Microsoft Xbox Strategy and Marketing Executive to Join Apple?

[neiltc13]

Um, yeah because they are soo similar...

They are very similar. Microsoft came up with the idea of providing free tools to developers in order to see them making software for their device. The software is sold on a digital store where the company which makes the game gets a regular payment after Microsoft takes its cut.

When the App Store "idea" came along I thought it was pretty funny to see Apple copying Microsoft yet again. Sure, they've done a better job probably because the applications on iPhone are more diverse and the consumers have more disposable income, but the concept itself originated with Microsoft.

 

[LagunaSol]

I thought it was pretty funny to see Apple copying Microsoft yet again.

BWA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

What more need be said?

 

[DELLsFan]

Huzzah! Now what we need is for more software gaming companies to publish more games compatible with the Mac. Don't just stop at the iPod Touch and iPhone.

Besides, I've seen the way kids (and adults alike) handle and use their Nintendo DS' and XBOX and PS3 controllers. My precious is too valuable for that sort of abuse.

 

[diemos]

People still play games on mac/pc? Just get a console, its much better experience, well except for fps games and strategy games.

 

[w00master]

BWA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

What more need be said?

Actually, I found his arguments quite valid. You do know that everyone copies from each other. In the example of the XNA store, Apple definitely got some ideas from the XNA store.

w00master

 

[SandynJosh]

When the App Store "idea" came along I thought it was pretty funny to see Apple copying Microsoft yet again. Sure, they've done a better job probably because the applications on iPhone are more diverse and the consumers have more disposable income, but the concept itself originated with Microsoft.

Your statements are murky as to what "concept" you feel MS came up with that Apple copied. Software has been sold via online sites since shareware days.

The difference between the two is like saying Sam Wall ripped off the ideas of a corner grocery to build Wallmart. What Sam Wall, Ray Kroc and Apple did was take a lot of existing ideas and juxtaposition them together in such a way that something totally new and successful came of it.

 

[Mousse]

I guess I have to ask you, "Compared to what?"

If you consider that the iPhone and iTouch games are so highly desirable that they comprise the bulk of all app store downloads, then while they may not be as feature-rich as a dedicated game box, they do entertain people who have a few minutes to spare or are in need of some diversion.

I the iPhone games stacks up well compared to games on other phones. Heck they squash games on other phone. But compared to the polished offerings on the PSP or Gameboy, those games are seriously lacking. Games that have simple premises or require simple controls works well (ie. puzzle games, racing games, side scrolling platform games) works well enough. But games that require more multiple input or complex controls, the come up short. Metal Gear Solid was recently added to the App Store. It pails in comparison to the PSP versions, mainly due to the lack of complex controls offered by the iPhone.

The other reason they don't compare well with dedicated gaming platforms is because, as you stated, those games are designed for short game plays. Until there's a quality RPG on the iPhone, I'll never consider it a serious gaming machine.

 

[t0mat0]

First, we've seen an IBM employed going for Apple. Then an AMD. Then an Microsoft.

Looking at it:

IBM -> PowerPC CPU

Multiples variants of PPC are used by ALL current console, and even last-generation consoles. The guy obliviously know something about how to optimize an CPU for a gaming console.
Wii -> Broadway http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadway_(microprocessor)
GameCube -> Gekko http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gekko_(microprocessor)
Xbox 360 -> Xenon http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenon_(processor)
PlayStation 3 -> Cell http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_(microprocessor)

AMD -> Ati > Ati GPUs

Once again, GPUs used by consoles.
Wii -> Hollywood http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_(graphics_chip)
GameCube -> Ati GPU (no specific name)
Xbox 360 -> Xenos http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenos_(graphics_chip)

Microsoft -> Xbox

So yeah, pretty explicit. From a pessimist view, it could just be coincidences.

Like the thinking - linking this to another thread - Apple's looking at SoC. We've heard about ARM, PA Semi, a whole host of people being brought in. We've got OpenCL -
What's to stop Apple doing what they do with Intel (not use the normal chipset, get custom/early chips, package them how they want etc)
and do this with Nvidia for example?
From low power tech, through to higher power good performance per watt multicore tech - with the GPU CPU waters muddying, ARM's power rising, the bringing in of GPU power to the OS - it makes sense to have personnel from these fields. Through getting more GPU on board - it brings in the possibility of better gaming on the back of it, be it mobile or desk/laptop.

Think Tegra, but with Apple's help, in 2010 perhaps.

