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MBA overheating: important new insight!
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on the lap?
As someone seriously pondering an MBA purchase soon, am a bit worried about these overheating/performance issues.
On a slightly different tangent...has anyone actually used the MBA for long periods on their lap, that is, as a real laptop? A very large portion of my use would be on trains, sitting on top of my chinos or jeans (no thick wool skirt).
Any insight appreciated
As someone seriously pondering an MBA purchase soon, am a bit worried about these overheating/performance issues.
On a slightly different tangent...has anyone actually used the MBA for long periods on their lap, that is, as a real laptop? A very large portion of my use would be on trains, sitting on top of my chinos or jeans (no thick wool skirt).
Any insight appreciated
As someone seriously pondering an MBA purchase soon, am a bit worried about these overheating/performance issues.
On a slightly different tangent...has anyone actually used the MBA for long periods on their lap, that is, as a real laptop? A very large portion of my use would be on trains, sitting on top of my chinos or jeans (no thick wool skirt).
Any insight appreciated
I've used mine on my lap and it's hands down the coolest running laptop I've ever owned. The Air does put the "lap" back in laptop. Proc. temps. avg. in the 40ºs C so the case is a bit cooler. Used for up to 3 hours w. thin pants in lap without noticeably uncomfortable heat.
ok guys, don't blame me if this doesn't work for you, but I called Apple yesterday, and the very charming customer rep told me to do a permission repair.
Why didn't I think of that myself - all my issues seem to be solved now.
Why didn't I think of that myself - all my issues seem to be solved now.
trust me, if anyone is doubting that, it's me, I am still waiting for it to shutdown/act weird. any minute now.
Some new insight on the heat issue:
I connected my external sound card (Edirol UA-4fx, very basic one) to the MBA, and now the fan speed seems to go up even when doing very light tasks.
Previously my Air was very quiet, fan keeping steady at 2500rpm when doing the same kind of tasks.
It seems that the temperature goes easily higher when connecting external gear: monitors, sound boards, etc. So the heat issue might not be with the processor but the integrated chipset, with display/communication controllers. Some users here reported core shutdowns even when the CPU temp was around 75C?.. iStat doesn't show me the chipset temperature, but the heatsink temp seems to be higher now when I have the sound board connected.
Now the fan has been running constantly at 3500-4000rpm just typing this message, no flash banners on any page, no music playing, same room temp. I'd like to have a wireless sound card anyway but haven't found any suitable yet.
I connected my external sound card (Edirol UA-4fx, very basic one) to the MBA, and now the fan speed seems to go up even when doing very light tasks.
Previously my Air was very quiet, fan keeping steady at 2500rpm when doing the same kind of tasks.
It seems that the temperature goes easily higher when connecting external gear: monitors, sound boards, etc. So the heat issue might not be with the processor but the integrated chipset, with display/communication controllers. Some users here reported core shutdowns even when the CPU temp was around 75C?.. iStat doesn't show me the chipset temperature, but the heatsink temp seems to be higher now when I have the sound board connected.
Now the fan has been running constantly at 3500-4000rpm just typing this message, no flash banners on any page, no music playing, same room temp. I'd like to have a wireless sound card anyway but haven't found any suitable yet.
Please have a look at this thread and report your results:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/459306/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/459306/
external monitor
OK - it seems for me to be pegged almost entirely to using an external monitor, which I do every day for work. I can do most things ok using the built-in LCD, but if I plug in to any resolution external monitor with DVI and just play an album in iTunes with Large visualization on - no other significant programs running, no time machine on, etc. - I get a core drop before I finish a 45 minute album and the visualization starts to stutter.
Being that the computer has 3 ports, i'm a little annoyed that using one of those ports kills half my CPU... But at least now I have it pretty well proven, at least to myself. Back to the apple store in the morning for me; I'll present the Geniuses with my findings and swap this frustrating sucker for another and see what I can find. If anyone can try the same thing (plug into a DVI monitor, turn on Large visualization and play a 30-60 minute album) and report back on their results, that'd be very interesting to see.
OK - it seems for me to be pegged almost entirely to using an external monitor, which I do every day for work. I can do most things ok using the built-in LCD, but if I plug in to any resolution external monitor with DVI and just play an album in iTunes with Large visualization on - no other significant programs running, no time machine on, etc. - I get a core drop before I finish a 45 minute album and the visualization starts to stutter.
Being that the computer has 3 ports, i'm a little annoyed that using one of those ports kills half my CPU... But at least now I have it pretty well proven, at least to myself. Back to the apple store in the morning for me; I'll present the Geniuses with my findings and swap this frustrating sucker for another and see what I can find. If anyone can try the same thing (plug into a DVI monitor, turn on Large visualization and play a 30-60 minute album) and report back on their results, that'd be very interesting to see.
"that's a feature, not a bug"
Brought my MBA into the store, plugged it into an external monitor there and replicated the core dropping within 20 minutes for the genius. And he said - and I quote, "that isn't a failing, it's a feature."
Then i asked for a manager and swapped my MBA for a macbook standard.
