Microsoft Announces Intel Atom-Based Surface 3 With Windows 8.1 for $499

[bkkcanuck]

This has already started happening to me. For a variety of reasons I'm finding myself using my Acer Aspire Switch 11 more and my iPad and MBA less. (pretty surprising to me since my MBA is my best notebook ever)

It will be a while before I consider an S3 (it would cost me $750 for a Surface 3 configuration that I have with the Switch 11 @ $449) but there is growing interest for me to switch back to Windows... part of it has to do with available devices, other reasons have to do with how the environments are handled (including "forced" upgrade to iOS 8 on my iPad 4, "pressure" to upgrade to Yosemite on my MBA and iMac)

[Off-topic now] I am one of those that falls into an either or category but rarely both at the same time. I went with an iPad that I am still happy with for what I bought it for, which is primarily media consumption while on short trips with some social media and emailing (but not much typing) and flashcards (which work better on my tablet) - which is what the iPad was designed for. However I may be requiring a more functional laptop for contract work that is very close to having to be on-call, so even on short trips I might have to access a full laptop and thus upgrade (Remote Desktop on a touch device is nasty). If the new Macbook was out at the time I might have chosen it over the iPad..... When it comes to lightness and being thin - it is extremely important that the device be as least annoying as possible (remembering back to recovering from road warrior years and recovering from laptop induced injuries). I could carry an external keyboard with the iPad but it just seems like a bastardized solution - pulling out the tablet and keyboard / detatching keyboard putting it back in while in tablet mode or having the two pieces not tightly bound together while using it on my lap.... just feels like a clunky solution in regards to a device that is primarily a tablet.

I am still not ready to return to Windows as a primary operating system (I have 4 computers; 2008 Mac Pro; 2009 Mac Mini; 2014 Custom built Windows 7; 2013 Linux). With all the computers I prefer to use my Mac Pro (My Windows Machine is basically just sitting collecting hard drives - 11 x 3TB). I have installed and tried out Windows 10 for a few days, but I still feel.... uncomfortable with Windows.... and that is coming from using DOS/Windows machines since PC DOS 1.1.

The surface 3 tablet is intreging, and there are some interesting features like the pen (I do have a pen for my iPad for use with a whiteboard app only), but the keyboard add-on still feels like a cheap tackon -- not much different than keyboards for the iPad. I also don't care for touch interfaces on my computer, I find having my hand around the home keys with the mouse right next to it being more comfortable when using a computer for 8+ hours a day (mostly coding).

 

[Technarchy]

It's quite competitive, but there is still a lot that an iPad does better than any Windows device as a tablet. I have both a Surface Pro 3 and a couple of iPads, including an Air 2, and there are any number of things that are frustratingly difficult, or really just not possible on the Surface.

Please expand on this. I'm genuinely curious.

 

[sracer]

... - pulling out the tablet and keyboard / detatching keyboard putting it back in while in tablet mode or having the two pieces not tightly bound together while using it on my lap.... just feels like a clunky solution in regards to a device that is primarily a tablet. ...

I understand and agree. The mechanism to attached the tablet to the keyboard on that Acer is the best that I've used. Except for a minor issue of being a bit top-heavy, it feels and operates like a "native" notebook when using it in notebook mode.

It's quite competitive, but there is still a lot that an iPad does better than any Windows device as a tablet. I have both a Surface Pro 3 and a couple of iPads, including an Air 2, and there are any number of things that are frustratingly difficult, or really just not possible on the Surface.

Please expand on this. I'm genuinely curious.

zhenya's experiences echo mine. I've described that numerous times at great length. The specific details are pretty irrelevant because the bottom line is that it greatly depends upon one's use cases and workflow. There is a lot of software that is available for the iPad that has no modern UI counterpart for Windows. The situation is improving, and is better than it was 1-1.5 years ago... which is why I'm revisiting Windows tablets/hybrids now.

 

[CE3]

zhenya's experiences echo mine. I've described that numerous times at great length. The specific details are pretty irrelevant because the bottom line is that it greatly depends upon one's use cases and workflow. There is a lot of software that is available for the iPad that has no modern UI counterpart for Windows. The situation is improving, and is better than it was 1-1.5 years ago... which is why I'm revisiting Windows tablets/hybrids now.

