More Screenshots and a Hands-On of Microsoft Office for Mac 2011

[shervieux]

Not sure if I understand what your talking about

I hate Apple's mail program, so I am looking forward to this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stockcerts View Post
Would you be able to use Outlook for your Apple e-mail account?
No, they won't allow it.

I use Entourage now with MobileMe, what do you mean they won't allow it....

http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2029?viewlocale=en_US

 

[Hackint0sh]

Any word on whether "OneNote" will be included?

 

[shervieux]

Yikes! What is that??

OneNote? Now I know what to avoid.

I will give you two weeks using it, and you will not know how you lived without it. I tried it and was hooked in the first week. Also, once installed, Outlook will have a "Send to One Note" button that you can easily click and your email message goes into onenote. great for working on projects.

try it free for 60-days and you will see what I mean. Also, don't let me screens scare you. I am a power user and been using OneNote for 4 years. I have every toolbar enabled... I have embedded PDF's, linked and embedded files for organization, audio and video recordings, notes with handwritten and typed annotations, etc., I even exported pages from my livescribe smart pen notebooks (PDF) and put them into one note. I copy and paste from Excel and word all day. Plus webclippings, etc....

I used it for school and for work.

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/onenote/default.aspx

 

[cumanzor]

Microsoft software has been running on Macs since the very first Mac was shipped in 1984. There's nothing weird about that. Maybe you're just too young to know that Microsoft's application suite was the software that made the Mac a usable alternative to DOS boxes. If it wasn't for Microsoft's Mac support, the Mac would have never been a success.

That's completely and utterly wrong.

Office came out on Mac first.

Before Microsoft was given the IBM pc monopoly, various versions of Microsoft software came out on Mac first.

So...... you agree with him I presume.

 

[shervieux]

Any word on whether "OneNote" will be included?

Been on my knees praying, but no hopes yet

 

[jettredmont]

To Microsoft: please, once and for all, UNIFY the currently mess of interfaces between Office applications. As an example, a single unified spell checker interface with common dictionaries for all Office applications. Likewise for the search interface. And, please, place the sort a list feature inside the Edit menu and not inside the Table menu. IT AMAZES ME HOW ANTI-INTUITIVE Microsoft products are. I hate them, but I am forced to use them for compatibility with the World.

On reusing components, I really wish Microsoft would just make one Dictionary interface and one SpellCheck interface as well. Maybe make them available to other apps to use as well! Heck, if they did that, I bet Apple would include those kind of should-only-ever-be-done-once services in the OS itself!

Oh yeah, Apple already does.

Seriously. I'm stuck on Office 2004 still, and the fact that "define" brings up Microsoft's own funkified "dictionary" and the spell checker doesn't recognize the words I've added from other apps (proper names, etc) is just plain 1998-ish. Unfortunately, 2004 sucks in the performance department, and I cringed when I had to install Rosetta on my brand new iMac in order to defile it with that abomination. So, Microsoft probably has my money anyway. Sigh.

If only the multi-billion-dollar publishing megacorp I work for could allow docs to be written in anything besides MS Word...

 

[Dillenger]

Been on my knees praying, but no hopes yet

If it hasn't come out for Mac as a stand alone product, I doubt it will come out bundled with Mac Office.

 

[Hackint0sh]

now if Microsoft would just give us OneNote on the mac........ I NEED IT BAD.

Try Notebook 3.0 from Circus Ponies. I love OneNote too, but Notebook 3.0 is a very nice product.

http://www.circusponies.com/

 

[Hackint0sh]

Regarding Outlook. I recently ditched Entourage when I realized that Time machine was backing up all 7 gig of my email every time I made a small change or received a single email into my Entourage DB. This is where the mbox format really shines. My incremental Time Machine backups are 7 meg now, instead of 7 gig. Big difference!

I do miss the integration of calendar, notes, and tasks though.

Unless something has changed, I'm sticking with Mac Mail. PDA's, phones, and whatnot seem to sync up much easier than they did with Entourage anyway.

 

[shervieux]

Ok, I got that. Really. Why in the heck wouldn't you use parallels and the windows version. It would work MASSIVELY better. And the compatibility would be 100%.

Can't answer for him. but does not work well for me. I have a 2008 macbook that will only support 2gb of ram. I had to delete my parallels and Windows xp virtual PC. Even without parallels running my macbook was slow. as soon as I uninstalled it, the speed of my machine increased dramatically. PLus when I deleted it, I got back 115gb on my drive. My Windows XP was only configured at 60gb, so I can only assume that Parallels Desktop 5 was taking up the rest.

