :

#1 - I've been lusting after an iBook for months on end. But have held out. Now - I feel vindicated and will have (what I think) is a much cooler little toy.

#2 - there's just no bones about it - 802.11g is cool - and its a major draw for me. I foresee buying an airport extreme. But - I really want it for use away from home.

#3 - Smaller is better - tougher is better. I'm not using it like a desktop. I'm using it more like a palm that can actually do the things I want. I will aim to always have it with me - the coffee shop just got a lot more fun.

#4 - yes - I wish it had FW800 and DVI - but the point is using it on the go - not carting around screens and drives. However, I do wish I could fit a gig of RAM in it.

#5 - Maybe I'm wrong - but I think it'll still have a place next to that 17" PBG5 I'm gonna buy in a year.

Oh there's more - but you don't care. I'm voting yes. I just couldn't get excited about ibooks - and I tried. But - just the thought of whipping this out and fiddling around with it got me all hard - like a big shiny aluminum.......

oh yeah - this was my first post - hope it wasn't too annoying. I geeked out so much watching MWSF that I just had to join up.

 

[matttichenor]

15" Powerbook Updates

I'd imagine Apple will update the 15" Powerbook when the current inventory is eliminated. It is unusual for them to have such a sloppy upgrade, adding models but not updating others? Seems odd, must be an inventory thing. Maybe 1-2 Months before the whole line is updated. In the meantime the current 15" might get a price reduction in order to clear it out faster.

m

 

[msxgames]

Great but again prices...

All great stuff announced but once more (I know there have been a lot of discussions about this), in Europe we are again robbed...

At today's currency convertsion rates:
12": US price: $ 1,799 / Europe (apple.be): $2,391
That is a 32.9% price difference!

17": US price: $3,299 / Europe: $ 4,406
That is a 33.6% price difference!

OK, VAT would explain 20% maximum ... but FOR WHAT are the extra 13% ???

Hmm, it's always been like this - i'm better off to take a cheap plane ticket to the US, spend a nice w/e somewhere and come back to my home country with a new laptop ... and I still will have saved money!

------------------
Otherwise excellent new stuff! But I really dislike Apple's policy to get $$$ from whatever they can - I understand they develop good new innovative stuff but remember the rip off with OSX.1 couponing thing to get a free update when a new version would be available that actually cost $170 ! Well, Steve can say there are hundreds of reasons to switch to Jaguar but I won't until I buy a new Mac (in the States). A pity, I would have liked using all this new stuff!

 

[jessemann]

not sure what fcp express lacks...

not sure what fcp express lacks...but im assuming its pretty signifgant if those features are worth $700. If FCP express lets you edit as a pro and not just like a pro... then i do give big ups to apple. still... most pro users need realtime output to an ntsc monitor... and the rt cards are more available and cheaper on windows systems. i dont own a windows machine...but a client just got a 600 dollar new card from pinicale that offeres way more rt effects than rt mac (not that you can use it in xp) ..and wyswyg after effects...and it runs in xp... i was very...very jealous.

raid cards are cheaper... premire (although not my fav editing platfrom) is cheaper than fcp...

but hollywood fx and other compositing packages are much more available for windows. boris is nice...but its a complliacted interface and hard to get stellar effects on low scale jobs. apple needs to start making nice w/ pinacle or someone like them or making the products themselves. i thought w/ the aquisition of india titler pro we would see a fcp titler/ compositor.

i dont want a boring borg windows machine sucking the creativity out of my office... but i do feel unsupported with the lack of realtime hardware and compositing/ titling software.

 

[Deltan]

Re: Re: 802.11g

Originally posted by RogueLdr

If you don't mean to TROLL, then try to avoid phrases like "nattering on."

[edit]And if it actually makes you livid, then you are not a troller but a concerned owner of a recent iBook/TiBook....right??? And doen't it just burn you that you can't put an AGP card in a B/W G3!

RL

Yes, a recent ibook, like a few months old. Now who's nattering on, mumbling about b/w g3's.

Edit: now that the apple site finally works for me, it appears I was wrong about who can & can't use them. My bad.

