Microsoft's Windows 10 Fall Update Will Link With iOS for Easy App Switching Across Devices

[Mathias Denichi]

You'd have to be mad to leave OS X for Windows 10. There are so many minor frustrations that you have to deal with and unexpected errors and just general bullsh*t.

I have an IT services company that supports Macs and PCs and mobile devices (plus servers, networking equipment, etc.). If everyone was on a Mac we'd lose probably 80% of our billable hours for desktop support. PCs just break that much.

Plus you have to literally edit the hosts file to prevent Microsoft from logging your every move and keep an eye on the hosts file after every update to make sure they didn't reenable what is, by definition, built-in spyware. This is not hyperbole.

I'm not mad, I know how to work Windows 10 and customize it. I don't recommend it for the average user, but I'm very unimpressed with the offering of macOS as of late, and don't feel Apple is delegating any attention to it.

I prefer freedom of hardware and advanced program choice over security of who sees what youtube video, or of what the latest Trump Photoshop image I create. Id prefer a more advanced form of iOS over macOS by this point due to the great file compression,instant loading and battery life with minimal resources; plus, Apple actually cares about it right now.

 

[v0lume4]

I am absolutely delighted to be seeing changes like this implemented. Cross-platform support and continuity is always a MASSIVE win for consumers like you and me. Woohoo!

 

[convergent]

The original story has a big error... its Windows Graph, not Windows Graft!

By the way, here is a video of the keynote where this was demonstrated

. Of course many of the comments from Apple users are claiming this is the same as continuity which simply is not true. Much of the world uses a Windows desktop and an iPhone... so Apple's closed system is not nearly as useful in the majority of the business world. Microsoft's solution has tight integration into Office 365.

For me, a cloud-based file syncing service has one critical feature, which is how quick it detects changes on the local file to sync it to the cloud. Dropbox, almost immediately, always. Google Drive, close, but sometimes it takes a few seconds to start syncing. OneDrive, I actually timed it a few times and often it takes minutes (40 minutes was the longest) before it detects and syncs any changes to the cloud. That is ridiculous, and defeats the purpose of the service. (all of these are clients on a Mac).

Your experience is vastly different from mine. I use OneDrive and OneDrive for Business, using two Microsoft accounts (personal and business) to sync all of my documents, multiple Sharepoint libraries, personal and business OneNote notebooks, and more. I'm syncing across Windows, MacOS, and iOS. I have literally saved an Excel file on my laptop and a minute later needed to open it on my phone and it was there. I have the two OneNote apps (2016 and W10 App) open on my SP4 and take notes via the pen in one app and it appears in the other a few seconds later (that requires two syncs to complete). So maybe your system isn't setup correctly or something. I have no files I use for work that are not on OneDrive... none. For many of them in SharePoint libraries, my team is working together on them so the folders are synced across multiple people's machines.

The integration into Office is also great. When I attach a file in Outlook to an email, it lets me decide whether I want to send a link to the cloud file or attach a copy... can't do that with Dropbox.
[doublepost=1494537682][/doublepost]

You'd have to be mad to leave OS X for Windows 10. There are so many minor frustrations that you have to deal with and unexpected errors and just general bullsh*t.

I have an IT services company that supports Macs and PCs and mobile devices (plus servers, networking equipment, etc.). If everyone was on a Mac we'd lose probably 80% of our billable hours for desktop support. PCs just break that much.

Plus you have to literally edit the hosts file to prevent Microsoft from logging your every move and keep an eye on the hosts file after every update to make sure they didn't reenable what is, by definition, built-in spyware. This is not hyperbole.

I won't disagree that Macs are easier to support. But saying you'd be mad to leave OS X for Windows 10 is a stretch. OS X is not used in the vast majority of businesses so many people don't have an option not to use Windows. The bottom line for me is that OS X is also getting kind of stale and will always be a closed system. Microsoft is doing some interesting things.

The insistence by Apple to avoid a touchscreen and/or pen in favor of the touch bar is silly. Having now used a Surface Pro 4 for a few weeks and experienced Windows 10 on that device, I can say that for me I love having touch. Apple is too stubborn to admit they are wrong on this one, or unable to demonstrate why they are not wrong. What they did with the touch bar is not better than a touch screen, plain and simple. Microsoft fumbled badly on the integrated desktop/tablet OS with Windows 8, but now it is getting pretty good. They have stayed with it. Apple keeping two platforms meaning you have to buy a tablet and a laptop... its not as good. The question is whether Apple will ever see this, or will they stubbornly continue down this current path.

