Theres some really clever thinking in Junior. iPad Safari is very much an exercise figuring out how to bring desktop features to a tablet experience. Junior seems more focused on how to accomplish web browsing tasks in a tablet. Its an important distinction.
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Mozilla Working on 'Junior' Web Browser for iPad
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Mad-B-One
macrumors 6502a
I think the "simpler" refers to what others are already doing differently: Use your screen real estate wisely and use e.g. gestures for tab switches (like Atomic), offer Full Screen (Atomic as well) and - that is new - do not restart with loading all open tabs because - as mentionned - most are outdated or need logins and you might not even want to continue with the last, let's say, ten addresses you visited. The enlongated icons is a fresh idea - especially for touch devices - and might make it indeed easier to start right in... I guess something along this line... Do I make sense? 🙂
mdelvecchio
macrumors 68040
get real. most websites are so poorly designed and laden w/ ads that its necessary. my #1 Safari feature is....Reader. strips out all ads, sidebars, comments, etc and puts the article's content up front & center.
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ArtOfWarfare
macrumors G3
Agreed... very poor pacing (really, this whole presentation could have been done in 4 minutes. 7 tops.) Novice presenting abilities on the part of both presenters...
The browser looks a little interesting... I know what they mean by the whole tab closing issue... I definitely always feel compelled to close tabs.
mdelvecchio
macrumors 68040
verniesgarden
macrumors 65816
I agree the "dude" giving the presentation should be an example of why you should be professional, all the way though it's like he's never seen his product before and damnit man you are wanting to be taken seriously put on a decent shirt
bushido
Suspended
lol okay, i'll keep blocking those annoying bastards the same way i dont watch commercials on tv
So they're making "Junior" for iPad because:
1) They wanted to do something (anything!) "different"
2) iOS is really popular and they have nothing on it
Which one of those reasons is going to benefit users?
1) They wanted to do something (anything!) "different"
2) iOS is really popular and they have nothing on it
Which one of those reasons is going to benefit users?
It's nice to see some real innovation in "tab" management and it looks like their webkit wrapper has some great ideas.
Uncortunately, without Reader it might struggle to take off, regardless of how slick the UI is.
They REALLY need to get someone with some presentation skills to present the thing though! It's just painful to watch (I made it to the end, somehow). It's like they didn't even bother to prepare.
Uncortunately, without Reader it might struggle to take off, regardless of how slick the UI is.
They REALLY need to get someone with some presentation skills to present the thing though! It's just painful to watch (I made it to the end, somehow). It's like they didn't even bother to prepare.
Completely different issue.
With that said I could see a similar trial if somebody makes a big enough stink about it.
Mad-B-One
macrumors 6502a
Yea, of course, and Atomic is another one... that's why so many here like Atomic. Who said it doesn't exist? 🙄
Mad Mac Maniac
macrumors 601
Considering how this article is talking about the iPad, and the iPad pretty much does have a monopoly on tablets at the moment.... It'll be interesting to see how Win8 does in this space. But if the iPad continues as it has been, and the tablet continues to grow exponentially and be seen more and more as a replacement for traditional PC's for many people, I can easily see this becoming the same issue.
Mad-B-One
macrumors 6502a
I can't agree more! I wonder as well how long Apple can block Flash this way. It's basically the same issue as soon as they are forced to open their device somewhere for other browsers - because I'm pretty sure they cannot block them just because they compile Flash as well... and once e.g. the European Union forced Apple to open the device to 3rd party browsers, the next philosophical pillar (no Flash) will fall as well.
theelysium
Suspended
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=42951
I checked the Safari KB shortcuts and it didn't show up in the list, but I use Control + tab to move through the tabs and Shift + Control + Tab to do it in reverse. That is actually not on the shortcut page for some reason, but it's there.
I can't pick a tab though I've been trying different keystrokes. Oh, Wait I have MT Lion... just a sec...nope just the tab on that version too.
You can also get adblocker from here http://safariadblock.com/ and http://download.cnet.com/Safari-AdBlock/3000-2378_4-10793198.html
Go to Apple.com/feedback and tell them to add it.
Wait here is a plugin that will add the feature: https://github.com/rs/SafariTabSwitching
Tada! 😀
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Frobozz
macrumors demi-god
I really liked the demo. A lot of their insight about how generally poor the UX is for Safari on iOS is spot-on.
I love the simplicity of side-accessed thumb menus. And, yes, I do UX for a living. So I know how hard it is to actually break new ground without users understanding basic paradigms you're employing. That's where really good UX works, though.
Kudos to the Mozilla team!
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Well, I think it's much more likely for the big 4 to release a new UX for iPad than it is for a fifth wheel. Almost nobody seeks out alternative web browsers except advanced users. I've never heard of these other browsers, though now I will certainly check them out.