 

[nickmcghie]

Re: Re: 12 inch Powerbook real disappointment

Originally posted by drastik


You don't seem to get the idea of an ultra-portable. Many business users need only the most basic funtions. What they need is small and light an durable. As far as this class of notebooks goes, this one is quicker, smaller, lighter and cheaper than the competition (sony, mainly.) People drop thousands on these things because they are tiny, not for DVI out and PMCIA cards. What do you need a card lot for on the thing. It has built in ethernet and modem, airport for wireless, bluetooth built in. all the ocnnections you could want. What do you need a card for?

is the new 12" powerbook small? yes, definitely... is it TINY and ULTRAPORTABLE? no way.. i mean, really, come on apple, if you wanna make an ULTRAPORTABLE, you might as well go all the way.

Go take a look at Toshiba's Portégé 2010, now *that* is a true 12" ultraportable. Except for the built-in optical drive, inferior video card, and (arguably) slower processor, it is similar to the 12" powerbook spec-wise (256 RAM, 12.1" 1024x768 screen, full-size keyboard, etc.)... plus, its got a PCMCIA card slot, a SD card slot, and built-in wifi (yes, i know its only 802.11b, but still.. its built-in).

And yes, the toshiba does cost $200 more than the powerbook, but its real sexiness lies in its SIZE. It weighs 2.6lbs and the thickness is listed as 0.6/0.75" thick (i'm not exactly sure what that means, but even if we take the larger number, 0.75", its still thinner than even an ipod!!!)... i've seen this machine in person, and it looks damn SEXY =)

I hoped that Apple would release a laptop to compete with the likes of the Portégé 2010, but the machines aren't really even in the same league. The Portégé is a true ultraportable while the powerbook is just a nice, small laptop. By releasing it the way they did (i.e. a "full-featured" laptop), it is now competing against the ibook AND the other powerbooks.

I'm not saying that its a "bad" machine, cuz it certainly isn't.. but it'll cannibilize sales of ibooks. Yes, I know that Apple will probably get higher profit margins from these new powerbooks, but they could've kept their ibook sales strong AND gotten into a totally new market. As the guy I quoted said, many business users need only the most basic funtions, such as email, internet, presentations, etc... therefore, power shouldn't have been the main issue in designing this new 12" powerbook, weight and portability should have. What I think Apple should've done: get rid of the optical drive (make it external), use a 1.8" hard drive, and make a true ULTRAPORTABLE... something under an inch thick and less than 3lbs.

but oh well.. here's to hoping that they will indeed release a true ultraportable sometime in the future

 

[RogueLdr]

Re: Re: Re: 802.11g

Originally posted by Deltan


Yes, a recent ibook, like a few months old. Now who's nattering on mumbling about b/w g3's.

First off, I'm sorry that there is no upgrade path for you iBook to move to APExtreme. I have run into Apple end-of-life technologies before (right after a big purchase) and I know how bad it can get.
But I must say that this does occasionally happen (as in the case of the B/W G3 and the lack of AGP expandability) and it seems that Apple's choices are either make the best product that they can with the most up to date technology or spend more money finding a way to make their new technology work with older systems. It looks like they went with abandoning the older tech (at least as far as a HW upgrade is concerned) this time.
I must say I am surprised at this development however. I thought that they would have been able to easily produce an APExtreme card that used the PCMCIA format. Perhaps there were extenuating circumstances that we are unaware of in the requirements of APExtreme?

RL

PS: I own a Gigabit Ethernet G4 and was hoping for a new card to pop in to go up to 802.11g myself and now I, too, am left out in the cold.

 

[JaseInNY]

FCPE vs FCP 4

Wow, FCPE has just been released, I really can't tell what the difference is with FCPE and FCP3 apart from the obvious that it is only DV. Having spent money on all the upgrades over the years from version FCP 1.25, it surprises me that us users of FCP 3 have not seen a release of version 4 alongside with FCE.

What worries me, is Apple on the same route as AVID? Is this a sign they are going to change there strategy? Are they on the way to releasing versions that only production companies, TV stations can afford?
That's what was so amazing about FCP, is the fact it is intergrated for all formats and it is up to the user to upgrade hardware to push it to the max. Avid cost's a fortune to own the top of the line "composer/symphony."