 

[fenderbass146]

Its bad, but not much worse than the 13in 2016 MBP with Touchbar that I have. I was able to at least get 8 hours with a few power modifications on my i7/256/16gb SP4. My issue is lack of TB3, USB C, and LTE, which the Galaxy Book seems to be doing this, but I don't trust Samsung.

Ill take form factor over battery life.

I felt like I was using a early days android phone. I was always worrinying about stuff syncing in the background and what apps I had running. My nTB 2016 gets legit 10 hour battery life and I never worry about what I'm running other then a virtual machine.

The only think I liked about the surface was the form factor and Windows 10 has really gotten pretty dang good. They even have a decent trackpad and good gestures, but when you combine terrible battery life, no iMessage, no good photo management software, no air drop or airplay it just wasn't worth it for me.

 

[boast]

Just saw the demo video, pretty cool! (Except everything will probably need to be on OneDrive)

More integration is great as I use a Windows Desktop at home.

 

[convergent]

Just saw the demo video, pretty cool! (Except everything will probably need to be on OneDrive)

More integration is great as I use a Windows Desktop at home.

It will require OneDrive and Cortana to work I believe. The good part is both of those things already work pretty well on iOS. If you don't want to use OneDrive though, I expect this is a non-starter. The same restriction would apply if you wanted to use Apple Continuity... you'd need iCloud.

 

[macduke]

I'm really curious how, exactly, they are doing this. Aren't these private APIs on the iPhone side? And Cortana can't just run in the background indefinitely managing things unless Microsoft is leaking upcoming iOS 11 features.

 

[convergent]

I'm really curious how, exactly, they are doing this. Aren't these private APIs on the iPhone side? And Cortana can't just run in the background indefinitely managing things unless Microsoft is leaking upcoming iOS 11 features.

Why do you think that Cortana can't run in the background?

 

[JRobinsonJr]

Microsoft is the king of "good enough". Here is hoping that it turns our better than "good enough."

Microsoft certainly WAS the "King of good enough"... but it appears that times are changing. This has positive implications for everyone regardless of what platform you prefer.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

That new UI is looks good.

 

[the-msa]

PCs just break that much.

My 9 year old Samsung r560 (with bluray drive) laptop would like to have a word with you...

Meanwhile, osx has Alzheimer's on my work-iMac and keeps forgetting to have my emails on desktop 2 and my calendar on desktop 3. It changes it back randomly while the machine is on, it's hilarious.

 

[macduke]

Why do you think that Cortana can't run in the background?

Because iOS apps are limited to 10 minutes of background activity unless they use a special API such as background audio, GPS, notifications, etc. From what I understand, background app refresh can only do so much. You can't have something like Cortana deeply integrated like Siri at the iOS level. It would require a fundamental change and API from Apple.

 

[zzLZHzz]

How will this work? Won't iOS 11 need to create an API to allow this sort of integration? If so, will Linux and other OSes get to partake?

I believe it uses the swiftkey keyboard

I just tried making the switch to a sp4 and am returning it. The battery life is horrendous, but If they fix this and get the features you mention plus a decent apple photo competitor id switch in a heartbeat...which is why it will never happen.

SP4 battery life is at best half of macbook pro

Steve Jobs made a statement over 15 years ago that people had to get over the idea that for Apple to win, Microsoft had to lose. As a result of that cooperation we had some pretty good software released for the Mac, most notably MS Office. The platform was shored up when Apple and its users needed that the most.
It looks like the current - and very practical - CEO of MS has realized the same thing. He's facilitating Windows/iOS integration like never before. This will benefit everyone.

I really wish Satya had a chance to work with Steve Jobs. I firmly believe the entire computing industry would have benefited from their collaboration.

microsoft is still a service/software company, which mean their stuffs need to work on others hardware. but apple is a hardware company.

yes, satya has better vision as compared to ballmer. some of the visions were great but unfortunately not easy to pull it off.

 

[pika2000]

Your experience is vastly different from mine. I use OneDrive and OneDrive for Business, using two Microsoft accounts (personal and business) to sync all of my documents, multiple Sharepoint libraries, personal and business OneNote notebooks, and more. I'm syncing across Windows, MacOS, and iOS. I have literally saved an Excel file on my laptop and a minute later needed to open it on my phone and it was there. I have the two OneNote apps (2016 and W10 App) open on my SP4 and take notes via the pen in one app and it appears in the other a few seconds later (that requires two syncs to complete). So maybe your system isn't setup correctly or something. I have no files I use for work that are not on OneDrive... none. For many of them in SharePoint libraries, my team is working together on them so the folders are synced across multiple people's machines.

