I agree with it too, to a certain point. But I think they're keeping it a little too simple.
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Microsoft Releases Second 'Laptop Hunters' Commercial
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I agree with it too, to a certain point. But I think they're keeping it a little too simple.
It looks like there might still be life in desktops.... Laptop sales are growing faster, but desktops are projected to grow, not decline.
SO, WHERE'S THE QUAD-CORE MINI-TOWER, TIM !?!?!?
Where in these figures do we see sale numbers for mid-range computers ?
It's not broken out by such categories. The "Desktop and server" category fits the bill though.
This is still a multi billion dollar industry, and it's disappointing for Apple to ignore a market that they could probably do quite well in.
But they don't ignore this "Desktop and Server" category, only specifically, the mid-range, tower, upgradeable computer. They already were in this market and they dropped out.
It comes down to your definition of a desktop. In the opinion of myself, and many other PC geeks, the iMac is not a desktop computer. It's a laptop with no battery and a built in screen... a.k.a, an "all in one" computer.
For ideological reasons, not having to due with sales. When they still reporting the individual model sales, towers were doing well. They couldn't push the precious laptop on a stick while they were still around. Apple's sales numbers also do not measure satisfaction with purchase. Herding people into your machines is a great short term, but it can cause problems down the road. Tell me, where does it leave Apple in a couple years if the more trendy buyers flake and the relationship with the working professional is irreparably harmed? You're thinking very short term with no concept that things may not always be as they are now. You're taking that things will evolved as Apple wants them as a given.
Unfortunately pain and hassle of some sort may be unavoidable. You may like the iMac alright and you may end up with near windows level frustration over all the things it can't do that a PowerMac could like me.
I'm here for two reasons. One being to counter the FUD spread about Windows. Second reason being to help new users who are thinking about buying a Mac see the truth about the whole "Apple Experience" and make a proper and well informed decision based on reality and not one sided blindness that Apple apologists tend to suffer from.
How is Microsoft making the Mac seem more "cool" and "exclusive" with these ads? If anything they're pointing out the cold hard fact that the Mac brand is a vanity brand and you don't get what you pay for. You get style, sure. But you don't get hardware up to spec with the price. Look at the MacBook Pro. It has specs that are about equal to a $900 PC (below in the case of the GPU). The case, size, and OS X are not worth the minimum $1,100 premium. Not by a long shot. Seeing as how OS X isn't up to par with Windows, it can't even be considered a premium.
If you're expecting to be able to get a good amount of money for your MBP in two years, you're in for a harsh reality. Outside of the closed Mac communities, resale value of Macs has plummeted. The same used system you see selling here for $1500 won't even grab $900 on eBay or Craigslist these days. I mean, look at my UniBody MacBook. It's still in like new condition. It's only 6 months old. If I sold it to a fellow Mac user I could probably net a good $900 for it. But if I went to someone knowledgeable about PC hardware or even a regular user, I'd be lucky to get $600 for it. Back in the PowerPC days, Apple was able to fool people into believing that Macs were something special and worth the premium price tag. But now Macs are nothing more than overpriced PCs using lower-end components than those costing several hundred less, if not half as much less. You're going to have a tough time convincing someone in two years that a 2.4GHz Core 2 Duo with 4GB of RAM and a GeForce 9600M GT is worth more than a couple hundred dollars, when quad core running at higher speeds that have gone through at least 2 core revisions and at least double the RAM minimum as well as a GPU thats going to be at least 4x faster than that 9600M GT goes for less than a grand. It's not like in the past where someone could lie to another and say "but this G4 is faster than the Pentium at the higher speed!" (which was never true to begin with). No.. now you have the same hardware. And people now know that the $1,999 and $2,499 MacBook Pros aren't even worth half that much new.
Sooner or later Apple's marketshare growth will stall (if it hasn't already, seeing as how it dropped last quarter) and eventually start to shrink. At that point Apple is going to have to realize that being the Bose of computing and basing your computer business off being a vanity brand with a technically inferior but visually cleaner OS isn't how you do business and survive. It happened once already and it will happen again, seeing as how Apple has failed to learn lessons from their not so distant past.
How is it not profitable? Desktops got outsold by notebooks by what was it? 100,000 units? And if netbooks hadn't been part of the equation, desktop systems would have outsold notebooks by a tremendous amount.