Other than that, I never ran into any compatibility issues between Windows Office 2007 and Mac Office 2008. Of course I am using the mac office 2008 Expression media version (that has since been discontinued and replaced with mac office 2008 business).

 

[jettredmont]

You must not be much of an Excel/Numbers user... This is where office absolutely blows iWork away. If you are an intensive Excel user there is no way you can replace it with numbers.

You see, this is where comparing the two apps becomes really meaningless.

People tend to define themselves as "a really intensive App X user" rather than "a scientist needing to do regressive analysis" (where Excel shines) or "a home user needing to track seventeen small tables of interrelated information to decide which option will be cheaper for putting together the media room" (where Numbers and its ability to track multiple tables on the screen at once really shines).

Not to harp too much, because I know a lot of people define themselves by the tools they use and how "professionally" or "intensively" or "expertly" they use those tools, rather than what they really produce and how well they do it. I see the same on resumes all the time.

But, especially when comparing two apps, the extra context is absolutely critical.

For the record: I've replaced Excel with Numbers as my go-to spreadsheet app for personal information. I wouldn't dare try to do a regression analysis with it, though. It's just not "there" yet. I also wouldn't dare put together a spreadsheet that needs to be distributed in Excel format to anyone else; the results are just so not-pretty.

 

[jettredmont]

1) Fire all your mac UI developers
2) Buy this guys http://www.projectwizards.net/en/merlin/
3) Make them program all the UI stuff for Word,Excel,etc.
4) While waiting for them to finish, fix the damn bugs in Office 2008
5) Rename Merlin to MS Project
6) Release a decent Mac Office 2014

Hmm. It's been a while since I used Merlin (oh, three years and some), but I did leave them for OmniPlan before our org went agile. The main reasons were little interface glitches and lack of compatibility with MS Project on import/export. Also, the company seemed to be highly overtaxes in getting updates out, which didn't give me confidence that they'd still be around a few years down the road (although obviously they have).

Maybe they've fixed the Project compatibility enough that Merlin could be called MS Project for Mac.

On the UI design front, I wouldn't follow their instincts over those of Omni Group, Apple, etc, but they're a solid step up from typical Microsoft Office "design" catastrophes.

 

[jettredmont]

To me the biggest downside of iWork vs. Office is the lack of any kind of integrated media collection. Sure, 90% of the stuff in the Microsoft image/clipart collection sucks, but at least there's something there. With Apple you get nothing (except for the handful of images that come with the templates).

And how many typical users want to go to iStockphoto and pay for an image (or several) to use in their neighborhood flyer?

Big, big disadvantage.

Huh. Even with Office, I just head over to Google Images to search for clipart anyway. I didn't realize Word still came with those piles of OfficeArt make-my-brain-remember-the-scent-of-floppies abominations.

 

[shervieux]

Try Notebook 3.0 from Circus Ponies. I love OneNote too, but Notebook 3.0 is a very nice product.

http://www.circusponies.com/

I have it. if I was not in love with OneNote, I would probably use it more.

What circus ponies seem to lack:

1. Multiple notebooks open at once.
2. Ability to write, type and draw / annotate freely on the same page
3. Sections across the top, and page tabs that auto title from the first typed line in the page.
4. Search across all notebooks

What circus ponies has, that OneNote needs:

1. flags
2. Stickies
3. Auto Index (Actually they changed the name to multidex)

Why is it with circus ponies you have to specify the type of page (probably because of the multidex). OneNote gives you a blank page to just add what you need.

yeah, in 3.0 they made a lot of improvements to it. but it also crashes when you add a lot to the toolbar across the top.

I support 130 hospitals and answer questions for people all day. there are many things in OneNote that gives me advantage over Circus Ponies.

Having said that, if it was just for my personal stuff - Circus Ponies may suffice for 85% of stuff.

 

[jettredmont]

What I can say though is that Entourage is dead and Outlook is NOT Entourage.

The performance increase is amazing due to a changed DB MS is using as well as allowing things like Spotlight and Time Machine.

By "allowing things like ... Time Machine" I hope hope hope you mean that the database being used doesn't store the entire contents of every email I've ever received in on gigantic 4.7GB opaque file, but instead adopts the (very un-Microsoft) approach of storing individual items on disk and only storing the pointer and search information in the database ... Because that's not how Outlook 2007 works either (one big PST file).

I mean, you could also kinda say you are more Time Machine friendly by allowing every folder in Outlook to be a separate PST file, so at least the 4.6GB of archived mail doesn't need to be re-backed up every time I get an email in my Inbox (only the 100MB of the active Inbox needs to be backed up). Which would certainly be an improvement. But, that requires users to set it up themselves and is just plain less elegant than the Apple Mail (and other Apple database-driven apps) approach.