Ah, the good old "you're holding it wrong." Yup, let's just blame the user. It's the same responses I got everytime I contacted MS support. Ignore the fact that Dropbox and even Google Drive (which used to actually be worse than OneDrive) work just fine. Yup, it's the user's fault.

 

[Solomani]

iTunes coming to the Windows Store too! WTH, has hell frozen over????

I know huh? Apple is more open to having their software on the Windows side, and then Microsoft is more and more embracing support for iOS (which they realize is still a very dominant mobile OS). It's like getting their chocolate into the other guy's peanut butter.

 

[pika2000]

I know huh? Apple is more open to having their software on the Windows side, and then Microsoft is more and more embracing support for iOS (which they realize is still a very dominant mobile OS). It's like getting their chocolate into the other guy's peanut butter.

Apple has always been working together with MS, despite the appearance of bitter rivals. Siri uses Bing, and Apple relies on MS Office to show that the iPad Pro is not just a consumption device. On MS side, Apple users are actually more likely to spend money on genuine software (MS Office) than the typical Windows user. It is, and has been, a win win for both companies.

 

[Solomani]

Apple has always been working together with MS, despite the appearance of bitter rivals. Siri uses Bing, and Apple relies on MS Office to show that the iPad Pro is not just a consumption device. On MS side, Apple users are actually more likely to spend money on genuine software (MS Office) than the typical Windows user. It is, and has been, a win win for both companies.

Like everyone and their mom, I'm surrounded by friends and co-workers who are Windows users. And I can't remember when any of them "bought" Office software. I've long come under the conclusion that software piracy is "the norm" in the Windows world. I'm mostly a Mac/Apple user at home, so I legitimately purchase my apps from the Apple App Store, iTunes Store, etc. At work, I use Windows (one of the many dumbed-down workstations) and the programs and apps are already installed by our company's IT department. They don't even allow us to charge our iPhones on the PCs's USB slots, as they have disabled much of the PCs functionalities.

 

[DrumApple]

If they could just put Messages on Windows while they're at it that would be great thanks.

 

[H2SO4]

You'd have to be mad to leave OS X for Windows 10. There are so many minor frustrations that you have to deal with and unexpected errors and just general bullsh*t.

I have an IT services company that supports Macs and PCs and mobile devices (plus servers, networking equipment, etc.). If everyone was on a Mac we'd lose probably 80% of our billable hours for desktop support. PCs just break that much.

Plus you have to literally edit the hosts file to prevent Microsoft from logging your every move and keep an eye on the hosts file after every update to make sure they didn't reenable what is, by definition, built-in spyware. This is not hyperbole.

Whilst I don’t like Windows that a load of subjective crap. Maybe YOUR company aren't administering the hardware well, I know lots of IT professionals that prefer PCs?
Plus you literally have to…………
Don’t dance around it, either you do have to or you don’t.

 

[NightFox]

Microsoft has just taken "copyright" to the next level

The trouble is, people say "I won't switch to Windows because it doesn't do X,Y and Z that my Mac does", but when MS add X,Y and Z, people just say they're lamely copying OSX.

 

[jaded-mandarin]

Taking your Apple hat off you have to say that Microsoft et al are really leading the way in innovation nowadays, both from a software and hardware point of view.

Apple are continuing to rely on iterations of products that were outstanding and bar setters in their day, but they have not brought anything new the table for a while (iPhone 7 [6SS], MacBook Pros [Touch Bar a gimmick]) etc, and the questions are starting to loom as to how long they can hold their place at the top without any new meaningful innovation.

If you take your modern day iPhone, Apple TV, MacBook Pro, iMac and iPad and compare them to the same products from two years ago – has there been any new real innovation? It's the same with software, each new MacOS brings nothing significant new (if it's not broke don't fix I know, but that's also not an excuse for lack of new innovation) and all iOS has done is rip features and imitate the social platforms (Snapchat etc) of their main target audience; teenagers.