 

[Saladinos]

So they have a third of the sales of a dedicated portable gaming device, and even then only a small fraction of those users will be using their iPhone/Touch for gaming beyond a 5 minute diversion while waiting for a train or bus. I would say, as far as on the go gaming fares, that does indeed pale in comparison. Also as good as touch and tilt controls are, for a large number of popular gaming genres, they just do not work as well as physical pads+buttons or a combination of both.

The App Store platform devices are wonderful and inventive pieces of kit, but to suddenly think they will be able to challenge the likes of Nintendo (over 250 Million portable consoles sold) for the portable gaming crown on the basis of them hiring a guy who worked in the Red Ring of Death department for MS and few guys who's products got humped by Intel or Nvidia is stretching things.

In my opinion I think Apple are happy with the market they have created for themselves a market which will continue to grow separate from the more mainstream portable gaming scene, and to attempt a turf war against such established names would not be the wisest choice of actions.

The DS has been on the market for 54 months. 100M in 54 months makes 1.8M per month.
The iPhone platform has been on the market for 23 months. 37M in 23 months makes 1.6M per month.

If we scale the iPhone's selling rate to equal the amount of time the DS has been on sale (which is bad practice, but gives us an approximate figure), Apple would have sold nearly 87M units. That does not pale in comparison.

Let's not forget either that the iPhone/iPT's selling rates have been increasing as new hardware is released each year. By the time Apple hits the 54 months stage, there's a good chance they will have surpassed the 100M mark.

Again, you should note that games are the most popular category on the AppStore, so there aren't "a fraction of people" playing games on them. Gaming is an extremely popular activity on these devices, especially since some games are free, unlike on the NDS.

 

[layte]

The DS has been on the market for 54 months. 100M in 54 months makes 1.8M per month.
The iPhone platform has been on the market for 23 months. 37M in 23 months makes 1.6M per month.

If we scale the iPhone's selling rate to equal the amount of time the DS has been on sale (which is bad practice, but gives us an approximate figure), Apple would have sold nearly 87M units. That does not pale in comparison.

Let's not forget either that the iPhone/iPT's selling rates have been increasing as new hardware is released each year. By the time Apple hits the 54 months stage, there's a good chance they will have surpassed the 100M mark.

Again, you should note that games are the most popular category on the AppStore, so there aren't "a fraction of people" playing games on them. Gaming is an extremely popular activity on these devices, especially since some games are free, unlike on the NDS.

100M people bought a device to play games, people buying the iPhone/Touch are buying a phone/MP3 Player with features such as internet access and gaming as a nice addition but hardly the primary reason for buying the device. Children, Adults, Pensioners buy Nintendo handheld devices. People who have no interest in fancy phones and before the DS no interest in gaming. They buy them to play games (usually Nintendo games), and games alone. Not to make telephone calls or browse the internet. The iPhone/Touch will always have a market, but as I said it will be a separate one to the traditional space occupied by Nintendo and Sony. (all in my opinion of course but I would imagine the number of people using Apple's devices as a serious gaming platform does indeed pale next to Nintendo, and even Sony's hardware)

 

[dan83193]

Hypothesis : JOBS IS LEAVING APPLE

The reason that apple is hiring all of these major leaders in other companies is because Steve Jobs is not in good health, and they want to be set up ok when he leaves.

 

[Goona]

It must really piss off Apple fanboys seeing MS having so much success with the Xbox360 in such a short period of time they've entered the gaming market. The fanboys should stick to their PS3s.

Damn so now losing billions of dollars and coming in second every console race is a success, lol.

 

[Goona]

BWA HA HA HA HA!

You mean bleeding money like a stuck pig while repairing/replacing 30% (at least) of their gaming hardware due to an epic failure rate (my brother is on his 3rd - and he's one of the lucky ones)? And to add insult to injury, ending up getting pwned by "lowly" Nintendo in the Mother of All Console Wars?

BWA HA HA HA HA!

If that's success, I'd hate to see failure.

What a Ballmer-licking tool.

 

[Goona]

A force compared to whom? Nintendo own the portable gaming market, 100M DS sales and still rapidly rising. While even the PSP has sales of over 50M units and that is considered a failure in the face of the Nintendo portable behemoth. Total iPhone and Touch sales pale compared to either of those numbers, plus you have to keep in mind that only a fraction of those owners will even be using the device as a serious gaming platform.