The computer being single-core performant when I use it for anything intensive for more than 20 minutes on an external monitor is a "feature" I'd rather not have, and the MacBook has no such "feature" - it works with both cores, all the time, unless you do something really weird and outside normal operating parameters.
Shutting down a core is a feature if it happens when you misuse the computer -- eg using it in 120 degree weather in direct sunlight, or when you're blocking the exhaust port -- but under normal usage scenarios (watching a movie and playing some songs in itunes in clamshell mode for 30 minutes) I expect dual-core performance, as advertised. Thanks.
Guess I'll wait for MBA rev2.
Brought my MBA into the store, plugged it into an external monitor there and replicated the core dropping within 20 minutes for the genius. And he said - and I quote, "that isn't a failing, it's a feature."
Then i asked for a manager and swapped my MBA for a macbook standard.
The computer being single-core performant when I use it for anything intensive for more than 20 minutes on an external monitor is a "feature" I'd rather not have, and the MacBook has no such "feature" - it works with both cores, all the time, unless you do something really weird and outside normal operating parameters.
Shutting down a core is a feature if it happens when you misuse the computer -- eg using it in 120 degree weather in direct sunlight, or when you're blocking the exhaust port -- but under normal usage scenarios (watching a movie and playing some songs in itunes in clamshell mode for 30 minutes) I expect dual-core performance, as advertised. Thanks.
Guess I'll wait for MBA rev2.
Did you try same test with any of their display systems? I find it appalling they would explain it away like that but then again, I haven't been impressed w. many of the Apple employees I've spoken to either.
Hope your MB works great!
Reading that got my blood pressure up. I am really sorry man, hope everything is better with your macbook - it's a great machine too!
Reading that got my blood pressure up. I am really sorry man, hope everything is better with your macbook - it's a great machine too!
I'm really liking my macbook standard, it just feels like a brick after the Air - it's a full 66% heavier
LCD isn't as nice, either.And the technical problems themselves aside, in general the service I've gotten has been solid. I didn't have to raise too big of a stink for them to exchange my (technically out of return period) Air for a brand new macbook plus a bunch of store credit (since i had bought my original one online). So I'm still satisified with my overall Apple experience, especially when compared with what i've had with any of a half dozen PC manufacturers' support lines, RMA processes, etc.
If you're having similar issues, just be firm about wanting an exchange or return when you bring your computer in and not letting them stonewall you on it being "proper MBA behavior."
oh I already got my return acknowledge, I just told them I was sick and tired of dealing with the troubles. They were cool about it, just as you are used from Apple.
Apart from the thinness and lightness, the thing I'll miss the most is this gorgeous keyboard, so much nicer than the one on the pro.
Apart from the thinness and lightness, the thing I'll miss the most is this gorgeous keyboard, so much nicer than the one on the pro.
on my first vacation w/ mba and it is a joy. watched a 2 hr movie full screen (itunes download) and no heat issues at all...movie never skipped a beat once.
having the mba on a plane makes it worth every cent.
btw to address earlier post about heat. i've owned 6 laptops over the past 5 years and this is by far the quietest and COOLEST I have ever owned...period.
having the mba on a plane makes it worth every cent.
btw to address earlier post about heat. i've owned 6 laptops over the past 5 years and this is by far the quietest and COOLEST I have ever owned...period.
Hello,
Sorry for the really long post but i really want to get to the bottom of this as i really like my air!!
I have been following the over heating topics very closely. I still decided to give the macbook air a shot. Tonight was my first night with the air. I cant get the core to shut down on youtube or imovie (even had several apps going). This maybe because I have not been using it long enough. I down loaded a shareware card game from the apple site called "Solitaire Epic". Since I have been following this problem I have had activity monitor open the whole time. Without fell the sec core will shut down ( might take longer if the air is cold). I did not even notice a lag as the game takes almost no CPU. I looked over and saw that the sec core stopped fluctuating. I tested the dock just to make sure. Sure enough the core was shut down and the dock wasn't as fluid as normal. Here is the weird part the sec i close the game the core turns back on regardless of the temperature readings!! I even tried with youtube open playing a video ( excellerates the shut down while playing the game?). As i played i monitored the temperatures the CPU didn't go too high 70 max. The temp would dip back down to like 69, the youtube video would stutter as the core shut down, fans were at max ( in a well ventilated space on a desk). The moment I closed the solitaire epic ( I mean instantaneous) the core would turn back on and the youtube video would begin to play normally regardless of temperature!!!!.. This however did not work in the opposite manner if i shut down only youtube the core remained shut down untill i closed the solitaire epic game. Not computer savvy just a researcher so i am good with the experimenting but have no idea about these results. So this lead me dow another path. I also own an imac G5 rev c with the camera, anyways i had open photo booth open to the comic effect and left to go eat when i came back my GPU temp was 95 C i have never seen it passed 45 c. So i did another test after the core shuts down with the solitare game I close it and the core started back up i then right away opened photo booth and put it on the comic effect less the 30 sec the core shut down again. Once again the moment I deselected the comic effect or closed photo both the core would start back up again. I do not know if this is a deal breaker for me as I don't know what apps will cause her to shut her core down ( hope i can video chat ). This is my third mac and it steals the sweetness from me I hope this helps, try downloading the game and trying it out. Once again this was in a well ventilated area with the vents unblocked. Hopefully this can be fixed in a software update? Do y'all feel that this problem could cause hardware to fell sooner then it should? I guess the GPU was meant to only bursts of processing? BTW the air was plugged in the whole time!
