Moved from 2015 MBP to 2018... trackpad, keyboard, touchbar are a dumpster fire.

vsh001

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Apr 3, 2019
3
9
My 2015 MBP recently broke down and was replaced by Apple for a 2018 MBP. I just have to vent somewhere about the controls on this machine. It's infuriating trying to use the oversized trackpad. My palm is constantly clicking it. In order to properly use it I need to set my palm sideways with my elbow flared out in a 120 degree angle, or I can only rest my palm on the outer edge of the machine that's about 1/4" wide. And regardless of all of that my palms still click it. How the hell did this pass user experience testing? I can't believe current mac users have been dealing with this for years since the 2016 release. You must be losing your minds. I'm only a few days in and I'm already losing my sanity. The touchbar is complete garbage that gets in the way of using the computer. The keyboard is substandard, and the arrow keys have an improper layout for absolutely no reason. These machines are significantly less usable than the average laptop. Why was any of this necessary? Standard keyboards, standard trackpads and F-keys do their jobs well. I feel like I'm using a cheap toy with a shiny finish that can't handle the demands of someone who can move their hands quickly and needs to be able to move around accurately. Everything about this user experience is diminished and below the standard of an average notebook. This is not a premium experience. I cannot believe how delusional Apple is, and I cannot believe that this product was allowed to hit the shelves. I'm honestly going to have to sell this machine to someone else. It's just that bad. I don't know what I'll get to replace it, but I know that this is damn near frustratingly unusable. At this point Apple have forced me to migrate to a different platform because this machine is like a hacked together prototype rather than a professional grade device.
 

lwilliams

macrumors 6502
Nov 27, 2012
315
106
Athens, GA
I replace my 2012 MBP with a new one in Feb. I love almost everything about it.

I have the same issues with my palms touching the track pad. I would have preferred the pad stay smaller.

They keyboard is ok. Many laptops now have a similar feel. However, I trained as a touch-typist 42 years ago. This kind of keyboard slows down my typing.

But, otherwise, I love this thing!!
 

poorcody

macrumors 6502a
Jul 23, 2013
791
603
My 2015 MBP recently broke down and was replaced by Apple for a 2018 MBP. I just have to vent somewhere about the controls on this machine. It's infuriating trying to use the oversized trackpad. My palm is constantly clicking it. In order to properly use it I need to set my palm sideways with my elbow flared out in a 120 degree angle, or I can only rest my palm on the outer edge of the machine that's about 1/4" wide. And regardless of all of that my palms still click it. How the hell did this pass user experience testing? I can't believe current mac users have been dealing with this for years since the 2016 release. You must be losing your minds. I'm only a few days in and I'm already losing my sanity.
Have you tried just using the keyboard normally without thinking about the trackpad? The palm-rejection works perfectly for me -- in over two years of using it it has never registered palm presses.
 

jerryk

macrumors 603
Nov 3, 2011
5,040
2,482
SF Bay Area
Have you tried just using the keyboard normally without thinking about the trackpad? The palm-rejection works perfectly for me -- in over two years of using it it has never registered palm presses.
Same thing for me. I really find the size of the trackpad comical, and worried a lot about unexpected movement of the cursor. But, those fears turned out to be unfounded.
[doublepost=1554324655][/doublepost]
My 2015 MBP recently broke down and was replaced by Apple for a 2018 MBP.
If Apple recently replaced it why not go back and ask them for a refurbished or new 2015 MBP unit. If your unit was a 15", they sold that system through mid 2018. Be persistent and get what works for you.
 
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maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
64,167
30,751
Boston
The palm-rejection works perfectly for me
For me, I'm shocked at the size of the trackpad, but Apple has the best palm rejection heuristics in the industry and I've had zero problems with typing/palms interfering. I had a Razer Blade 15" and the trackpad was smaller but it caused a lot of headaches with the cursor jumping around thanks to my palm brushing up against the trackpad.
 

Cashmonee

macrumors 65816
May 27, 2006
1,168
832
The trackpad is honestly a non-issue. I do not know too many people that report the palm rejection is not working.

The TouchBar is superfluous and definitely of dubious value. Having said that, unless you use the hard function keys often (and some certainly do), I am not sure it necessarily detracts from the experience. Also, using BetterTouchTool really can bring the TouchBar into the realm of useful features.

The keyboard is a problem for a lot of people. It is less reliable than previous versions and for many people, not a pleasurable typing experience.
 

LogicalApex

macrumors 6502a
Nov 13, 2015
505
434
I don't remember ever having a palm issue on my 2018 MBP. The palm rejection is absolutely amazing from my experience with Windows laptops. They did such a good job honestly that when you're not using it as a touchpad it feels just a sturdy as the rest of the machine. So you don't feel like you have an oversized trackpad there.

