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viacavour

macrumors 6502a
Mar 22, 2012
636
0
Microsoft shouldn't be any different. Age of Empires shouldn't be different. But Office is different from any other program/suite. Having Office on the iPad (and I mean real Office that doesn't barf at any existing Office document) would be a really big deal for the iPad. If I were Apple I would do almost anything to get a good version of Office available for the iPad. Except tell anyone that that's what I was doing. It would of course kill the Surface stone dead, so I have no idea what Microsoft is really trying to do, unless it already knows this.

That's what people think, but MS is smart enough to just make it into a lite version. The Surface Office app is the real deal. Only on Win 8. I don't think they will update the Mac version to keep up with Win 8 too.

Do one thing more strategic with Apple, then they will talk again.
 

redkamel

macrumors 6502
Aug 29, 2006
437
34
Well, I got tired of using Office...Outlook had nothing to offer me . I don't like Excel on Mac. Windows was just ok. Powerpoint is boring.

On the other hand Keynote is awesome, Pages looks much cleaner, and Numbers seemed ok for what I do with it (minor work). Mail is great. I switched. So did one of my bosses and all his staff.

I don't think companies are switching to iOS/OSX. But a lot of people are switching at home. And in college, you used to have to be familiar with Excel. Now people are familiar with Excel, google docs, and Numbers, to a degree all at the same time. Its really all the same. Many people are realizing they don't need Office...there are viable, cheaper alternatives.

My old roomate was trying to get her small business to work on Excel on her ipad for edits. It didn't, really. So I advised her to switch to Numbers, or to just view documents and edit later. She switched to Numbers. Some learning curve, but with google, trouble shooting takes 30 minutes.

All it takes is a higher up (like in my case) to say "Use the Apple Suite or Google docs, no need for Excel" and its done.

Apple doesn't have to play ball with Microsoft. Time is on their side. Office is no longer a "killer app".
 

HenryDJP

Suspended
Nov 25, 2012
5,084
843
United States
i want imcrosoft one note for mac, is it coming out yet??

Oh please, Evernote kicks the crap out of One Note, especially since it's very Mac/iOS centric and is syncs everything from the cloud free of charge. Funny, Microsoft knows how to make their customers feel that nothing is better than what they offer in software when it simply is far from the truth. Never missed One Note, never will.
 

MacDav

macrumors 65816
Mar 24, 2004
1,031
0
Microsoft shouldn't be any different. Age of Empires shouldn't be different. But Office is different from any other program/suite. Having Office on the iPad (and I mean real Office that doesn't barf at any existing Office document) would be a really big deal for the iPad. If I were Apple I would do almost anything to get a good version of Office available for the iPad. Except tell anyone that that's what I was doing. It would of course kill the Surface stone dead, so I have no idea what Microsoft is really trying to do, unless it already knows this.

It seems that you are saying: Microsoft shouldn't be any different, but with the exception of Office. I agree having office on iOS would be a very good thing for Apple. Whether it is so good that they should make an exception seems like a slippery slope that would have long term negative consequences.
 

AppleScruff1

macrumors G4
Feb 10, 2011
10,026
2,949
I know it must be hard for you to focus, but we are talking about the fact that every other App. developer on the planet pays 30% to be part of the iOS ecosystem. Why should Microsoft be any different? We are not discussing other avenues of business. If you would like to talk about some other aspect of the Apple business environment then start another topic for discussion. This topic is about whether Microsoft should pay the same amount as everyone else. If you disagree with the idea that they should pay the same as everyone else, then please give some intelligent reasons as to why this should be so. Otherwise don't bother to respond and waste my time.

I didn't insult you, but you just insulted me again. Good job.
 

HenryDJP

Suspended
Nov 25, 2012
5,084
843
United States
Well microsoft, use this to your advantage.