For too long there's been noises about ventures into new markets and then next big thing from Apple HQ (The Car, a TV solution) and yet each product launch comes and goes and frankly underwhelms, we get a new slightly updated iteration of an existing product, and often the design changes are detrimental and un-Apple like. I just get an overwhelming sense of hubris coming out of Infinite Loop, that they can continue to ride the wave of their previous successes. I guess as they continue to rake in the billions they may say their reasoning is justified.

In this same period Microsoft have realigned themselves in the market, are trying new approaches to the software ecosystem and have produced beautiful hardware in Surfaces and Surface Studio. Amazon has stole a lead with the Echo line, and Google is benefitting from Samsung producing a flagship phone that is much closer to the standard that was the iPhone than ever before. Oh, and Tesla are killing it (just buy them already Apple).

I really believe that in ten years time we won't see Apple in the same light as we have for the previous ten. And they will have no one to blame but themselves. It's a cliche to bring up Steve Jobs but I believe he wouldn't have liked the Apple we have today in 2017.

 

[kyleh22]

If they get iMessage and Continuity phone calls to windows 10, I'm 100% dumping the iPad and MacBook for a SP4/5

I would too. I absolutely love my windows 10 work computer. I rarely use my mac anymore but when I do, i'm always reminded how nice it is to have continuity calls and imessage on the desktop.

I doubt Apple would allow these services on windows b/c it's one of the main things keeping people in the Apple ECO system besides for AirPlay (which unfortunately still leaves a lot to be desired).

 

[convergent]

Ah, the good old "you're holding it wrong." Yup, let's just blame the user. It's the same responses I got everytime I contacted MS support. Ignore the fact that Dropbox and even Google Drive (which used to actually be worse than OneDrive) work just fine. Yup, it's the user's fault.

Seriously??? Trying to compare someone putting their hand in a different spot and causing reception to change with a piece of complex integrated software not working correctly on one person's computer is quite a stretch. Software configuration can get screwed up... if you don't understand that then I'm not sure what to tell you. There are plenty of cases where Apple's stuff also gets screwed up. OneDrive works great for millions of people, but not for you. You are welcome to believe its because you are holding it wrong.

Like everyone and their mom, I'm surrounded by friends and co-workers who are Windows users. And I can't remember when any of them "bought" Office software. I've long come under the conclusion that software piracy is "the norm" in the Windows world. I'm mostly a Mac/Apple user at home, so I legitimately purchase my apps from the Apple App Store, iTunes Store, etc. At work, I use Windows (one of the many dumbed-down workstations) and the programs and apps are already installed by our company's IT department. They don't even allow us to charge our iPhones on the PCs's USB slots, as they have disabled much of the PCs functionalities.

What is your point? Windows users are thieves and Apple users aren't? My family, and all of my personal friends have bought or subscribe to office, as far as I'm aware. We are a mixed OS group. My company spends millions of dollars a year on Office 365 subscriptions. We are also a mixed OS group, but primarily Windows. People who pirate software come in all sizes and flavors. It has nothing to do with what OS they use.

If they could just put Messages on Windows while they're at it that would be great thanks.

I believe this would be totally on Apple, and I highly doubt they'd ever do it for a variety of reasons. For one, they don't support other stuff to the degree that other stuff supports them. For example, they have iCloud for Windows and its a stinking pile of poop. I installed it and quickly removed it. And there is iTunes... which nets Apple potentially music subscriptions and sales... if they don't properly do that then why would they make messages available? Messages is one of the biggest reasons that someone might feel trapped in the Apple ecosystem. For me, it is the primary reason since my family who are non computer geeks all use it.

Taking your Apple hat off you have to say that Microsoft et al are really leading the way in innovation nowadays, both from a software and hardware point of view.

Apple are continuing to rely on iterations of products that were outstanding and bar setters in their day, but they have not brought anything new the table for a while (iPhone 7 [6SS], MacBook Pros [Touch Bar a gimmick]) etc, and the questions are starting to loom as to how long they can hold their place at the top without any new meaningful innovation.

If you take your modern day iPhone, Apple TV, MacBook Pro, iMac and iPad and compare them to the same products from two years ago – has there been any new real innovation? It's the same with software, each new MacOS brings nothing significant new (if it's not broke don't fix I know, but that's also not an excuse for lack of new innovation) and all iOS has done is rip features and imitate the social platforms (Snapchat etc) of their main target audience; teenagers.