I am worried that I will not be able to afford the expected "amazing" FCP 4. Especially when it is my career/buisness using FCP.

What does this mean for the future release of FCP4? Any ideas?

 

[RogueLdr]

Re: Re: Re: 12 inch Powerbook real disappointment

Originally posted by nickmcghie


is the new 12" powerbook small? yes, definitely... is it TINY and ULTRAPORTABLE? no way.. i mean, really, come on apple, if you wanna make an ULTRAPORTABLE, you might as well go all the way.

Go take a look at Toshiba's Portégé 2010...

snip

You are right in that the toshiba is really light, but Apple seems to like to release fully featured machines. And for that weight savings with the toshiba you pay $200 more for no combo drive and no firewire ports.
There is the PCMCIA slot in the toshiba, but that means you can either pick a firewire card for CD reading/burning or a wireless card for connectivity.
If my options are either carry a really light machine that I have to carry alot of cards and a cdrw/dvdr drive with or just carry one machine for $200 less...I can deal with the "extra"weight.

RL

 

[Abstract]

Quote by Steve Jobs when talking to the audience:

"I read some of the rumor sites that said this is going to be the most boring Macworld in history," Jobs told the audience. "I guess you shouldn't believe everything you read."

Hmmm......he reads rumour sites. This probably means that the more "good" suggestions you make, the more you get of what you ask for.

 

[Deltan]

Re: Re: Re: Re: 802.11g

Originally posted by RogueLdr


PS: I own a Gigabit Ethernet G4 and was hoping for a new card to pop in to go up to 802.11g myself and now I, too, am left out in the cold.

Wow, that's worse than my own predicament. I'm debating whether to pawn my ibook on ebay for cheap and take the loss for a new AP Extreme ready or hope that -someone- comes out with an 802.11g adapter that either fits in the airport socket or I'd even settle for USB. Either way, it's ridiculous that every notebook, and desktop out there now that mac owns is completely unable to take advantage of 802.11g. I'm I setting myself up for a big fall in thinking that they might still come up with something for existing customers?

 

[nickmcghie]

Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 inch Powerbook real disappointment

Originally posted by RogueLdr


You are right in that the toshiba is really light, but Apple seems to like to release fully featured machines. And for that weight savings with the toshiba you pay $200 more for no combo drive and no firewire ports.
There is the PCMCIA slot in the toshiba, but that means you can either pick a firewire card for CD reading/burning or a wireless card for connectivity.
If my options are either carry a really light machine that I have to carry alot of cards and a cdrw/dvdr drive with or just carry one machine for $200 less...I can deal with the "extra"weight.

RL

understandable.. but for ppl like you, the ibook should do the job just fine.. but i'll reiterate the point i was trying to make: by releasing the 12" powerbook the way they did (i.e. a "full-featured" laptop), it is now competing against the ibook AND the other powerbooks... and apple STILL doesn't have a true ultraportable.. honestly, not EVERY SINGLE PERSON who buys a laptop needs it to be completely full-featured.. believe me, there *is* a market out there for people who can do without an optical drive on the go and just want the smallest, lighest, sexiest ultraportable they can get.

i think apple is in danger of getting into the trouble they had before steve jobs came back.. namely, too many similar models that created some confusion amongst consumers and inefficiecy for the company itself

(btw, as i mentioned earlier, the toshiba has built-in wireless, so you wouldn't need a wireless card for connectivity)

 

[RogueLdr]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 802.11g

Originally posted by Deltan


Wow, that's worse than my own predicament. I'm debating whether to pawn my ibook on ebay for cheap and take the loss for a new AP Extreme ready or hope that -someone- comes out with an 802.11g adapter that either fits in the airport socket or I'd even settle for USB. Either way, it's ridiculous that every notebook, and desktop out there now that mac owns is completely unable to take advantage of 802.11g. I'm I setting myself up for a big fall in thinking that they might still come up with something for existing customers?