Apple is a company that only cares about seeing how high they can push prices until their sales drop. You can see that by looking at changes to their entire lineup over the last few years. All they've done is removed features and increased the price, or changed features by adding something and taking away the more useful feature. As I said before, who wants to spend $1,499 on a "desktop" PC that can't even push that 24" display properly?
Steve Jobs saying that desktops are dying might be true for Apple. But thats only because their desktop systems are an absolutely terrible value. Again, who wants to spend $1,499 on a "desktop" system that doesn't have the power to take advantage of the screen it comes with? Who wants to spend $1,499 on a "desktop" computer that doesn't even come close to matching the power of notebook PCs costing $200 less? Apple's desktop sales might be in decline, but thats only because of the fact that even the most hardened Apple fanboy is going to have a hard time justifying the cost of an iMac with a dedicated GPU when the screen and overall system power can't even begin to come close to what you can buy in a PC costing several hundred less.
As Anuba said, it's not OUR less. It's Apple's loss. They're the ones missing out on the potential for millions upon millions of sales. A $700 Core 2 Quad desktop (maybe Core i7 or Core i5 in the future) with a wide range of GPU options and expandability would have the potential to be their best selling system ever.
But we all know the REAL reason why Apple won't release a realistically priced desktop system.
If Apple released a desktop Mac tower with Core 2 Quad around 2.66GHz, 4GB of RAM, and a GeForce 9600M GT or GT 130... who would buy the Mac Pro? You've got about the same amount of processing power right there for $2,000 less. If Apple did that then even the most dedicated Apple fanboys would not be able to defend Apple's pricing at all. This sort of system would ruin the insane profit margins they enjoy on the iMac and Mac Pro. The system itself would be profitable, but Apple's high end profits would be gone.
So rather than please the customer, they'd rather please the shareholders and screw the customer by selling fewer yet more expensive systems and driving those who do want power away from Apple and into the arms of PC manufacturers.
As always, said perfectly. No one else could have put it better than that.
Tell me about it! If I have my Mac on the desk connected to my external display, theres all kinds of cables. Not to mention the massive mini DisplayPort adapter.
One reason why I have never given up on a workstation, very easy to replace anything, whether it be through failure or through upgrading as newer/betters things become available, especially with graphics & USB ports. i.e. A larger monitor does not require complete replacement of the machine.
I don't necessarily disagree with the replacement option, as it is good to move people into a continual cycle of upgrading as you can get lower power consumption features etc, but for the most part these days so many machines have more than enough processing power that upgrades aren't as necessary for the average user so it makes it harder to force upgrades, which might then lead into the whole make it look better etc etc to try and get some to upgrade sooner than they might otherwise need.
There was only one size tower - the Blue and White "Smurf Hotel", and then various minor variations of the white/grey/silver plastics.
__________
I really don't understand why so many fans are so opposed to giving the customers the choice here.
We know that Apple would come up with an expensive (for the specs), but probably good looking machine that would go beautifully with the 24" LED-backlit display.
Apple probably doesn't sell enough Mac Pros that it would affect their bottom line if MP sales dropped by a factor of 10.
A mini-tower with a high margin (I'm serious about the $1000 Core i7 mini-tower for $1500) could be a huge seller.
And now that Steve's gone, maybe someone will decide to show some courage and give people an option instead of the laptop on a stand that is Apple's desktop.
The worst thing about Apple's passive-aggressive attitude towards cables is that it's contagious. Their crazy germ rubs off on third parties.
One of the worst (and funniest) cases I've ever seen is this Mac-only audio card, the Apogee Duet. The picture speaks a thousand words -- it's clearly built for, and inspired by, Mac. Unsurprisingly, it looks very slick in product shots.
But wait... it's a multi-channel audio card, where are the inputs and outputs? There's just this giant volume knob. Elegant, but surely something is missing in this picture.
Weeeeell... to complete the picture you also have to add some cables, of course. This is what the elegant device looks like when it's set up so that you can actually use it:
I rest my case.
this is a reference to your use habits with both machines not their inherent traits
Someone say Amen
Sorry guys look in the quote to see my comments
I rest my case.
Pretty white cables! Would you feel better if they were DELL black?
On a black desk like that?
Gee... let me think.
(3 milliseconds pause)
Yes.
I think this sums it up pretty well: The tangle is such an abomination that someone actually went and built a breakout box to replace it. Here's their ad:
Very symptomatic of the form-over-function syndrome. Some third party has to come in and clean up the mess. Just like with the scratch-prone surfaces on iPods and iPhones, you have to wrap them in third-party rubber protection in order to use them.