A much more likely situation is that Apple are looking to design their own low power/high performance mobile device chipsets. The benefits being silicon exactly designed for the tasks Apple have in mind and security via obscurity (if nobody outside Apple knows about the chips, good luck unlocking it).

You know iphone and ipod touch have been out less than 2 years but have sold over 37 million devices, by the time 2 years is up, they will be at 50 million plus. How long have the DS and PSP been out, iphone/ touch will overtake them soon.

 

[NT1440]

The reason that apple is hiring all of these major leaders in other companies is because Steve Jobs is not in good health, and they want to be set up ok when he leaves.

Because steve jobs in in charge of chips and marketing right now?

These guys wont be leading apple, just working there.

 

[jemo07]

Damn so now losing billions of dollars and coming in second every console race is a success, lol.

Considering that now the "new" economy dictates the NOT loosing ALL your Billions IS a success

 

[Saladinos]

100M people bought a device to play games, people buying the iPhone/Touch are buying a phone/MP3 Player with features such as internet access and gaming as a nice addition but hardly the primary reason for buying the device. Children, Adults, Pensioners buy Nintendo handheld devices. People who have no interest in fancy phones and before the DS no interest in gaming. They buy them to play games (usually Nintendo games), and games alone. Not to make telephone calls or browse the internet. The iPhone/Touch will always have a market, but as I said it will be a separate one to the traditional space occupied by Nintendo and Sony. (all in my opinion of course but I would imagine the number of people using Apple's devices as a serious gaming platform does indeed pale next to Nintendo, and even Sony's hardware)

The point is that as games consoles such as the PSP and DS become more media focussed, devices that were previously media focussed (such as iPods) move in to gaming. Apple are advertising the gaming aspect of the IPT, and this move indicates that they are going to move even further in that direction and really push the gaming features of the IPT.

As it is right now, I would imagine the average IPT customer buys their device as an iPod/MID and treats the fact that it can play games as an additional feature. My interpretation is that Apple are moving to bring in a new type of customer in addition to them - the type of customer who is out to buy a gaming device, and treats the iPod and MID sides of the product as additional features.

I think there's a high probability they will succeed. AppStore sales figures suggest that it is an effective way of distributing games and can be highly profitable, and Apple have added new features in 3.0 to allow for episodic content - unlike any other mobile gaming platform. These factors should lead to strong publisher and developer support.

Nintendo were in a desperate state before the Wii and DS, and despite those products being phenomenal sellers, I worry about their long-term strategy. They haven't shown much competence in audio/video or digital distribution yet, whilst Apple have, and have shown competence in innovative control systems (which is Nintendo's philosophy). This could lead Apple's products having a competitive edge, despite Nintendo's established IP.

 

[Goona]

BWA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

What more need be said?

Muahahahaha, that was a good laugh.

 

[BMWFan]

Yes keep on claiming they're losing money. They're recently started making profit. It's not different to Apple spending so much on Macs and going nowhere vs PCs. Success is has more than the monetary aspect. They've built a strong brand. Xbox360 has dedicated fansites and blogs just like Apple. They have a very strong fanbase just like Apple.

 

[layte]

The point is that as games consoles such as the PSP and DS become more media focussed, devices that were previously media focussed (such as iPods) move in to gaming. Apple are advertising the gaming aspect of the IPT, and this move indicates that they are going to move even further in that direction and really push the gaming features of the IPT.

As it is right now, I would imagine the average IPT customer buys their device as an iPod/MID and treats the fact that it can play games as an additional feature. My interpretation is that Apple are moving to bring in a new type of customer in addition to them - the type of customer who is out to buy a gaming device, and treats the iPod and MID sides of the product as additional features.

I think there's a high probability they will succeed. AppStore sales figures suggest that it is an effective way of distributing games and can be highly profitable, and Apple have added new features in 3.0 to allow for episodic content - unlike any other mobile gaming platform. These factors should lead to strong publisher and developer support.

Nintendo were in a desperate state before the Wii and DS, and despite those products being phenomenal sellers, I worry about their long-term strategy. They haven't shown much competence in audio/video or digital distribution yet, whilst Apple have, and have shown competence in innovative control systems (which is Nintendo's philosophy). This could lead Apple's products having a competitive edge, despite Nintendo's established IP.

