Tell me... How is MacOS any more difficult for devs than PS5?....
You're really overplaying the notarisation thing here.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Major gaming news at WWDC: Metal and New games
- Thread starter Homy
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Tell me... How is MacOS any more difficult for devs than PS5?....
You're really overplaying the notarisation thing here.
Can you develop for Windows without Windows hardware either? Granted it is far more likely for you to already have a Windows box. But the argument is you need a Mac to create Mac is irrelevant. And you can certainly use development tools other than Xcode. I use Rider for my Unity project.
Yes in my lab I have all my old computers and graphics cards to test my current game. Mix of AMD and NVIDIA GPUs and older Intel and AMD CPUs.
Plus the compatibility layer is horrible on Linux for NVIDIA GPUs, I do not get very good results compared to native Windows versions of the game. You know the most common GPUs around that every single thread about gaming and Mac GPU keeps demanding "NVIDIA support".
Agreed. How is using Unity worse for macOS vs Windows development? In what way is macOS much much more difficult? Also, keep in mind Nintendo Switch is getting A LOT of ports of current gen games where they had to spend significant amount of time to downgrade graphics. Mortal Kombat 1, Doom 2016 etc.
So then explain it to me as someone who had to buy an Acer Predator Helios Neo 16" 4060 to game on due to the fact that none of the mainstream games work at all (or in the case of BG3, decently) on my 13" M1 Macbook Pro with 16GB of RAM? Apex, NOPE! Overwatch 2, NOPE! Outer Worlds, NOPE! Why don't they create these games for Mac?
Have you tried asking Respawn Entertainment, Activision-Blizzard and Obsidian Entertainment why?
Marketshare/Dev not being bothered... The main issue it's always been.
Since Apple Silicon 'weak GPUs' are no longer the excuse.
With BG3, I think you'll find it runs quite well on the M2/M3. But that game is only using Metal2 features, and sadly because the third party porting house they hired for the Mac version is based in Russia, they can't update things as fast as they would like to.
Well, the thing is both my M1 and my refurbed acer cost me less than an M2 or M3 Max...
Just makes me long for a time when Apple cared about more than just mobile gaming...
What am I saying? They have never really cared about gaming.
Last edited:
Oh Larian rehired them? I was under the impression that Larian was going to handle all of the macOS updates for BG3 from now on.
Na, they didn't. But they did say they were going to do the bare minimum updates for Larian. But I'm not sure if they're even doing those anymore.
Your Windows laptop plays more games than your M1/Therefore 'Apple doesn't care about gaming'.
Ok then.
Not just more. Better frame rates. Higher resolutions. No limitations or workarounds. The only reason that Macs game at all is due to the efforts of developers in spite of Apple.
Buddy, you’re arguing against your own argument!
Think on it long and hard before you answer me, and if you’re still unconvinced, I’ll walk you through it, step by step.
Only if you think that mobile gaming is real gaming. If so, then yes, I stand corrected. I, however, do not.
If by 'in spite of Apple' you mean 'actually bothering to develop their game for macOS' then OK. But what's your argument here?
I stated it. You agreed with it in your own way. My way is Apple is going out of their way to make it obtuse and different to develop specifically for MacOS. If they instead came to the table and worked so that cross platform approaches would work, then maybe I wouldn't need to have a second PC/laptop just for gaming.
But I don't see that happening. I say in spite of Apple, you say actually bothering to develop.
It’s starting to sound more and more like someone else who used to hang around here, m****y, constantly spamming threads with unfounded misleading posts.
Digital Foundry concluded that Resident Evil Village Mac and PC look practically identical with the same settings. The PC and Xbox X versions also look identical except for AA. The visual quality of Xbox X and PS5 is almost the same too. So saying the image quality of Resident Evil Village Mac is not even close to PS5 means the image quality of PC/Xbox X is neither close to PS5 and PS5 has vastly sharper image than PC/Xbox X which simply is not true.
Further more the poster takes for granted that you always have to use MetalFX in macOS. That is only needed on low-end Macs. RE Village runs perfectly fine with the same performance as PS5 and Xbox X on several Macs without MetalFX. Again DF ran the game at max settings and 4K without MetalFX at a stable frame rate of 50-60 fps on M1 Ultra. That’s only on the first gen Apple Silicon. We have also M2 Max/Ultra and M3 Max and soon Ultra. Note that the comparison before was made between PS5 and macOS, not any particular Mac.
Another misleading detail is again that macOS always uses or have to use MetalFX upscaling and PS5/Xbox X doesn’t. Both those consoles have to use Checkerboard rendering to achieve 60 fps at 4K. Although the result is very good and almost identical to 4K and CBR is not the same as upscaling the consoles rely on that feature while M1 Ultra mentioned above achieves the same result rendering fully 4K images. Therefore I see no problem in comparing the performance of consoles with Macs using MetalFX Quality, especially when DF found the quality of MetalFX impressive.
Then we have that argument again about Apple making it hard for everyone to develop and trying to force everybody into their HW and SW. The solution in other words is that Apple first should abandon their architecture, scrap Apple Silicon and go back to x86 CPUs from AMD, just like PS5 and Xbox. They should also scrap Metal and replace it with Vulkan and even macOS with a compatibility layer that can run both games and applications like Proton/Linux. In other words Apple should become just another PC maker. Well, I think we have enough of those. Anyone wanting that can buy PCs with Windows, AMD, Intel, Nvidia or Linux/Proton or the beloved Steam Deck. Why would we even need Apple anymore?
It amazes me every time and makes me wonder why people saying such things don’t do something constructive like contacting Apple with their ideas or even apply for a job there to make real changes. I guess it’s easier to have such creative and wild ideas about Apple’s business practices in internet forums than actually pitching them for Johny Srouji and Tim Cook. Imagine having a meeting and telling them straight up they should ditch their HW and OS and become another Dell. I would love to see their faces.
Last edited:
I was JUST about to post that in reply to their last post... It seems that's what they're implying, but won't outright say (I wonder why).
From recent reports from expert graphics tech developers like Sebastian Aaltonen, the Xcode GPU debugging/profiling tools are equal to the best console tools, and in some ways surpass them. In other words, as good as it gets.
There have been some super strange takes coming from these forums recently.
Thanks for the tip about Aaltonen. I'm going to use that in the future. To hear that from someone who has "over 20 years of experience in graphics programming" and "In the past have been working at Ubisoft and Unity building their cross platform rendering technologies" is vey interesting. Such a contrast to "Xcode is dog s***t".
Sebastian Aaltonen - MobyGames
Game credits, biography, portraits and other game industry information for Sebastian Aaltonen - MobyGames
Last edited:
I wonder if it is just marketshare. They shut down Apex Legends even on the huge mobile market that iOS and Android have.
Apex Legends Mobile is shutting down on Android and iOS in May
As a result of a recent loss in game quality, EA has made the decision to shut Apex Legends Mobile...
9to5google.com