Why do you blame Apple? They don't even make this product.
You don't have to use a case. It's just that the iPhone is so gorgeous, people want to take care of it. I used a Razr once and it was covered in scratches. It's not a problem unique to iPhones.
Who's opposed ? We're just being realists and realising that the chance of Apple entering a market it left recently is very slim, and thus raving and whining will do nothing.
Bravo!!!!!!!!!!!!! standing ovation, this is the best post I have ever read on any forum across the net.
Not that I didnt already know this but I wonder just how many Apple fanboys will still be in denial after reading your post. At some point even the most die hard fans will educate them self's enough to know that Apple has played a very well crafted game of deception for years. Trust me when I tell you that the switch to the Intel processor was only just the beginning of the secret veil starting to slowly reveal what has always been a huge game of deception by Apple.
The problem is unlike Anuba or AidenShaw, you're so unbelievably biased towards Microsoft that it provides little in the way of objectivity to the new users you apparently intend upon assisting. You despise "Apple apologists", yet ironically you're a Microsoft apologist.
I like MS too, and in fact am really enjoying 7 so far......looking forward to the RC next month. Their server products are quite amazing.
But I don't like them to the point where they can do no wrong. Same goes for Apple. Or Linux.
I'm assuming the Apple fanboys will continue to be Apple fanboys, the Microsoft fanboys will continue to be Microsoft fanboys, and people like me will continue to roll their eyes and use both (or all 3 major) OSes, and move on with our lives.
Game of deception? ROFL. There's no deception. Apple doesn't care what you think. They tell you what to use. You either use it and like it, or you don't. Pretty simple, really.
This forum is full of personal anecdotes and opinions as fact. It's staggering.
Truth hurts! has nothing to do with trolling but if that makes you feel better then so be it. I have own several thousands of dollars worth of Mac hardware over the years starting all the way back with the original Apple Cube which I bought new.
Troll, I think not! I have seen through the smoke screen that is Apple and until you do of course you will label me a troll.
What I mean by deception is that there has always been this mythical believe that Apple hardware is better and that is what makes me ROFL. Apple hardware its not better and it never has been! the poor little Asian kids that make all computer components do not make a separate pile just for Dell and a separate pile just for Apple. Its all the same crap that all computer companies over charge for.
They sure didn't, but do you think anyone else would've made aluminium slabs with a tangle of white cables coming out of it if Apple didn't start this "trend"?
Let's backtrack here.
The argument against minitowers was that Apple prefers a desktop to be clean, rather than a tangled mess of cables. And voilá: The iMac.
But if they don't like visible cables and other whatchamacallits spilling out all over your desk, why do they...
...not make docking stations for laptops, instead forcing people to have half a dozen cables sticking out from the left side of a MacBook (Pro)?
...make all their cables white, despite the fact that A) it makes them extremely visible, and B) their "white era" is over, these days Macs are silver and black?
...keep replacing industry standard ports with weird ones so that you need big ugly adapters hanging from the machines like guano?
As for the Apogee thing -- just a funny side note.
The iPhone 3G is actually not that scratch-prone, thanks to the plastic. Wouldn't call it "gorgeous", though. The original iPhone was gorgeous, this one is wholly unremarkable. But the iPods, particularly the ones with clear plastic front and chrome back, were so scratch prone that pocket lint or even a soft cloth would scratch them. Surely not by accident, they just wanted to sell more accessories. Otherwise no one would make a portable device so blatantly anti-rugged.
I'm not labeling you a troll, I'm labeling mosx a troll. There is no smoke screen, no reality distortion field. Apple doesn't make computers that are about raw specs and raw power. That people always want to compare Apple computers to these raw specs is their problem. Ultimately, it is them that are hurt by the fact that Apple doesn't want to compete in their niche and offer them a product and hence they come here and whine endlessly about things like the Apple tax.
If all Apple is was really just a trend, Microsoft wouldn't be paying this much attention, and neither would the general public. Trends are fickle and die out.
Ok fair enough lets call a truce! but in my honest opinion until the reign of Steve Jobs comes to an end the current line up will not change. As we all know Steve is like no other CEO and his powers over the company all the way down to what is put on the store shelf's is incredibly scary. I predict that when his regin his over the entire line up will change to reflect a bit more of what the average Joe can afford and needs. Until that day comes its all about iPhones gadgets and iMacs the love of his life.