I still do not agree with that, and I do not want to spend more time repeating what I have already said but in a slightly different manner. Basically if Apple really intend to compete directly with the DS/PSP (which I do not think they do) they will be up against the most popular games company of all time. Nine of the top ten selling console titles ever were made by Nintendo, they have an incredible fanbase which is probably even more loyal than some of the fanatics I see here posting nothing but GO APPLE/Death to M$/dance monkey boy dance. I do not think Apple want or even need that fight as both types of device can exist without competing with each other in a meaningful fashion.

Anyway I'll sign off for now. I am glad I got a reasoned debate,, when I first made my post I feared it would get backlash from some of the more fanatical Apple followers.

 

[Saladinos]

I still do not agree with that, and I do not want to spend more time repeating what I have already said but in a slightly different manner. Basically if Apple really intend to compete directly with the DS/PSP (which I do not think they do) they will be up against the most popular games company of all time. Nine of the top ten selling console titles ever were made by Nintendo, they have an incredible fanbase which is probably even more loyal than some of the fanatics I see here posting nothing but GO APPLE/Death to M$/dance monkey boy dance. I do not think Apple want or even need that fight as both types of device can exist without competing with each other in a meaningful fashion.

Anyway I'll sign off for now. I am glad I got a reasoned debate,, when I first made my post I feared it would get backlash from some of the more fanatical Apple followers.

I'm certainly not a fanatical Apple follower. I'm doing a masters in nanotechnology, so I'm interested in where the industry is going and in companies that are expanding their hardware efforts that I could make a difference working for. I also study financial accounting and corporate finance and dabble in the stock market, so I'm interested in the financial future of these companies. The idea is that I understand the financial position of these companies more than most who understand the technology, and understand the technology more than most who understand the financial position of the company. My opinion is that Apple will be able to break through, although I certainly respect that Nintendo is formidable opposition.

Nice discussing it with you

 

[MH01]

Damn so now losing billions of dollars and coming in second every console race is a success, lol.

They actually did exceptionally well to crack a market that had two main players in it and was dominated by Sony. If you are going pay anyone out, pay out sony, how they managed to loose the huge market share and come in third. Nintendo rocked the Market with the Wii but Microsoft can consider their entry into the console market to be a success, yes it cost them, but they choose to enter at a time where Sony dominated the scene. 2nd is damn good.

Apple will not be entering the console market, what they will be trying to do is push gaming on the portables (iphone, itouch). Though good luck with that, the Nintendo DSi is 10x the gaming device that an iphone is, I do not care if you can get an external controller post 3.0, the last thing people are going to want is to carry a controller around with thier portable gaming device.

If Apple were to try to crack the console market, it will be a good reality check for them.

 

[MH01]

BWA HA HA HA HA!

You mean bleeding money like a stuck pig while repairing/replacing 30% (at least) of their gaming hardware due to an epic failure rate (my brother is on his 3rd - and he's one of the lucky ones)? And to add insult to injury, ending up getting pwned by "lowly" Nintendo in the Mother of All Console Wars?

BWA HA HA HA HA!

If that's success, I'd hate to see failure.

What a Ballmer-licking tool.

Heard of Sony??

Failure = PS3, from complete domination of the console market to completly getting it wrong with the PS3. Not every kid has $$$$$. In comes cheap Wii that cleans up.

You do realise that apple did not dominate the MP3 market after 2 generations of the Ipod.......

 

[Saladinos]

They actually did exceptionally well to crack a market that had two main players in it and was dominated by Sony. If you are going pay anyone out, pay out sony, how they managed to loose the huge market share and come in third. Nintendo rocked the Market with the Wii but Microsoft can consider their entry into the console market to be a success, yes it cost them, but they choose to enter at a time where Sony dominated the scene. 2nd is damn good.

Apple will not be entering the console market, what they will be trying to do is push gaming on the portables (iphone, itouch). Though good luck with that, the Nintendo DSi is 10x the gaming device that an iphone is, I do not care if you can get an external controller post 3.0, the last thing people are going to want is to carry a controller around with thier portable gaming device.

If Apple were to try to crack the console market, it will be a good reality check for them.

I agree. I'm a PS3 owner myself, but I applaud Microsoft on how well they've entered the Market. They broke in to the industry well. Since it appears Apple is trying to do the same, it makes sense to hire the guys that let MS do it. On the business side of the industry, MS have done extremely well.

 

[naman34]

People still play games on mac/pc? Just get a console, its much better experience, well except for fps games and strategy games.

well there are some shooters as well that work much better on a computer..... aiming with an analog stick is just not as much fun as a mouse!