Sorry for the really long post but i really want to get to the bottom of this as i really like my air!!
I have been following the over heating topics very closely. I still decided to give the macbook air a shot. Tonight was my first night with the air. I cant get the core to shut down on youtube or imovie (even had several apps going). This maybe because I have not been using it long enough. I down loaded a shareware card game from the apple site called "Solitaire Epic". Since I have been following this problem I have had activity monitor open the whole time. Without fell the sec core will shut down ( might take longer if the air is cold). I did not even notice a lag as the game takes almost no CPU. I looked over and saw that the sec core stopped fluctuating. I tested the dock just to make sure. Sure enough the core was shut down and the dock wasn't as fluid as normal. Here is the weird part the sec i close the game the core turns back on regardless of the temperature readings!! I even tried with youtube open playing a video ( excellerates the shut down while playing the game?). As i played i monitored the temperatures the CPU didn't go too high 70 max. The temp would dip back down to like 69, the youtube video would stutter as the core shut down, fans were at max ( in a well ventilated space on a desk). The moment I closed the solitaire epic ( I mean instantaneous) the core would turn back on and the youtube video would begin to play normally regardless of temperature!!!!.. This however did not work in the opposite manner if i shut down only youtube the core remained shut down untill i closed the solitaire epic game. Not computer savvy just a researcher so i am good with the experimenting but have no idea about these results. So this lead me dow another path. I also own an imac G5 rev c with the camera, anyways i had open photo booth open to the comic effect and left to go eat when i came back my GPU temp was 95 C i have never seen it passed 45 c. So i did another test after the core shuts down with the solitare game I close it and the core started back up i then right away opened photo booth and put it on the comic effect less the 30 sec the core shut down again. Once again the moment I deselected the comic effect or closed photo both the core would start back up again. I do not know if this is a deal breaker for me as I don't know what apps will cause her to shut her core down ( hope i can video chat ). This is my third mac and it steals the sweetness from me I hope this helps, try downloading the game and trying it out. Once again this was in a well ventilated area with the vents unblocked. Hopefully this can be fixed in a software update? Do y'all feel that this problem could cause hardware to fell sooner then it should? I guess the GPU was meant to only bursts of processing? BTW the air was plugged in the whole time!
I have the core shutdown too, but only when watching videos, which then start to stutter.
What happens is: one core shuts down, and the process "kernel_task" shoots up (from ~5% when both cores are active) to 60-70% CPU usage.
This is the reason why the videos become jerky, there's simply not enough CPU power left.
But why does the kernel_task get so high? And does this happen with you, too?
EDIT: Weird thing is: when I stop the video, it takes only about 1 second and the second core is active again. This can't be the temperature, it would go down so quickly.
What happens is: one core shuts down, and the process "kernel_task" shoots up (from ~5% when both cores are active) to 60-70% CPU usage.
This is the reason why the videos become jerky, there's simply not enough CPU power left.
But why does the kernel_task get so high? And does this happen with you, too?
EDIT: Weird thing is: when I stop the video, it takes only about 1 second and the second core is active again. This can't be the temperature, it would go down so quickly.
No i dont have that problem with the kernel task. I can be doing alot of CPU stuff like watching HD videos in itunes and be watching a youtube videos all at the same time. I have yet to see the core shut down while doing that (even when its on my lap). The core only shuts down when its a GPU issue like Photo Booth effect or something like that. Should i try to get a replacement. I have only had it a day and it came preinstalled with 10.5.2. so its a newer one i think. I am just wondering if they all have a core shut down problem just not many people have used the GPU non-stop for awhile which will cause this problem. Try that card game I talk about and see as it takes no CPU but still the fan rev high and if you play a couple of games and see if it starts to lock up. I does happen quicker if the Air is already really warmed up.
Oops, I forgot to add that the core shutdown only happens when watching video on an external display. It doesn't matter, if the internal screen is active or not or if the lid is closed or not.
The most probably thing is that the core shutdowns isn't core shutdowns, because the Intel processors has no such feature. More likely it's only a buggy Intel graphics driver that is causing this issue.
All thermal throttling on the processor is achived by lowering clockspeed or pausing processing for short periods, no core shut down is possible.
All thermal throttling on the processor is achived by lowering clockspeed or pausing processing for short periods, no core shut down is possible.
had first overheating problem the other day. was simply typing on word and the thing heated up to around 170-180 F within minutes and wouldn't cool off. Vents weren't blocked, it was simply sitting on a desk. And the worst part was that it killed the battery when it was overheating, i had a full charge and it gave me a life of about an hour and a half. I kept it on for about 45 minutes (was taking notes in class and couldnt turn it off) and shut her down. Booted it back up later on in the day and it's worked fine ever since. Not really sure what happened but it does kinda scare me that its gonna keep doing this and eventually do damage to itself.