Agreed.

I use my Air 2 to browse the web and watch videos, but my main reason for buying it is for music and photo editing (and it's also great to bring to meetings to present designs and ideas to clients).

iOS has a large selection of powerful apps that make better use of the limited resources available on an iPad, because they're designed specifically to run on these types of devices. I'm going to be able to get a lot further running a DAW like Auria on my iPad, or one of iOS' many excellent photo apps, than I will running a full Windows OS application like Ableton or Photoshop on a Surface.

 

[Naimfan]

Walked past a MS kiosk yesterday and experimented with a Surface. While reasonably well done, it feels awkward and kludgey with the keyboard and kickstand - nowhere near as polished an experience compared to an iPad/MBA.

I suppose if you really have to have tablet and laptop functionality in one device it's OK, but tough for me to imagine that. (And I travel way too much, usually with a 15" MBP.)

 

[zhenya]

Please expand on this. I'm genuinely curious.

For me, it's things like reading magazines, where on iOS there are more available with designs that are more specifically tailored to the form factor, not to mention how much better it is to read on with the higher dpi screen, much lighter weight, and better battery life.

For listening to streaming music, sent either to a bluetooth or Airplay speaker, anything I can listen to on iOS just works, and will play for days with the screen off. Switching between sources is also trivial, as opposed to Windows where you still have to venture into the desktop sound settings and change your default device. On a device like the Surface Pro 3 you cannot listen to anything at all once the screen is off unless there is a Metro app - and there are virtually none of those - nothing for Spotify, Pandora, Beats, Tidal, iTunes, etc.

For video, more websites are actually compliant with iOS's touch modes than with Windows, so with streaming video you often end up having to use an interface that is intended for a mouse, so barely usable with a finger. If I want to send the video to my tv, the Airplay experience on iOS is far more polished, has a better UI, provides more predictable results, and drains the battery less. On Windows you can get a Miracast stick (included with some devices like the Amazon Streaming Stick or Roku) but again, unless you use the virtually non-existent Modern apps, you have to treat it like a 2nd display in Windows which means either mirroring the entire screen, or treating it like a separate display, at which point there is no way to interact with the content on that display unless you have a mouse attached. The performance is also nowhere near as reliable.

Windows still barely has a notification system - and not one that is reliably used - so there is no way to easily have a chat conversation in tablet mode unless you use one of the 3rd party apps to connect to your chat service that has a crummy UI, might not work reliably, etc. etc. Think the very very early days of messaging on iOS.

Games for my kids - the iPad has more than we could ever possibly explore, many of them of very high quality. There is virtually nothing on the Surface for touch, and it's far too easy for them to get out of the game and into the desktop where they can do real damage. Since Apple is dragging their feet in making a kids mode, this would be a great niche for MS; make a real, user-configurable kids mode and fund the development of a dozen or so great kids games.

On top of all this, the iPad will easily go a week off the charger with a couple of hours of daily use. The SP3 is good for 24 hours under most circumstances. Occasionally I stretch it to 2 days when I have shut everything down except a few browser tabs and my usage stays light.

The Surface is a great device in many ways, but the iPad is still a much better casual use device and a more reliable computing appliance.

 

[Dmunjal]

On paper, yes it is. However, the total user experience is where Apple might possibly still be better as far as the tablet side of things is concerned. IMO, the ipad is still the better tablet but perhaps the Surface is the better overall product when all things are considered. Hard to compare since they really operate quite differently.

I still think tablets should be just tablets and the idea of a hybrid or whatever you want to call the Surface ends up limiting the device in some ways and creates the "jack of all trades, master of none" condition. The ipad On the other hand is just a great tablet and that's it. If I want a full blown OS and need power computing capabilities then I'd buy a MacBook or a higher end windows laptop.

The SP3 really ought to have 4GB of RAM though. RAM is dirt cheap now. In fairness, Apple has been pretty stingy with RAM too. It's like.... Cmon guys....

The iPad does have a better user experience. But so did the Mac in the 90s. That didn't stop Microsoft and the PC makers from winning the battle with a good enough product at a lower cost.