 

[jettredmont]

I knew it would probably happen, but the Outlook does not work with Exchange 2003.

If only my work was not so slow to upgrade.

Mine too. So, I guess Office 2004 will have to last me yet another upgrade cycle, because the corp sees Exchange upgrades as a 10-year cycle... Sigh.

 

[impierced]

It's not. The interface might look similar (now), but the inner workings now interface properly with Exchange servers. If you've been having problems with Entourage or Mail losing connections with Exchange, losing emails or appointments, this should solve them. I had all of the above and was relegated running Outlook '07 in XP/Fusion. Outlook 2011 beta has obviated the need for the Windows/Mac two-step.

Hope you're right, cause I've had all of those issues. Not to mention I'm getting really sick of deleting the hundreds of errors generated when sync'ng my boss's calendar, "couldn't sync calendar event blah..."

However, I will believe it's Outlook when I see server side rule support, ability to see multiple calendars at the same time side-by-side, ability to open a PST file (NOT import it), can see a full 12 hours in a standard calendar window frame without having to have a 30" monitor, and many other Outlook standard features. Until then it's Entourage renamed with some Exchange functionality added.

 

[MorphingDragon]

As long as Microsoft is still using the ribbon interface I would much rather face the trials of OpenOffice.

 

[shervieux]

As long as Microsoft is still using the ribbon interface I would much rather face the trials of OpenOffice.

I think the reason Microsoft is going all ribbon is due to Windows vista and 7 are geared to run on tablet / touch PC's. Thus why the larger icons. Windows XP tablet edition was a mess due to small icons that were not made for touch / tablet. I worked for a company that implemented a lot of touch monitors. it did not go over to well (icons in software were too small to click on accurately, and who wants to use a touch screen in a medical lab anyway? yuck). They were using touch screens because they were easier to clean than keyboards.

the ribbon works well for touch / tablet PC's, menus do not.

 

[shervieux]

And why is it just about all of these note taking programs look pretty much the same? Won't some software developers break out of the "all look the same, but have a different name" note taking program. I think Circus Ponies is the only one that looks different, but it isn't no OneNote.

think that is bad, every note-taking app I look at in the app store for my iphone (and soon to be ipad) seems to be the exact same thing.. The only one that stands out is TakeNotes (formally called PadNotes).

You have to watch the video all the way to the end though to see it's true functionality...

http://www.blogsdna.com/8096/padnotes-ipad-app-preview-shows-off-the-possibilities-of-the-ipad.htm

http://www.hackcollege.com/blog/201...the-way-for-ipad-use-in-the-lecture-hall.html

Oh and Moes Notes for the ipod, iphone, ipad is different too....

http://www.moeskitchen.com/MoesNotes/

 

[JavierP]

Hmm. It's been a while since I used Merlin (oh, three years and some), but I did leave them for OmniPlan before our org went agile. The main reasons were little interface glitches and lack of compatibility with MS Project on import/export. Also, the company seemed to be highly overtaxes in getting updates out, which didn't give me confidence that they'd still be around a few years down the road (although obviously they have).

Maybe they've fixed the Project compatibility enough that Merlin could be called MS Project for Mac.

On the UI design front, I wouldn't follow their instincts over those of Omni Group, Apple, etc, but they're a solid step up from typical Microsoft Office "design" catastrophes.

Omni programs are also great. How about:

1) Buy omni and merlin
2) Cross bread developers and let them design Mac Office 2014
3) Rename OmniGraffle to Visio and OmniPlan/Merlin breed to MS Proyect
4) Release a decent MS Office 2014

?

 

[graham1971]

Have they changed the way the mail database works so that Time Machine doesn't have to back up my entire 6GB database every hour?

 

[DrumApple]

I'm so desperate for OneNote that I run Crossover just to have it, man it is annoying to open using virtualization software and not having full-functionality.

MICROSOFT: Please, if you're listening, give us OneNote!

 

[MartiNZ]

6gb? Then I wouldn't have been able to install it on my computer. I just check in the program files and it's exactly 1gb.

I only installed the base 3 of beta 2010: Word, Excel and PowerPoint without Outlook, on boot camp Windows 7 and it's 382MB. I've found them decent but not that different from '07 really.

Back on the main topic, the people saying stuff about integrating with the system ... damn good points. Wish they would use the built in dictionary! And if I recall Word still has its own Address Book tool, among other things they just don't need to reinvent. Hey even the OS font and colour panels would be nice! Come on Mac BU!

 

[Mattie Num Nums]

What would be nice is if outlook synced with address book.

Supports sync services.