Microsoft Releases Pricing on Surface Tablet, Ships October 26th

[gnasher729]

Dying Market? Sales have slowed, because new consoles are right around the corner ( everyone knows it, Console people tend to follow this stuff pretty closely ).

But over 100 Million Wiis Sold? 70ish Million XBOX 360s? 70 millionish PS3s? That's well over the number of iPads Apple has sold.

I'd hardly call it a dead market

The next Battle is in the living room, where Microsoft already has standing, and Apple has nothing.

Apple TV atm is a Joke, the XBOX 360 can do everything a Apple TV can do, and also play games.

I think you are missing a few things here. The 96 million Wiis sold is over 5 1/2 years, and the sales are dropping. 9 million were sold in the last twelve months. XBox 360 is doing worse. The "joke" Apple TV actually sold more units in the last quarter than XBox 360. They sell 4 million Apple TVs per year, about 44% of the Wii. Not bad for a "joke".

Apple sold 17 million iPads in Q2 2012. That's twice as many as Wiis sold in four quarters. The "battle in the living room" that you are dreaming of isn't happening. There may be a tiny "battle in the kids' bedroom", that's all.

 

[Chupa Chupa]

False.

Or at least mostly false. You need to realize that many people, like myself, bought an Android device because I have zero tolerance for closed and forced systems like iTunes.

Uh, yeah, that is "anti-Apple," i.e., the way it conducts business. You don't accept it so you found a more "open" product you are more comfortable with.

 

[Retrostarscream]

No matter what they introduce in the touchscreen era, they're going to be far behind Apple.

The pricing is very odd - those who don't want the Apple will get their Android tabs. And those who are willing to shell out some money will go for the iPad.

What about those that long for a Microsoft Office productivity suite in a tablet iteration, along with a OEM keyboard built in the protective cover, & USB & HDMI support.

 

[everything-i]

Apple introduced iPad at the exact same price. At the time, it was also "unproven." People mocked the name and questioned whether there was a purpose for this kind of device. There were also a very limited amount of iPad-native apps (I do not count pixel-doubled iPhone apps).

The entry price for the current model iPad remains $500. The iPad was and continues to be a hit.

The biggest thing MS has to do to get into the game is battle the notion that the only tablet worth buying is the iPad, which seems to be consumer sentiment. Microsoft has begun doing this with some decent-looking commercials as well as touting the Surface-exclusive features such as the admittedly slick cover/keyboard.

Only problem with your argument is that when Apple launched there was no competition in this arena. Now there is and Apple is still on top by a long way. M$ have so far failed to make significant inroads into mobile phones with this interface and I suspect tablets will be no different. You say decent-looking commercials but the consensus seems to be that they are a bit crap. Apart from the kickstand, and a detachable keyboard the ad shows nothing about the tablet at all and have nothing about what the device is capable or or how you can use it. Happy Happy Joy Joy teenagers dancing around holding the device is just ridiculous.

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What about those that long for a Microsoft Office productivity suite in a tablet iteration, along with a OEM keyboard built in the protective cover, & USB & HDMI support.

I can get a keyboard cover for an iPad but it doesn't cost anywhere close to $120.

 

[a.phoenicis]

I find it particularly amusing that in the "click" commercial, they have a shot of a bunch of guys sitting on a bench, awkwardly holding the surface tablet over their laps with both hands... Showing that the "killer feature" of this tablet—its ability to mimic a laptop—can't be used on one's lap

All in all, the commercial is pretty ugly. The dancing is awkward and a little forced (the school girls scene was particularly uncomfortable to watch), it leaves me wondering what the point of the product is. It may be a good tablet, and there are some aspects of Win8 that are compelling, but this commercial is pretty terrible.

 

[Retrostarscream]

Please don't get me wrong, the iPad is a revolutionary & fantastic device that ushered in & defined a new portable computing genre. For media consumption it is almost unmatched keeping your movies, photos, & music close at hand. For light productivity it still proves worthy. However, as much as I would love to replace it with my current 2010 MBP, it's just not there yet.

Surface solved an ittibitty gripe with the keyboard making it one with the device itself that "may" improve productivity by certain margins, & also "seemly" solves the issue of true multitasking by having side by side applications open as opposed to having a window open for each & flipping back & forth through them.

If these features hold true & "just work" along with the UI interface on the final product, it will have just enough leverage & flexibility to replace a traditional laptop, not to mention USB & HDMI connectivity.

If you are indeed intent on replacing on replacing a laptop with a surface tablet then $120 is a small price to pay for carrying an embedded tangible keyboard along with your multipurpose tablet computer, from my perspective, otherwise yes it would simply be too much mula.

 

[Geckotek]

FUD is back!!!

I think your "company" should look for a different CTO.

Not necessarily, if they are a large org that will be buying units in the hundreds or thousands, they may be waiting until they have multiple options, perhaps options that fit their current deployment and management models. If they are a big MS shop and don't want to go through the expense of purchasing a separate MDM, waiting on Surface might make sense.