Seems this is happening all over again in the tablet market.

 

[Technarchy]

I've described that numerous times at great length. The specific details are pretty irrelevant

It's actually critically relevant given the claims.

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...snip...

feedback noted for future reference and purchase considerations.

 

[mi7chy]

I see Surface 3 as the nail in the coffin for the continually shrinking iPad market and will also eat away the Macbook Air market. Wonder if this will finally force Apple to build a convertible Mac OS X tablet with detachable keyboard and pen input.

 

[Dmunjal]

I see Surface 3 as the nail in the coffin for the continually shrinking iPad market and will also eat away the Macbook Air market. Wonder if this will finally force Apple to build a convertible Mac OS X tablet with detachable keyboard and pen input.

I hope so, too. Apple does its best work when they play from behind. They get too conservative when they have the lead in the market.

The SF3 proves that the market has changed. Hardware has advanced that an x86 can offer a thin package with excellent battery life yet still run a full OS. Windows 10 will push the envelope even further but Apple can do so much more if they put some effort into integrating their two platforms.

 

[2IS]

The iPad does have a better user experience. But so did the Mac in the 90s. That didn't stop Microsoft and the PC makers from winning the battle with a good enough product at a lower cost.

Seems this is happening all over again in the tablet market.

Except in the tablet market, even user experience is debatable. If everything you need to do can be done with an iPad then yes, it's user experience is great, but I'm seeing more and more people wanting to see more functionality being given to the iPad. There the die hard fans that absolutely do not want the added functionality until Apple says it's time to have it, but besides those folks, I think people would like to see the iPad be a more functional device. It may have lead the post PC revolution, but the momentum stalled a while back and is even regressing now.

 

[Dmunjal]

Except in the tablet market, even user experience is debatable. If everything you need to do can be done with an iPad then yes, it's user experience is great, but I'm seeing more and more people wanting to see more functionality being given to the iPad. There the die hard fans that absolutely do not want the added functionality until Apple says it's time to have it, but besides those folks, I think people would like to see the iPad be a more functional device. It may have lead the post PC revolution, but the momentum stalled a while back and is even regressing now.

Agreed. It's hard to believe that after six iterations of the iPad and eight iterations of iOS, it's still missing some basic functions that we take for granted in any modern operating system. Things like an exposed file system, advanced multitasking, IPC, etc.

These may not be as important on a smartphone but are required for a productivity tablet in the enterprise or any office environment.

 

[bkkcanuck]

Except in the tablet market, even user experience is debatable. If everything you need to do can be done with an iPad then yes, it's user experience is great, but I'm seeing more and more people wanting to see more functionality being given to the iPad. There the die hard fans that absolutely do not want the added functionality until Apple says it's time to have it, but besides those folks, I think people would like to see the iPad be a more functional device. It may have lead the post PC revolution, but the momentum stalled a while back and is even regressing now.

Call me an old Apple foggie, but I don't want to use a tablet as a data entry device, and I don't want to have touch on my desktop or laptop computers which I use for work. The user interfaces are designed differently from the ground up. Just taking on a touch interface for the hell of it will just confuse the existing user interface. The Aqua interface is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse from the ground up. More information on screen, dropdowns, slim table lines these are just not touch friendly designs. Adding a touch interface just makes the interface more of a kludge. When using a computer for most of a day, I would find lifting up my hands from the keyboard and poking the screen for 8 hours to be tiring. Sure adding touch makes it a cool new toy because you have something new to play with -- but functionally it does not improve the MY usecase. A laptop for me is just a proxy for my desktop when I am away from the desk. When I have the laptop at my desk, I would plug in large monitors from it and be too far away again.

The difference between Microsoft and Apple is that Apple really strives for consistency across the user interface, while Microsoft is fine hacking things in and having them inconsistent. To each their own.

Touch is no more natural than a mouse, it is not a natural interface. It requires you to be close to the screen (which when I am sitting at a desktop - I am typically 1.5 arms lengths away). They even added remotes to TVs because getting up to touch a device was not considered user friendly (ok that one is just me being facetious).