I love the simplicity of side-accessed thumb menus. And, yes, I do UX for a living. So I know how hard it is to actually break new ground without users understanding basic paradigms you're employing. That's where really good UX works, though.
Kudos to the Mozilla team!
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Well, I think it's much more likely for the big 4 to release a new UX for iPad than it is for a fifth wheel. Almost nobody seeks out alternative web browsers except advanced users. I've never heard of these other browsers, though now I will certainly check them out.
Lots of posts seem to be dismissing this new browser because
But I think that kind of misses the point. For me at least, there seem to be quite a few cool ideas in this new browser, especially since this is just a prototype.
I don't like mozilla on the desktop, but what i found pretty cool in this browser was:
Obviously like the guys said, there are still several things missing, but it's certainly a promising start.
- The presentation/presenters were bad (which they were)
- All non safari browsers are just wrappers for webkit (which they are)
But I think that kind of misses the point. For me at least, there seem to be quite a few cool ideas in this new browser, especially since this is just a prototype.
I don't like mozilla on the desktop, but what i found pretty cool in this browser was:
- The whole idea of browsing profiles. I'd love to be able to let a friend or family member use my iPad to browse the net, without worrying about what's in my history
- The idea of containers which combines history and tabs, especially if they implement that idea of 'pinching' or 'zooming' a container to see all the pages related to a site taht you've visited. Might work kind of like photo albums I'm assuming. This would make it pretty easy to find something you were looking at maybe a few days ago
- The immersive full screen (ok, i know, not exactly new, but i like how they've implemented it, without menus and toolbars that auto appear when your finger gets to a certain point on the screen.
- The trays for storing favourites seem pretty cool. Continues the paradigm for launching apps from the OS
Obviously like the guys said, there are still several things missing, but it's certainly a promising start.
most of you guys seem to be fixated on the _form_ of the presentation, ignoring the fact that this is an internal demo, not a keynote or something.
https://air.mozilla.org/product-design-at-mozilla/
that's how mozilla operates. thankfully so!
https://air.mozilla.org/product-design-at-mozilla/
that's how mozilla operates. thankfully so!
Mad Mac Maniac
macrumors 601
Well two things.
Apple can't be FORCED to work with Adobe to include flash natively in safari. The worst that I can see would be forcing Apple to let browsers on the app store that can use flash... but aren't there already apps that do this? Is there honestly anything that is stopping Adobe from making their own iOS browser that is fully flash compatible?
Secondly, flash is already on it's way out the door. By the time anything could have legally happened to force flash on the iPad, it will be dead in the water. So the point will be moot.
Mad-B-One
macrumors 6502a
There is no other browsers on iOS. The only one is Safari. "Junior" - or whatever Mozilla will call it - will be no different. It won't be a browser but just a mask for Safari unless Apple decides (or is forced to) change its policy. You don't have to be an advanced user to find limitations in the mobile version of Safari that make you look for a better mask. Atomic has Atomic Lite (as do others) with less features so you can explore for free if you like what they make out of the Safari engine. I just looked for "browser" in the AppStore and the one with by far the most ratings (and 4.5 stars) is Atomic - so, it's not an App for techies at all. About 2600 ratings is pretty good, actually.
BTW, the vast majority of these can be done with the, otherwise, speed-wise, far superior Safari with add-on scriptlets on non-jailbroken devices (zoom in, translation, page source etc.)
And on jailbroken devices, a lot more can be done:
- U-A change (FREE)
- upload ($2)
- download manager (currently not working on iOS 5, though)
- full screen ($1.30)
and even having almost exactly the same external keyboard shortcuts as with a desktop Mac, except for Cmd + 1...9 tab switching with BeeKeyboard - see https://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?p=15072049&posted=1#post15072049
Mad-B-One
macrumors 6502a
First, yes, Apple can be forced to do something. The European Union forced Microsoft to unbundle Windows and IE due to pressing on an open market be preinstallation of their browser. They didn't charge or anything, but they limited competition by using their monopoly on the PC platform. Something similar could happen to Apple because they dominate the Tablet Market. (I believe MS actually did have to pay a fine close to $1Bn because they didn't comply in time) I'm not saying it will or it is likely, I'm just saying you are wrong if you think it cannot. I never said they have to support Flash in Safari though. I stated they might be forced to let other browsers run on the iPad - meaning not using Safari and just plug a mask over it but be a "real" browser with own engine - and that would be way more likely that Apple is forced to do that than the integration of Flash into Safari.
To your second: As long as web developers use Flash - and there are still some free countries out there where you can do what you want - it is not dead. I personally don't care weather there will be a Flash-free Web out there one day, I just think it will not be. See how many PCs still run on IE 7 giving the web devs a headache each day. Also, old content might never change. There are tons of reasons why it will never go away...