Release Office only for mobile windows and leverage that face: MS office available only on microsoft powered phones and tablets, great for businesses and consumers alike. The best compatibility between your desktop and tablet, at a level iOS cannot achieve.

Well at least everybody here knows where your heart is...;)
 

viacavour

macrumors 6502a
Mar 22, 2012
636
0
To be clear, it is a limitation of the iOS billing system. But MS should have started the talk much earlier or have a plan B to use the existing scheme first.

Even if Apple has a developer platform review and update, they will do it with the entire base, and maybe in their event. MS could ride along like their appearance in old Mac events.

This sort of things need to be planned out together and harmoniously. Just because Xbox next is late, and Surface didn't pick up doesn't mean the whole world has to follow MS.

If Apple make concession to MS, their dev base may revolt. They need to be prepared for the change for everyone. Holidays may be too risky since the marketing and finance people will be swarmed. They need numbers from the new 52 countries to decide how best to proceed.

Do something strategic with Apple. They will help out if it makes sense to their users and doesn't pawn their platform away.


What ever happen to old school business sense ? I blame the management by quarterly paper money approach, and the stupid media for fanning rivalry.
 
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MacDav

macrumors 65816
Mar 24, 2004
1,031
0
I didn't insult you, but you just insulted me again. Good job.

So no reply about the topic of discussion? Just a response about you being assailed by my vicious attacks? Tell me why Microsoft should pay less than everyone else. Other people have replied and given some good reasons. Apparently you would rather play victim than actually think and respond.
 

Glideslope

macrumors G3
Dec 7, 2007
8,011
5,466
The Adirondacks.
Come on!!!!!!!!!!!

Microsoft can still play a role in todays world. But not with Ballmer in charge,
or crapware like WIN8 RT.

70% Steve. Take it. You're in a dream world. :apple:
 
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ScooterLibby

macrumors member
Jun 24, 2010
54
0
Would anyone who wants to use Office 365 on an iOS device really be deterred by having to use a traditional computer or a non-iOS handheld to buy their subscription? Are there any would-be Office users who have only an iPad?

Just asked my wife a minute before I read your question what made her keep her crappy laptop around instead of using only her ipad and the answer was MS Office, so your N size is at least one.

I maintain a PC because I like building and gaming with them, but Office would also be an important feature for me if I went ipad only.

People can disparage these preferences for a variety of reasons, but MS wouldn't be pursuing this if I didn't know there was a market for this.

Now if only we could get SAS on an iPad, that would be this nerd's dream. Not seeing the market demand for it, though.
 

Blakjack

macrumors 68000
Jun 23, 2009
1,806
319
Microsoft, you're going about this allll wrong. 30% is fair. Plus, Apple is doing just fine without office. Wht makes you think they should fix something thats not broke by giving you a discount?

But I understand......You have to try. I get that.
 

Ryth

macrumors 68000
Apr 21, 2011
1,591
157
No. I can ask the guy who made a claim to back up his argument with proof.



"reams of paper" is not a Microsoft application. I asked the other guy to validate his argument that companies are moving from MS to iOS. Companies replacing paper with iPads is not moving from MS to iOS

We're using Keynote/Numbers...have no issues with them on iOS or OSX. Lots of people use Google Docs.

MS is not needed. It's just a suite that many people are brainwashed into thinking they need to have..when you show them other options that work and they actually try to use them.

It's just that MS has created this stigma that you cannot survive without them in the workplace and that is just absolutely false.

But if they want to put out an iOS app to make people feed secure and comfortable, then honestly they should...because they'd make a ton off people that don't educate themselves on other solutions...just like MS has done in the corporate and government sectors.
 

viacavour

macrumors 6502a
Mar 22, 2012
636
0
Just asked my wife a minute before I read your question what made her keep her crappy laptop around instead of using only her ipad and the answer was MS Office, so your N size is at least one.

I maintain a PC because I like building and gaming with them, but Office would also be an important feature for me if I went ipad only.