----------

hese may not be as important on a smartphone but are required for a productivity tablet in the enterprise or any office environment.

And this is where people fail to understand what the iPad is suppose to be. IT IS NOT a productivity device, it is a consumption device, it is a menu device.... it definitely is not a productivity device. About 25% of the users have settled on it because it meets their thin/light requirements and being the least annoying thing to carry, but it is just that settling on something that is not meant for what it is being used for. Those users would be best served by a laptop of similar non-bulky design and similar weight - but that option was not available when the iPad was released.

 

[spinedoc77]

It's quite competitive, but there is still a lot that an iPad does better than any Windows device as a tablet. I have both a Surface Pro 3 and a couple of iPads, including an Air 2, and there are any number of things that are frustratingly difficult, or really just not possible on the Surface.

Just out of curiosity, what are those things?

 

[spinedoc77]

For me, it's things like reading magazines, where on iOS there are more available with designs that are more specifically tailored to the form factor, not to mention how much better it is to read on with the higher dpi screen, much lighter weight, and better battery life.

For listening to streaming music, sent either to a bluetooth or Airplay speaker, anything I can listen to on iOS just works, and will play for days with the screen off. Switching between sources is also trivial, as opposed to Windows where you still have to venture into the desktop sound settings and change your default device. On a device like the Surface Pro 3 you cannot listen to anything at all once the screen is off unless there is a Metro app - and there are virtually none of those - nothing for Spotify, Pandora, Beats, Tidal, iTunes, etc.

For video, more websites are actually compliant with iOS's touch modes than with Windows, so with streaming video you often end up having to use an interface that is intended for a mouse, so barely usable with a finger. If I want to send the video to my tv, the Airplay experience on iOS is far more polished, has a better UI, provides more predictable results, and drains the battery less. On Windows you can get a Miracast stick (included with some devices like the Amazon Streaming Stick or Roku) but again, unless you use the virtually non-existent Modern apps, you have to treat it like a 2nd display in Windows which means either mirroring the entire screen, or treating it like a separate display, at which point there is no way to interact with the content on that display unless you have a mouse attached. The performance is also nowhere near as reliable.

Windows still barely has a notification system - and not one that is reliably used - so there is no way to easily have a chat conversation in tablet mode unless you use one of the 3rd party apps to connect to your chat service that has a crummy UI, might not work reliably, etc. etc. Think the very very early days of messaging on iOS.

Games for my kids - the iPad has more than we could ever possibly explore, many of them of very high quality. There is virtually nothing on the Surface for touch, and it's far too easy for them to get out of the game and into the desktop where they can do real damage. Since Apple is dragging their feet in making a kids mode, this would be a great niche for MS; make a real, user-configurable kids mode and fund the development of a dozen or so great kids games.

On top of all this, the iPad will easily go a week off the charger with a couple of hours of daily use. The SP3 is good for 24 hours under most circumstances. Occasionally I stretch it to 2 days when I have shut everything down except a few browser tabs and my usage stays light.

The Surface is a great device in many ways, but the iPad is still a much better casual use device and a more reliable computing appliance.

I can see a lot of validity in your reasons for needing an ipad. Magazine reading I'm not sure, Zinio is quite awesome on windows but I haven;'t really used ipad apps for that so can't compare. Now the surface 3 has slightly less dpi than the ipad, I forget but it's what 270 vs 240 or something like that. You also get the larger screen with the s3 which IMO would be better for reading magazines, but once again personal preference.

Bluetooth I see where you are coming from. Bluetooth is a pain on my SP3, I have to reconnect my BT headphones all the time, and many times it's a pain to have multiple BT devices and have to switch between them all. Android and iOS handle Bluetooth much better. No music with screen off also sucks.

Streaming video: No issues here with touch mode, I'd be curious which sites in particular you have trouble with.

Notification system: Yeah, windows isn't great. Not sure if you are keeping up with Win10 but they vastly improved the notification system, and it's still a work in progress.

Kid Games: My daughter has quite a few games on my SP3, certainly there are MANY more on iOS though so I see your point.