Dare I say it, but I think Apple has the best trackpads in the business hands down. Surprised to see a complaint for that.
 

c0ppo

macrumors 65816
Feb 11, 2013
1,459
2,600
I hate the touch bar, and the keyboard is a complete failure.
But the trackpad on MBP is by far the best trackpad out there. I also had no issues with palm rejection.
 

jerryk

macrumors 603
Nov 3, 2011
5,040
2,482
SF Bay Area
For me, I'm shocked at the size of the trackpad, but Apple has the best palm rejection heuristics in the industry and I've had zero problems with typing/palms interfering. I had a Razer Blade 15" and the trackpad was smaller but it caused a lot of headaches with the cursor jumping around thanks to my palm brushing up against the trackpad.

When I go to my SurfaceBook the biggest issue is the bottom right corner is a mouse right click. I cannot tell you how many times I clicked there and nothing happens!
 

doitdada

Suspended
Oct 14, 2013
947
546
I’m seeing the same usernames complaining in most threads. I wouldn’t want to go back to 2015. iPhone X and MacBook Pro 15 2018 is great.

Would consider Lenovo laptops if an Android phone could loose their filmsy feel.

I felt the issues with 2016-2017 was real, but my 2018 doesn’t have anything but software issues.
 
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ilikewhey

macrumors 65816
May 14, 2014
1,224
1,295
nyc upper east
ha i can somehwhat relate to OP even though he just signed up yesterday hence i question his credibility.

i returned my touchbar mbp for a 2015 13inch and to this day no regrets. the biggest problem was the keyboard, the touchpad was fine and the touchbar was somewhat to get used to.
 

booksbooks

macrumors 6502a
Aug 28, 2013
599
440
My 2015 MBP recently broke down and was replaced by Apple for a 2018 MBP. I just have to vent somewhere about the controls on this machine. It's infuriating trying to use the oversized trackpad. My palm is constantly clicking it. In order to properly use it I need to set my palm sideways with my elbow flared out in a 120 degree angle, or I can only rest my palm on the outer edge of the machine that's about 1/4" wide. And regardless of all of that my palms still click it. How the hell did this pass user experience testing? I can't believe current mac users have been dealing with this for years since the 2016 release. You must be losing your minds. I'm only a few days in and I'm already losing my sanity. The touchbar is complete garbage that gets in the way of using the computer. The keyboard is substandard, and the arrow keys have an improper layout for absolutely no reason. These machines are significantly less usable than the average laptop. Why was any of this necessary? Standard keyboards, standard trackpads and F-keys do their jobs well. I feel like I'm using a cheap toy with a shiny finish that can't handle the demands of someone who can move their hands quickly and needs to be able to move around accurately. Everything about this user experience is diminished and below the standard of an average notebook. This is not a premium experience. I cannot believe how delusional Apple is, and I cannot believe that this product was allowed to hit the shelves. I'm honestly going to have to sell this machine to someone else. It's just that bad. I don't know what I'll get to replace it, but I know that this is damn near frustratingly unusable. At this point Apple have forced me to migrate to a different platform because this machine is like a hacked together prototype rather than a professional grade device.
Dude I know. I have a few threads on this. I just got 2 brand new 2015 MacBook Pros and am loving them. I have a 2017 MBP and the keyboard sucks. The Touchbar useless trash. The trackpad a beached whale. It sucks.

So here I am, typing on my brand new 2015 15" MacBook Pro rocking 512 GB SSD and 16 GB RAM running Mojave. For the first time in over a year since I've had my 2017 MBP, I actually feel like doing work. On the 2017, I dreaded typing every work because the keyboard sucks so bad.
 

GoldfishRT

macrumors 6502a
Jul 24, 2014
509
286
Somewhere
Meanwhile I consider my 2018 the best laptop I've ever held.

Different strokes for different folks I guess. I've grown to like the 3rd generation keyboard, of course the trackpad is massive for no real good reason but it works great, and the touch-bar is mostly useless. The only thing that saves me from saying completely is with the Touch Bar I can picture in picture videos that normally don't have the option and skip through ads by dragging on the timeline that shows up. That actually almost makes it worth it to me lol.
 

Donnation

macrumors 6502a
Nov 2, 2014
887
867
No sympathy for you OP. These aren't brand new machines. This style MacBook Pro has been out for several years now. Unless you've been living in a cave then you have no excuse for not knowing the differences between the 2015 and the newer ones.

And you are doing something wrong if the trackpad is causing that big of an issue for you. And yes the keyboard is different, but after using it for a while I truly enjoy typing on it. It may not be for you but calling it a dumpster fire because you don't like it is nothing but your fault.

Trackpad: Yeah its nothing crazy great, but there are some great mods out there that make it really useful.
 