 

[TallManNY]

Are you being serious or shilling? The RT cannot run existing X86 windows apps and the only third party apps that it can run have to be Metro which mean no accessing the win32 api. You can only access the WinRT (Windows Runtime).

Microsoft office will be the only non-Metro app that can run on it because it is from Microsoft.

Windows RT cannot join an Active directory domain.

So to answer your question in a nutshell, no it cannot run all of the enterprise stuff.

You are probably better off with an iPad with a keyboard and Citrix Receiver if your company has a Citrix infrastructure. Or alternatively, you could get an Apple Macbook Air and either install windows dual booting through Bootcamp or run windows in Parallels or VMware and have that machine instance joined to the domain.

The version of surface that will run all of your enterprise stuff is likely to cost more than a Macbook air.

Hmm, I was really meant to say that the Surface should seamlessly fit into an enterprise set up, connect to your outlook email and calendar, load the smaller spreadsheets and smaller word docs. But isn't that the vast majority of stuff that is done at the consumer and non-hardcore level? Increasingly stuff is just going to be emulated on your local machine while the work gets done at a back office server. Don't you think that Microsoft is probably going to be the best at this and the company IT department is going to be most familiar with their solution? Citrix tries to do this, but it doesn't seem fantastic. I suspect that the Surface RT will be able to connect to an enterprise solution running Windows 8 on real computers in the back office and the experience is going to be pretty good since that OS will be optimized for touch screen controls.

 

[IJ Reilly]

Again you never bothered to read what I said

I don't know what you are on about. You seem to be responding to some other argument than the one I suggested. I backed up this argument with two articles documenting the issues with the OEMs. They are peeved, and in at least one case, have said so. Not sure how anyone can advance a more definite, validated argument then that.

 

[JAT]

Its ignorant and insulting to the macrumors community making blanket statements speaking on behalf of unknown individuals.

Your response is also condescending which is frequent in nature of the apple community (unfortunately). I know very well what anti- means, your attitude isnt needed, find another forum if you feel the need otherwise.

If you know what it means, why did you accuse another person of saying something that prefix doesn't say?

As for blanket statements, you should avoid them yourself, at least in the very post where you claim they are ignorant and insulting.

 

[JAT]

Except - throw the ipad mini into the mix. That pricing structure will hurt the surface.

I think we'll need to compare a Touch version of Office to Pages. I don't miss Office at all.

Perhaps. But I would say the 7-8" range is a different marketplace. Similar, yes, but different. MS isn't aimed at the 7" crowd, it wants business people.

 

[Tech198]

I'm actually quite disapointed of the Surface price tag.

 

[Geckotek]

I'm actually quite disapointed of the Surface price tag.

Me too, I want a free one.

 

[LLIBSETAG]

ZuneTabiPadWannabeSurface

Microsoft will give all of its employees a free Surface & count the sales as being in the millions on the first day plus offer free Beeber concert tickets for all the kiddies who will grab them & leave to go to the Apple store next door & buy an iPad Nano Tablet.

Commercial? Geeks becoming Gleeks.

 

[k995]

I don't know what you are on about. You seem to be responding to some other argument than the one I suggested. I backed up this argument with two articles documenting the issues with the OEMs. They are peeved, and in at least one case, have said so. Not sure how anyone can advance a more definite, validated argument then that.

You said it would be a serieus issue for MS, while reality is that the OEM who complained barely push MS products.

 

[IJ Reilly]

You said it would be a serieus issue for MS, while reality is that the OEM who complained barely push MS products.

I said it might be a serious issue if the Surface is a success, but my main point is that it's a big change in the relationships between Microsoft and the Windows OEMs.

The OEMs have to sell Microsoft products, not "push" them. Acer for one is a big Windows OEM. They'd be a partner with Microsoft even if they hadn't agreed to develop Windows RT tablets, which they have. Now Microsoft has positioned themselves as both a partner and a competitor. That's a new relationship, and very different relationship. if Acer is already publicly raising questions about whether this playing field can possibly be level, then you have to bet the others are as well, if only in private.

More commentary on the issue that you insist doesn't exist:

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2411123,00.asp

 

[aristotle]

So? large companies using this wont have any problems programming for it, rest can by pro version.

Do you honestly believe that most companies are going to bother developing in-house Metro apps? Really?

Net yet

This has been discussed ad nauseum already. RT will not support joining a windows domain which mean that you cannot directly log into exchange with your domain account and you would have to use Outlook Web access or some other authentication method like Active Sync instead which the IT people would have to configure for you.

AD has nothing to do with running enterprise stuff, its an easy way of managing, and you forget the pro tablet.

You obviously do not work for large enterprise with a domain tree. I do. As I mentioned above, you need to have domain support in order to connect to Exchange the traditional way and you would have to enable an alternative method of accessing email such as OWA.

No you are not better of, you are actually a lot worse of in a lot of cases, but yes it does work in some way. But I highly doubt its a better experience (doubt as the surface still has to be released and people talk as they have been using it for months) then either of the surface tablets.

I think you are talking out of your arse quite frankly. I have accessed my desktop through citrix access gateway with RDP as well as Outlook on my iPad and mac with citrix receiver.