SP3 battery life: Well, the comparison is to the surface 3, do we have battery benchmarks for that yet? I know baytrail tablets should get 3 or 4 days with couple hour/day use, probably more. The ipad is very nice for battery though so it's a close one.

Our uses are different, it seems you need more of a consumption device so in that sense the ipad works for you, especially the particular content you utilize. I love mine as a consumption device, but deeply relish the functionality it has over that, that's overkill for some though, although why eschew something that's kind of free I don't understand. But in your case you need a different kind of functionality.

----------

Call me an old Apple foggie, but I don't want to use a tablet as a data entry device, and I don't want to have touch on my desktop or laptop computers which I use for work. The user interfaces are designed differently from the ground up. Just taking on a touch interface for the hell of it will just confuse the existing user interface. The Aqua interface is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse from the ground up. More information on screen, dropdowns, slim table lines these are just not touch friendly designs. Adding a touch interface just makes the interface more of a kludge. When using a computer for most of a day, I would find lifting up my hands from the keyboard and poking the screen for 8 hours to be tiring. Sure adding touch makes it a cool new toy because you have something new to play with -- but functionally it does not improve the MY usecase. A laptop for me is just a proxy for my desktop when I am away from the desk. When I have the laptop at my desk, I would plug in large monitors from it and be too far away again.

The difference between Microsoft and Apple is that Apple really strives for consistency across the user interface, while Microsoft is fine hacking things in and having them inconsistent. To each their own.

Touch is no more natural than a mouse, it is not a natural interface. It requires you to be close to the screen (which when I am sitting at a desktop - I am typically 1.5 arms lengths away). They even added remotes to TVs because getting up to touch a device was not considered user friendly (ok that one is just me being facetious

I think the difference here is how you use your device. For example, I use my SP3 at work by plopping it into a dock and then using my 28" monitor, full size keyboard and mouse. Then when I need I slip it off the dock to take notes remotely with the digitizer, or take it on the road to be used as a tablet. It's this dual nature which makes the SP3/S3 so powerful and ingenious.

 

[2IS]

Call me an old Apple foggie, but I don't want to use a tablet as a data entry device, and I don't want to have touch on my desktop or laptop computers which I use for work. The user interfaces are designed differently from the ground up. Just taking on a touch interface for the hell of it will just confuse the existing user interface. The Aqua interface is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse from the ground up. More information on screen, dropdowns, slim table lines these are just not touch friendly designs. Adding a touch interface just makes the interface more of a kludge. When using a computer for most of a day, I would find lifting up my hands from the keyboard and poking the screen for 8 hours to be tiring. Sure adding touch makes it a cool new toy because you have something new to play with -- but functionally it does not improve the MY usecase. A laptop for me is just a proxy for my desktop when I am away from the desk. When I have the laptop at my desk, I would plug in large monitors from it and be too far away again.

Don't really get your point. iPad can remain a touch friendly device while being more functional at the same time. Just because Apple isn't doing it (yet) doesn't mean it can't be done. OSX can remain a desktop/laptop oriented interface as well.

I'm also not sure where this whole concept of lifting your hands off the mouse to touch your screen is coming from, as it relates to the Surface 3. With the Surface you have the option of using touch exclusively, or external input devices exclusively. You aren't forced to do both if you don't want to.

 

[Dmunjal]

Call me an old Apple foggie, but I don't want to use a tablet as a data entry device, and I don't want to have touch on my desktop or laptop computers which I use for work. The user interfaces are designed differently from the ground up. Just taking on a touch interface for the hell of it will just confuse the existing user interface. The Aqua interface is designed to be used with a keyboard and mouse from the ground up. More information on screen, dropdowns, slim table lines these are just not touch friendly designs. Adding a touch interface just makes the interface more of a kludge. When using a computer for most of a day, I would find lifting up my hands from the keyboard and poking the screen for 8 hours to be tiring. Sure adding touch makes it a cool new toy because you have something new to play with -- but functionally it does not improve the MY usecase. A laptop for me is just a proxy for my desktop when I am away from the desk. When I have the laptop at my desk, I would plug in large monitors from it and be too far away again.

The difference between Microsoft and Apple is that Apple really strives for consistency across the user interface, while Microsoft is fine hacking things in and having them inconsistent. To each their own.