People can disparage these preferences for a variety of reasons, but MS wouldn't be pursuing this if I didn't know there was a market for this.

Now if only we could get SAS on an iPad, that would be this nerd's dream. Not seeing the market demand for it, though.

We need to see it in action first. The RT Office is more full featured but has issues. The iPad one is said to be lighter weight. Hopefully it has some killer features.

They should let us see it before rallying for support. Right now all we have is just the standard rev share model. And then what ?
 

Black Magic

macrumors 68030
Sep 30, 2012
2,789
1,502
Microsoft and Office aren't the end all be all they used to be. Office just isn't really needed anymore. I say this and people jump out clamoring about how many businesses still use it and all that mess. The truth is this. We can live just fine without Office. In fact, all the iPad users have been doing it for years now. Is there really someone that grabs a tablet and starts typing up a 20 page document? Is there really a dying need for Office?
 

KdParker

macrumors 601
Oct 1, 2010
4,793
998
Everywhere
Microsoft shouldn't be any different. Age of Empires shouldn't be different. But Office is different from any other program/suite. Having Office on the iPad (and I mean real Office that doesn't barf at any existing Office document) would be a really big deal for the iPad. If I were Apple I would do almost anything to get a good version of Office available for the iPad. Except tell anyone that that's what I was doing. It would of course kill the Surface stone dead, so I have no idea what Microsoft is really trying to do, unless it already knows this.

Good point, maybe that is why they are looking for the better split.
 

Puevlo

macrumors 6502a
Oct 21, 2011
633
1
Rules are rules. They have to apply to everyone equally. That is why Apple pays the same rental rates as everyone else for their Grand Central retail store. Right?
 

faroZ06

macrumors 68040
Apr 3, 2009
3,387
1
Microsoft should go to Cydia with it... :p

And start jailbreaking phones at the microsoft store... :cool:

Too bad the iPhone 5 and 4S running iOS 6 can't be jailbroken :(
I hope the hackers hurry up with this.

----------

there is no need for MS Office for most people. most people can do just fine with Pages/Numbers/Keynotes.

just like most people can do just fine without rooting their phone/tablet. only the hardcore need Office or Android.

Apparently, doing graphs with best-fit lines and all of the settings you need is just too hardcore for Numbers. But Pages and Keynote are better than Word and PowerPoint (not to mention more stable).

----------

Not at 100% compatibility you can't and good for only fairly simple documents. A mobile MS Office could offer more functionality and more compatibility with the desktop version... but if this works for you then fine, it won't work for everyone.

iWork on iOS works seamlessly with iWork for Mac. The big problem comes when I have to do a spreadsheet and find that Numbers is too much of a joke to do it, so I have to use Excel, and the Excel document formats differ slightly between versions, then Excel crashes 3 times, and I can't put subscripts in the chart titles in my specific version...

Seriously, all Apple has to do is fix Numbers, and I'll never touch Office again.
 

maattp

macrumors newbie
Aug 5, 2011
20
33
Can't they just make it a basic "free" app but then require you to have a MS account to get the good features? Why can't they just bypass payment through Apple altogether? Similar to how if I download the Dropbox app with a free account I only get 2 GB, and if I want more storage I deal with Dropbox directly and not Apple.
 

bungiefan89

macrumors 6502a
Apr 5, 2011
565
76
Financial institutions around the world have no problem with Excel, graphs and labels.
Well, I'm not a financial institution. When I make a graph, it's to highlight differences in points of data to explain things to a wide variety of people... not give a board of directors something to boast about at their next golf game.