For too long there's been noises about ventures into new markets and then next big thing from Apple HQ (The Car, a TV solution) and yet each product launch comes and goes and frankly underwhelms, we get a new slightly updated iteration of an existing product, and often the design changes are detrimental and un-Apple like. I just get an overwhelming sense of hubris coming out of Infinite Loop, that they can continue to ride the wave of their previous successes. I guess as they continue to rake in the billions they may say their reasoning is justified.

In this same period Microsoft have realigned themselves in the market, are trying new approaches to the software ecosystem and have produced beautiful hardware in Surfaces and Surface Studio. Amazon has stole a lead with the Echo line, and Google is benefitting from Samsung producing a flagship phone that is much closer to the standard that was the iPhone than ever before. Oh, and Tesla are killing it (just buy them already Apple).

I really believe that in ten years time we won't see Apple in the same light as we have for the previous ten. And they will have no one to blame but themselves. It's a cliche to bring up Steve Jobs but I believe he wouldn't have liked the Apple we have today in 2017.

This video by Jobs is spot on. I worked for IBM for most of my career and Jobs nailed it. They had a monopoly that was a cash cow and became too protective. Jobs was a product visionary. Cook is not. He doesn't have an ounce of product innovation in his body. He's a supply chain guy (and likes to push his political agenda). He's not even inspiring to hear talk... nor are any of the minions. They use the same lingo that Jobs used, but there isn't anything behind it. They will ride what Jobs built for a long time because its such a cash cow, but if they don't get someone into the leadership that understands what Jobs was saying in this video, they will slowly start to slide.

 

[scribz]

I just tried making the switch to a sp4 and am returning it. The battery life is horrendous, but If they fix this and get the features you mention plus a decent apple photo competitor id switch in a heartbeat...which is why it will never happen.

I made the switch in December after years with Apple. My SP4 has 65% battery left after two movies. I've had no problems. The SP4 is what I wanted from the iPad for years and was tired of waiting. Love it.
[doublepost=1494607737][/doublepost]

If they get iMessage and Continuity phone calls to windows 10, I'm 100% dumping the iPad and MacBook for a SP4/5

I switched over recently to a SP4 and all my family was on FaceTime and iMessages, so that was my worry at first. It actually worked out ok. I just switched over to Skype. What's nice about that is it's cross platform so I'll keep using it wherever I am.
[doublepost=1494607937][/doublepost]

Taking your Apple hat off you have to say that Microsoft et al are really leading the way in innovation nowadays, both from a software and hardware point of view.

Apple are continuing to rely on iterations of products that were outstanding and bar setters in their day, but they have not brought anything new the table for a while (iPhone 7 [6SS], MacBook Pros [Touch Bar a gimmick]) etc, and the questions are starting to loom as to how long they can hold their place at the top without any new meaningful innovation.

If you take your modern day iPhone, Apple TV, MacBook Pro, iMac and iPad and compare them to the same products from two years ago – has there been any new real innovation? It's the same with software, each new MacOS brings nothing significant new (if it's not broke don't fix I know, but that's also not an excuse for lack of new innovation) and all iOS has done is rip features and imitate the social platforms (Snapchat etc) of their main target audience; teenagers.

For too long there's been noises about ventures into new markets and then next big thing from Apple HQ (The Car, a TV solution) and yet each product launch comes and goes and frankly underwhelms, we get a new slightly updated iteration of an existing product, and often the design changes are detrimental and un-Apple like. I just get an overwhelming sense of hubris coming out of Infinite Loop, that they can continue to ride the wave of their previous successes. I guess as they continue to rake in the billions they may say their reasoning is justified.

In this same period Microsoft have realigned themselves in the market, are trying new approaches to the software ecosystem and have produced beautiful hardware in Surfaces and Surface Studio. Amazon has stole a lead with the Echo line, and Google is benefitting from Samsung producing a flagship phone that is much closer to the standard that was the iPhone than ever before. Oh, and Tesla are killing it (just buy them already Apple).

I really believe that in ten years time we won't see Apple in the same light as we have for the previous ten. And they will have no one to blame but themselves. It's a cliche to bring up Steve Jobs but I believe he wouldn't have liked the Apple we have today in 2017.

Microsoft beat Apple in hardware design with the Surface Pro 4, and the recent Surface Studio. What's surprising is from the looks of the new Fluent Design System UI demoed yesterday at Build, Microsoft is beating Apple in software design as well.

 

[tkermit]

What's surprising is from the looks of the new Fluent Design System UI demoed yesterday at Build, Microsoft is beating Apple in software design as well.

It didn't remind you of anything?