Touch is no more natural than a mouse, it is not a natural interface. It requires you to be close to the screen (which when I am sitting at a desktop - I am typically 1.5 arms lengths away). They even added remotes to TVs because getting up to touch a device was not considered user friendly (ok that one is just me being facetious).

----------



And this is where people fail to understand what the iPad is suppose to be. IT IS NOT a productivity device, it is a consumption device, it is a menu device.... it definitely is not a productivity device. About 25% of the users have settled on it because it meets their thin/light requirements and being the least annoying thing to carry, but it is just that settling on something that is not meant for what it is being used for. Those users would be best served by a laptop of similar non-bulky design and similar weight - but that option was not available when the iPad was released.

That seems to be what Apple intended. But there are users that want more. Just read the iPad forum over the past few years complaining about functions that are not available. There's even a rich JB community to address these gaps.

Microsoft has seen the opportunity and, out of desperation, has innovated something Apple has not. I'm not saying that MS has come up with a perfect solution because their two OS's still don't seem completely consistent yet. I haven't seen Windows 10 yet.

But I do believe that a single, unifed, consistent interface is possible and I'd like to see Apple make an effort to see what can be done.

There's no reason I have to pay $2000 for a two device solution when I can pay $1000 for a single device that is more than capable for all my needs. This is called convergence and Apple has been excellent at it so far (camera, camcorder, music player, video player, phone, Internet device, GPS, etc. in a single device).

 

[bkkcanuck]

There's no reason I have to pay $2000 for a two device solution when I can pay $1000 for a single device that is more than capable for all my needs. This is called convergence and Apple has been excellent at it so far (camera, camcorder, music player, video player, phone, Internet device, GPS, etc. in a single device).

I understand where you are coming from, but then you're convergence and Apple's convergence are different. Apple's version of convergence is to have very focused devices (be it a phone, a tablet, a general computer, or a few devices that are still in development that likely focus around home automation) that hand-off seamlessly (editing a document on a computer, then picking up your tablet and selecting "the same app" there and the document already being there at the same point in the edit). Apple's convergence is not the same hardware serves all purposes, where you can take your phone and plug in a monitor and keyboard and use it like a general computer. Or taking your phone and plugging it into your TV and it acting as your cable provider. Doing the second requires you to add more power draining performance into a device and either increasing its bulk or confusing it's usage. There is a cost to having one device do everything, and there is a cost to having more than one device, and there are plenty of people that have no need of a tablet or a computer and just using their phone as there social media consumption etc.... which don't require the added cost and functionality of having it be able to be all things to all people.

I was always taught by many futurists that the general computer as we knew it would eventually become a thing of the past... something that would be consumed into everything and be less recognizable. It is the same evolution that many new technologies have followed over the last century, first you have a general purpose device and then it fades and it is integrated into more user friendly devices that would not be recognizable by those in the early days....

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That seems to be what Apple intended. But there are users that want more. Just read the iPad forum over the past few years complaining about functions that are not available. There's even a rich JB community to address these gaps.

A lot of that was caused by thirst for something that did not exist, a misuse of something to try and fill the gaps. What they really want is a laptop of the same size and portability of an iPad in most cases.

 

[CE3]

I see Surface 3 as the nail in the coffin for the continually shrinking iPad market and will also eat away the Macbook Air market. Wonder if this will finally force Apple to build a convertible Mac OS X tablet with detachable keyboard and pen input.

The market is only shrinking because millions of people already own them and they've proven to be reliable products that don't need upgraded every year. And of course some people with larger phones don't have much use for tablets these days. But the iPad is still clearly one of the best tablet options on the market. Even the second generation model continues to sell well over 4 years later.

It'll be interesting to see what the Pro version has to offer.

 

[bkkcanuck]

It'll be interesting to see what the Pro version has to offer.

The pro tablet will have a small market in comparison - which is probably it's aim. It is for a lot of technical stuff that the main tablet market cannot serve. There may be a need, but not a large market.

 

[mi7chy]

Just out of curiosity, what are those things?

Probably very few to none for anything of significance.