Listen, Excel is fine but it's also the EASIEST solution for giant corporations to use. It's easy for them because they just tell all their employees to use this particular software and it becomes a human resource no different than staplers and paper. It gives the people up on top control over the work their workers do. Fortunately, I haven't sold my soul to such an organization (yet) and I'll tell you now there are PLENTY of alternatives to Microsoft Office that do everything it does and more... and more often than not they are cheaper alternatives. ;)
 

linuxcooldude

macrumors 68020
Mar 1, 2010
2,480
7,232
MS is trying to use Win8 to merge mobile and desktop ecosystems together, which would liberate mobile devices from their budget ecosystem. If they're successful, they're a threat to both iOS and Android. Apple has no easy way to merge iOS and OS X, they'd have to blow it all up.

If the Surface Pro fails though, MS loses its leverage

I don't think Apple wants to merge iOS & Mac OSX. I think they want them to comunicate with each other seamlessly through iCloud. I think thats why we are seeing very simular apps like notes, reminders, calendar ect. on both platforms. So switching to a desktop once you get home when you were using an iPad on the subway is seamless. Or vice versa.

I think Microsoft had a knee jerk reaction with competing with tablets so they put a tablet interface to windows 8 to get people interested. But I think its giving a reverse reaction.
 

Mak47

macrumors 6502a
Mar 27, 2011
751
32
Harrisburg, PA
It may be easy to do business with iPads and iPhones, and they may suit you and lots of people for productivity purposes. However, most large companies will not even consider iPads and iPhones without being able to count on Microsoft Office. The real thing, not some replacements or alternatives. They'll just continue using Windows PCs, which will not be threatened by the iPads, no matter how popular they become.

I've seen this argument over and over again, and as far as PC replacement is concerned you and everybody else who makes it is right.

However, you're all missing the point of the iPad and iPhone and why they are growing for businesses.

First, iPhone has already been adopted by businesses and is the dominating force as far as enterprise smartphones are concerned. The primary concern here is email, calendar & contact access. Nobody is editing documents on 3.5-4" screens and they're not relying on them to view documents either. Existing apps that allow users to view these documents in a pinch are more than satisfactory.

Some people view the iPad as a replacement for a PC, others don't. Many view it as an additional piece of equipment and issue both a laptop and an iPad to their employees. More common however is employees buying their own iPads and using them for work, also called BYOD. They seek out the applications they like and use them as they please. Software choices are not forced on them by their IT departments.

iPads that are issued by companies are often used for things other than what conventional PC's are used for. They give the user access to an entire library of things like catalogs, PDF documents, photo galleries, video demos and the like. The devices are much easier to use for sharing things like these with customers and partners than a laptop could ever hope to be. The battery lasting all day long is a major positive as well.

A lot of companies issue laptops to employees instead of desktops now. This way the employee can have a full PC while they're at the office, but can also move to different rooms or take the work home with them.

Many people assume companies are choosing a desktop, portable computer and a smartphone. I'd say this is inaccurate. Portables are replacing desktops.

Microsoft Office for iPad would be welcome by many I'm sure, but not having it isn't going to keep iPads out of enterprise. They're already there and the people who use them love them. The same can't be said for their Windows PC's.

A reasonably priced MS Office application would likely be bought by most iPad owners, but it's not going to be a deal breaker for most people. If it is, it's just the first reason on the list of reasons not to buy one. Once it's available, they'll replace that with another reason.

What Apple really needs to do here is do a better job of promoting awareness of iWork. Most people don't even know what it is, but if they actually tried it (particularly for Pages and Keynote) they'd never go back to Office again.
 

chagla

macrumors 6502a
Mar 21, 2008
797
1,727
Touché !

Rules are rules. They have to apply to everyone equally. That is why Apple pays the same rental rates as everyone else for their Grand Central retail store. Right?

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/apple_bidder_taste_qywMqXxdu4TFd6OuGAALwO

MTA gave Apple unfair edge for Grand Central shop, state audit says
‘Unfair’ GCT edge

Apple even tried to get reimbursed by taxpayers for the initial $2 million it had paid the restaurant Metrazur to vacate the balcony atop the historic commuter hub, the report found

really Apple? quite pathetic.
 
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