Unfortunately when you patronize a company that makes most of its dough selling hardware, you have to expect that there will be lots of "incentives" to upgrade to the new hardware.
Does that mean that there is nothing other than that holding Apple back from doing an 802.11g card for the "old" Airport? No, it just means that there is some design advantage to using the new card format and Apple has no qualms in moving older lines (and yes, I know you purchased really recently, but at some point some part of a recent computer just gets outdated instantly) of of the front page of the support pages on their site.

RL

 

[RogueLdr]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 inch Powerbook real disappointment

Originally posted by nickmcghie



understandable.. but for ppl like you, the ibook should do the job just fine.. but i'll reiterate the point i was trying to make: by releasing the 12" powerbook the way they did (i.e. a "full-featured" laptop), it is now competing against the ibook AND the other powerbooks... and apple STILL doesn't have a true ultraportable.. honestly, not EVERY SINGLE PERSON who buys a laptop needs it to be completely full-featured.. believe me, there *is* a market out there for people who can do without an optical drive on the go and just want the smallest, lighest, sexiest ultraportable they can get.

i think apple is in danger of getting into the trouble they had before steve jobs came back.. namely, too many similar models that created some confusion amongst consumers and inefficiecy for the company itself

(btw, as i mentioned earlier, the toshiba has built-in wireless, so you wouldn't need a wireless card for connectivity)

The problem that Apple runs into is that they do not have the resources to cover every angle of every market. With that being the case they release a "top-end" solution for their laptops.
And yes, you are right, the toshiba has Wi-Fi compliance, but NOT 802.11g compliance or Bluetooth compliance.

And the lack of an optical drive necessitates either an external optical drive or a secondary desktop computer to offload files that are accumulated on the road with the toshiba. The 12" Powerbook lets you own only that one machine. The price is a steal!

RL

 

[peterjhill]

Re: X11

Originally posted by agp
Has anyone downloaded the X11 beta? Could someone tell me how I set the display in the xterm so I can ssh into a remote machine and run an app across the X Server? Cheers

ssh -X xxx.yyy.zzz

you might need to do a
setenv DISPLAY ip.of.your.mac

 

[peterjhill]

Re: Re: Re: Re: SAFARI

Originally posted by valypan

Originally posted by nickmcghie



yea i guess you're right, it IS an amazing first step, the ONLY thing i can see that is missing is tabbed browsing...

I could think of another couple of things: web pages passwords saved on Keychain (like with Chimera) and Auto Fill forms! Come on guys! lets start sending some feedback!

khtml is really konqueror, a kde browser. Check out the link below for pics of a recent patch that allows tabbed browsing. Did Apple release the source for safari? or just their changes to the rendering engine?

Yeah, autofill, I use it all the time, another thing is lack of certificate inport support of both site and personal certificates. Personal certificates are very nice. It is a way an enterprise can authorize users to corporate web sites.
http://www.konqueror.org/pics/tabbed.png

 

[peterjhill]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 inch Powerbook real disappointment

Originally posted by firestarter

Well the other PowerBooks need this too and they have DVI. DVI includes SVGA pins - all you need is an adapter. Looks like Apple have crippled this machine on purpose.

Why have a 4.6 pound ultraportable if you need to lug an adapter everywhere you go to connect to lcd projectors? There are plenty of LCD panels (maybe not made by apple) that accept VGA inputs. Dell (seriously) has a very nice LCD panel with vga, dvi, svideo, and composite video in.

I have an 800dvi tibook, and, though not as light as the 12" machine, lets me appreciate how light it is compared to my old pc laptop. If I could shed two pounds on it, I would. I know that you will probably say, it is only a few more ounces for the adapter, but it adds up. I think VGA is just fine. Thank goodness for dual display support.

I will also miss pc card support for digital cameras, this makes me wonder when they will build bluetooth into cameras. It runs at what, 1 mbps. So it would take about two minutes to transfer 128mb of pictures. That would not be too bad at all.