Brammy

macrumors 68000
Sep 17, 2008
1,653
630
I have a 2016 15" MacBook Pro.
  • I don't like the keyboard. I never got used to the lack of travel, and the 2016s are very loud keyboards
  • I like the trackpad. I haven't had any palm rejection issues.
  • I am neutral on the Touchbar. I use my MacBook in Clamshell most of the time, so it dosn't get used. I think it's a good idea, but a lot of the app's use of it is weird. I think if I could customize it on a per-app basis it would be better.
 

rdowty

macrumors 6502a
Oct 5, 2008
662
106
ha i can somehwhat relate to OP even though he just signed up yesterday hence i question his credibility.

i returned my touchbar mbp for a 2015 13inch and to this day no regrets. the biggest problem was the keyboard, the touchpad was fine and the touchbar was somewhat to get used to.
Apple changes design three years ago. OP gets one Yesterday and gives it all of about half a day to get used to it, doesn't like it. Creates a new account on MacRumors just to complain...
 

Plutonius

macrumors G3
Feb 22, 2003
8,204
6,216
New Hampshire, USA
I felt the issues with 2016-2017 was real, but my 2018 doesn’t have anything but software issues.
I believe that the T2 bridgeOS fault is caused by a hardware issue and Apple has been trying to fix the problem in firmware / software. They have been working on it for 1+ years and have had some success although they haven't eliminated it. I think that it's telling that the T2 was left out of the latest iMac.

The butterfly keyboard problems from 2016 - 2018 are not software issues.
 

rdowty

macrumors 6502a
Oct 5, 2008
662
106
I believe that the T2 bridgeOS fault is caused by a hardware issue and Apple has been trying to fix the problem in firmware / software. They have been working on it for 1+ years and have had some success although they haven't eliminated it. I think that it's telling that the T2 was left out of the latest iMac.

The butterfly keyboard problems from 2016 - 2018 are not software issues.
The T2 issue is why I don't have a 2018 MBP. My understanding is the reason there's no T2's in the iMac's is it doesn't support non-SSD storage as a boot device.
 

LogicalApex

macrumors 6502a
Nov 13, 2015
505
434
I believe that the T2 bridgeOS fault is caused by a hardware issue and Apple has been trying to fix the problem in firmware / software. They have been working on it for 1+ years and have had some success although they haven't eliminated it. I think that it's telling that the T2 was left out of the latest iMac.
Chip problems are routinely fixed with software. You'd be surprised to learn how much "errata" (chip bugs) exist for Intel CPUs and how often your CPU is patched either via the OS or firmware updates to address them (sometimes Intel can't fix the issue and leaves them unpatched).

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/intel-skylake-bug-causes-pcs-to-freeze-during-complex-workloads/

I haven't had the T2 issues on my 2018 MBP, but I think it is hard to say where the problem lies. Hopefully Apple resolves it for those experiencing issues.

But I don't see Apple backing down from T2. The rumors are that Apple will be adding more custom Apple silicone to their devices not less. And that makes sense as it makes it easier for Apple to differentiate their devices from PCs with unique features only they can provide. Such as, security completely isolated from the Intel CPU and all applications running on the machine as the T2 provides.
 

vsh001

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Apr 3, 2019
3
9
No sympathy for you OP. These aren't brand new machines. This style MacBook Pro has been out for several years now. Unless you've been living in a cave then you have no excuse for not knowing the differences between the 2015 and the newer ones.

And you are doing something wrong if the trackpad is causing that big of an issue for you. And yes the keyboard is different, but after using it for a while I truly enjoy typing on it. It may not be for you but calling it a dumpster fire because you don't like it is nothing but your fault.

Trackpad: Yeah its nothing crazy great, but there are some great mods out there that make it really useful.
Not sure what you mean, I didn't choose this machine. The machine was given to me by Apple because my 2015 MBP died.
 
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jerryk

macrumors 603
Nov 3, 2011
5,040
2,482
SF Bay Area
Not sure what you mean, I didn't choose this machine. The machine was given to me by Apple because my 2015 MBP died.

Can't you just go back and ask them for a 2015 machine? Apple sold the 15" 2015 model until Summer 2018 so they are bound to have new or refurbished stock.

Just say the 2018 does not work as you expected and you want a 2015 to replace your recently broken 2015.
 
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LogicalApex

macrumors 6502a
Nov 13, 2015
505
434
Can't you just go back and ask them for a 2015 machine? Apple sold the 15" 2015 model until Summer 2018 so they are bound to have new or refurbished stock.

Just say the 2018 does not work as you expected and you want a 2015 to replace your recently broken 2015.
Wouldn't you be better off selling the 2018 and buying used 2015 if the 2018 is that unusable?
 
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