Reality is iPad is the most restrictive. I can't even install Popcorn Time IO without jailbreak that I can do on Android. Even better on the fanless Core M Windows tablet is I can stream 1080p content wirelessly to Chromecast, say for someone else, while concurrently playing 1080p YouTube locally for me that neither of the other ecosystems can do. This is just one of many many examples but the biggest one is you can run all the full professional desktop software. Why mess around with paying for mobile wanna be Office app with questionable compatibility, stability and document size limitations when you can run the real Office or even LibreOffice which is significantly better than any mobile app.

 

[bkkcanuck]

I view the future of convergence to be closer to this futuristic potentials from Sharp on their OLED technology and what it could be used for..... one where not all devices are the same device, but the technology seamlessly hands off in a more natural way. Of course a lot of what is needed for this technology to really take off is still a considerable ways away (Artificial Intelligent / Learning devices). Right now even if we were able to perfect voice interfaces (which can only be done with voice recognition in context since a lot of words are "similar" but our brains decode those "similar" sounds in context of what we are doing, what we have said etc) it would still be tedious until the devices can learn and be able to interpret in context.... When we talk and communicate with people we are often communicating in a context (a sort of shorthand) where we know what each other know and refer to stuff in context to communicate without being overly detailed (like something). Once we achieve that the surface technology will not require touch or any other device and can hand off as we move around and be able to interpret all manner of what we want also in context.

Sharp IGZO

 

[spinedoc77]

A lot of that was caused by thirst for something that did not exist, a misuse of something to try and fill the gaps. What they really want is a laptop of the same size and portability of an iPad in most cases.

I don't think so, but that's only my opinion. The ipad was a product of its times, a compromise because a full OS didn't work within the confines of battery life, size/weight, etc of something like the ipad. We can all compare the ipad with a windows tablet of the time and have a good laugh. Microsoft, however did not rest on its laurels, it fit it's full OS into a package the size of an ipad. I see consumers realizing the trade off they've made and windows tablets will eat into the tablet market share. It may take something shiny and new like the S3 to do it more so than the plastic crap which is already out there, I don't know. Having an ipad AND a laptop is anachronistic in today's era IMO, although that's what most ipad users do out of necessity and because Apple's coffers like it that way just fine.

Put it this way, if the ipad offered OSx tomorrow how many users would truly go out and purchase a laptop? As long as there was a viable keyboard, and maybe a dock I'll bet laptop sales would drop sharply. The ipad is a primitive holdback, a very nice shiny well built primitive holdback, but still a primitive holdback.

 

[thejadedmonkey]

I'm also not sure where this whole concept of lifting your hands off the mouse to touch your screen is coming from, as it relates to the Surface 3. With the Surface you have the option of using touch exclusively, or external input devices exclusively. You aren't forced to do both if you don't want to.

I've found that most people fall into 2 categories: Those who have used a PC with a touchscreen, and think they're amazing, and those who have never used a touch screen PC and toe the "gorilla arm" line, or some variant of it. I've honestly never seen someone who used a touch screen on a PC for any significant amount of time who dislikes the experience.

I'm pointing this out because the poster you quoted talks in the future tense, as though he never actually used a touch screen PC, but knows that if he would, he would hate it.

 

[bkkcanuck]

Put it this way, if the ipad offered OSx tomorrow how many users would truly go out and purchase a laptop? As long as there was a viable keyboard, and maybe a dock I'll bet laptop sales would drop sharply. The ipad is a primitive holdback, a very nice shiny well built primitive holdback, but still a primitive holdback.

And this is where we differ, I would never advocate putting OS X on an iPad since the form factor and kludging of add on keyboard technology is not great. OS X user interface and all the applications written on it are not developed with the user interface of touch being part of the equation and snapping it on after the fact just becomes annoying for a general computer user (controls too small, not organizing information to allow for bigger buttons for fat fingers, drop downs). Different device, different use case. One device does not suit every need perfectly and trying to force it only alienates people more than anything else. This is why forcing Windows 8.1 as the answer to everything on people that used their computers for productivity was widely rejected by most existing users and they refused to upgrade. It is also why businesses widely rejected any move and will stay with Windows 7, because it better meets their use case.