 

[firestarter]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: 12 inch Powerbook real disappointment

Originally posted by peterjhill

Why have a 4.6 pound ultraportable if you need to lug an adapter everywhere you go to connect to lcd projectors? There are plenty of LCD panels (maybe not made by apple) that accept VGA inputs. Dell (seriously) has a very nice LCD panel with vga, dvi, svideo, and composite video in.

VGA LCDs are noticibly poorer video quality and colour than DVI. Also, Apple don't make VGA LCDs. Does SJ want me to buy a Dell?

Seriously - the reason there's no DVI is either because of its poor graphics chipset, it's an iBook board in a metal box, or Apple marketing want you to spend more on a 15 inch - not because DVI is a bad idea on a laptop.

Oh yes - and you have to lug an adapter anyway - the VGA port on the PowerBook isn't a standard one!

I have an 800dvi tibook, and, though not as light as the 12" machine, lets me appreciate how light it is compared to my old pc laptop. If I could shed two pounds on it, I would. I know that you will probably say, it is only a few more ounces for the adapter, but it adds up. I think VGA is just fine. Thank goodness for dual display support.

You can get dual display with external VGA on the iBook. You just have to take out the bit of software Apple's marketing team decided to put in which cripples this line...

I will also miss pc card support for digital cameras, this makes me wonder when they will build bluetooth into cameras. It runs at what, 1 mbps. So it would take about two minutes to transfer 128mb of pictures. That would not be too bad at all.

You're welcome. I use 512M cards, and PCMCIA transfers a whole lot faster than 8minutes.

Let's reiterate - this is not an ultraportable. Ultraportables weigh much < 4 pounds. IBM, Sony, Toshiba ultraportables are all around 2-3 pounds. It's only around 100g less than the iBook.

What differentiates the 12 inch from the rest of the PowerBook line?

No PCMCIA
No DVI
No Cache (potentially slower than the 800MHz iBook, 'cos G4 needs cache due to longer pipeline)
No FW 800
No Gigabit ethernet
No Memory expansion over 640M
Slower NVIDA chipset than the iBook
DDR is a joke 'cos it's still G4 bus limited

And why is the PowerBook better than the iBook?

Slightly smaller (4mm less tall - I suppose Alu is thinner than polycarbonate)
100g lighter?
Bluetooth
Takes new Airport card
Possibility for superdrive
£350 more expensive in the UK.

The really interesting points with the new PowerBook are the 128M onboard RAM and the port layout.

Port layout is IDENTICAL to the iBook - very interesting - could this have been a motherboard intended for a different machine?

The 128M onboard is an example of Apple really abusing their users. The lowest spec 12 ships with 256M, so Apple could have soldered this onto the motherboard and let you upgrade to 768M. Why not?

Use of the 420 chipset is bad news (possibly this also explains lack of DVI - does the 420 support it?). Did Steve fall out with ATI, or is this a political move to get the Nvida FX parts early for the desktop range?

 

[artistry]

Why tabs are bad (runs and hides)

Originally posted by edvniow



I have to disagree with their logic on that.

The resason I use tabs is not because page rendering is slow, it's because it's a helluva lot more convienent.

...

Like I said before, it's so much easier and more productive to manage a group of tabs tather than a group of seperate windows, especially when you have little screen space to begin with.

Just been thinking about the tabs thing. I like tabs, so don't get me wrong here - just being devil's advocate

I wonder if tabs are a 'power user' type of thing? For the average user, might tabs be a bit confusing if they're used to windows opening for new sites etc? The 'open in new tab' command might not be as intuitive as we think. I'd like to see a 'normal' user attempt to use Netscape or Chimera's tab facility to see what they actually do.

If, as I suspect, they find it confusing, then Apple's stance is correct and should be applauded. However, they could always have it as an option (as, indeed, it is in the others - so what am I on about?)

But just wanted to point out that we aren't Apple's number one priority when they make these decisions and we, unlike a typical home user, know how and where to get hold of alternative browsers. In my experience, most computer owners stick with what came on their machine and very rarely update or change things like browsers (almost everyone I know is still on the Mac OS that shipped with their machine, for example). So Safari is aimed at a different market, maybe, and maybe they don't like tabbed browsing.

As I say, devil's advocate time...