Hmm, I was really meant to say that the Surface should seamlessly fit into an enterprise set up, connect to your outlook email and calendar, load the smaller spreadsheets and smaller word docs. But isn't that the vast majority of stuff that is done at the consumer and non-hardcore level? Increasingly stuff is just going to be emulated on your local machine while the work gets done at a back office server. Don't you think that Microsoft is probably going to be the best at this and the company IT department is going to be most familiar with their solution? Citrix tries to do this, but it doesn't seem fantastic. I suspect that the Surface RT will be able to connect to an enterprise solution running Windows 8 on real computers in the back office and the experience is going to be pretty good since that OS will be optimized for touch screen controls.

Unless if your IT department reconfigures their stuff to allow you to access your Exchange server without domain authentication, you are out of luck on a Windows RT device as far as Exchange email and calendaring is concerned.

As I already mentioned to the other guy, you can access servers with a Citrix Receiver client on an iPad just fine or with an RDP client to access a Terminal server.

You seem to be under the mistaken impression that Windows RT integrates with the enterprise when it does not. You could by the Pro version a year from now but it will probably cost you over 1k so you would be better off with an Ultrabook like the Macbook Air.

 

[Renzatic]

You could by the Pro version a year from now but it will probably cost you over 1k so you would be better off with an Ultrabook like the Macbook Air.

It comes out January.

Question, though. Why would people be better off buying an ultrabook over the Pro? Assuming that both have roughly equivalent performance, of course.

 

[aristotle]

It comes out January.

Question, though. Why would people be better off buying an ultrabook over the Pro? Assuming that both have roughly equivalent performance, of course.

Uh, because an Ultrabook like the Macbook Air will probably have better performance than the Surface?

Unless if MSFT is going to take a bath (lose money) on each unit, they cannot compete with Apple on economies of scale for components like Flash storage and ram. They either have to charge more or offer lower quality components and lower performance.

Isn't it funny how Apple is now the big dog when it comes to economies of scale for flash memory when a decade ago, they were struggling to get parts from IBM and Motorola and competing against companies running Intel like Dell who had economies of scale in their favour?

 

[Geckotek]

Uh, because an Ultrabook like the Macbook Air will probably have better performance than the Surface?

Unless if MSFT is going to take a bath (lose money) on each unit, they cannot compete with Apple on economies of scale for components like Flash storage and ram. They either have to charge more or offer lower quality components and lower performance.

Isn't it funny how Apple is now the big dog when it comes to economies of scale for flash memory when a decade ago, they were struggling to get parts from IBM and Motorola and competing against companies running Intel like Dell who had economies of scale in their favour?

You've made a lot of assumptions. We know Apple gets good pricing, but what makes you think MS wouldn't be able to do the same in a market that they have been driving for decades?

Also, why would you assume that an Ultrabook is more powerful than the Surface Pro before we have any specs?

 

[Rogifan]

It comes out January.

Question, though. Why would people be better off buying an ultrabook over the Pro? Assuming that both have roughly equivalent performance, of course.

Decent keyboard and trackpad?

 

[Renzatic]

Uh, because an Ultrabook like the Macbook Air will probably have better performance than the Surface?

Unless if MSFT is going to take a bath (lose money) on each unit, they cannot compete with Apple on economies of scale for components like Flash storage and ram. They either have to charge more or offer lower quality components and lower performance.

Isn't it funny how Apple is now the big dog when it comes to economies of scale for flash memory when a decade ago, they were struggling to get parts from IBM and Motorola and competing against companies running Intel like Dell who had economies of scale in their favour?

Considering the price of the RT, I kinda doubt they're gonna attempt undercutting the price of the Pro. Like I've said before, I'll be honestly surprised if it comes out under $1000.

Though all things equal, there's no reason to assume the Surface will run any worse than the Air. Size wouldn't be an issue. The Air actually looks thinner than what it is because it tapers down. At its thickets, it's 20mm. Roughly double the thickenss of the iPad. The Surface Pro doesn't have quite as large of a surface area as the Air, but it also doesn't have a taper, thus potentially about the same amount of room. It's not too off base to assume MS could stuff about the same hardware into it without having to sacrifice anything.

Or to simplify, you could say the Surface Pro is an 11" Air with the keyboard taken out, and the screen placed in front of it. Or it's an ultrabook in a different form factor.

 

[APlotdevice]

Also, why would you assume that an Ultrabook is more powerful than the Surface Pro before we have any specs?

The Surface will have greater heat and space constraints than an ultrabook. So it's a pretty safe bet that the hardware won't run as fast.

 

[Geckotek]

The Surface will have greater heat and space constraints than an ultrabook. So it's a pretty safe bet that the hardware won't run as fast.

You must be looking at different ultrabooks than I am then.

 

[Renzatic]

The Surface will have greater heat and space constraints than an ultrabook. So it's a pretty safe bet that the hardware won't run as fast.

The Pro is gonna be a bit thicker than the RT. They'll have as much room to dissipate heat as any ultrabook.